Adamantine weapon price realism [Archive] - Wizards Community

Adamantine weapon price realism [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
evangelion1010
12-07-04, 06:36 PM Can anyone tell me why realistically it would cause the same increase in price to make a adamantine dagger vs a greatsword or spiked chain? Far less material is used on the dagger, and it requires considerably less skill to create a dagger than chain or a greatsword.

I ask this because I'm playing a rogue with upwards of 18 daggers, and find it somewhat unfair/unrealisitc that 10 small daggers (5 pounds) costs 10 times more than a medium spiked chain, which weighs twice as much.
Pinky's brain
12-07-04, 06:50 PM It gets really ridiculous if you actually think about crafting with adamantium, you pay 1/3 of the cost for raw materials ... so the arguement that the cost is because of the higher difficulty of working with it falls flat too. What exactly happens with all that extra adamantium which is supposedly going into weapons of negligible weight?

Maybe it is for balancing reason, regardless though it is too silly ... just ask your DM if you can use a scaled version of the mithril pricing rules.
shakedown47
12-07-04, 06:50 PM The best explanation is that adamantium is rare. Very, very rare. As such, weapons made from it are not made on an assembly line, or one right after the other. The price is a flat increase because the amount of metal needed to create a dagger or a spiked chain doesn't reflect the cost of the weapon so much as actually finding the metal does. People may come across it randomly, or they may have to quest for it. Once it is actually found, they have to get it someplace where it can be worked.

That's part of the reason an adamantium weapon is a masterwork item; someone who actually found enough to work with wouldn't just putz around with it to create a ****** weapon, they would take their time to make it right. That, and if an adamantium dagger only cost 100 gp more than a normal one everyone would have one, and suddenly it wouldn't be that rare anymore. Think of it, some run-of-the-mill rogue having over 18 daggers made of one of the rarest materials in the world? That's one lucky rogue.
Pinky's brain
12-07-04, 07:10 PM That is silly, if finding adamantium daggers is equally hard as finding say an adamantium greataxe then you would just try to find a greataxe instead and craft the daggers from that ... a rogue with 12 adamantium daggers would be luckier than a barbarian with an adamantium greataxe, but only because the barbarian was unfortunate enough to meet said rogue before he acquired those daggers.

No amount of fluff can justify the pricing ... it is not merely fantastical it is inconsistent.

On the other hand, you could always become a hulking hurler and throw collossal adamantium shurikens at a very decent price.
evangelion1010
12-07-04, 07:19 PM Since the amount of material is almost insignificant (1,500 gp for 5 pounds of adamantine), and very few people will argue that it isn't much easier to make a dagger VS a spiked chain, then the price should be something around 500 or so a pop, after i supplied the adamantine?

Also, if one wants to look at rarity and difficulty to craft, ammunition is +60 gp (i'm assuming for 50 units, as is standard), so tell me which is harder to make, 50 arrow heads or a dagger.
shakedown47
12-07-04, 07:36 PM That is silly, if finding adamantium daggers is equally hard as finding say an adamantium greataxe then you would just try to find a greataxe instead and craft the daggers from that ... a rogue with 12 adamantium daggers would be luckier than a barbarian with an adamantium greataxe, but only because the barbarian was unfortunate enough to meet said rogue before he acquired those daggers.

No amount of fluff can justify the pricing ... it is not merely fantastical it is inconsistent.

On the other hand, you could always become a hulking hurler and throw collossal adamantium shurikens at a very decent price.

Use your brain, it's not an issue of finding an adamantine dagger or adamantine greataxe, it's an issue of finding the adamantium itself.
Pinky's brain
12-07-04, 07:51 PM Which is pretty much the same thing in economical terms, this aint X-Men ... weapons can be melted down.
salamander
12-07-04, 08:14 PM Yeah, but whereas raw ore is relatively easy to mine once you've found it, expensive weaponry tends to be used by its owner to vehemently defend his property. ;)
evangelion1010
12-07-04, 08:49 PM So all the cost seems to be coming from obtaining the metal, not how difficult it would be to forge such a hard metal.

