Post/Author/DateTime	Post
killswitchxxx 05-23-07, 09:06 AM	im my campaign im gonna attack the nine hells and abyss with my 2 billion person army what special unit should i have and special items would work out?
Grandmaster_Kane 05-23-07, 09:23 AM	Well i dont think you should do this considering the amount of time it would take to move 2 billion people into hell By the time your last guy got throught the first 1.99999999 billion would have been slaughtered
killswitchxxx 05-23-07, 09:30 AM	umm i have like a billion lv ones but i have a legion of lv 20s but i would diffently have a huge chance if i had alot of holy water? or a iron colossus and a rod of wyrm because i have 300 mill and dont know what to buy with it have any suggestions?
Aluroon 05-23-07, 09:47 AM	umm i have like a billion lv ones but i have a legion of lv 20s but i would diffently have a huge chance if i had alot of holy water? or a iron colossus and a rod of wyrm because i have 300 mill and dont know what to buy with it have any suggestions? Lots and Lots of Tomb Stones. Do a search for The Gates of Hell and download chapters 8-9. Tomb Stones. Lets ignore the fact your attacking an infinite plane with a theoretically infinite number of devils to throw at you, and the fact that even a single CR 5 devil can devastate hundreds of soldiers or more, or that teams of 20 pit fiends can blanket our level 20 characters with dominates until the role a 1. Any attack upon the outer planes as a whole is pointless. Your better off going after strategic targets, and even then you risk being overwhelmed by legions with access to greater teleport at will.
killswitchxxx 05-23-07, 09:54 AM	hey well can u give me a link for the download and i was thinking about a sea of holy water because i made a flying north america basically with alot of strongholds and that such
Deamon 05-23-07, 01:33 PM	What level are you and you're followers/allies? How powerful are the archfiends that you will be fighting (what stats is the DM using)? How much money do you have for the entire army and what resources do you have?
Rutibex 05-23-07, 02:20 PM	What you should be doing is useing that big pile of money to get all those 1st level "useless" troops Epicly Transformed: http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/seeds/transform.htm Factor it around so that it's an area effect, and maybe throw in a Ward against disjunction. You could get your whole army in one or two castings if the area is large enough (you could build platforms to take advantage of vertical area). Congradulations, you now have 2 billion Solar Angels ready to stomp Hell.
killswitchxxx 05-23-07, 02:57 PM	well i have 300 million and i have a trillion pounds of iron through wish so i can make anything i want also i have a leadership score of 89 and i have times 20 to the amount cause i have legendary commender and extra followers so what should i get for this army cause i lost ideas besides 209 iron colossus and rods of wyrm and i have the highest lv of followers are 22
Rutibex 05-23-07, 03:44 PM	well i have 300 million and i have a trillion pounds of iron through wish so i can make anything i want also i have a leadership score of 89 and i have times 20 to the amount cause i have legendary commender and extra followers so what should i get for this army cause i lost ideas besides 209 iron colossus and rods of wyrm and i have the highest lv of followers are 22 You should have all you followers that are over level 7 take Leadership as well :D
killswitchxxx 05-23-07, 03:50 PM	but u cant do that there npcs so i would do that but i have the whole worlds armys as my own army but is there any items or equipment i should get ??
Deamon 05-23-07, 03:53 PM	What level are you? How many spellcasters do you have and of what level? Can you cast epic spells and if so of what DC?
killswitchxxx 05-23-07, 03:58 PM	im a lv 24 monk and i have one spellcaster which is lv 23 my dm has the epic book so idk if the sor can cast epic spells but we also have a 23 cleric so i could pay for some mercenary's possibly and what kind of classes should they be?
Deamon 05-23-07, 04:15 PM	Both the sorceror and the cleric can take the epic spellcasting feat (http://srd.plush.org/epicFeats.html#epic-spellcasting). Read the rules on epic spell development (http://srd.plush.org/epicSpellDevelopment.html). As mentioned above the transform seed could be useful. If you choose to do this invest in a magic item to boost spellcraft.
killswitchxxx 05-23-07, 04:20 PM	yea i should do that but im thinking on having some special units like dragons and that such i have a diplomacy check mod of 70 so could i convince a dragon to work for me or something?
