Wish & Rod of excellent magic farming [Archive] - Wizards Community

Wish & Rod of excellent magic farming [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
ikki
01-29-08, 08:09 AM Rods of excellent magic, 26000xp, have a xp cost in wishing of 52000xp.
So at 2000 xp this is a 3% DAILY growth. (calculated from 100, allowing 3 with a wide margin)

So if you have 30 of those rods, you get your 31st rod and a pile of coins, the next day another rod. Soon youll be getting two rods a day.

Overall its a 4.800.000% profit annually.

In 10 years, you have a number of rods that have some 48 zeroes. I bet youll need demiplane to store those by then. One suitably locked into a real world object, like a medallion, ring, staff... anything really. Making it a bit harder for someone else to mess with it.

Ofcourse by then a reasonable wish is to have a demiplane the size of a galaxy, filled with 1*10^40 ultra-obdurium colossi (1*10^8 xp each?) and portals waiting to deliver them anywhere to fight my battles. You can have one of those ragnaroks each day.. Or continue growing your power (why, oh why?)

Yeah this is getting marvel-like, annihiliate all existance and have it redone, thrice a day. Booring..

Heh, even after a mere 15 months.. one year of growing power into a minimum of 4.800.000 rods, (assuming a starting capital of 100 rods) then another 3 months of doing EVERYTHING you have ever imagined... you should be pretty much ready to die. Life no longer having any meaning ;)
9,6 billion daily xp oughta allow unlimited pleasures.

And just wishing for those rods to be gone for a return of struggle, would be kinda meaningless. You would just redo it all.

Either that or become a dirtfarmer like your daddy would have wanted.. lol

That should teach some adventurers not to mess with farmers.. some of them just might have accomplished all that matters and just long for the simple life again.
Annoy them.. and you may wish you had never been born.

Yeah.. guess it was a stupid idea ;)
Back to a meaningful struggle of dying on a orcs sword and scraping for pitiful gains in gold coins.... err...
Quite the dilemma.. a offer too good to resist, but too good to survive it qith any meaningful kind of life remaining too.
Starmage21
01-29-08, 09:01 AM Im not entirely sure what your point is, even after reading your post 3 times.

If im reading correctly, you postulate that having a large number of rods of excellent magic means you can use the Wish spell at will with no XP loss?

2 things if the above is correct:
1.) You have to be able to brandish a rod to gain it's effect, and even if the RAW does not state it specifically, you should only be able to use one at a time.

2.) There are MUCH easier ways to gain the ability to use Wish infinitely. Gaining Wish as an at-will SLA is one way, or using an epic shapechange spell to turn yourself into an Efreeti or Noble Djinni(or anything else that has Wish or Miracle as an SLA), or becoming a deity with the trickery domain. These are likely just a few.

**edit**
I believe what you are attempting to do is use the rods daily granted 2,000XP to gain yet more rods. Unfortunately, as #1 statess, you should only be able to use 1, maybe 2 at a time if youve got 2 hands(and by that logic a hecatonhieres could use 200 because hes got 200 hands, 2 for each head), so thats still a cost of 1,000XP to your personal reserve every time you cast Wish.
Also, the XP granted by the rod of excellent magic can only be used to power a spell, it says so right in the description.
ikki
01-29-08, 11:49 AM Actually using those 100 at the same time, thus getting 3 more.
Wish 5000xp+3*26000*2 (twice the xp cost of an item when wishing for it)

Hmm.. i was hoping for some method to merge them into a unified whole. Batteries for a machine if you like. Just lots and lots of batteries.

But i suppose a hecatoneires shapeshift would be useful if the merging cannot be carried out..

Anyway.
The single wish is rather limited, merely 25K each.
I was looking for something far grander ;)
It originated from a liquid pain moneyspinner idea.

But yeah.. wish at will is pretty good.
40th level or there about as a wizard.. And the extended warlock powerlist has it as a 50th level invocation.
Anuvrix
01-29-08, 12:35 PM The true way to gain unlimited power (why would you want to?) is through a staff of wish, used to obtain a deck of many things.

(a staff of wish is possible, but expensive)

You aquire the staff, use a wish to restore charges if ny are gone. Use two wishes to aqquire a DoMT. (first wish is wishing that the next wish will have no negative drawbacks, etc...)

Next, wish that the next card drawn by you is the Sun DIsk (1 wonderous item of use and 50,000 xp).

Continue wishing for he same card, untill you have the levels you want, then use the ramaining wishes to do with as you want.

(even wish for the ability to use unlimited rods, and get the above rods required):D
ikki
01-29-08, 01:04 PM Hmm.. staffmastery allows non-use of charges. A bit iffy to allow a use of wish to restore more than one charge.
Nasty detail that you have to declare how many cards you want to draw.. and have to that reasonably quickly.

