A new and very powerful sword Treat with Caution [Archive] - Wizards Community

A new and very powerful sword Treat with Caution [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
DnDsnd
07-08-07, 09:22 PM I created this sword a long time ago for a campaign I ran in Advanced Dungeons and Dragons. EMBER (http://dndsnd.pbwiki.com/Ember)
NoldorForce
07-08-07, 10:35 PM What's a plot device doing here? The whole +27 equivalent thing is something I'd be REALLY suspicious of as both a character and a player at non-epic levels.

At epic levels, though, this thing's a pushover.
DnDsnd
07-09-07, 05:06 PM What's a plot device doing here? The whole +27 equivalent thing is something I'd be REALLY suspicious of as both a character and a player at non-epic levels.

At epic levels, though, this thing's a pushover.

O.K. so the sword is a push over at epic level. What would you do to improve it? Ember is an intelligent weapon if your a creative or an imaginative DM would you not play Ember as cautious and perhaps the sword is smart enough to hold back it's power at lower levels misleading characters into a false sense of security. I have not official tested the sword in 3.5E have been considering it again. so I have not determined if the sword is balanced. I am also well aware of the powers of epic characters and I fully realize that an epic character can control it. I was not introducing this sword as a plot device I was just laying it on the table so to speak just to bring it to the attention of others. Because I believe that their are many imaginative people who can expand upon ones ideas. I believe that is what forums are about to create a round table of discussions like in Arther's court. I apologize if this is in the wrong forum is not a sword a piece of equipment if all it's properties are removed.
NoldorForce
07-09-07, 05:31 PM The +27 equivalent bonus is still, as I'd said, a giveaway that This Should Be Checked Out Further. Unlike the other abilities, that part can't be turned off. Maybe it's just like a +12 Hackmaster, the best weapon in the game but not much else. Or it could have its own quirky story behind it...as it does here.

The per-day powers are fine as long as you treat Ember as a unique NPC. It doesn't have to use them if it doesn't want to. I'd suggest scaling down the remainder of the bonus to something non-epic. In any case, if this isn't epic or an artifact, the entire clause about it being nearly impossible to damage should be removed. Giving it damage resistance in the form of hardness is fine; giving it damage immunity is not, not even in epic. Only artifacts are supposed to be unbreakable by normal means. That said, this thing has enough standing to qualify as a minor artifact anyway.

If it were not an artifact, I'd suggest giving bonuses out to +10. +12 is fine for a minor artifact, but be sure in both cases to limit the actual bonus to +5. +6 stuff is another thing reserved for epic levels.

What I'm saying here is that quite a bit of the stuff inherent in Ember implies that it should be an epic challenge; its power as an antagonist isn't, however, and thus it should either be toned down to suit a non-epic campaign or altered to better fit an epic campaign.
Grandmaster_Kane
07-09-07, 05:42 PM This weapon is on the level of major artifact but it would get totally pwned by pretty much any other major artifact.
You need to complelte remake it so that it's abilities flow together better.
DnDsnd
07-09-07, 08:05 PM The +27 equivalent bonus is still, as I'd said, a giveaway that This Should Be Checked Out Further. Unlike the other abilities, that part can't be turned off. Maybe it's just like a +12 Hackmaster, the best weapon in the game but not much else. Or it could have its own quirky story behind it...as it does here.

The per-day powers are fine as long as you treat Ember as a unique NPC. It doesn't have to use them if it doesn't want to. I'd suggest scaling down the remainder of the bonus to something non-epic. In any case, if this isn't epic or an artifact, the entire clause about it being nearly impossible to damage should be removed. Giving it damage resistance in the form of hardness is fine; giving it damage immunity is not, not even in epic. Only artifacts are supposed to be unbreakable by normal means. That said, this thing has enough standing to qualify as a minor artifact anyway.

If it were not an artifact, I'd suggest giving bonuses out to +10. +12 is fine for a minor artifact, but be sure in both cases to limit the actual bonus to +5. +6 stuff is another thing reserved for epic levels.