Grandmaster_Kane 05-23-07, 06:29 PM	A great wyrm prismatic dragon would increase your chances from 1: several trillion to about 1 :500,000 Much better odds
Witch 05-23-07, 06:32 PM	What you should be doing is useing that big pile of money to get all those 1st level "useless" troops Epicly Transformed: http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/seeds/transform.htm Factor it around so that it's an area effect, and maybe throw in a Ward against disjunction. You could get your whole army in one or two castings if the area is large enough (you could build platforms to take advantage of vertical area). Congradulations, you now have 2 billion Solar Angels ready to stomp Hell. Don't encourage Epic Spellcasting abuse. Your billions do not matter against the billions of vastly superior devils. Whether you succeed will depend entirely on DM fiat.
bluemage55 05-23-07, 06:49 PM	What you should be doing is useing that big pile of money to get all those 1st level "useless" troops Epicly Transformed: http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/seeds/transform.htm Factor it around so that it's an area effect, and maybe throw in a Ward against disjunction. You could get your whole army in one or two castings if the area is large enough (you could build platforms to take advantage of vertical area). Congradulations, you now have 2 billion Solar Angels ready to stomp Hell. If you really want to cheat, why bother with epic anyway? Just go ahead and use Pun-Pun.
blade_runner 05-23-07, 07:33 PM	My idea. 1. Get enough epic spellcasters together to actually do this 2. Get them on the 9 hells 3. Breach the farplane. That is where the pseudonatural people live, isn't it? (don't ask me how, I know it can be done) 4. Watch the hilarity.
Flymolo 05-23-07, 09:19 PM	If you plan on assaulting the Perdition as put forth by Dicefreaks, you're in for trouble. The Dark Host of the Pit is composed entirely of malefircareim (HD 45, DvR 0), Nessian pit fiends (HD 37), and fully advanced Cornugons. It is at least 9 times larger than the Dark Ministry at its peak (which is thought to currently contain at least 72 trillion devils). So, assuming you have 2 billion troops, the Dark Host alone will outnumber you at least 324,000:1. All of which are creatures that could destroy entire armies of HD 1 soldiers. The primary infernal host will outnumber you a paltry 36,000:1, however. Good odds for any Greek. Oh, yes, and an Overgod serpent the size of the sun (its scales are the size of worlds) with well over HD 100 and roughly DvR 27, lays wounded and angry at the heart of Nessus (if you do somehow reach it). You are playing in some other setting, right? Please, please tell me you are. If so, I'd highly recommend waiting until you are much, much stronger before assaulting the heart of Lawful Evil itself and Chaotic Evil incarnate. Seriously, it will not end well for you.
Flymolo 05-23-07, 09:20 PM	Lots and Lots of Tomb Stones. Do a search for The Gates of Hell and download chapters 8-9. Tomb Stones.. What? I just tried that and it returned no results. What are they?
the.real.elwood 05-23-07, 09:38 PM	Well, if you get down to it, the Gates of Hell rules are merely optional rules put forth by Dicefreaks, which are in no way official, although they are high quality and many use them. But if you were to go ahead and do this, I'd say you'd have a decent chance of conquering a significant portion of the first level of hell, but that's about it. Being an infinite plane, it's hard to conquer everything, and all of the lords of the 9 levels are simply too powerful for you to do any significant conquering, although merely controlling a portion of the first level would be impressive and make you an important figure, though you would constantly be defending it.
blade_runner 05-23-07, 10:03 PM	I seem to be the master of dumb ideas, but here goes another one. Sick the Terresque on them (preferably a failed will save half golem to make it immune to nonleathel damage). Or an army of these: Half green dragon-half iron golem trolls(if they fail the will save and go construct, the only way to kill them is with rust attacks).
Flymolo 05-23-07, 11:29 PM	Well, if you get down to it, the Gates of Hell rules are merely optional rules put forth by Dicefreaks, which are in no way official, although they are high quality and many use them. But if you were to go ahead and do this, I'd say you'd have a decent chance of conquering a significant portion of the first level of hell, but that's about it. Being an infinite plane, it's hard to conquer everything, and all of the lords of the 9 levels are simply too powerful for you to do any significant conquering, although merely controlling a portion of the first level would be impressive and make you an important figure, though you would constantly be defending it. Of course, I simply meant that if he is using that setting, invading Hell at all would not be a good idea. As the bastion of pure Lawful Evil, I personally wouldn't feel comfortable attempting any kind of siege without some sort of powerful trump card. Simple force will get you nowhere if the Lords of the Nine unify against you. I seem to be the master of dumb ideas, but here goes another one. Sick the Terresque on them (preferably a failed will save half golem to make it immune to nonleathel damage). Or an army of these: Half green dragon-half iron golem trolls(if they fail the will save and go construct, the only way to kill them is with rust attacks). Remember, simple immunity to damage isn't really that powerful. I'm sure at least one Lord of the Nine has a big pit with unbreakable walls sitting around unused... Or IIRC such creatures can still be coup-de-graced, right?