Otherwise.. yeah.. you should be able to draw 70 cards 50 in staff+20 spellslots.. staff charges spent along with your whole list of 9th & higher spellslots... assuming a 24th or such level.

You cannot wish for a artifact tho, but need to find or buy it.
Some archmages are know for keeping a deck...

Thats still 3.500.000 XP.. or letsee..

24k+XK/2*(X-24)=3.500.000 wherein X is the aquired level.
ugh.. ill try this with trials..

(12000+lastlvel/2)*gained levels

lvl 100 went too far.. 90 too.. but level 85 fits!!!
61 levels gained.. and now you have wish as a SLA and other such goodies.
And a nice lil horde of 70 new magical items..
Kain_Darkwind
01-29-08, 02:12 PM There are MUCH easier ways to gain the ability to use Wish infinitely. Gaining Wish as an at-will SLA is one way, or using an epic shapechange spell to turn yourself into an Efreeti or Noble Djinni(or anything else that has Wish or Miracle as an SLA), or becoming a deity with the trickery domain. These are likely just a few.

Becoming a deity is easier than monkeying around with XP rods? Somehow, I doubt it.

Genies don't work either. They can only grant 3 wishes a day, and only to those that aren't genies themselves.

And enlighten me as to how you gain it as an 'at will SLA'? I recall a feat in 3.0 that used to do the trick (if you sacrificed a 17th level spell slot), but I don't know of any 3.5 means to do so. The fact that the feat was left out of both Complete Arcane and Complete Mage probably indicates they realized it was broken as soon as epic was introduced.
Silvercrys
01-29-08, 03:43 PM Becoming a deity is easier than monkeying around with XP rods? Somehow, I doubt it.

Genies don't work either. They can only grant 3 wishes a day, and only to those that aren't genies themselves.

And enlighten me as to how you gain it as an 'at will SLA'? I recall a feat in 3.0 that used to do the trick (if you sacrificed a 17th level spell slot), but I don't know of any 3.5 means to do so. The fact that the feat was left out of both Complete Arcane and Complete Mage probably indicates they realized it was broken as soon as epic was introduced.

Actually, it is in Complete Arcane. It's called Innate Spell.
Starmage21
01-29-08, 04:14 PM Actually, it is in Complete Arcane. It's called Innate Spell.

Innate Spell I think has the caveats of still requiring XP costs, when normally SLAs never require XP or components(even costly ones). This is from memory, it might not be accurate.
Kain_Darkwind
01-29-08, 09:12 PM Innate Spell I think has the caveats of still requiring XP costs, when normally SLAs never require XP or components(even costly ones). This is from memory, it might not be accurate.

Ah! I was looking for something beginning with Spell-like. Thanks for pointing it out, Silvercrys. Guess that nukes my contention that they took it out for brokenness.

Innate Spell does require XP to be paid, as well as foci to be used, and any spell with expensive material components requires a focus costing 50x their value.

But if you weren't intended on using the feat to accomplish this goal, Starmage, how were you going to make it an at will SLA? For that matter, how were you intending on becoming a god of Trickery?
Taeldrin Laesrash
01-30-08, 12:18 AM Genies don't work either. They can only grant 3 wishes a day, and only to those that aren't genies themselves.

You could summon or bind one. From there, you just wish for more wishes.
Starmage21
01-30-08, 08:04 AM Ah! I was looking for something beginning with Spell-like. Thanks for pointing it out, Silvercrys. Guess that nukes my contention that they took it out for brokenness.

Innate Spell does require XP to be paid, as well as foci to be used, and any spell with expensive material components requires a focus costing 50x their value.

But if you weren't intended on using the feat to accomplish this goal, Starmage, how were you going to make it an at will SLA? For that matter, how were you intending on becoming a god of Trickery?

Your DM may in fact make it easier for you to become a diety than to farm all these rods of excellent magic. Its a theoretical comparison :D

Otherwise, there are very few RAW supported ways to gain Wish as an at-will SLA. You can do it with the beginnings of the Pun Pun abuse, or create your own template that grants it(starting with +3 LA according to savage species), or use an epic spell to summon genies(as long as your wishes dont have lasting effects beyond the stay of the genie; fortunately, most wishes are instantaneous).
Kain_Darkwind
01-30-08, 11:06 AM Your DM may in fact make it easier for you to become a diety than to farm all these rods of excellent magic. Its a theoretical comparison :D

I thought of that after I posted. I thought, "well damn, I'd be more likely to let a player become a god than monkey around with this magic item cheese...at least the former makes for a good adventure/campaign goal."