What I'm saying here is that quite a bit of the stuff inherent in Ember implies that it should be an epic challenge; its power as an antagonist isn't, however, and thus it should either be toned down to suit a non-epic campaign or altered to better fit an epic campaign.

I am sorry Ember has 30 hit points and a hardness of 12. The sword does not have damage immunity it can be damage, look at hardness and hit points on page 222 of the dmg. The sword could be a +10. However it is not, it is a +6 meaning that it takes another weapon with a +6 to damage it or even attempt a sunder the other +21 equivalent is for its added special abilities which helps determine Market Price. Because Ember is intelligent It is my opinion that he can with hold any information he does not want the wielder to know even if that wielder has access to an Identify spell I should think that it would be a contest of wills and Ember has a substantial ego. Again this is only my opinion.
DnDsnd
07-09-07, 08:13 PM This weapon is on the level of major artifact but it would get totally pwned by pretty much any other major artifact.
You need to complelte remake it so that it's abilities flow together better.

Ember was once a living creature a dragon to be exact. Ember was both a mix of a black dragon and a red dragon, he had a breath weapon that was flaming acid both fire and acid damage that is why he has acid blast and fiery blast. I am trying to figure out why his abilities don't flow together what makes them not flow.
DnDsnd
07-10-07, 12:53 PM Another look at the sword with going to the wiki.

Ember, The Bane of All: +6 acidic blast, everdancing, fiery blast, morphing epic short sword; AL CE; Int 27, Wis 17, Cha 26; Speach, telepathy, 120 ft. darkvision, blindsense and hearing; Ego score 75

Primary Abilities: Wielder can use see invisibility at will, Feather fall on wielder 1/day, Detect Lawful Good at will, Wielder does not need to sleep.

Extraordinary Powers: Passwall at will, Feeble Mind (DC 23) 2/day, Levitation 3/day.

Awesome Powers: Improved Invisibility wielder only 40 min. duration 2/day, Gate 1/day.

Embers purpose: Defeat/slay all (other than the Ember and the wielder)

Purpose power: Disintegrate (DC 29)

Personality: Ember is sadistic and diabolical it enjoys destroying families and adventuring groups, Ember while it's purpose is to slay everything in it's path is smart enough to bide it's time to evaluate a situation and find the best way to bring chaos and pain to all. Ember is the bane of all and over 5000 years ago was once a great wyrm who wrought destruction across continents and many paid tribute to Emberysiritious, Ember was the union of a black and red dragon the only egg to hatch and was gifted with with all the knowledge of a full grown wyrm. Ember would have continued his tyrannical rage of power as a Dracolich however an elf lord whom wanted to harness the power of Ember for himself and commissioned a wizards enclave to forged a sword and trap the power of Ember in it. The wizards were successful but unfortunately the elf lord was no match for Embers will and was unable to control the sword and in Embers wrath he destroy all the elf lord had and the conclave of wizards. Ember's last known location is unknown.

The sword was created from living metal (page 179 Magic of Faerun) hardness 12 and has 30 hit-points it can only be harm by another epic weapon equal to it's +6 enhancement bonus. Living metal heals 1 point of damage per minute. Ember also has the ability to morph (page 69 Underdark) into any weapon, long sword, battle axe, bow, spear are some examples, the morphing ability can be found in the Underdark campaign book.
NoldorForce
07-10-07, 02:53 PM I am sorry Ember has 30 hit points and a hardness of 12. The sword does not have damage immunity it can be damage, look at hardness and hit points on page 222 of the dmg.Except for that note about it only being possible to damage with a +6 weapon. In non-epic campaigns, that's an immunity to anything except +4 Construct Bane weapons.The sword could be a +10. However it is not, it is a +6 meaning that it takes another weapon with a +6 to damage it or even attempt a sunder the other +21 equivalent is for its added special abilities which helps determine Market Price.I was referring to limiting it to a +5 actual enhancement and giving it additional bonuses to put it up to a +10 (non-artifact) or +12 (artifact) effective enhancement. It doesn't need a market price, by the way.Because Ember is intelligent It is my opinion that he can with hold any information he does not want the wielder to know even if that wielder has access to an Identify spell I should think that it would be a contest of wills and Ember has a substantial ego. Again this is only my opinion.But that's not how the rules work.