blade_runner 05-23-07, 11:45 PM	I believe a CdG can only be used if the victim is rendered helpless, and holding down an army of those trolls (and the Terresque) wouldn't be that easy. As to the pit, that's why you make the whole army out of them (they just charge forward and fill the pit, or crush whatever other obstacle is before them). You know what, I'm going to stop posting now, I've disgraced myself enough (I don't even play D&D, I'm a d20 Modern kind of guy).
Rikandur_Azebol 05-24-07, 01:50 AM	You know ? Being on Your place killswitchxxx I would start with conquering layer of Abyss. Preferably a small one and with weak Lord. Use only Your best troops for that. By best I mean those lvl 10+. How would I do it being on Your place ? Hired an Garrote epix assassins to steal the layer's Demon Lord's soul into a gem and bring You this gem. Your cohorts, arcanist and cleric 23 lvl, deserve to get best equipment You can buy in Sigil or in Union. Invest around 5 millions in the gear for each of them. Invest around 20 millions in gear for Yourself. what Your spellcasters need ? +Con thing (HP, saves, Concentration) +Primary casting stat thing (more spellz, spell DCs !) +Save thing (You don't want them to die screaming, don't You ?) + Spellcraft thing (You want them to cast potent spells) Permament and Tenacious Mindblank. From the top of my head.
NightBreeze 05-24-07, 08:24 AM	First of all, if you are playing this with your DM, I assume that he thinks that it is a possible feat. So he is using his own stats and so on. There's no need for everyone to yell "It's impossible" First of all, you should understand that you 1st level soldiers/fighters would be absolutely useless unless you put them in the condition to be useful. Also, numbers don't count very muck, as you will probably lose any battle of attricion, due to the fact that devils are just too tough. If you were able to (ab)use epic spells, it's easier. But let's play starting from the low. All your base soldiers should be first level clerics with crossbows. This way, they can bless their weapons and aim at the devils with a storm of arrows. Th e only devils that gets it's damage reduction bypassed by good AND silver are cornugons and pit fiends. While fighting devils, your tactic is to slow them and fight them from distance (at least with lemures: they are the simpliest enemy). the problem, is, almost all of the other devils can teleport at will. So your legions shall be trained to shoot concentrated volleys of arrow as soon as they see a devil. Also, all of them should have some silver arrows, so that they can shoot at higher level ones. Out of 1000 clerics shooting at a cornugon, 50 will hit. If it's not an illusion or something else, that's 50d6 damage that bypasses his reduction: he should be dead. All you higher levels should be spellcasters, also. If can post the complete table of your followers: levels and numbers, we can do projects with greater precision. The most important thing is: your army shall be very very well organized. And it should be flexible: by no way a traditional marching army. You should speak with your dm and come up with custom items that allow you to teleport your soldiers. An item that casts teleport ring at will would be a bless: it's cost would be 406k (but it would be an abuse of the magical items creation rules, I suppose) : the one using it starts creating rings of teleportation and the army goes on crossing them. You are not going to take over hell with that army: but as you have them, there's no need to leave them useless, isn't it? They key for victory are your higher level followers.
killswitchxxx 05-24-07, 03:13 PM	ok well could do that with a task force of 20,000 or so with lv 10 fighters and higher in it and i have all the equipment i need im a monk i spent alot of my money on getting my fists to be able to dispel on attack and a 100 in every ability score so i could spend money in the epic assasins but in my group everyone wants to join and fight i have a fighter a bar a solider and a cleric a sor plus the barbarian is a colossal minotaur and the fighter has a 100 in all stats too from buying tattoos and the sor has a 150 from buying a tattoo
NightBreeze 05-24-07, 03:31 PM	Um...yeah....100 in all stats at level 24..? Ph, well, who I am to question your DM sanity? :rolleyes: BTW, do you know what punctuation and formatting is? They don't hurt, trust me. As you seem to have a pretty good high-powered army, aim at the devil's strong and weak point: their organization. They are absolutely organized: this is why them manage to beat demons even when outnumbered 10 to 1. However, there's a reverse to this: they depend on commands. Not all of them are creative or disobey stupid orders: if you manage to disrupt the chain of command, their armies can get a disadvantage. Kill important and influential commanders, and maybe during the battles dispatch casters to dominate weak-minded commanders, forcing them to give stupid orders: not many, if any, of the devils have arcane sight, so it would be difficult for them to understand their leaders is dominated. You shall be very organized, even (and especially) in your party (and post that damned table with all your followers),
killswitchxxx 05-24-07, 03:36 PM	umm yea that would work but i have a teleporting strongholds so i could diffently attack the nine hells with ease because when i have 300 insane strongholds against the demons and devils there pretty much done for plus the strongholds fly move and planeshift the works from stronghold buliders guide
Witch 05-24-07, 04:06 PM	umm yea that would work but i have a teleporting strongholds so i could diffently attack the nine hells with ease because when i have 300 insane strongholds against the demons and devils there pretty much done for plus the strongholds fly move and planeshift the works from stronghold buliders guide The Lords of the Nine control the planar traits of their layers. That means they can control where teleport can work, and who can access it. You do not know where it works, nor will you be allowed access.