You say its the trouble finding the stuff, not the weight involved, but yet he sells an adamantine weapon he sells his daggers for the same price relativly as a great axe, which means he has to go out and find more adamantine that much sooner.

Weaponsmith : wow, this stuff is so hard to find, i better get as much as i can *loads up 300 pounds worth of pure adamantine into the cart*
Adventurer: I'd like an adamantine greataxe
Weaponsmith: Sure. I'll price that the same as a dagger, to reflect the fact that if i stood around making these things all day i'd have to get more adamantine after 30 weapons. Now as far as daggers, well, i'll have to make 300 of those before i go back to get some more. Obviously i should charge the same amount for them, despite the fact that one takes 10 times as much ore...

This also means that when a Titan or someone comes in, a huge greatsword will cost the same +3000 increase that a small dagger will.

Its also why in the real world, precious metals that are difficult to obtain obviously aren't measured out by weight, but rather by application. Its also why diamonds are sold by number, rather than size. :blink: :blink:
Vintar
12-08-04, 09:44 AM I don't know about you - but I sure as heck wouldn't charge the Titan too much - he might get mad. :gah:
Darion Fenix
12-08-04, 10:51 AM I suppose you could multiply the weight of an item by 500 or so and then add the base cost for the item and masterwork quality on top of that.

3335 Gold to make an adamantium bastard sword? Sounds pretty reasonable.
evangelion1010
12-08-04, 11:12 AM Makes small daggers 250 + 300 + 2.... 552 gp, not a bad price, especially compared to 3002.
Darion Fenix
12-08-04, 04:42 PM 26,650 gold for a suit of full plate is pretty steep, but it's reasonable.

"You want a what?...made out of what?"
Melpomene
12-08-04, 04:49 PM Why in goodness would you carry an adamant daggar? That seems downright rediculus. The only reason I can think to craft something like that out of adamant would be for ammo, in which case you'd calculate it out of 50.

Er... sorry, that was a little meaner sounding than I wanted it to be...
Pinky's brain
12-08-04, 04:54 PM Because you are a master thrower with ranged sunder?
Melpomene
12-08-04, 04:57 PM Well, there's that, except that throwing daggars (Vecna know where I got this info from) are also treated as ammo for such things. But, I suppose, YMMV and all that.
Edymnion
12-08-04, 05:17 PM Well, there's that, except that throwing daggars (Vecna know where I got this info from) are also treated as ammo for such things. But, I suppose, YMMV and all that.I don't think even Vecna knows. Throwing daggers are still just plain old daggers. You build and enchant them as normal weapons. Maybe you just need to lay off the pepperroni before bedtime? :P

The whole issue boils down to one thing though
The price of anything in D&D has NOTHING to do with being realistic. It has everything to do with being balanced. You are not paying +3,000 gp for the metal your weapon is made out of, you are paying +3,000 for the ability to ignore hardness and bypass DR.

You could say wooden weapons add +10d6 damage to anything made out of it, and you would pay for that damage boost, it doesn't matter than any Joe Schmoe can cut down a tree limb and use it as an improvised wooden club.

Aka, its like hitpoints. It doesn't have to be realistic, it doesn't have to make sense. Its a balancing point that keeps the game moving. And really, character wealth is the biggest balancing factor for any item your characters ever get. Just accept that its one of those things, and move on with life. If you sit around pulling your hair out trying to get it to make sense, you'll be bald long before you find the answer.
Melpomene
12-08-04, 05:20 PM 1.) I completely agree. It doesn't have to make sense. That's the fun of it.

2.) Vecna knows. Of that, you can be sure.
evangelion1010
12-08-04, 05:59 PM It's balanced as long as you aren't a thrower, or someone who needs 6 + items to be able to hope to bypass DR.

Its that simple. If you're a thrower, throwing 16 daggers a round, all the sudden that DR 10/adamantine that the flaming greatsword powerattacking fighter attacks isn't worth that much, since its being bypassed by a considerable amount each swing.

