Armour question [Archive] - Wizards Community

Armour question [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Tharivol_Nailo
03-05-07, 04:47 PM I have a set of very unique elven chain. It is glammered and has light fortification. Also this armour was made by a now dead mage to have no arcane spell failure chance. Does the last property make it too unbalancing?
Novacat
03-05-07, 04:56 PM By "elven chain", I assume you mean "mithral chain shirt". This already has no ACP. Not overpowered (nor unique), assuming an item with a market value of 7950g (assuming the enhancement bonus is only +1) is alright for your level.
Tharivol_Nailo
03-05-07, 05:02 PM Elven chain is a set of masterwork mithral chainmail, not chain shirt. Look under specific armours in the DMG.
jadehawk
03-05-07, 05:32 PM I think novacat forgot which of the two versions of the elven items in the DMG were listed as elven chain, and to be honest if I didn't have the DMG in front of me I would've forgotten which was the shirt and which was the mail. In hindsight, I now recall the mithral chain shirt is called 'elven shirt', right?

If you are looking to reduce the armour check penalty to 0, I would find a legitimate way to do it. I am pretty sure there is a +1 or +2 magical enhancement that reduces armour check penalties...I can't think of the name, but I think it starts with a "d"...I know, great help.
Tharivol_Nailo
03-05-07, 05:43 PM I think I made a typo, the arcane spell failure chance is zero when wwearing this armour.
Zherog
03-05-07, 05:47 PM If you are looking to reduce the armour check penalty to 0, I would find a legitimate way to do it. I am pretty sure there is a +1 or +2 magical enhancement that reduces armour check penalties...I can't think of the name, but I think it starts with a "d"...I know, great help.

It starts with "t" and is called twilight. ;)

As to whether it's "balanced" or not - it would depend on the value given to the "no arcane spell failure" piece of the armor.
Kouk
03-05-07, 08:14 PM SRD:
Elven Chain
This extremely light chainmail is made of very fine mithral links. Speed while wearing elven chain is 30 feet for Medium creatures, or 20 feet for Small. The armor has an arcane spell failure chance of 20%, a maximum Dexterity bonus of +4, and an armor check penalty of -2. It is considered light armor and weighs 20 pounds.

No aura (nonmagical); Price 4,150 gp.
-------------------------------------------------

So, you want a glamered, light fortification elven chainmail with the added property of having 0% arcane failure chance.

Glamered is not an enhancement, just a flat cost of 2,700 gold.

Light Fortification is a +1 enhancement equivalent.

Twilight special ability is an armor enhancement equivalent to +1 bonus, that reduces arcane failure chance by 10% (and makes it transluscent).

To put any bonus on the armor you need at least a +1 enhanced piece.

Elven Chain base cost 4150g, add a total of +3 enhancement armor bonus (+1 armor, +1 Light Fort, +1 Twilight) for total cost of 9000g.

End result is +1 Twilight Elven Chainmail with Light Fortification:
AC: 6, Check Penalty -2, Arcane Failure Chance 10%, 25% chance to negate crits

Currently there is no way to get elven chainmail below a 10% failure rate unless you are counting character abilities like armored mage. If you want to houserule something like Greater Twilight for 20% reduction in failure, I would think that would count as a +3 bonus instead of a +1.

Alternatively you could figure out how to enchant it in a way that grants armored mage?

Edit: It can't really be unbalanced unless you go over a +10 total enhancement to armor, but the issue is whether you want that item to exist in the game when it is worth so much. It is also quite possible that it was an intentional balance issue to limit Twilight to 10%, but with the money you could probably work some other way around it, like just getting big bracers of armor.
runestar
03-06-07, 01:59 AM You could just say that elven mithril chainshirt variants exist, not just chainmail(who in their right mind would waste good mithril on crafting chainmail?):confused:
Yokomohoyo
03-06-07, 05:01 AM Mith Chain would have a 10% ASF but if you have added Twilight to it it drops to 0%. I highly suspect that your DM added to the armor he gave you.
Kouk
03-06-07, 09:27 AM Elven Mithril Chainmail is the item under discussion, but obviously there exists much confusion between the elven chainmail and a mithril chain shirt. Probably owes to shorthands used in the item's name itself (Elven Chain is mithril chainmail). Anyway, confirm what the item is with the DM (unless that's you).

If the item in actuality is a Mithril Chain Shirt that happened to be made by Elves, and not an enchanted suit of Elven Chainmail, then the 0% spell failure would be doable with existing mechanics (Twilight enchantment).