If the PCs run Identify against Ember, it'll work by the rules. If the PCs run any divinations by Ember, they'll work normally against it by the rules. Even if they try to find out how it works brute-force, they'll find out quickly (within two rounds) that it's a REALLY POTENT ITEM. This is just possible by watching; Ember can't withhold the primary weapon powers, which are always on and quite flashy.

And a Mind Blank or similar effect on Ember is actually going to be more suspicious, considering that many divinations don't fail or have a very low chance of failing. If Identify tells you nothing, and Detect Magic tells you nothing, but this sword has visible effects that are way out of line with that...you're going to be treating it with a lot of suspicion.

The PCs are only going to find Ember in two ways...if they chance to find it or encounter someone else with it in combat. The former offers ample time to look at it, test it, and so forth in safety. If it doesn't seem magical, they're not going to pick it up. If it does...it looks very suspicious. And if it throws stuff at them in the meantime, it's going to look even more suspicious. And the latter makes the sword's effects rather obvious.
DnDsnd
07-10-07, 04:50 PM Ember can't withhold the primary weapon powers, which are always on and quite flashy.

By primary weapon powers what are you referring to. DnD is not just about the rules DnD is a game of imaginations. I agree that the sword is powerful and yes divination can be helpful however the DM can be cryptic with divination offering riddles and sly remarks. I think to many individuals rely on the rules when the rules are meant to be guidelines helping you to shape a fun story and game. The I like how the rules work don't get me wrong because it allows for easy creation of gaming materials and was was referring to the market price so I might have a idea of what it took to create Ember in the first place. I really look forward to your next comment because you inspire me think and ponder more, it helps me to research and learn more.

Thank you very much
NoldorForce
07-10-07, 05:09 PM By primary weapon powers what are you referring to.The whole "+6 acidic blast, everdancing, fiery blast, morphing" part. Intelligent weapons can't suppress that stuff.I agree that the sword is powerful and yes divination can be helpful however the DM can be cryptic with divination offering riddles and sly remarks.That's if you cast the divinations that let the DM do that. Quite a few divinations don't allow enough leeway for this to occur. Commune, for instance, gives one-word answers. Unless said answers would be misleading or contrary to your deity's interests, in which case it gives a short phrase.I think to many individuals rely on the rules when the rules are meant to be guidelines helping you to shape a fun story and game.D&D is still a rules-heavy game; there's quite a lot of stuff that requires the rules, and people assume that the existing rules are going to be followed or at least altered with prior notice.
DnDsnd
07-10-07, 05:37 PM The whole "+6 acidic blast, everdancing, fiery blast, morphing" part. Intelligent weapons can't suppress that stuff.
I am afraid that they very much can Intelligent weapons control all their abilities. they can turn their powers on and off they can say no to the character. Items Against Characters page 271 DMG they have allot of free will They are intelligent after all.

Just another example perhaps Ember is willing to let the character know it's powers, willing seducing the character into a sense of security. Ember could play coy and use it's power for good temporally seducing and helping the party and of course they will know it's powerful, but hey it's helping. Also on page 136 of Magic of Faerun There are ideas on self identifying items. As for the acid blast, fiery blast, and everdancing they have to be activated by either the sword or character sword willing. I have used many evil items in many campaigns and allot of the time no one checks the items alignment or may you play without alignments in your game like suggested in Monte Cook's Arcana Unearthed pleas don't limit your fun by being a rules lawyer let the rules be a guide.
tenguroEd
07-10-07, 06:37 PM /is this supposed to be a weapon of legacy? if so, are there certain levels you gain the abilities?
DnDsnd
07-10-07, 10:41 PM /is this supposed to be a weapon of legacy? if so, are there certain levels you gain the abilities?

