Epic Vestiges: Any thoughts? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Epic Vestiges: Any thoughts? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Pitiless_Interfector
06-12-07, 02:47 PM Anybody done anything on epic vestiges? The binder class just doesn't feel epic until and unless it acquires epic vestiges.

Epic vestiges: These should be truly monumental beings. An epic binder might make a pact with Lucifer himself, or with a Far Realm entity locked beyond the universe by its insane brethren. Little or nothing of the vestige's legend should be known to mortals; instead, hints at a mythic past and impossible future should be sprinkled liberally throughout the vestige's concept.
NOTE: If you're having trouble coming up with a name for your vestige, look up the Lesser Key of Solomon on Wikipedia. Almost all the vestiges in ToM come from the Key, except for Geryon (a three-headed giant from Greek Mythology), Eurynome (a titaness in Greek myths), and Orthos (a canine similar to cerberus, who was owned by Geryon the giant and referred to as Orthrus in Greek myths).
Influence: This should be more than a simple inclination, quirk, or personality trait. Epic vestiges have a purpose, and so should their influence. A binder who fails his check might receive telepathic commands from the vestige, and receive a negative level for ignoring or countermanding those commands [which ignores the soul guardian class feature, obviously].

Epic Pactmaker (Epic)
You can make pacts with inhuman entities of unimaginable power, gaining abilities far beyond an ordinary binder.
Prerequisites: Effective binder level 21st, Knowledge (the planes) 24 ranks
Benefits: You may now bind vestiges of 9th level and higher. This follows all the rules for pact magic as outlined in Tome of Magic, with the following exceptions:

Epic vestiges are not bound as rigorously to the standard rules and laws of the supernatural. Therefore, an antimagic field only suppresses vestige abilities if the binder fails a binder level check (DC 30 + CL of antimagic field - vestige level).
Epic vestiges require a certain level of knowledge regarding the otherwordly. Thus, each vestige requires a minimum number of ranks in Knowledge (the planes) in order to summon it, and the Ignore Special Requirements feat does not circumvent this measure.

Here are a few examples:

Alastor, The Chosen One
Alastor is an enigmatic being who grants great powers of destruction to those who bind him.
Legend: Alastor is an enigmatic being whose origins defy detailed investigation. Even the most powerful of epic divinations reveal no more than a blank void when Alastor is subjected to their scrutiny. Nevertheless, his name and his power are well-known to learned binders.
Seal: Three cruciform glyphs entwined around a central spiral, with innumerable tiny dots and lines forming patterns at the edges.
Vestige Level: 9th (Epic)
Minimum Ranks: 33
Binding DC: 50
Special Requirement: You must obtain a powerful demonic weapon, be it the sword of a balor or the axe of a molydeus, and place it within the seal.
Manifestation: With a shimmering in the air, a powerful force seizes hold of the weapon and causes it to straighten and rise into the air. For the briefest instant, a humanoid-shaped distortion in the air appears to grip the weapon and hold it in salute, then vanishes. Alastor speaks through his armament, causing the blade to hum and crackle with power as his booming baritone reverberates through and beyond it. Alastor's presence bends the very fabric of the planes, setting off shadowquakes and etheric cyclones at the moment he is called. Once the pact is made, the disturbances are quelled, and the floating weapon winks out, only to reappear in your hand in the form of an otherwordly sword constructed of an unidentifiable blue metal and embossed with red and silver glyphs and runes.
Sign: Your eyes become silvery orbs, and you leave ripples and distortions in the air as you walk, as if you were a plate of obsidian in the middle of a burning desert. The weapon with which you called him never leaves your hand for more than 1 round unless commanded to do so during combat.
Influence: Those who toy unwisely with Alastor become prey to his whims. The vestige will send empathic commands to the binder; the binder isn't even aware of another being, he simply knows in his head what he must do. If he ignores the rejoinder and neglects fulfilling Alastor's antediluvian purpose, he gains a negative level that will persist until he begins working towards the Chosen One's aims, at which point all such negative levels are removed. These negative levels also vanish when the pact ends or if Alastor is expelled for some reason.
Granted Abilities:
Alastor grants you physical and spiritual might, and a weapon worthy of a destroyer of worlds.
Might of Alastor: While bound to Alastor, you are immune to ability damage, ability drain, poison, disease, fatigue, exhaustion, death effects, petrification, and any effect requiring a Fortitude save unless it also works on objects or is harmless or requires a willing target. You also gain DR 30/epic and starmetal and the benefits of a giant size spell that lasts for as long as you desire, affecting you and your equipment (including Alastor's Blade, as described below)
Fury of Alastor: While wielding the Blade of Alastor, you gain the benefits of the Great Cleave, Overwhelming Critical (fullblade), Devastating Critical (fullblade), Improved Whirlwind Attack, Improved Awesome Blow (affects all attacks with the blade without the -4 penalty), Wield Oversize Weapon (makes the blade of Alastor deal 10d8 damage while using giant size), and Exotic Weapon Proficiency (fullblade)
Alastor's Blade: Binding Alastor grants your demonic weapon the power of the mighty Destroyer (replacing its previous powers and abilities). It becomes a +8 fiery blast ghost touch brilliant energy fullblade of speed and ignores hardness and damage reduction of all kinds, save those of artifacts and deities (as far as is known; Alastor's purpose remains unclear, despite his many pawns). Unlike most brilliant energy weapons, the blade of Alastor can affect nonliving things, even cutting through magical effects such as a wall of force or prismatic sphere; the weapon's ability to ignore armor comes from its ability to destroy anything it touches. Anything that touches its blade is affected as if by a disintegrate spell, taking 2d6 points of damage per EBL, or 5d6 on a successful Fortitude save (DC 10 + 1/2 EBL + Cha modifier). Anything reduced to 0 or fewer hp is turned to dust. While you are bound to Alastor, the weapon cannot be destroyed by any mortal means (and few deific means, for that matter), ignoring any effects that would harm or suppress the weapon or its powers.

