Post/Author/DateTime	Post
sin_vraal 01-04-08, 07:25 PM	does anyone have a home brew way or is there errata to some effect on how to get around this piece of text in the animate dead seed? .... The undead remain animated until they are destroyed. (A destroyed undead can’t be animated again.) .... say I wanted to use an epic spell to re-animate an undead being under my control but I just whacked it dead (IE. destroyed). any ideas on how to re-animate it or DC modifiers etc? For instance, if I wanted to use "Animate Vampire Concubine (http://forums.gleemax.com/wotc_archive/index.php/t-431391)" (compliments of Kyuketsukiouji, aloon and the discount epic spell emporium) on a dead vampire so I could say have her tell me where she kept her pile of phat lewt that my search impaired eyes didnt have to search for it, how would I go about doing it (assuming I just HAD to animate her in some fashion)?
Selgard 01-07-08, 03:23 PM	When your character researches the spell, incorporate Destruction seed to destroy the creature after X rounds; or request that the DM put a duration into the spell. (asking for a limit, i would think, shouldn't be a problem). Alternatively use Speak with Dead.
Avoraciopoctules 01-07-08, 03:55 PM	does anyone have a home brew way or is there errata to some effect on how to get around this piece of text in the animate dead seed? .... The undead remain animated until they are destroyed. (A destroyed undead can’t be animated again.) .... say I wanted to use an epic spell to re-animate an undead being under my control but I just whacked it dead (IE. destroyed). any ideas on how to re-animate it or DC modifiers etc? For instance, if I wanted to use "Animate Vampire Concubine (http://forums.gleemax.com/wotc_archive/index.php/t-431391)" (compliments of Kyuketsukiouji, aloon and the discount epic spell emporium) on a dead vampire so I could say have her tell me where she kept her pile of phat lewt that my search impaired eyes didnt have to search for it, how would I go about doing it (assuming I just HAD to animate her in some fashion)? If you really want to turn it into an undead creature again, you could probably just reset the body. Resurrect the destroyed undead, kill the now-living body, and you have a corpse that has not been animated yet. It's fairly roundabout, but it ought to get the job done without any of the hassle involved in epic spellcasting.
sin_vraal 01-08-08, 01:12 AM	If you really want to turn it into an undead creature again, you could probably just reset the body. Resurrect the destroyed undead, kill the now-living body, and you have a corpse that has not been animated yet. It's fairly roundabout, but it ought to get the job done without any of the hassle involved in epic spellcasting. Well, I thought about doing this... Ideally just resurrecting the corpse would be ideal, or speaking with dead (not quite as good, even as animating, but far less evil). The thing is, with resurrect, you get the choice of whether you want to come back or not. and speak with dead gives you a save... animating the corpse offers no save or resistance, so in many ways its far superior to both resurrection and speak with dead, with the exception you now have a vampire animated from the dead, making it somewhat unattractive to a neutral to good character. Perhaps cloning first would making the best choice? dunno yet.
Taren 01-08-08, 02:21 AM	Perhaps cloning first would making the best choice? dunno yet. animate object ftw XD
BillTheManiac 01-08-08, 12:27 PM	If you really want to turn it into an undead creature again, you could probably just reset the body. Resurrect the destroyed undead, kill the now-living body, and you have a corpse that has not been animated yet. It's fairly roundabout, but it ought to get the job done without any of the hassle involved in epic spellcasting. Seed: Life Seed: Death (choose to fail Will save) Seed: Animate Dead That way you can do it in one convenient epic spell.
Avoraciopoctules 01-14-08, 06:56 PM	Seed: Life Seed: Death (choose to fail Will save) Seed: Animate Dead That way you can do it in one convenient epic spell. I'm not sure how the death seed forces a revived creature to voluntarily fail its saving throw. In fact, I'm not sure what saving throw you're talking about, since death effects usually prompt a Fortitude save. Don't souls always have the choice of whether or not to come back to life? Could you explain what the spell is supposed to do in a bit more detail?
Avoraciopoctules 01-14-08, 07:07 PM	Well, I thought about doing this... Ideally just resurrecting the corpse would be ideal, or speaking with dead (not quite as good, even as animating, but far less evil). The thing is, with resurrect, you get the choice of whether you want to come back or not. and speak with dead gives you a save... animating the corpse offers no save or resistance, so in many ways its far superior to both resurrection and speak with dead, with the exception you now have a vampire animated from the dead, making it somewhat unattractive to a neutral to good character. Perhaps cloning first would making the best choice? dunno yet. "Clone Necromancy Level: Sor/Wiz 8 Components: V, S, M, F Casting Time: 10 minutes Range: 0 ft. Effect: One clone Duration: Instantaneous Saving Throw: None Spell Resistance: No This spell makes an inert duplicate of a creature. If the original individual has been slain, its soul immediately transfers to the clone, creating a replacement (provided that the soul is free and willing to return). The original’s physical remains, should they still exist, become inert and cannot thereafter be restored to life. If the original creature has reached the end of its natural life span (that is, it has died of natural causes), any cloning attempt fails. To create the duplicate, you must have a piece of flesh (not hair, nails, scales, or the like) with a volume of at least 1 cubic inch that was taken from the original creature’s living body. The piece of flesh need not be fresh, but it must be kept from rotting. Once the spell is cast, the duplicate must be grown in a laboratory for 2d4 months. When the clone is completed, the original’s soul enters it immediately, if that creature is already dead. The clone is physically identical with the original and possesses the same personality and memories as the original. In other respects, treat the clone as if it were the original character raised from the dead, including the loss of one level or 2 points of Constitution (if the original was a 1st-level character). If this Constitution adjustment would give the clone a Constitution score of 0, the spell fails. If the original creature has lost levels since the flesh sample was taken and died at a lower level than the clone would otherwise be, the clone is one level below the level at which the original died. The spell duplicates only the original’s body and mind, not its equipment. A duplicate can be grown while the original still lives, or when the original soul is unavailable, but the resulting body is merely a soulless bit of inert flesh, which rots if not preserved. Material Component The piece of flesh and various laboratory supplies (cost 1,000 gp). Focus Special laboratory equipment (cost 500 gp)." Pertinent text in red. Similar to resurrection, and the inert copy would have none of the original's memories. If the consent of the soul is a problem, then track down the soul and use a compulsion effect on it. Spend your epic spell creation time on a really nifty divination spell that shows you the location of the soul, warp in, and either take it back with you first or magically force it to accept resurrection.
