Epic Major Artifacts and artifacts as characters. [Archive] - Wizards Community

Epic Major Artifacts and artifacts as characters. [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
RealSorceror
06-26-07, 04:32 PM I made this thread to get answers on these three questions:

First, are there any specific rules for the statistics and creation of artifacts? Both the DMG and EH are too vague for my tastes. My Lesser God character (see link in sig) has just taken the Craft Artifact salient ability. He can obviously create artifacts, but just how long does it take him to do so? Would the time be similiar to creating a non-artifact version of the item?

Second, can an existing item become an artifact? What would I need to do for this to happen?

Third, can an artifact be something that is "alive", such as a Golem or other construct? If so, does this mean that an intelligent golem character could potentially be an artifact, and therefore immune to direct physical and magical harm?

I ask this because my deity character intends to rebuild his metal body as an epic major artifact. Unfortunately, he is Collossal+ and has many, many moving parts (but still falls under the category of golem/vehicle).

Let it be known that the DM has full knowledge of this and that it was actually him who suggested it.
Alias
06-27-07, 08:11 PM Wow... where to start.

First, are there any specific rules for the statistics and creation of artifacts? Both the DMG and EH are too vague for my tastes. My Lesser God character (see link in sig) has just taken the Craft Artifact salient ability. He can obviously create artifacts, but just how long does it take him to do so? Would the time be similiar to creating a non-artifact version of the item?
No, there aren't. I messed around with it a little last year - reverse-engineered the artifacts from the 1E DMG to figure out what kind/number of powers artifacts of a given level would get - and then let it go. I was actually going to go back to that as soon as I'm done with my current project (s) - so, in a couple days.

As for PCs being able to create artifacts... I'd say no, unless you're a god (which you are). I'd ask Upper Krust in this situation - he, I think, has some rules for divinities making artifacts.

Second, can an existing item become an artifact? What would I need to do for this to happen?
Sure. The way our group does it is:

It has to have a name.

It has to have a special purpose (either specifically made for that purpose, or ends up being used for that purpose, like slaying demons).

It has to be used by one person for a long period of time - 20 levels or so is typical.

It has to have been used in several noteworthy events.

It's a pretty free-form system - those are pretty much guidelines that we follow.

Third, can an artifact be something that is "alive", such as a Golem or other construct? If so, does this mean that an intelligent golem character could potentially be an artifact, and therefore immune to direct physical and magical harm?
The Mighty Servant of Leuk-O is a construct, and an artifact, so yes. As for a PC becoming an artifact... that's really up to the DM to allow or not, but I'd say no, because you'd be "immune to direct physical and magical harm". It would make for a really interesting NPC, though...
RealSorceror
06-28-07, 01:51 PM Wow... where to start.

No, there aren't. I messed around with it a little last year - reverse-engineered the artifacts from the 1E DMG to figure out what kind/number of powers artifacts of a given level would get - and then let it go. I was actually going to go back to that as soon as I'm done with my current project (s) - so, in a couple days.

As for PCs being able to create artifacts... I'd say no, unless you're a god (which you are). I'd ask Upper Krust in this situation - he, I think, has some rules for divinities making artifacts.
Ya, its pretty frustrating not knowing how to do something that your character knows how to do. I'll PM Upper Krust and see what he thinks.

Sure. The way our group does it is:

It has to have a name.

It has to have a special purpose (either specifically made for that purpose, or ends up being used for that purpose, like slaying demons).

It has to be used by one person for a long period of time - 20 levels or so is typical.

It has to have been used in several noteworthy events.

It's a pretty free-form system - those are pretty much guidelines that we follow.
Its name is the Great Engine, and is also widely known as Dotrak or Thunderclese.

Its special purpose to provide a place for scholars, inventers, and engineers to live and practice their craft. It is literally both a city and a giant robot. Any other special purposes would be directly related to my domains and portfolio. Lastly, the robot houses my divine power, and is in many ways my physical body.

The mech has been around for something like 500 years.

The mech was used in combat against alien gods, and severaly damaged one of them. The mech has also participated in freindly sparring matches against other native deities. And lastly, the mech assisted in destroying a moon that was falling toward the planet (ya, our god characters do some epic bs).