Lucifer, The Prince of Darkness
Legend: Little is known about Lucifer. He claims to be the first ruler of Baator, though the Nine Hells were the province of Asmodeus since time out of mind. Perhaps Lucifer was a lord of the ancient Baatorians, the diabolical creatures that predated the baatezu, much as the obyriths predated the tanar’ri. However, what is known is that Lucifer was once an angel, a powerful force for good who outstripped the mightiest solar in skill and power. But despite, or perhaps because of, his lofty status, he succumbed to hubris, jealousy, and greed; turning to evil, he was cast down into Hell, along with all those who followed him, becoming the first Lord of the Pit. It is unknown who or what finally brought about his end; all we know is that Asmodeus rules now, and laughs off questions about whether he was the first Prince of Darkness.
Seal: An inverted pentagram with three sixes spiraling about the center
Vestige Level: 9th (Epic)
Minimum Ranks: 38
Binding DC: 66
Special Requirement: Lucifer seeks to corrupt pure souls, and has little interest in the damned. Thus, he will not answer the call of an evil binder, or a hellborn or a character with devil-touched feats.
Manifestation: With a dull roar like a volcano, the summoning sigil explodes in a gout of hellfire while the shrieking of the damned washes forth. This goes on for 1 full round as a black, winged shape slowly looms up inside the circle. At the beginning of the next round, the geyser of hellfire dwindles to tiny ribbons that lick up and down the lines of the seal. When the conflagration has quieted, the figure in the center becomes clearly visible. He is at once beautiful and hideous. His smooth, pale skin is livid with scars and half-healed burns that weep blood onto the tiles, only to evaporate in the flames. His once-feathered wings are little more than blackened bones, to which scraps of charred flesh cling like wet leaves. The scent of brimstone and charred flesh is nauseating. He turns to look at you, angelic face marred by curved black horns on a bald pate and fiery crimson eyes that weep tears of black pitch. Despite his agony, or perhaps because of it, he smiles at you, revealing crooked, yellow fangs. In a chillingly friendly voice, he addresses you by name and folds his wings behind him to begin the process of pactmaking.
Sign: A trio of sixes radiating outward in a spiral forms on some discrete part of your body.
Influence: Lucifer requires that you commit evil whenever the opportunity to do so (and get away with it) presents itself.
Granted Powers: Lucifer grants binders the powers of Hell.
Fires of Hell: As a standard action, a binder can make a ranged touch attack to immolate a foe in unholy fire. If the attack hits, the target takes 1d8 points of vile unholy damage per EBL immediately, and once each round at the beginning of its turn for one round per effective binder level. Any creature adjacent to the target must make a Reflex save (DC 10 + 1/2 EBL + Cha modifier) or ignite as well, taking full damage for the full duration (the duration resets for the secondary target, though the original’s countdown continues). As a swift action, the binder can limn himself and his weapon with these fires, which deal no damage to him or his equipment but force foes adjacent to him to make a Reflex save or catch fire. Additionally, any attack he makes with his ranseur automatically ignite their target on a successful hit. These flames can only be extinguished with holy water. Creatures with the [Good] subtype take double damage from the flames and receive a –4 penalty on Reflex saves to avoid igniting.
Shepherd of Black Sheep: At will as a swift action, a pactmaker bound to Lucifer can call into being a +6 wounding cold iron ranseur of chaotic and good outsider dread and unholy axiomatic power. All damage dealt by the weapon is considered vile damage, including the wounding damage. A foe struck must make a Fortitude save (DC 10 + 1/2 EBL + Cha modifier) or begin to bleed, taking 1 point of Constitution damage at the beginning of its next turn, and on each succeeding turn until it succeeds on a Fortitude save or it dies.
Flight: You gain a fly speed equal to twice your ordinary land speed, with good maneuverability.
Skin of the Devil: You gain DR 30/epic, holy, and silver
Heart of the Devil: Spells and magical effects treat you as if your alignment were Lawful Evil, regardless of your current alignment. Furthermore, you gain fast healing 5.
Eyes of the Devil: You can see perfectly in darkness of any kind, even that created by a blacklight spell. You also gain the benefits of true seeing out to the limits of your vision, and can instinctively detect alignment auras as if you were simultaneously under the effect of detect chaos, detect evil, detect good, and detect law and concentrated on all four spells for the full three rounds. You gain these benefits immediately and are not adversely affected by overwhelming auras.
BillTheManiac
06-12-07, 04:01 PM I don't know. Their are only so many templates for "beings of rediculous power." "We don't know what he is" doesn't really cut it and you should try to minimize that. Here is a random ide for an unknowable Far Realms-type entity I thought up one time:

1. This creature's mate or companion or something was split apart and scattered accross the multiverse. It searches for the components and puts it back together, then realizes it is incorrect and, in rage, smashes and scatters it, in an endless cycle. Its influence is to hoard seemingly random magic items. People shouldn't know this, though.
Powers:
True Ressurection at will, using magic items instead of the material components.
Combine Items: Combine items with a combined value of spell level*caster level*1000 gp or higher to cast any wizard spell in its casting time. Lose access to those items for 24 hours.
Some kind of shattering thing, maybe.
Pitiless_Interfector
06-12-07, 06:32 PM "We don't know what he is" doesn't really cut it.

I thought 'fear of the unknown' was the greatest fear, and that vestiges were supposed to be enigmatic and incomprehensible entities with mysterious origins and agendas? Besides, they already did "we don't know what he is" for Orthos. The legends should be more of a general dossier on their personality and what binders have done with them in the past. I mean, you can't even summon them if you don't have enough ranks in Knowledge (the planes), so they're not exactly celebrities.
BillTheManiac
06-12-07, 07:03 PM Besides, they already did "we don't know what he is" for Orthos.
Exactly. I don't know which one Orthos is, but the door-opener guy and the Howling Wind are both unknowns. The point of vestiges is that they are magic with personality. "Hi, I'm an unknown guy that helps you do X", "Yes, I'm an unknown guy that helps you do Y", doesn't cut it. Random ideas:

A creature whose story would topple a major world faith, hidden by that faith's god and church.
An evil wizard with a signature epic spell that was used to rend life from bodies turned all his victims into a single vestige. His apprentice killed him with the same spell before being defeated by adventurers, and he is a vestige as well.
The mythical ancestor of a D&D monster race.
An ordinary human farmer granted cosmic power for no apparent reason.
Taeldrin Laesrash
06-12-07, 07:42 PM So are we assuming that Epic Vestiges are just another level of vestiges, like a 9th-level vestige? I've got some ideas, not all of which are simply "We don't know what it is." I'll put some up.
Pitiless_Interfector
06-12-07, 08:35 PM Check it (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=853969)
Taeldrin Laesrash
06-12-07, 08:51 PM That is really cool. Seriously, it could be a whole pantheon, where the most powerful names are summoned to possess its insane priests. Not all of them should be epic, not all of them should be summoned vestiges, but dang, that is cool.
DarkSunLord1
10-16-07, 03:51 AM I heard on Dicefreaks that someone here mad a Lady of Pain epic vestige.