So I guess it is easier, in an actual game, to become a god than to sell a DM on some mechanics Sleight of Hand. Point conceded.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
ikki 01-29-08, 08:09 AM	Rods of excellent magic, 26000xp, have a xp cost in wishing of 52000xp. So at 2000 xp this is a 3% DAILY growth. (calculated from 100, allowing 3 with a wide margin) So if you have 30 of those rods, you get your 31st rod and a pile of coins, the next day another rod. Soon youll be getting two rods a day. Overall its a 4.800.000% profit annually. In 10 years, you have a number of rods that have some 48 zeroes. I bet youll need demiplane to store those by then. One suitably locked into a real world object, like a medallion, ring, staff... anything really. Making it a bit harder for someone else to mess with it. Ofcourse by then a reasonable wish is to have a demiplane the size of a galaxy, filled with 110^40 ultra-obdurium colossi (110^8 xp each?) and portals waiting to deliver them anywhere to fight my battles. You can have one of those ragnaroks each day.. Or continue growing your power (why, oh why?) Yeah this is getting marvel-like, annihiliate all existance and have it redone, thrice a day. Booring.. Heh, even after a mere 15 months.. one year of growing power into a minimum of 4.800.000 rods, (assuming a starting capital of 100 rods) then another 3 months of doing EVERYTHING you have ever imagined... you should be pretty much ready to die. Life no longer having any meaning ;) 9,6 billion daily xp oughta allow unlimited pleasures. And just wishing for those rods to be gone for a return of struggle, would be kinda meaningless. You would just redo it all. Either that or become a dirtfarmer like your daddy would have wanted.. lol That should teach some adventurers not to mess with farmers.. some of them just might have accomplished all that matters and just long for the simple life again. Annoy them.. and you may wish you had never been born. Yeah.. guess it was a stupid idea ;) Back to a meaningful struggle of dying on a orcs sword and scraping for pitiful gains in gold coins.... err... Quite the dilemma.. a offer too good to resist, but too good to survive it qith any meaningful kind of life remaining too.
Starmage21 01-29-08, 09:01 AM	Im not entirely sure what your point is, even after reading your post 3 times. If im reading correctly, you postulate that having a large number of rods of excellent magic means you can use the Wish spell at will with no XP loss? 2 things if the above is correct: 1.) You have to be able to brandish a rod to gain it's effect, and even if the RAW does not state it specifically, you should only be able to use one at a time. 2.) There are MUCH easier ways to gain the ability to use Wish infinitely. Gaining Wish as an at-will SLA is one way, or using an epic shapechange spell to turn yourself into an Efreeti or Noble Djinni(or anything else that has Wish or Miracle as an SLA), or becoming a deity with the trickery domain. These are likely just a few. edit I believe what you are attempting to do is use the rods daily granted 2,000XP to gain yet more rods. Unfortunately, as #1 statess, you should only be able to use 1, maybe 2 at a time if youve got 2 hands(and by that logic a hecatonhieres could use 200 because hes got 200 hands, 2 for each head), so thats still a cost of 1,000XP to your personal reserve every time you cast Wish. Also, the XP granted by the rod of excellent magic can only be used to power a spell, it says so right in the description.
ikki 01-29-08, 11:49 AM	Actually using those 100 at the same time, thus getting 3 more. Wish 5000xp+3260002 (twice the xp cost of an item when wishing for it) Hmm.. i was hoping for some method to merge them into a unified whole. Batteries for a machine if you like. Just lots and lots of batteries. But i suppose a hecatoneires shapeshift would be useful if the merging cannot be carried out.. Anyway. The single wish is rather limited, merely 25K each. I was looking for something far grander ;) It originated from a liquid pain moneyspinner idea. But yeah.. wish at will is pretty good. 40th level or there about as a wizard.. And the extended warlock powerlist has it as a 50th level invocation.
Anuvrix 01-29-08, 12:35 PM	The true way to gain unlimited power (why would you want to?) is through a staff of wish, used to obtain a deck of many things. (a staff of wish is possible, but expensive) You aquire the staff, use a wish to restore charges if ny are gone. Use two wishes to aqquire a DoMT. (first wish is wishing that the next wish will have no negative drawbacks, etc...) Next, wish that the next card drawn by you is the Sun DIsk (1 wonderous item of use and 50,000 xp). Continue wishing for he same card, untill you have the levels you want, then use the ramaining wishes to do with as you want. (even wish for the ability to use unlimited rods, and get the above rods required):D