Looks like I meet all those criteria. Thats good, because it would likely take me a very, very long time to rebuild the city-mech from scratch.
The Mighty Servant of Leuk-O is a construct, and an artifact, so yes. As for a PC becoming an artifact... that's really up to the DM to allow or not, but I'd say no, because you'd be "immune to direct physical and magical harm". It would make for a really interesting NPC, though...
Well, the DM (who is also the creater of our homebrew world) approves, and so does the rest of the playgroup. Also, due to our particular cosmology, my invincible nature will likely not come into play very often (not to mention that we only rarely play our god characters. Usually they just appear in camios as NPCs).
Alias
06-29-07, 12:02 PM Well, the DM (who is also the creater of our homebrew world) approves, and so does the rest of the playgroup. Also, due to our particular cosmology, my invincible nature will likely not come into play very often (not to mention that we only rarely play our god characters. Usually they just appear in camios as NPCs).
Well, if you guys are having fun and everyone's cool with it, go for it. I'm going to start working on that guide today, so I'll let you know how it works out.
Alias
07-04-07, 12:41 PM Here's a preliminary version of the Craft Artifact divine ability, first written up as a feat. This is from the first time I was working on this system - I've started working on it again, but I haven't gotten this far yet.

The artifact in question, if a weapon or armor, must be of excellent (+5) or better craftsmanship; if it is another item, the creator must make the appropriate Craft check (DC 40) to make the item (which costs 100 times normal). All other criteria are as above. Only minor artifacts can be made in this manner.

Crafting artifacts is not simply a matter of gathering necessary components, casting a few spells, spending some time, gp, and XP, and voila – a magic item. Magic items, for the most part, require the appropriate feat, as well as the specific spells noted in the prerequisites. A few require a the creator to be a specific race or have a feat or a certain number of ranks in a skill. Artifacts, on the other hand, take this one step further. Not only do the artifacts themselves have very specific prerequisites (see below), but the individual components themselves often have specific conditions under which they can be gathered or made. An axe of the dwarvish lords, for example, would require pure mithril and adamantine mined by dwarves, and be forged only by dwarves (from the person swinging the hammer to the one working the bellows); a book of vile darkness would require thin plates of obsidian for the covers and tanned skin from some sentient race for the pages. DMs, let your imaginations run wild here – it should never be easy to create an artifact; if the players want to make one, make them work for it. Gathering the components alone could be the object of several adventures, and making the item itself could be the purpose of an entire campaign.