sin_vraal 01-14-08, 09:18 PM	"Clone Necromancy Level: Sor/Wiz 8 Components: V, S, M, F Casting Time: 10 minutes Range: 0 ft. Effect: One clone Duration: Instantaneous Saving Throw: None Spell Resistance: No This spell makes an inert duplicate of a creature. If the original individual has been slain, its soul immediately transfers to the clone, creating a replacement (provided that the soul is free and willing to return). The original’s physical remains, should they still exist, become inert and cannot thereafter be restored to life. If the original creature has reached the end of its natural life span (that is, it has died of natural causes), any cloning attempt fails. To create the duplicate, you must have a piece of flesh (not hair, nails, scales, or the like) with a volume of at least 1 cubic inch that was taken from the original creature’s living body. The piece of flesh need not be fresh, but it must be kept from rotting. Once the spell is cast, the duplicate must be grown in a laboratory for 2d4 months. When the clone is completed, the original’s soul enters it immediately, if that creature is already dead. The clone is physically identical with the original and possesses the same personality and memories as the original. In other respects, treat the clone as if it were the original character raised from the dead, including the loss of one level or 2 points of Constitution (if the original was a 1st-level character). If this Constitution adjustment would give the clone a Constitution score of 0, the spell fails. If the original creature has lost levels since the flesh sample was taken and died at a lower level than the clone would otherwise be, the clone is one level below the level at which the original died. The spell duplicates only the original’s body and mind, not its equipment. A duplicate can be grown while the original still lives, or when the original soul is unavailable, but the resulting body is merely a soulless bit of inert flesh, which rots if not preserved. Material Component The piece of flesh and various laboratory supplies (cost 1,000 gp). Focus Special laboratory equipment (cost 500 gp)." Pertinent text in red. Similar to resurrection, and the inert copy would have none of the original's memories. If the consent of the soul is a problem, then track down the soul and use a compulsion effect on it. Spend your epic spell creation time on a really nifty divination spell that shows you the location of the soul, warp in, and either take it back with you first or magically force it to accept resurrection. yea. see I'm thinking its gonna have to be ad-hoc +X dc for the win here... think a +2 is fair? it seems like this should be a minor thing to do... I wonder if they even thought about it, considering someone living then made dead then to undead doesnt get a save... why would the already undead person get a free break?
BillTheManiac 01-15-08, 07:31 AM	I'm not sure how the death seed forces a revived creature to voluntarily fail its saving throw. In fact, I'm not sure what saving throw you're talking about, since death effects usually prompt a Fortitude save. Don't souls always have the choice of whether or not to come back to life? Could you explain what the spell is supposed to do in a bit more detail? Well, I meant if you had the creature's cooperation, like Raise Dead for undead. You return it to life, kill it with Death. It voluntarily fails its Fortitude save because it knows that the reanimation is contingent on it. Alternately, make the Fort save DC really high. Then you reanimate it. Reanimate Truedead Conjuration (Healing)/Necromancy [Death, Evil] Spellcraft DC: 60 Components: V, S, DF, Backlash Casting Time: 11 minutes Range: Touch Target: Truedead creature touched Duration: Instantaneous Saving Throw: Fortitude returns to life, not undeath (harmless) Spell Resistance: Yes (harmless) To Develop: Life (DC 27), Slay (DC 25), Animate Dead (DC 25), +1 factor for each 1d6 backlash suffered on casting (ad hoc +3, based on official ad hoc), +10 minute casting time (-20 DC) Reanimate Druedead will restore undeath and complete vigor to any destroyed creature of up to 81 HD. The condition of the remains is not a factor. So long as some small portion of the creature’s body still exists, it can be returned to life, but the portion receiving the spell must have been part of the creature’s body at the time of death. (The remains of a creature hit by a disintegrate spell count as a small portion of its body.) Destroyed undead usually turn to dust, and that counts. The creature can have been truedead for no longer than two hundred years. The creature is immediately restored to full hit points, vigor, and health, with no loss of prepared spells. However, the subject loses one hit die (or 1 point of Constitution if the subject was 1st level). Backlash: For each HD the undead now has beyond 20, you suffer 1d6 backlash. The amount of backlash is modified by the undead type modifiers given in the Animate Dead seed, to a minimum of 0d6. You can ad hoc in other undead, such as necropolitans and liches