I have never found it.
IRememberCecil
10-16-07, 05:10 PM I heard on Dicefreaks that someone here mad a Lady of Pain epic vestige.

I have never found it.
Ma Yuan would also make a kickass Vestige.

I got an idea the other day for a Vestige: The Abyss itself. As in, the plane. The bottomless pit of hatred and fury, that lives and breathes as it spawns endless amounts of offspring to further its agenda.

I have another idea for an epic feat:

Epic Favored Vestige [epic]
As your power increases, so strengthens your connection with a Vestige that you can bind.
Prerequisites: Pactmaker level 21st, Favored Vestige
Benefit: All benefits that your Vestige grants are doubled in power. This includes the magnitude of any damage reduction (and can only be overcome by epic weapons that possess the same qualities), enhancement bonuses to ability scores, skill bonuses. If there exists an epic version of a feat that the Vestige grants, the Vestige grants that as a bonus feat instead (Otiax grants Epic Combat Reflexes, and Paimon grants Improved Whirlwind Attack). Summoned items have their enhancement bonus increased by +2 and +1 for every 3rd effective binder level beyond 21st.

Exception: Extra damage dice (such as those granted by sneak attack) are not multiplied, though they do still advance as normal. Note that damage dice gained from special abilities are not extra damage dice, and as such are doubled, as normal.

Furthermore, all abilities granted by your favored Vestige have their save DCs increased by 4. This increase does not stack with the one granted by the Favored Vestige Focus feat.