However DR 3/adamantine and immunity to critcal hits prevents my thrower from doing any damage in a round to said creature. Is that balanced - yes. However I should be able to bypass that with the same relative ease/cost a fighter wielding one weapon can if he gets it made out of adamantine. I realize its unrealistic for some purposes, but i'm essentially useing them as unbreakable ammunition.

I do find it stupid that with my +6 int mod, it'd be more effective to get masterwork craftsmen tools, and a ring of weaponcrafting +10 (10,100 gp total), and make my own daggers if i'm making more than a few of them. The sad thing is i don't even need a rank in craft to do this, i'd get +18 to my check - enough to make masterwork daggers quite effectivly.
Thelon Fairblade
12-09-04, 10:50 AM In the Planescape campaign I play, we repriced all special materials to a per-pound basis. Daggers cost less than greatswords. I think we took longswords as the "base" weight and ratioed from there... Adamantine is like 600 gp per pound.

Personally, I think an adamantine dagger is very useful. Easily concealed, and can cut through stone and iron = perfect escape implement!
detectevil
12-09-04, 11:27 AM Can't you just throw shurikens, or darts or something simplier?
evangelion1010
12-09-04, 02:49 PM Lets see...shurikens are ammunition, hence are destroyed each time thrown. I'd be using 16 a round. A wand of GMW for caster level 20 is 60,000 retail price. that would enchant 50*50 shurikens. That gives me 2,500/16 = 156 rounds. Each round i'd deal (assuming they all hit, which most will execpt on a 1),
16*1 + 16*5 + 8 * int (6), + 1 * 4d6 SA = 163.5
The biggest problem is not doing SA for most of your attacks because of the lack of free feinting in combat.

Its workable, i suppose, but i dislike the flavor, and it deals less damage. However i'm unable to get shurikens of bane (for undead, constructs), holy (demons), etc. Besides, 2,500 small shurikens weigh 125 pounds... i realize there are portable holes, but still...
Edymnion
12-09-04, 04:51 PM It's balanced as long as you aren't a thrower, or someone who needs 6 + items to be able to hope to bypass DR. Not to sound crass, but you are the one that decided to make a character that depended on lugging around at least two dozen differant weapons.

But, why haven't you talked to your DM? Work up some kind of a "split" or "phantom" enchantment. Put it at say, +3, and it allows you to make your full throwing attack using only one weapon. The enchantment makes phantom copies of the weapon, makes the item split into several copies, whatever. Then you could rely on just one weapon the same way everyone else does.

The problem isn't with the system, its with your character. The answer is not to change the system, but to find a character specific solution.
Pathanus
12-09-04, 06:14 PM You could always save the gold on adamantine and put it towards enchanting the weapon as a +1 Metalline made of normal steel (from Underdark source book) and then just change it to adamantine.

Of course this would cost you much more gold than the adamantine itself as it would be a +3 weapon.

You could also make it out of Star Metal (from Complete Arcane) if you can come up with 2000 more gold, since it has a damage bonus too.

Path
Pinky's brain
12-09-04, 06:27 PM Fabricate wont save you with the standard rules BTW. The exact same amount of adamantine goes into a medium dagger as goes into a collosal greatsword, amount of basic material needed to craft something depends only on cost of the finished product. So that just makes you go round in a circle.
evangelion1010
12-09-04, 09:43 PM The exact same amount of adamantine goes into a medium dagger as goes into a collosal greatsword

The spell may work like that, but realistically unless adamantine is some wierd physics altering subject that has variable density solid that keeps its properties regardless of density. Not that i ever expect physics to make sense.

If i'm reading correctly, i need to pay for the cost of materials, for which adamantine is 1/3 the cost of the enchantment (3000gp). If whoever casts the spell has a craft check that allows for a 20 (to make masterwork daggers), i can get said daggers for the cost of 1k/piece, + cost of fabricate.