Actually I haven't gone over my Weapons of Legacy book yet, but I don't see why some couldn't do that. Who knows I might after I read Weapons of Legacy.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
DnDsnd 07-08-07, 09:22 PM	I created this sword a long time ago for a campaign I ran in Advanced Dungeons and Dragons. EMBER (http://dndsnd.pbwiki.com/Ember)
NoldorForce 07-08-07, 10:35 PM	What's a plot device doing here? The whole +27 equivalent thing is something I'd be REALLY suspicious of as both a character and a player at non-epic levels. At epic levels, though, this thing's a pushover.
DnDsnd 07-09-07, 05:06 PM	What's a plot device doing here? The whole +27 equivalent thing is something I'd be REALLY suspicious of as both a character and a player at non-epic levels. At epic levels, though, this thing's a pushover. O.K. so the sword is a push over at epic level. What would you do to improve it? Ember is an intelligent weapon if your a creative or an imaginative DM would you not play Ember as cautious and perhaps the sword is smart enough to hold back it's power at lower levels misleading characters into a false sense of security. I have not official tested the sword in 3.5E have been considering it again. so I have not determined if the sword is balanced. I am also well aware of the powers of epic characters and I fully realize that an epic character can control it. I was not introducing this sword as a plot device I was just laying it on the table so to speak just to bring it to the attention of others. Because I believe that their are many imaginative people who can expand upon ones ideas. I believe that is what forums are about to create a round table of discussions like in Arther's court. I apologize if this is in the wrong forum is not a sword a piece of equipment if all it's properties are removed.
NoldorForce 07-09-07, 05:31 PM	The +27 equivalent bonus is still, as I'd said, a giveaway that This Should Be Checked Out Further. Unlike the other abilities, that part can't be turned off. Maybe it's just like a +12 Hackmaster, the best weapon in the game but not much else. Or it could have its own quirky story behind it...as it does here. The per-day powers are fine as long as you treat Ember as a unique NPC. It doesn't have to use them if it doesn't want to. I'd suggest scaling down the remainder of the bonus to something non-epic. In any case, if this isn't epic or an artifact, the entire clause about it being nearly impossible to damage should be removed. Giving it damage resistance in the form of hardness is fine; giving it damage immunity is not, not even in epic. Only artifacts are supposed to be unbreakable by normal means. That said, this thing has enough standing to qualify as a minor artifact anyway. If it were not an artifact, I'd suggest giving bonuses out to +10. +12 is fine for a minor artifact, but be sure in both cases to limit the actual bonus to +5. +6 stuff is another thing reserved for epic levels. What I'm saying here is that quite a bit of the stuff inherent in Ember implies that it should be an epic challenge; its power as an antagonist isn't, however, and thus it should either be toned down to suit a non-epic campaign or altered to better fit an epic campaign.
Grandmaster_Kane 07-09-07, 05:42 PM	This weapon is on the level of major artifact but it would get totally pwned by pretty much any other major artifact. You need to complelte remake it so that it's abilities flow together better.
DnDsnd 07-09-07, 08:05 PM	The +27 equivalent bonus is still, as I'd said, a giveaway that This Should Be Checked Out Further. Unlike the other abilities, that part can't be turned off. Maybe it's just like a +12 Hackmaster, the best weapon in the game but not much else. Or it could have its own quirky story behind it...as it does here. The per-day powers are fine as long as you treat Ember as a unique NPC. It doesn't have to use them if it doesn't want to. I'd suggest scaling down the remainder of the bonus to something non-epic. In any case, if this isn't epic or an artifact, the entire clause about it being nearly impossible to damage should be removed. Giving it damage resistance in the form of hardness is fine; giving it damage immunity is not, not even in epic. Only artifacts are supposed to be unbreakable by normal means. That said, this thing has enough standing to qualify as a minor artifact anyway. If it were not an artifact, I'd suggest giving bonuses out to +10. +12 is fine for a minor artifact, but be sure in both cases to limit the actual bonus to +5. +6 stuff is another thing reserved for epic levels. What I'm saying here is that quite a bit of the stuff inherent in Ember