NightBreeze 05-24-07, 05:50 PM	The Lords of the Nine control the planar traits of their layers. That means they can control where teleport can work, and who can access it. You do not know where it works, nor will you be allowed access. His DM seems to dislike DF rules, otherwise there would be no sense even to try :P
killswitchxxx 05-24-07, 05:52 PM	yea but my dm doesnt give a crap about that stuff so i can do it
NightBreeze 05-24-07, 05:58 PM	First of all, "that staff" is one of the best non-commercial materials, so don't dispatch it so easilty. I just want to give some help, otherwise I laught at it too. Well, the flying strongholds seem a good idea. Just stuff them with crossbow clerics and take them to fly. However, you should protect them from magical assault: we don't want the devils to make them crash down, do we? Keep the strongholds close to each other and make cross fire. Also, what is your aim? Control or destroy? If you want control, you can obtain only partial one: you will have to raze the key points of each layer (like the bornze and the iron towers), and control the gates. The control of gates is important: every devil can teleport, but they can't planeshift. So, if you manage do destroy/control the permanent gates leading from one layer to another, you can almost arrest the flow of their armies.
killswitchxxx 05-24-07, 06:04 PM	hmm that would work should i bring my flying north asia as well to keep the demons and devils not able to move from one layer to the next? how i got this flying telelporting planeshifting asia is by spending a billion gold on it
Einvaldurinn_mikli 05-24-07, 06:09 PM	How old are you killswitch?
killswitchxxx 05-24-07, 06:19 PM	um u dont need to know so stay on topic
Einvaldurinn_mikli 05-24-07, 06:22 PM	um u dont need to know so stay on topic Oh, I was just curious. As for staying on topic... I would feel pretty confident if I were you. Your DM obviously has no problems with ridiculous things so handing you a layer of the nine hells shouldn't be a problem.
killswitchxxx 05-24-07, 06:34 PM	yea okay but anyway have any plans on what i should do?
Einvaldurinn_mikli 05-24-07, 06:37 PM	Check with your DM if you can create a nuclear bomb. That could be cool. As I already said, I don't think you have to worry about succeeding. It's a matter of doing it with style.
killswitchxxx 05-24-07, 06:42 PM	thats probably the most stupid idea ever but thanks anyway
NightBreeze 05-24-07, 06:59 PM	Lol, was thinking the same think, but I wanted to see how far would he go. Anyway....if you've got an entire flying continent why don't you just throw it at the nine layers?
Einvaldurinn_mikli 05-24-07, 07:06 PM	Lol, was thinking the same think, but I wanted to see how far would he go. Who are you addressing?
NightBreeze 05-24-07, 07:16 PM	Who are you addressing? (I was saying that to you :P )
killswitchxxx 05-24-07, 07:17 PM	um u its a stupid idea for dnd but d20 modern a good idea
Einvaldurinn_mikli 05-24-07, 07:22 PM	um u its a stupid idea for dnd but d20 modern a good idea Are you slow or something? I was mocking you.
Mrloki 05-24-07, 07:31 PM	Are you slow or something? I was mocking you. I understood it! Also this is a dumb idea... your dm pretty well hates rules, and doesn't understand the basis of the game...i'm sorry that you are brainwashed into thinking you are having fun...but oo well!