Special: This feat can be gained multiple times. Its benefits do not stack. Each time you select it, you choose a new Vestige as a favored Vestige.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Pitiless_Interfector 06-12-07, 02:47 PM	Anybody done anything on epic vestiges? The binder class just doesn't feel epic until and unless it acquires epic vestiges. Epic vestiges: These should be truly monumental beings. An epic binder might make a pact with Lucifer himself, or with a Far Realm entity locked beyond the universe by its insane brethren. Little or nothing of the vestige's legend should be known to mortals; instead, hints at a mythic past and impossible future should be sprinkled liberally throughout the vestige's concept. NOTE: If you're having trouble coming up with a name for your vestige, look up the Lesser Key of Solomon on Wikipedia. Almost all the vestiges in ToM come from the Key, except for Geryon (a three-headed giant from Greek Mythology), Eurynome (a titaness in Greek myths), and Orthos (a canine similar to cerberus, who was owned by Geryon the giant and referred to as Orthrus in Greek myths). Influence: This should be more than a simple inclination, quirk, or personality trait. Epic vestiges have a purpose, and so should their influence. A binder who fails his check might receive telepathic commands from the vestige, and receive a negative level for ignoring or countermanding those commands [which ignores the soul guardian class feature, obviously]. Epic Pactmaker (Epic) You can make pacts with inhuman entities of unimaginable power, gaining abilities far beyond an ordinary binder. Prerequisites: Effective binder level 21st, Knowledge (the planes) 24 ranks Benefits: You may now bind vestiges of 9th level and higher. This follows all the rules for pact magic as outlined in Tome of Magic, with the following exceptions: Epic vestiges are not bound as rigorously to the standard rules and laws of the supernatural. Therefore, an antimagic field only suppresses vestige abilities if the binder fails a binder level check (DC 30 + CL of antimagic field - vestige level). Epic vestiges require a certain level of knowledge regarding the otherwordly. Thus, each vestige requires a minimum number of ranks in Knowledge (the planes) in order to summon it, and the Ignore Special Requirements feat does not circumvent this measure. Here are a few examples: Alastor, The Chosen One Alastor is an enigmatic being who grants great powers of destruction to those who bind him. Legend: Alastor is an enigmatic being whose origins defy detailed investigation. Even the most powerful of epic divinations reveal no more than a blank void when Alastor is subjected to their scrutiny. Nevertheless, his name and his power are well-known to learned binders. Seal: Three cruciform glyphs entwined around a central spiral, with innumerable tiny dots and lines forming patterns at the edges. Vestige Level: 9th (Epic) Minimum Ranks: 33 Binding DC: 50 Special Requirement: You must obtain a powerful demonic weapon, be it the sword of a balor or the axe of a molydeus, and place it within the seal. Manifestation: With a shimmering in the air, a powerful force seizes hold of the weapon and causes it to straighten and rise into the air. For the briefest instant, a humanoid-shaped distortion in the air appears to grip the weapon and hold it in salute, then vanishes. Alastor speaks through his armament, causing the blade to hum and crackle with power as his booming baritone reverberates through and beyond it. Alastor's presence bends the very fabric of the planes, setting off shadowquakes and etheric cyclones at the moment he is called. Once the pact is made, the disturbances are quelled, and the floating weapon winks out, only to reappear in your hand in the form of an otherwordly sword constructed of an unidentifiable blue metal and embossed with red and silver glyphs and runes. Sign: Your eyes become silvery orbs, and you leave ripples and distortions in the air as you walk, as if you were a plate of obsidian in the middle of a burning desert. The weapon with which you called him never leaves your hand for more than 1 round unless commanded to do so during combat. Influence: Those who toy unwisely with Alastor become prey to his whims. The vestige will send empathic commands to the binder; the binder isn't even aware of another being, he simply knows in his head what he must do. If he ignores the rejoinder and neglects fulfilling Alastor's antediluvian purpose, he gains a negative level that will persist until he begins working towards the Chosen One's aims, at which point all such negative levels are removed. These negative levels also vanish when the pact ends or if Alastor is expelled for some reason. Granted Abilities: Alastor grants you physical and spiritual might, and a weapon worthy of a destroyer of worlds. Might of Alastor: While bound to Alastor, you are immune to ability damage, ability drain, poison, disease, fatigue, exhaustion, death effects, petrification, and any effect requiring a Fortitude save unless it also works on objects or is harmless or requires a willing target. You also gain DR 30/epic and starmetal and the benefits of a giant size spell that lasts for as long as you desire, affecting you and your equipment (including Alastor's Blade, as described below) Fury of Alastor: While wielding the Blade of Alastor, you gain the benefits of the Great Cleave, Overwhelming Critical (fullblade), Devastating Critical (fullblade), Improved Whirlwind Attack, Improved