I'm still going to talk to my DM about that. As for the +3 enchantment (phantom/split), its not a bad idea at all Edymnion. I could get a +1 Holy Split Enfeebling Undead Bane adamantine dagger for 128k (+8 enchantment), which is a decent amount less than i was paying for 16 daggers with various +2 or +3 net enchantments.

I still have the problem of bypassing outsiders DR, which at higher levels is good and silver or cold iron. Metaline is good, i suppose, and i could put it on the dagger for a +10 total.

Of course theres always the +1 Split acidic frost flame sonic shocking outside(evil) bane adamantine dagger (+10) that allows me to get 5d6 damage on 16 attacks. (thats 280 on average, provided no resistance)
Kursk
12-10-04, 10:38 AM In my world it's far rarer than mere gold. And once you get some (unlikely event) only the most skilled Dwarven smiths using arcane dwarven spells can refine and work this metal. So the only ones walking around with it are the "cost is no object crowd".
evangelion1010
12-10-04, 11:27 AM I take it you have few golems in your campaign. Even if its priceless, having 10 priceless items or 1 priceless item... it doesn't make sense that the priceless is the same value.

Anyways, although i can appreciate its rarity, we're using the standard DMG pricing/availability for the sake of arguement.
Kursk
12-10-04, 09:22 PM "Anyways, although i can appreciate its rarity, we're using the standard DMG pricing/availability for the sake of arguement."

I am too. 1 lb of gold = $50 g.p.
1 lb of adamantine = $1000 g.p.

Do the math. NOBODY should have many of these golems running around in their campaign... :D
Quoriil
12-13-04, 12:47 PM Still doesn't make any sense but considering the trouble (magic needed and all that) that a crafter needs to go through to make a single admantine dagger odds are the merchant is just charging you for profit, as that is what merchants do... It's like saying why does my nike slipper-shoe cost so damn much when I could go to a discount shoe store and 10 pairs of massive work boots for the same price? Answer: You are charged because the merchant thinks you will pay for it.
Unmitigated Lie
12-13-04, 10:26 PM +1 size category adds 50% to cost weight and size. A collassal greatsword would cost quite a bit more since it is what 4 size categories bigger?