Aside from material concerns, artifacts should also require specific criteria to be met during creation. Let's use the hammer of thunderbolts as an example. First, the crafter must craft the hammer itself from pure mithril and enchant it, exposing it to at least one lightning strike from a natural (not magically created or summoned) thunderstorm. Next, a fighter, barbarian, or ranger wearing gauntlets of ogre power and a girdle of giant strength must use the hammer to slay three or more giants in single combat. Then, and only then, can the hammer achieve its final enhancements.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
RealSorceror 06-26-07, 04:32 PM	I made this thread to get answers on these three questions: First, are there any specific rules for the statistics and creation of artifacts? Both the DMG and EH are too vague for my tastes. My Lesser God character (see link in sig) has just taken the Craft Artifact salient ability. He can obviously create artifacts, but just how long does it take him to do so? Would the time be similiar to creating a non-artifact version of the item? Second, can an existing item become an artifact? What would I need to do for this to happen? Third, can an artifact be something that is "alive", such as a Golem or other construct? If so, does this mean that an intelligent golem character could potentially be an artifact, and therefore immune to direct physical and magical harm? I ask this because my deity character intends to rebuild his metal body as an epic major artifact. Unfortunately, he is Collossal+ and has many, many moving parts (but still falls under the category of golem/vehicle). Let it be known that the DM has full knowledge of this and that it was actually him who suggested it.
Alias 06-27-07, 08:11 PM	Wow... where to start. First, are there any specific rules for the statistics and creation of artifacts? Both the DMG and EH are too vague for my tastes. My Lesser God character (see link in sig) has just taken the Craft Artifact salient ability. He can obviously create artifacts, but just how long does it take him to do so? Would the time be similiar to creating a non-artifact version of the item? No, there aren't. I messed around with it a little last year - reverse-engineered the artifacts from the 1E DMG to figure out what kind/number of powers artifacts of a given level would get - and then let it go. I was actually going to go back to that as soon as I'm done with my current project (s) - so, in a couple days. As for PCs being able to create artifacts... I'd say no, unless you're a god (which you are). I'd ask Upper Krust in this situation - he, I think, has some rules for divinities making artifacts. Second, can an existing item become an artifact? What would I need to do for this to happen? Sure. The way our group does it is: It has to have a name. It has to have a special purpose (either specifically made for that purpose, or ends up being used for that purpose, like slaying demons). It has to be used by one person for a long period of time - 20 levels or so is typical. It has to have been used in several noteworthy events. It's a pretty free-form system - those are pretty much guidelines that we follow. Third, can an artifact be something that is "alive", such as a Golem or other construct? If so, does this mean that an intelligent golem character could potentially be an artifact, and therefore immune to direct physical and magical harm? The Mighty Servant of Leuk-O is a construct, and an artifact, so yes. As for a PC becoming an artifact... that's really up to the DM to allow or not, but I'd say no, because you'd be "immune to direct physical and magical harm". It would make for a really interesting NPC, though...
RealSorceror 06-28-07, 01:51 PM	Wow... where to start. No, there aren't. I messed around with it a little last year - reverse-engineered the artifacts from the 1E DMG to figure out what kind/number of powers artifacts of a given level would get - and then let it go. I was actually going to go back to that as soon as I'm done with my current project (s) - so, in a couple days. As for PCs being able to create artifacts... I'd say no, unless you're a god (which you are). I'd ask Upper Krust in this situation - he, I think, has some rules for divinities making artifacts. Ya, its pretty frustrating not knowing how to do something that your character knows how to do. I'll PM Upper Krust and see what he thinks. Sure. The way our group does it is: It has to have a name. It has to have a special purpose (either specifically made for that purpose, or ends up being used for that purpose, like slaying demons). It has to be used by one person for a long period of time - 20 levels or so is typical. It has to have been used in several noteworthy events. It's a pretty free-form system - those are pretty much guidelines that we follow. Its name is the Great Engine, and is also widely known as Dotrak or Thunderclese. Its special purpose to provide a place for scholars, inventers, and engineers to live and practice their craft. It is literally both a city and a giant robot. Any other special purposes would be directly related to my domains and portfolio. Lastly, the robot houses my divine power, and is in many ways my physical body. The mech has been around for something like 500 years. The mech was used in combat against alien gods, and severaly damaged one of them. The mech has also participated in freindly sparring matches against other native deities. And lastly, the mech assisted in destroying a moon that was falling toward the planet (ya, our god characters do some epic bs). Looks like I meet all those criteria. Thats good, because it would likely take me a very, very long time to rebuild the city-mech from scratch. The Mighty Servant of Leuk-O is a construct, and an artifact, so yes. As for a PC becoming an artifact... that's really up to the DM to allow or not, but I'd say no, because you'd be "immune to direct physical and magical harm". It would make for a really interesting NPC, though... Well, the DM (who is also the creater of our homebrew world) approves, and so does the rest of the playgroup. Also, due to our particular cosmology, my invincible nature will likely not come into play very often (not to mention that we only rarely play our god characters. Usually they just appear in camios as NPCs).
Alias 06-29-07, 12:02 PM	Well, the DM (who is also the creater of our homebrew world) approves, and so does the rest of the playgroup. Also, due to our particular cosmology, my invincible nature will likely not come into play very often (not to mention that we only rarely play our god characters. Usually they just appear in camios as NPCs). Well, if you guys are having fun and everyone's cool with it, go for it. I'm going to start working on that guide today, so I'll let you know how it works out.
Alias 07-04-07, 12:41 PM	Here's a preliminary version of the Craft Artifact divine ability, first written up as a feat. This is from the first time I was working on this system - I've started working on it again, but I haven't gotten this far yet. The artifact in question, if a weapon or armor, must be of excellent (+5) or better craftsmanship; if it is another item, the creator must make the appropriate Craft check (DC 40) to make the item (which costs 100 times normal). All other criteria are as above. Only minor artifacts can be made in this manner. Crafting artifacts is not simply a matter of gathering necessary components, casting a few spells, spending some time, gp, and XP, and voila – a magic item. Magic items, for the most part, require the appropriate feat, as well as the specific spells noted in the prerequisites. A few require a the creator to be a specific race or have a feat or a certain number of ranks in a skill. Artifacts, on the other hand, take this one step further. Not only do the artifacts themselves have very specific prerequisites (see below), but the individual components themselves often have specific conditions under which they can be gathered or made. An axe of the dwarvish lords, for example, would require pure mithril and adamantine mined by dwarves, and be forged only by dwarves (from the person swinging the hammer to the one working the bellows); a book of vile darkness would require thin plates of obsidian for the covers and tanned skin from some sentient race for the pages. DMs, let your imaginations run wild here – it should never be easy to create an artifact; if the players want to make one, make them work for it. Gathering the components alone could be the object of several adventures, and making the item itself could be the purpose of an entire campaign. Aside from material concerns, artifacts should also require specific criteria to be met during creation. Let's use the hammer of thunderbolts as an example. First, the crafter must craft the hammer itself from pure mithril and enchant it, exposing it to at least one lightning strike from a natural (not magically created or summoned) thunderstorm. Next, a fighter, barbarian, or ranger wearing gauntlets of ogre power and a girdle of giant strength must use the hammer to slay three or more giants in single combat. Then, and only then, can the hammer achieve its final enhancements.