Awesome Blow (affects all attacks with the blade without the -4 penalty), Wield Oversize Weapon (makes the blade of Alastor deal 10d8 damage while using giant size), and Exotic Weapon Proficiency (fullblade) Alastor's Blade: Binding Alastor grants your demonic weapon the power of the mighty Destroyer (replacing its previous powers and abilities). It becomes a +8 fiery blast ghost touch brilliant energy fullblade of speed and ignores hardness and damage reduction of all kinds, save those of artifacts and deities (as far as is known; Alastor's purpose remains unclear, despite his many pawns). Unlike most brilliant energy weapons, the blade of Alastor can affect nonliving things, even cutting through magical effects such as a wall of force or prismatic sphere; the weapon's ability to ignore armor comes from its ability to destroy anything it touches. Anything that touches its blade is affected as if by a disintegrate spell, taking 2d6 points of damage per EBL, or 5d6 on a successful Fortitude save (DC 10 + 1/2 EBL + Cha modifier). Anything reduced to 0 or fewer hp is turned to dust. While you are bound to Alastor, the weapon cannot be destroyed by any mortal means (and few deific means, for that matter), ignoring any effects that would harm or suppress the weapon or its powers. Lucifer, The Prince of Darkness Legend: Little is known about Lucifer. He claims to be the first ruler of Baator, though the Nine Hells were the province of Asmodeus since time out of mind. Perhaps Lucifer was a lord of the ancient Baatorians, the diabolical creatures that predated the baatezu, much as the obyriths predated the tanar’ri. However, what is known is that Lucifer was once an angel, a powerful force for good who outstripped the mightiest solar in skill and power. But despite, or perhaps because of, his lofty status, he succumbed to hubris, jealousy, and greed; turning to evil, he was cast down into Hell, along with all those who followed him, becoming the first Lord of the Pit. It is unknown who or what finally brought about his end; all we know is that Asmodeus rules now, and laughs off questions about whether he was the first Prince of Darkness. Seal: An inverted pentagram with three sixes spiraling about the center Vestige Level: 9th (Epic) Minimum Ranks: 38 Binding DC: 66 Special Requirement: Lucifer seeks to corrupt pure souls, and has little interest in the damned. Thus, he will not answer the call of an evil binder, or a hellborn or a character with devil-touched feats. Manifestation: With a dull roar like a volcano, the summoning sigil explodes in a gout of hellfire while the shrieking of the damned washes forth. This goes on for 1 full round as a black, winged shape slowly looms up inside the circle. At the beginning of the next round, the geyser of hellfire dwindles to tiny ribbons that lick up and down the lines of the seal. When the conflagration has quieted, the figure in the center becomes clearly visible. He is at once beautiful and hideous. His smooth, pale skin is livid with scars and half-healed burns that weep blood onto the tiles, only to evaporate in the flames. His once-feathered wings are little more than blackened bones, to which scraps of charred flesh cling like wet leaves. The scent of brimstone and charred flesh is nauseating. He turns to look at you, angelic face marred by curved black horns on a bald pate and fiery crimson eyes that weep tears of black pitch. Despite his agony, or perhaps because of it, he smiles at you, revealing crooked, yellow fangs. In a chillingly friendly voice, he addresses you by name and folds his wings behind him to begin the process of pactmaking. Sign: A trio of sixes radiating outward in a spiral forms on some discrete part of your body. Influence: Lucifer requires that you commit evil whenever the opportunity to do so (and get away with it) presents itself. Granted Powers: Lucifer grants binders the powers of Hell. Fires of Hell: As a standard action, a binder can make a ranged touch attack to immolate a foe in unholy fire. If the attack hits, the target takes 1d8 points of vile unholy damage per EBL immediately, and once each round at the beginning of its turn for one round per effective binder level. Any creature adjacent to the target must make a Reflex save (DC 10 + 1/2 EBL + Cha modifier) or ignite as well, taking full damage for the full duration (the duration resets for the secondary target, though the original’s countdown continues). As a swift action, the binder can limn himself and his weapon with these fires, which deal no damage to him or his equipment but force foes adjacent to him to make a Reflex save or catch fire. Additionally, any attack he makes with his ranseur automatically ignite their target on a successful hit. These flames can only be extinguished with holy water. Creatures with the [Good] subtype take double damage from the flames and receive a –4 penalty on Reflex saves to avoid igniting. Shepherd of Black Sheep: At will as a swift action, a pactmaker bound to Lucifer can call into being a +6 wounding cold iron ranseur of chaotic and good outsider dread and unholy axiomatic power. All damage dealt by the weapon is considered vile damage, including the wounding damage. A foe struck must make a Fortitude save (DC 10 + 1/2 EBL + Cha modifier) or begin to bleed, taking 1 point of Constitution damage at the beginning of its next turn, and on each succeeding turn until it succeeds on a Fortitude save or it dies. Flight: You gain a fly speed equal to twice your ordinary land speed, with good maneuverability. Skin of the Devil: You gain DR 30/epic, holy, and silver Heart of the Devil: Spells and magical effects treat you as if your alignment were Lawful Evil, regardless of your current alignment. Furthermore, you gain fast healing 5. Eyes of the Devil: You can see perfectly in darkness of any kind, even that created by a blacklight spell. You also gain the benefits of true seeing out to the limits of your vision, and can instinctively detect alignment auras as if you were simultaneously under the effect of detect chaos, detect evil, detect good, and detect law and concentrated on all four spells for the full three rounds. You gain these benefits immediately and are not adversely affected by overwhelming auras.