ikki 01-29-08, 01:04 PM	Hmm.. staffmastery allows non-use of charges. A bit iffy to allow a use of wish to restore more than one charge. Nasty detail that you have to declare how many cards you want to draw.. and have to that reasonably quickly. Otherwise.. yeah.. you should be able to draw 70 cards 50 in staff+20 spellslots.. staff charges spent along with your whole list of 9th & higher spellslots... assuming a 24th or such level. You cannot wish for a artifact tho, but need to find or buy it. Some archmages are know for keeping a deck... Thats still 3.500.000 XP.. or letsee.. 24k+XK/2(X-24)=3.500.000 wherein X is the aquired level. ugh.. ill try this with trials.. (12000+lastlvel/2)gained levels lvl 100 went too far.. 90 too.. but level 85 fits!!! 61 levels gained.. and now you have wish as a SLA and other such goodies. And a nice lil horde of 70 new magical items..
Kain_Darkwind 01-29-08, 02:12 PM	There are MUCH easier ways to gain the ability to use Wish infinitely. Gaining Wish as an at-will SLA is one way, or using an epic shapechange spell to turn yourself into an Efreeti or Noble Djinni(or anything else that has Wish or Miracle as an SLA), or becoming a deity with the trickery domain. These are likely just a few. Becoming a deity is easier than monkeying around with XP rods? Somehow, I doubt it. Genies don't work either. They can only grant 3 wishes a day, and only to those that aren't genies themselves. And enlighten me as to how you gain it as an 'at will SLA'? I recall a feat in 3.0 that used to do the trick (if you sacrificed a 17th level spell slot), but I don't know of any 3.5 means to do so. The fact that the feat was left out of both Complete Arcane and Complete Mage probably indicates they realized it was broken as soon as epic was introduced.
Silvercrys 01-29-08, 03:43 PM	Becoming a deity is easier than monkeying around with XP rods? Somehow, I doubt it. Genies don't work either. They can only grant 3 wishes a day, and only to those that aren't genies themselves. And enlighten me as to how you gain it as an 'at will SLA'? I recall a feat in 3.0 that used to do the trick (if you sacrificed a 17th level spell slot), but I don't know of any 3.5 means to do so. The fact that the feat was left out of both Complete Arcane and Complete Mage probably indicates they realized it was broken as soon as epic was introduced. Actually, it is in Complete Arcane. It's called Innate Spell.
Starmage21 01-29-08, 04:14 PM	Actually, it is in Complete Arcane. It's called Innate Spell. Innate Spell I think has the caveats of still requiring XP costs, when normally SLAs never require XP or components(even costly ones). This is from memory, it might not be accurate.
Kain_Darkwind 01-29-08, 09:12 PM	Innate Spell I think has the caveats of still requiring XP costs, when normally SLAs never require XP or components(even costly ones). This is from memory, it might not be accurate. Ah! I was looking for something beginning with Spell-like. Thanks for pointing it out, Silvercrys. Guess that nukes my contention that they took it out for brokenness. Innate Spell does require XP to be paid, as well as foci to be used, and any spell with expensive material components requires a focus costing 50x their value. But if you weren't intended on using the feat to accomplish this goal, Starmage, how were you going to make it an at will SLA? For that matter, how were you intending on becoming a god of Trickery?
Taeldrin Laesrash 01-30-08, 12:18 AM	Genies don't work either. They can only grant 3 wishes a day, and only to those that aren't genies themselves. You could summon or bind one. From there, you just wish for more wishes.
Starmage21 01-30-08, 08:04 AM	Ah! I was looking for something beginning with Spell-like. Thanks for pointing it out, Silvercrys. Guess that nukes my contention that they took it out for brokenness. Innate Spell does require XP to be paid, as well as foci to be used, and any spell with expensive material components requires a focus costing 50x their value. But if you weren't intended on using the feat to accomplish this goal, Starmage, how were you going to make it an at will SLA? For that matter, how were you intending on becoming a god of Trickery? Your DM may in fact make it easier for you to become a diety than to farm all these rods of excellent magic. Its a theoretical comparison :D Otherwise, there are very few RAW supported ways to gain Wish as an at-will SLA. You can do it with the beginnings of the Pun Pun abuse, or create your own template that grants it(starting with +3 LA according to savage species), or use an epic spell to summon genies(as long as your wishes dont have lasting effects beyond the stay of the genie; fortunately, most wishes are instantaneous).
Kain_Darkwind 01-30-08, 11:06 AM	Your DM may in fact make it easier for you to become a diety than to farm all these rods of excellent magic. Its a theoretical comparison :D I thought of that after I posted. I thought, "well damn, I'd be more likely to let a player become a god than monkey around with this magic item cheese...at least the former makes for a good adventure/campaign goal." So I guess it is easier, in an actual game, to become a god than to sell a DM on some mechanics Sleight of Hand. Point conceded.