NightBreeze 05-24-07, 07:39 PM	...i'm sorry that you are brainwashed into thinking you are having fun... May I put this into my sign?
blade_runner 05-24-07, 07:42 PM	Children, do I have to separate you? If he wants a layer of the Nine Hells, let him have it. It's not your problem, In fact I like the idea of humans sticking it to the Devils. Just give him some (good) advice and let him enjoy himself. Oh, btw, I'm 16. Flame away, I can take it.
Einvaldurinn_mikli 05-24-07, 07:46 PM	Oh, btw, I'm 16. Flame away, I can take it. Why should we do that? If I recall correctly, you have pretty good sense for a 16 year old.
NightBreeze 05-24-07, 07:57 PM	Well, I was the first to defend him...but then my patience started running away :P . Still I'd like to help hims, as the idea for a campaign is really good and I'd love to play it as a PC. However, I'd also love him to post the damned table with followers and use some punctuation...it would help me helping him, after all. Physical age is not important, it's the mental one that matters.
Buugipopuu 05-24-07, 07:57 PM	Anyway....if you've got an entire flying continent why don't you just throw it at the nine layers? Not much of a continent however. Going by the rules in the Stronghold Builder's Guidebook, it seems impossible to get a flying planeshifting stronghold for much less than 100,000 gp per stronghold space. I budgeted closer to 2,000,000 gp per stronghold space, but that's because I was being wastefully extravagent. At 100,000 gp/space, 2 billion buys 20,000 stronghold spaces, which fills a volume that's 540 feet by 540 feet by 270 feet. Not really much of a continent. Even building 1 story high only lets you make a 2,800 foot by 2,800 foot by 10 foot stronghold.
blade_runner 05-24-07, 08:50 PM	Where do you get this Stronghold Builders Guide? It sounds awesome (I have visions of walking Steampunk castles of doom in my head). Scheming to take on the 9 hells is an arduous feat. It would be nice to see some stat blocks/battle plans though. (I've never been bothered by incorrect English, but I can see how it could bet annoying too). Oh, thanks for not killing me (and saying I have good sense) I try and be mature, but it does slip away from me sometimes. P.S. Just a hint, the Abyss isn't really infinite, the DM has to run out of ideas sooner or later :).
killswitchxxx 05-24-07, 08:56 PM	ok my dm does use rules but im not sure because im my group we have a kinda disabled kid so he makes it simple for him and he doesnt use rules for things he doesnt care about plus hes only 16 and im 14 so i dont think that hes a master at dming so
Einvaldurinn_mikli 05-24-07, 09:14 PM	How about this: -You find out the names of most of the major devils/demons in the layer you are intending to invade. -You summon and bind them -Invade severly weakened layer, mop up the mooks and declare yourself ruler -??? -Profit!!!
NightBreeze 05-24-07, 09:23 PM	The summoning/binding thingy can be actually difficult without epic spells. But that way of thinking is good: you've got an elite team of characters. Use it to mop down all the important devils/demons. Don't go searching them in their home: it's difficult. Try to get them while they are out somewhere.
Einvaldurinn_mikli 05-24-07, 09:27 PM	The summoning/binding thingy can be actually difficult without epic spells. Then use epic spells. Seriously, he has hundreds of millions to throw around. He can just buy that rod that provides XP for one epic spell, give it to a party spellcaster and have him develop the spell.
NightBreeze 05-24-07, 09:55 PM	Well, he was not very clear about that, but I think they cannot. And even if they could, if we start to use epic spells, the rules will just explode. Can you immagine 2 bilions 1st level cleric contributing to an epic ritual? :D
Einvaldurinn_mikli 05-24-07, 09:56 PM	Well, he was not very clear about that, but I think they cannot. And even if they could, if we start to use epic spells, the rules will just explode. Can you immagine 2 bilions 1st level cleric contributing to an epic ritual? :D >.<
blade_runner 05-24-07, 09:57 PM	He could use the most broken artifact ever (I'm not sure on this one, I haven't read the ELH in a long time) There is a book, this book lets you cast Any spell from any D&D rule book .