BillTheManiac 06-12-07, 04:01 PM	I don't know. Their are only so many templates for "beings of rediculous power." "We don't know what he is" doesn't really cut it and you should try to minimize that. Here is a random ide for an unknowable Far Realms-type entity I thought up one time: 1. This creature's mate or companion or something was split apart and scattered accross the multiverse. It searches for the components and puts it back together, then realizes it is incorrect and, in rage, smashes and scatters it, in an endless cycle. Its influence is to hoard seemingly random magic items. People shouldn't know this, though. Powers: True Ressurection at will, using magic items instead of the material components. Combine Items: Combine items with a combined value of spell levelcaster level1000 gp or higher to cast any wizard spell in its casting time. Lose access to those items for 24 hours. Some kind of shattering thing, maybe.
Pitiless_Interfector 06-12-07, 06:32 PM	"We don't know what he is" doesn't really cut it. I thought 'fear of the unknown' was the greatest fear, and that vestiges were supposed to be enigmatic and incomprehensible entities with mysterious origins and agendas? Besides, they already did "we don't know what he is" for Orthos. The legends should be more of a general dossier on their personality and what binders have done with them in the past. I mean, you can't even summon them if you don't have enough ranks in Knowledge (the planes), so they're not exactly celebrities.
BillTheManiac 06-12-07, 07:03 PM	Besides, they already did "we don't know what he is" for Orthos. Exactly. I don't know which one Orthos is, but the door-opener guy and the Howling Wind are both unknowns. The point of vestiges is that they are magic with personality. "Hi, I'm an unknown guy that helps you do X", "Yes, I'm an unknown guy that helps you do Y", doesn't cut it. Random ideas: A creature whose story would topple a major world faith, hidden by that faith's god and church. An evil wizard with a signature epic spell that was used to rend life from bodies turned all his victims into a single vestige. His apprentice killed him with the same spell before being defeated by adventurers, and he is a vestige as well. The mythical ancestor of a D&D monster race. An ordinary human farmer granted cosmic power for no apparent reason.
Taeldrin Laesrash 06-12-07, 07:42 PM	So are we assuming that Epic Vestiges are just another level of vestiges, like a 9th-level vestige? I've got some ideas, not all of which are simply "We don't know what it is." I'll put some up.
Pitiless_Interfector 06-12-07, 08:35 PM	Check it (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=853969)
Taeldrin Laesrash 06-12-07, 08:51 PM	That is really cool. Seriously, it could be a whole pantheon, where the most powerful names are summoned to possess its insane priests. Not all of them should be epic, not all of them should be summoned vestiges, but dang, that is cool.
DarkSunLord1 10-16-07, 03:51 AM	I heard on Dicefreaks that someone here mad a Lady of Pain epic vestige. I have never found it.
IRememberCecil 10-16-07, 05:10 PM	I heard on Dicefreaks that someone here mad a Lady of Pain epic vestige. I have never found it. Ma Yuan would also make a kickass Vestige. I got an idea the other day for a Vestige: The Abyss itself. As in, the plane. The bottomless pit of hatred and fury, that lives and breathes as it spawns endless amounts of offspring to further its agenda. I have another idea for an epic feat: Epic Favored Vestige [epic] As your power increases, so strengthens your connection with a Vestige that you can bind. Prerequisites: Pactmaker level 21st, Favored Vestige Benefit: All benefits that your Vestige grants are doubled in power. This includes the magnitude of any damage reduction (and can only be overcome by epic weapons that possess the same qualities), enhancement bonuses to ability scores, skill bonuses. If there exists an epic version of a feat that the Vestige grants, the Vestige grants that as a bonus feat instead (Otiax grants Epic Combat Reflexes, and Paimon grants Improved Whirlwind Attack). Summoned items have their enhancement bonus increased by +2 and +1 for every 3rd effective binder level beyond 21st. Exception: Extra damage dice (such as those granted by sneak attack) are not multiplied, though they do still advance as normal. Note that damage dice gained from special abilities are not extra damage dice, and as such are doubled, as normal. Furthermore, all abilities granted by your favored Vestige have their save DCs increased by 4. This increase does not stack with the one granted by the Favored Vestige Focus feat. Special: This feat can be gained multiple times. Its benefits do not stack. Each time you select it, you choose a new Vestige as a favored Vestige.