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
evangelion1010 12-07-04, 06:36 PM	Can anyone tell me why realistically it would cause the same increase in price to make a adamantine dagger vs a greatsword or spiked chain? Far less material is used on the dagger, and it requires considerably less skill to create a dagger than chain or a greatsword. I ask this because I'm playing a rogue with upwards of 18 daggers, and find it somewhat unfair/unrealisitc that 10 small daggers (5 pounds) costs 10 times more than a medium spiked chain, which weighs twice as much.
Pinky's brain 12-07-04, 06:50 PM	It gets really ridiculous if you actually think about crafting with adamantium, you pay 1/3 of the cost for raw materials ... so the arguement that the cost is because of the higher difficulty of working with it falls flat too. What exactly happens with all that extra adamantium which is supposedly going into weapons of negligible weight? Maybe it is for balancing reason, regardless though it is too silly ... just ask your DM if you can use a scaled version of the mithril pricing rules.
shakedown47 12-07-04, 06:50 PM	The best explanation is that adamantium is rare. Very, very rare. As such, weapons made from it are not made on an assembly line, or one right after the other. The price is a flat increase because the amount of metal needed to create a dagger or a spiked chain doesn't reflect the cost of the weapon so much as actually finding the metal does. People may come across it randomly, or they may have to quest for it. Once it is actually found, they have to get it someplace where it can be worked. That's part of the reason an adamantium weapon is a masterwork item; someone who actually found enough to work with wouldn't just putz around with it to create a ****** weapon, they would take their time to make it right. That, and if an adamantium dagger only cost 100 gp more than a normal one everyone would have one, and suddenly it wouldn't be that rare anymore. Think of it, some run-of-the-mill rogue having over 18 daggers made of one of the rarest materials in the world? That's one lucky rogue.
Pinky's brain 12-07-04, 07:10 PM	That is silly, if finding adamantium daggers is equally hard as finding say an adamantium greataxe then you would just try to find a greataxe instead and craft the daggers from that ... a rogue with 12 adamantium daggers would be luckier than a barbarian with an adamantium greataxe, but only because the barbarian was unfortunate enough to meet said rogue before he acquired those daggers. No amount of fluff can justify the pricing ... it is not merely fantastical it is inconsistent. On the other hand, you could always become a hulking hurler and throw collossal adamantium shurikens at a very decent price.
evangelion1010 12-07-04, 07:19 PM	Since the amount of material is almost insignificant (1,500 gp for 5 pounds of adamantine), and very few people will argue that it isn't much easier to make a dagger VS a spiked chain, then the price should be something around 500 or so a pop, after i supplied the adamantine? Also, if one wants to look at rarity and difficulty to craft, ammunition is +60 gp (i'm assuming for 50 units, as is standard), so tell me which is harder to make, 50 arrow heads or a dagger.
shakedown47 12-07-04, 07:36 PM	That is silly, if finding adamantium daggers is equally hard as finding say an adamantium greataxe then you would just try to find a greataxe instead and craft the daggers from that ... a rogue with 12 adamantium daggers would be luckier than a barbarian with an adamantium greataxe, but only because the barbarian was unfortunate enough to meet said rogue before he acquired those daggers. No amount of fluff can justify the pricing ... it is not merely fantastical it is inconsistent. On the other hand, you could always become a hulking hurler and throw collossal adamantium shurikens at a very decent price. Use your brain, it's not an issue of finding an adamantine dagger or adamantine greataxe, it's an issue of finding the adamantium itself.
Pinky's brain 12-07-04, 07:51 PM	Which is pretty much the same thing in economical terms, this aint X-Men ... weapons can be melted down.
salamander 12-07-04, 08:14 PM	Yeah, but whereas raw ore is relatively easy to mine once you've found it, expensive weaponry tends to be used by its owner to vehemently defend his property. ;)
evangelion1010 12-07-04, 08:49 PM	So all the cost seems to be coming from obtaining the metal, not how difficult it would be to forge such a hard metal. You say its the trouble finding the stuff, not the weight involved, but yet he sells an adamantine weapon he sells his daggers for the same price relativly as a great axe, which means he has to go out and find more adamantine that much sooner. Weaponsmith : wow, this stuff is so hard to find, i better get as much as i can loads up 300 pounds worth of pure adamantine into the cart Adventurer: I'd like an adamantine greataxe Weaponsmith: Sure. I'll price that the same as a dagger, to reflect the fact that if i stood around making these things all day i'd have to get more adamantine after 30 weapons. Now as far as daggers, well, i'll have to make 300 of those before i go back to get some more. Obviously i should charge the same amount for them, despite the fact that one takes 10 times as much ore... This also means that when a Titan or someone comes in, a huge greatsword will cost the same +3000 increase that a small dagger will. Its also why in the real world, precious metals that are difficult to obtain obviously aren't measured out by weight, but rather by application. Its also why diamonds are sold by number, rather than size. :blink: :blink:
Vintar 12-08-04, 09:44 AM	I don't know about you - but I sure as heck wouldn't charge the Titan too much - he might get mad. :gah:
Darion Fenix 12-08-04, 10:51 AM	I suppose you could multiply the weight of an item by 500 or so and then add the base cost for the item and masterwork quality on top of that. 3335 Gold to make an adamantium bastard sword? Sounds pretty reasonable.
evangelion1010 12-08-04, 11:12 AM	Makes small daggers 250 + 300 + 2.... 552 gp, not a bad price, especially compared to 3002.
Darion Fenix 12-08-04, 04:42 PM	26,650 gold for a suit of full plate is pretty steep, but it's reasonable. "You want a what?...made out of what?"
Melpomene 12-08-04, 04:49 PM	Why in goodness would you carry an adamant daggar? That seems downright rediculus. The only reason I can think to craft something like that out of adamant would be for ammo, in which case you'd calculate it out of 50. Er... sorry, that was a little meaner sounding than I wanted it to be...
Pinky's brain 12-08-04, 04:54 PM	Because you are a master thrower with ranged sunder?
Melpomene 12-08-04, 04:57 PM	Well, there's that, except that throwing daggars (Vecna know where I got this info from) are also treated as ammo for such things. But, I suppose, YMMV and all that.
Edymnion 12-08-04, 05:17 PM	Well, there's that, except that throwing daggars (Vecna know where I got this info from) are also treated as ammo for such things. But, I suppose, YMMV and all that.I don't think even Vecna knows. Throwing daggers are still just plain old daggers. You build and enchant them as normal weapons. Maybe you just need to lay off the pepperroni before bedtime? :P The whole issue boils down to one thing though The price of anything in D&D has NOTHING to do with being realistic. It has everything to do with being balanced. You are not paying +3,000 gp for the metal your weapon is made out of, you are paying +3,000 for the ability to ignore hardness and bypass DR. You could say wooden weapons add +10d6 damage to anything made out of it, and you would pay for that damage boost, it doesn't matter than any Joe Schmoe can cut down a tree limb and use it as an improvised wooden club. Aka, its like hitpoints. It doesn't have to be realistic, it doesn't have to make sense. Its a balancing point that keeps the game moving. And really, character wealth is the biggest balancing factor for any item your characters ever get. Just accept that its one of those things, and move on with life. If you sit around pulling your hair out trying to get it to make sense, you'll be bald long before you find the answer.
Melpomene 12-08-04, 05:20 PM	1.) I completely agree. It doesn't have to make sense. That's the fun of it. 2.) Vecna knows. Of that, you can be sure.
evangelion1010 12-08-04, 05:59 PM	It's balanced as long as you aren't a thrower, or someone who needs 6 + items to be able to hope to bypass DR. Its that simple. If you're a thrower, throwing 16 daggers a round, all the sudden that DR 10/adamantine that the flaming greatsword powerattacking fighter attacks isn't worth that much, since its being bypassed by a considerable amount each swing. However DR 3/adamantine and immunity to critcal hits prevents my thrower from doing any damage in a round to said creature. Is that balanced - yes. However I should be able to bypass that with the same relative ease/cost a fighter wielding one weapon can if he gets it made out of adamantine. I realize its unrealistic for some purposes, but i'm essentially useing them as unbreakable ammunition. I do find it stupid that with my +6 int mod, it'd be more effective to get masterwork craftsmen tools, and a ring of weaponcrafting +10 (10,100 gp total), and make my own daggers if i'm making more than a few of them. The sad thing is i don't even need a rank in craft to do this, i'd get +18 to my check - enough to make masterwork daggers quite effectivly.
Thelon Fairblade 12-09-04, 10:50 AM	In the Planescape campaign I play, we repriced all special materials to a per-pound basis. Daggers cost less than greatswords. I think we took longswords as the "base" weight and ratioed from there... Adamantine is like 600 gp per pound. Personally, I think an adamantine dagger is very useful. Easily concealed, and can cut through stone and iron = perfect escape implement!
detectevil 12-09-04, 11:27 AM	Can't you just throw shurikens, or darts or something simplier?