implies that it should be an epic challenge; its power as an antagonist isn't, however, and thus it should either be toned down to suit a non-epic campaign or altered to better fit an epic campaign. I am sorry Ember has 30 hit points and a hardness of 12. The sword does not have damage immunity it can be damage, look at hardness and hit points on page 222 of the dmg. The sword could be a +10. However it is not, it is a +6 meaning that it takes another weapon with a +6 to damage it or even attempt a sunder the other +21 equivalent is for its added special abilities which helps determine Market Price. Because Ember is intelligent It is my opinion that he can with hold any information he does not want the wielder to know even if that wielder has access to an Identify spell I should think that it would be a contest of wills and Ember has a substantial ego. Again this is only my opinion.
DnDsnd 07-09-07, 08:13 PM	This weapon is on the level of major artifact but it would get totally pwned by pretty much any other major artifact. You need to complelte remake it so that it's abilities flow together better. Ember was once a living creature a dragon to be exact. Ember was both a mix of a black dragon and a red dragon, he had a breath weapon that was flaming acid both fire and acid damage that is why he has acid blast and fiery blast. I am trying to figure out why his abilities don't flow together what makes them not flow.
DnDsnd 07-10-07, 12:53 PM	Another look at the sword with going to the wiki. Ember, The Bane of All: +6 acidic blast, everdancing, fiery blast, morphing epic short sword; AL CE; Int 27, Wis 17, Cha 26; Speach, telepathy, 120 ft. darkvision, blindsense and hearing; Ego score 75 Primary Abilities: Wielder can use see invisibility at will, Feather fall on wielder 1/day, Detect Lawful Good at will, Wielder does not need to sleep. Extraordinary Powers: Passwall at will, Feeble Mind (DC 23) 2/day, Levitation 3/day. Awesome Powers: Improved Invisibility wielder only 40 min. duration 2/day, Gate 1/day. Embers purpose: Defeat/slay all (other than the Ember and the wielder) Purpose power: Disintegrate (DC 29) Personality: Ember is sadistic and diabolical it enjoys destroying families and adventuring groups, Ember while it's purpose is to slay everything in it's path is smart enough to bide it's time to evaluate a situation and find the best way to bring chaos and pain to all. Ember is the bane of all and over 5000 years ago was once a great wyrm who wrought destruction across continents and many paid tribute to Emberysiritious, Ember was the union of a black and red dragon the only egg to hatch and was gifted with with all the knowledge of a full grown wyrm. Ember would have continued his tyrannical rage of power as a Dracolich however an elf lord whom wanted to harness the power of Ember for himself and commissioned a wizards enclave to forged a sword and trap the power of Ember in it. The wizards were successful but unfortunately the elf lord was no match for Embers will and was unable to control the sword and in Embers wrath he destroy all the elf lord had and the conclave of wizards. Ember's last known location is unknown. The sword was created from living metal (page 179 Magic of Faerun) hardness 12 and has 30 hit-points it can only be harm by another epic weapon equal to it's +6 enhancement bonus. Living metal heals 1 point of damage per minute. Ember also has the ability to morph (page 69 Underdark) into any weapon, long sword, battle axe, bow, spear are some examples, the morphing ability can be found in the Underdark campaign book.
NoldorForce 07-10-07, 02:53 PM	I am sorry Ember has 30 hit points and a hardness of 12. The sword does not have damage immunity it can be damage, look at hardness and hit points on page 222 of the dmg.Except for that note about it only being possible to damage with a +6 weapon. In non-epic campaigns, that's an immunity to anything except +4 Construct Bane weapons.The sword could be a +10. However it is not, it is a +6 meaning that it takes another weapon with a +6 to damage it or even attempt a sunder the other +21 equivalent is for its added special abilities which helps determine Market Price.I was referring to limiting it to a +5 actual enhancement and giving it additional bonuses to put it up to a +10 (non-artifact) or +12 (artifact) effective enhancement. It doesn't need a market price, by the way.Because Ember is intelligent It is my opinion that he can with hold any information he does not want the wielder to know even if that wielder has access to an Identify spell I should think that it would be a contest of wills and Ember has a substantial ego. Again this is