jareddm 05-24-07, 11:25 PM	I still liked the nuclear bomb idea... Kiloton Evocation Spellcraft DC: 381 Components: V, S. Casting Time: 10 minutes Range: 3,000 ft. Effect: Variable (see below) Duration: Instantaneous Saving Throw: Fortitude partial. Spell Resistance: No To Develop: 900,000 gp; 18 days; 36,000 XP; Seeds: afflict (DC 14), destroy (DC 29), energy (DC 19) and slay (DC 25). Factors: change from bolt to ball (+2 DC), increase range 900% (+18 DC), increase area 4900% (+196 DC), increase afflict damage 14 points (+56 DC), increase destroy damage by 40d6 (+80 DC), increase energy damage by 30d6 (+60 DC). Mitigating factors: burn 10,000 XP (-100 DC), increase casting time to 10 minutes (-20 DC). This spell creates a massive atomic explosion, mimicking the effects of one kiloton of TNT. The conflagration has four different effects. Firstly, anyone within 150 a feet radius of the epicenter must make a Fortitude save or be disintigrated. Secondly, anyone standing within 250 feet of the epicenter suffers 40d6 fire damage (Fortitude save for half ). Thirdly the shockwave deals 60d6 bludgeoning damage up to a 1000 foot radius (Fortitude save for half). Lastly, anyone within 1000 feet of the epicenter suffers radiation poisoning, which deals 6 points of damage to their Constitution, Dexterity and Strength.
Rikandur_Azebol 05-25-07, 12:19 AM	Yay for the A-bombs. :) As for age issues, I'm 26 ... so WTF ?! killswitchxxx, and again I advise You to start Your conquering from Abyss. It will be good training ground and unlike Hell. You won't face orgainised countermeansures. Just take at the weak demon lord. Use Your casters to create magic item, artifact to be precise, that will allow You to control Abyssal layer. Why ? I guess that You don't want to turn CE and became demon lord Yourself. With artifact made out of previous demon lord, it shouldn't be a problem. Tactic ? Summon and bind the ruling demon/devil. Brainwash/dominate it into submission and absolute obedience. Then all Your army will face would be "rebellion" and loyal devils/demons will help Your forces. If You use Abyssal layer as training ground ... Your forces will learn a bit about inter-planar combat. And if Your control over the Abyssal Layer would became as absolute as demon lord's ... You will gain significant Power. Closest to it is SAFE Wish/at will. :D And ... use Megaton (1000 kilotons) why limit Yourself with big bangs ? :evillaugh how to make it ? Ridiculous amount of extra casters participating in ritual. Make it contingent on Your primary caster who will be able to release it on command. Later You point at something, say an mountain or demon-lord, You dislike and Your caster says "Kazam !" and thing You dislike goes BOOM ! :P
killswitchxxx 05-25-07, 03:53 PM	um yeah that sounds good
Rikandur_Azebol 05-25-07, 11:41 PM	Warn Your DM that this is an ABUSE of rules. ;)
Angus Cotton 05-27-07, 11:00 PM	How about asia PLUS nuclear bombs? Then there is always Ice-9...what would that do to the Abyss? How about your 2 billion man army be all suicide bombers with nuclear bomb briefcases? nasty. nasty.
Geraturatu 05-29-07, 09:50 AM	Dude, just get a high level psion, and have him specialize in Telepathy, then have him cast Thrall. Make sure that his Charisma is so high that nothing can win the save, thus when you cast it on the most powerful creatures you can, you can use them to help, and it's permanent! Also, a good way to use this strategy is to tell your dm that you are looking for the most powerful creature ever heard of. If you have really high level wizards, really epic level bards, or, the best one, a powerful dragon with that draconic knowledge feat. Once you have found the most poweful beast ever heard of, find out it's stats (a.k.a., ask your dm to make an incredibly strong monster that is not immune to mind affecting affects but has a low will save, since this is dnd, there always is something like that hiding around some dark abandoned plane.) Then power your psion to such heights as to where the beast has no chance to make the save. Presumably, if it's powerful enough, it'll tear apart all of your enemies. Even if you don't (or can't) go with the big beast one, you can still control as many thralls as you want and you can theoretically take over all the army leaders of the nine hells, which is a big step closer to conqouring the Nine Hells itself. (On a side note, it's kind of odd how when you aspire to greater heights you hear of a new "the oldest and most powerful creature ever heard of.")
bluemage55 05-29-07, 02:50 PM	Dude, just get a high level psion, and have him specialize in Telepathy, then have him cast Thrall. Make sure that his Charisma is so high that nothing can win the save, thus when you cast it on the most powerful creatures you can, you can use them to help, and it's permanent! "Thrall" is no longer a psionic power as of the updates to 3.5, precisely due to the type of abuse that you suggest.
SupaTalka 06-01-07, 04:32 PM	Just bring Pun-Pun.
Flymolo 06-01-07, 09:18 PM	Bah, Pun-pun's got a CR of only 24282!
killswitchxxx 06-01-07, 11:55 PM	Okay wow thats pretty dumb im actually looking for ideas not jokes