Post/Author/DateTime	Post
SephDragoon 01-31-07, 01:00 AM	Ok, here's the deal. My character is a battle sorcerer, and a daggerspell mage. I've been thinking of grabbing Tenser's Transformation, since I've found my melee abilities to be pretty decent, but still lacking. Notably, it wouldn't be somehting I would use very often, but it is a thought. Now, my question is, I already have Arcane Strike, if I used Tenser's Transformation, could I still use the Arcane Strike feat for extra damage? Now, I know some people will come back and say, "that sounds broken" or "I wouldn't allow it in my game" but I am looking for facts not opinions, on whether it can be used or not, not game balance or personal preference. So, if anyone has any definitive rulings, please post, and if you have opinions one way or another, please show why you think so, not just a yes or no.
CowMasterTrojan 01-31-07, 01:16 AM	Arcane Strike is a feat. You are not casting spells, you're sacrificing them. So I see no reason to not allow you the use of your precious feat. Tensors Transformation+Arcane Strike=A good combo for a sorcerer. It's not broken.
Kayli 01-31-07, 01:23 AM	I see your cunundrome, Arcane strike has the ability to cast 3 lvl spells as a prereq, while Tensers transformation causes you to lose your Spell casting ability. Since AS has Spell casting as a Prereq, when you lose that ability you lose access to the feat. On the Flip side, ther are precedents for having feats that you do not meet the Prereq's for (such as monstrous bonus feats, or class bonus feats). and since the TT does not take away your spells slots for the day, there is nothing in the mechanic of TT that prohibits you from sacrificing or loseing them. Also TT is temporary, while you always have AS, even if you do not have any Spell slots left to sacrifice. One other thing to keep in mind, anything the player's can do, the villainous NPC's can do (and probably better).
Xylem 01-31-07, 01:24 AM	Well the version of the spell in the SRD says: You lose your spellcasting ability, including your ability to use spell trigger or spell completion magic items, just as if the spells were no longer on your class list. Using Arcane Strike isn't casting a spell, so far so good. The possible issue arises in the feat's prerequisites, which include the ability to cast 3rd level arcane spells. This is a problem because the SRD says (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/feats.htm#prerequisites) about feats: "A character can’t use a feat if he or she has lost a prerequisite." Which would seem to rule it out, as you no longer meet the prerequisites.
SephDragoon 01-31-07, 01:37 AM	There are other feats that have the same lines... I think Arcane Toughness or some such, which grants health (I am going from memory here >_<). So should they lose their health because they used tenser's transformation, or worse yet, anti-magic field... Anyways, I see your point though, and it does seem a strong arguement against it. I'm looking at other alternatives though, and wow, I checked out divine favor. I have to say, I'm jealous of clerics now. They get a spell that does essentially what I need, but has no material component, is 2 levels lower, and doesn't preclude spellcasting. Divine Favor... bah, stupid divine casters getting everything better than me! Thanks for the replies so far though, i hadn't even thought about the prerequisit being a problem.
unusualsuspect 01-31-07, 03:46 AM	There are other feats that have the same lines... I think Arcane Toughness or some such, which grants health (I am going from memory here >_<). So should they lose their health because they used tenser's transformation, or worse yet, anti-magic field... Anyways, I see your point though, and it does seem a strong arguement against it. I'm looking at other alternatives though, and wow, I checked out divine favor. I have to say, I'm jealous of clerics now. They get a spell that does essentially what I need, but has no material component, is 2 levels lower, and doesn't preclude spellcasting. Divine Favor... bah, stupid divine casters getting everything better than me! Thanks for the replies so far though, i hadn't even thought about the prerequisit being a problem. You mean Divine Power, I think. Divine Favor is that 1st level cleric spell that gives a +1-3 luck bonus to attack and damage for 1 minute/CL. Which, as it happens, is ALSO probably a bit better for melee combat then any 1st level arcane spells I'm aware of.
runestar 01-31-07, 04:34 AM	Divine Favor is that 1st level cleric spell that gives a +1-3 luck bonus to attack and damage for 1 minute/CL. I am pretty sure it lasts for 1 minute flat. But +3 to hit/damage is still a lot for a 1st lv spell.:) And righteous might...:cloud9:
Devlonir 01-31-07, 04:41 AM	[QUOTE=SephDragoon;11341369]There are other feats that have the same lines... I think Arcane Toughness or some such, which grants health (I am going from memory here >_<). So should they lose their health because they used tenser's transformation, or worse yet, anti-magic field...QUOTE] I do not think anti-magic field would stop you from using feats that have the ability to cast certain level spells. You still have the ability to cast them, their effects are just dampened. so i think a feat like Arcane Toughness would still work in an antimagic field, but I am not sure about the use of Arcane Strike.
Kayli 01-31-07, 10:59 AM	What book is Arcane Toughness in? I have been thinking about how to go about building Melee Combat Mage (With out using the stupid Warmge). And this seems like just the Feat I would Need. It would definetly help out with the Weapon Focus (Touch) and Arcane Strike.