evangelion1010 12-09-04, 02:49 PM	Lets see...shurikens are ammunition, hence are destroyed each time thrown. I'd be using 16 a round. A wand of GMW for caster level 20 is 60,000 retail price. that would enchant 5050 shurikens. That gives me 2,500/16 = 156 rounds. Each round i'd deal (assuming they all hit, which most will execpt on a 1), 161 + 165 + 8 int (6), + 1 * 4d6 SA = 163.5 The biggest problem is not doing SA for most of your attacks because of the lack of free feinting in combat. Its workable, i suppose, but i dislike the flavor, and it deals less damage. However i'm unable to get shurikens of bane (for undead, constructs), holy (demons), etc. Besides, 2,500 small shurikens weigh 125 pounds... i realize there are portable holes, but still...
Edymnion 12-09-04, 04:51 PM	It's balanced as long as you aren't a thrower, or someone who needs 6 + items to be able to hope to bypass DR. Not to sound crass, but you are the one that decided to make a character that depended on lugging around at least two dozen differant weapons. But, why haven't you talked to your DM? Work up some kind of a "split" or "phantom" enchantment. Put it at say, +3, and it allows you to make your full throwing attack using only one weapon. The enchantment makes phantom copies of the weapon, makes the item split into several copies, whatever. Then you could rely on just one weapon the same way everyone else does. The problem isn't with the system, its with your character. The answer is not to change the system, but to find a character specific solution.
Pathanus 12-09-04, 06:14 PM	You could always save the gold on adamantine and put it towards enchanting the weapon as a +1 Metalline made of normal steel (from Underdark source book) and then just change it to adamantine. Of course this would cost you much more gold than the adamantine itself as it would be a +3 weapon. You could also make it out of Star Metal (from Complete Arcane) if you can come up with 2000 more gold, since it has a damage bonus too. Path
Pinky's brain 12-09-04, 06:27 PM	Fabricate wont save you with the standard rules BTW. The exact same amount of adamantine goes into a medium dagger as goes into a collosal greatsword, amount of basic material needed to craft something depends only on cost of the finished product. So that just makes you go round in a circle.
evangelion1010 12-09-04, 09:43 PM	The exact same amount of adamantine goes into a medium dagger as goes into a collosal greatsword The spell may work like that, but realistically unless adamantine is some wierd physics altering subject that has variable density solid that keeps its properties regardless of density. Not that i ever expect physics to make sense. If i'm reading correctly, i need to pay for the cost of materials, for which adamantine is 1/3 the cost of the enchantment (3000gp). If whoever casts the spell has a craft check that allows for a 20 (to make masterwork daggers), i can get said daggers for the cost of 1k/piece, + cost of fabricate. I'm still going to talk to my DM about that. As for the +3 enchantment (phantom/split), its not a bad idea at all Edymnion. I could get a +1 Holy Split Enfeebling Undead Bane adamantine dagger for 128k (+8 enchantment), which is a decent amount less than i was paying for 16 daggers with various +2 or +3 net enchantments. I still have the problem of bypassing outsiders DR, which at higher levels is good and silver or cold iron. Metaline is good, i suppose, and i could put it on the dagger for a +10 total. Of course theres always the +1 Split acidic frost flame sonic shocking outside(evil) bane adamantine dagger (+10) that allows me to get 5d6 damage on 16 attacks. (thats 280 on average, provided no resistance)
Kursk 12-10-04, 10:38 AM	In my world it's far rarer than mere gold. And once you get some (unlikely event) only the most skilled Dwarven smiths using arcane dwarven spells can refine and work this metal. So the only ones walking around with it are the "cost is no object crowd".
evangelion1010 12-10-04, 11:27 AM	I take it you have few golems in your campaign. Even if its priceless, having 10 priceless items or 1 priceless item... it doesn't make sense that the priceless is the same value. Anyways, although i can appreciate its rarity, we're using the standard DMG pricing/availability for the sake of arguement.
Kursk 12-10-04, 09:22 PM	"Anyways, although i can appreciate its rarity, we're using the standard DMG pricing/availability for the sake of arguement." I am too. 1 lb of gold = $50 g.p. 1 lb of adamantine = $1000 g.p. Do the math. NOBODY should have many of these golems running around in their campaign... :D
Quoriil 12-13-04, 12:47 PM	Still doesn't make any sense but considering the trouble (magic needed and all that) that a crafter needs to go through to make a single admantine dagger odds are the merchant is just charging you for profit, as that is what merchants do... It's like saying why does my nike slipper-shoe cost so damn much when I could go to a discount shoe store and 10 pairs of massive work boots for the same price? Answer: You are charged because the merchant thinks you will pay for it.
Unmitigated Lie 12-13-04, 10:26 PM	+1 size category adds 50% to cost weight and size. A collassal greatsword would cost quite a bit more since it is what 4 size categories bigger?