Post/Author/DateTime	Post
OrionNo9 10-14-06, 01:39 PM	How do you resolve a human (or elft, gnome, ect. for that matter) when they want to bite someone? If does not happen that often but there are time when using your teeth can be quit helpful; for example in grapple when you have lost you light weapon. I am guessing that it would be an unarmed attack, but that just seems odd, a bite does bludgeoning damage? Also it would see to me that you would have to be in your opponents square to use a bite attack.
Arvagor 10-14-06, 02:06 PM	I am guessing that it would be an unarmed attack, but that just seems odd, a bite does bludgeoning damage? Also it would see to me that you would have to be in your opponents square to use a bite attack. Well, first off, you don't need to be in an opponent's square to bite them, otherwise every creature that has a bite attack would potentially take an AoO every time they attacked. Some things we know: Bite attacks deal all three damage types (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#bite) There's no set standard, but it looks like a Medium creature's bite attack generally deals 1d6 (+/- Str) A monk (a class that could be considered to be trained in a natural attack form) deals 1d6 with their unarmed strike when starting out, lethal or nonlethal, and they don't provoke when making the unarmed attack "normal" humanoid's untrained unarmed strike deals 1d3 non-lethal, and such an attack provokes I would say that using the unarmed strike analogy is a good starting point, and would suggest that a humanoid bite attack should be resolved as follows: Deals 1d3/x2 (1d2 for Small), bludgeoning* Only deals nonlethal damage (?)* Is considered a light weapon (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/equipment/weapons.htm#lightOneHandedandTwoHandedMe leeWeapons) Since it's a light weapon, you can use Weapon Finesse Provokes an AoO since you are considered to be attacking "unarmed" Such a bite attack does not threaten the squares around you Cannot be used as a secondary natural attack * I'm up in the air on damage types, and whether it can deal only nonlethal damage. Obviously a human's bite attack can draw blood (think Mike Tyson biting off Evander Holyfield's ear). If you want to allow lethal, then you should probably also let the bite deal all three damage types (bludgeoning, piercing, and slashing).
runestar 10-14-06, 11:11 PM	Aye, you resolve it as an unarmed strike.:) In planescape torment, I think morte's bite did blugeoning damage as well...:P
Neutronium_Dragon 10-14-06, 11:19 PM	Try this: It's an unarmed strike except in two ways: It deals SBP damage and counts as an improvised weapon. The latter makes a great deal of sense; humans just aren't built to bite things aggressively.
jaelis 10-14-06, 11:30 PM	It's an unarmed strike. Human teeth aren't big enough or sharp enough to slash or pierce.
Arvagor 10-15-06, 12:30 AM	It's an unarmed strike. Human teeth aren't big enough or sharp enough to slash or pierce.If only that were the case; take a look at http://www.forensicdentistryonline.org/forensichomepage.htm, and check out the section on bitemarks. Highly medical in nature, but clearly, lacerations, scrapes, etc. are mentioned multiple times. Despite not being as developed as a carnivorous animal's, humans still have incisors and canines -- the former slash, the latter pierce. Or look at it this way... You ever tried eating an overcooked steak? I can assure you, I'm not bludgeoning my way through it... ;)
runestar 10-15-06, 02:08 AM	Well, you could try comparing your bite to that of a dog...I believe you will find it vastly inferior...;) Or maybe take that vile deformity feat that gives you a bite attack...:P
Zariell 10-15-06, 04:30 AM	Well, you could try comparing your bite to that of a dog...I believe you will find it vastly inferior...;) Or maybe take that vile deformity feat that gives you a bite attack...:P Human teeth are closer then you might think. The difference is dogs and other animals like them have very strong jaw structures, and using there teeth is unlikely to incur damage to them. Additionally because dogs are 4 legged animals, its easier to bite, and then tear away. The only teeth differences, are dogs have larger canine teeth (The "vampire" teeth), and there teeth extend farther back in the mouth (giving them a larger bite).
jaelis 10-15-06, 08:29 AM	OK: In dnd terms, it's an unarmed strike. Human teeth aren't big enough or sharp enough to slash or pierce. I would imagine that you get pretty severe lacerations and scrapes if you are hit by a heavy mace too, but they call that bludgeoning. The dnd system is just an abstraction.
JadeSpider9643 10-15-06, 01:59 PM	The problem with a human bite attack sin't with the teeth, it's with the jaw muscles. We hardly have any. A "hard" bite from a human will barely draw blood, it takes an absolutely incredible bite to tear flesh (exceptions for ear lobes and other body parts without developed muscleas). And for biting thru anything with any sort of natural armor, just for get it! Don't believe me? Try and bite a chunk off a 2-by-4. I'm not even gonna suggest you could bite THRU it, just try to gnaw off a corner or an edge, I'd wager mechanically it's similar to a whip, no damage to anything with natural armor over +3