only my opinion.But that's not how the rules work. If the PCs run Identify against Ember, it'll work by the rules. If the PCs run any divinations by Ember, they'll work normally against it by the rules. Even if they try to find out how it works brute-force, they'll find out quickly (within two rounds) that it's a REALLY POTENT ITEM. This is just possible by watching; Ember can't withhold the primary weapon powers, which are always on and quite flashy. And a Mind Blank or similar effect on Ember is actually going to be more suspicious, considering that many divinations don't fail or have a very low chance of failing. If Identify tells you nothing, and Detect Magic tells you nothing, but this sword has visible effects that are way out of line with that...you're going to be treating it with a lot of suspicion. The PCs are only going to find Ember in two ways...if they chance to find it or encounter someone else with it in combat. The former offers ample time to look at it, test it, and so forth in safety. If it doesn't seem magical, they're not going to pick it up. If it does...it looks very suspicious. And if it throws stuff at them in the meantime, it's going to look even more suspicious. And the latter makes the sword's effects rather obvious.
DnDsnd 07-10-07, 04:50 PM	Ember can't withhold the primary weapon powers, which are always on and quite flashy. By primary weapon powers what are you referring to. DnD is not just about the rules DnD is a game of imaginations. I agree that the sword is powerful and yes divination can be helpful however the DM can be cryptic with divination offering riddles and sly remarks. I think to many individuals rely on the rules when the rules are meant to be guidelines helping you to shape a fun story and game. The I like how the rules work don't get me wrong because it allows for easy creation of gaming materials and was was referring to the market price so I might have a idea of what it took to create Ember in the first place. I really look forward to your next comment because you inspire me think and ponder more, it helps me to research and learn more. Thank you very much
NoldorForce 07-10-07, 05:09 PM	By primary weapon powers what are you referring to.The whole "+6 acidic blast, everdancing, fiery blast, morphing" part. Intelligent weapons can't suppress that stuff.I agree that the sword is powerful and yes divination can be helpful however the DM can be cryptic with divination offering riddles and sly remarks.That's if you cast the divinations that let the DM do that. Quite a few divinations don't allow enough leeway for this to occur. Commune, for instance, gives one-word answers. Unless said answers would be misleading or contrary to your deity's interests, in which case it gives a short phrase.I think to many individuals rely on the rules when the rules are meant to be guidelines helping you to shape a fun story and game.D&D is still a rules-heavy game; there's quite a lot of stuff that requires the rules, and people assume that the existing rules are going to be followed or at least altered with prior notice.
DnDsnd 07-10-07, 05:37 PM	The whole "+6 acidic blast, everdancing, fiery blast, morphing" part. Intelligent weapons can't suppress that stuff. I am afraid that they very much can Intelligent weapons control all their abilities. they can turn their powers on and off they can say no to the character. Items Against Characters page 271 DMG they have allot of free will They are intelligent after all. Just another example perhaps Ember is willing to let the character know it's powers, willing seducing the character into a sense of security. Ember could play coy and use it's power for good temporally seducing and helping the party and of course they will know it's powerful, but hey it's helping. Also on page 136 of Magic of Faerun There are ideas on self identifying items. As for the acid blast, fiery blast, and everdancing they have to be activated by either the sword or character sword willing. I have used many evil items in many campaigns and allot of the time no one checks the items alignment or may you play without alignments in your game like suggested in Monte Cook's Arcana Unearthed pleas don't limit your fun by being a rules lawyer let the rules be a guide.
tenguroEd 07-10-07, 06:37 PM	/is this supposed to be a weapon of legacy? if so, are there certain levels you gain the abilities?
DnDsnd 07-10-07, 10:41 PM	/is this supposed to be a weapon of legacy? if so, are there certain levels you gain the abilities? Actually I haven't gone over my Weapons of Legacy book yet, but I don't see why some couldn't do that. Who knows I might after I read Weapons of Legacy.