If it is Elven Chainmail for sure, then it should have a 10% failure chance with normal Twilight enchantment.
WinDReiN
03-06-07, 09:36 AM It seems to me that's an item from Baldur's Gate. If you're trying to convert it by D&D rules, the guys above did it...
starfire311
03-06-07, 09:36 AM It starts with "t" and is called twilight. ;)

As to whether it's "balanced" or not - it would depend on the value given to the "no arcane spell failure" piece of the armor.

lol, yeah it is quite good, my wife got a suit of +1 twilight mithril chainmail at the Gen Con special last year for her level 2 Wizard. Talk about rediculous, they just hand out great items, I got +1 Fireshaped Mithril Breastplate for my level 2 Barbarian. This was all in living greyhawk.

anyway, the glamoured, light fort, twilight mithril chainmail, is not too powerful IMO, I can see a 5th or 6th level character getting access to something like that, and yes it would be on the high powered end, but not gamebreaking.
Tharivol_Nailo
03-06-07, 05:45 PM Its a set of elven chainmail, and im level 15. The armour was from a black dragons treasure horde.
Vegepygmy
03-06-07, 07:36 PM I have a set of very unique elven chain. It is glammered and has light fortification. Also this armour was made by a now dead mage to have no arcane spell failure chance. Does the last property make it too unbalancing?That depends on how it is priced, doesn't it?

Off the top of my head, I'd consider pricing it as bracers of armor +5 (to reflect the armor bonus without any ASF), maybe give it a 20% price break because it does still count as light armor and have an ACP...call it 20,000 gp. Then I'd add light fortification and whatever enhancement bonus (let's assume +1) it has: that's a +2 price modifier (4,000 gp), for a total of 24,000 gp. (I'd throw in the glamered ability for free, since bracers don't look like armor, either.)

So essentially, you'd be paying about 10,000 gp more than for twilight elven chain for having no ASF. That seems reasonable to me.
Tharivol_Nailo
03-07-07, 09:42 PM Ok thank you all.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Tharivol_Nailo 03-05-07, 04:47 PM	I have a set of very unique elven chain. It is glammered and has light fortification. Also this armour was made by a now dead mage to have no arcane spell failure chance. Does the last property make it too unbalancing?
Novacat 03-05-07, 04:56 PM	By "elven chain", I assume you mean "mithral chain shirt". This already has no ACP. Not overpowered (nor unique), assuming an item with a market value of 7950g (assuming the enhancement bonus is only +1) is alright for your level.
Tharivol_Nailo 03-05-07, 05:02 PM	Elven chain is a set of masterwork mithral chainmail, not chain shirt. Look under specific armours in the DMG.
jadehawk 03-05-07, 05:32 PM	I think novacat forgot which of the two versions of the elven items in the DMG were listed as elven chain, and to be honest if I didn't have the DMG in front of me I would've forgotten which was the shirt and which was the mail. In hindsight, I now recall the mithral chain shirt is called 'elven shirt', right? If you are looking to reduce the armour check penalty to 0, I would find a legitimate way to do it. I am pretty sure there is a +1 or +2 magical enhancement that reduces armour check penalties...I can't think of the name, but I think it starts with a "d"...I know, great help.
Tharivol_Nailo 03-05-07, 05:43 PM	I think I made a typo, the arcane spell failure chance is zero when wwearing this armour.
Zherog 03-05-07, 05:47 PM	If you are looking to reduce the armour check penalty to 0, I would find a legitimate way to do it. I am pretty sure there is a +1 or +2 magical enhancement that reduces armour check penalties...I can't think of the name, but I think it starts with a "d"...I know, great help. It starts with "t" and is called twilight. ;) As to whether it's "balanced" or not - it would depend on the value given to the "no arcane spell failure" piece of the armor.
Kouk 03-05-07, 08:14 PM	SRD: Elven Chain This extremely light chainmail is made of very fine mithral links. Speed while wearing elven chain is 30 feet for Medium creatures, or 20 feet for Small. The armor has an arcane spell failure chance of 20%, a maximum Dexterity bonus of +4, and an armor check penalty of -2. It is considered light armor and weighs 20 pounds. No aura (nonmagical); Price 4,150 gp. ------------------------------------------------- So, you want a glamered, light fortification elven chainmail with the added property of having 0% arcane failure chance. Glamered is not an enhancement, just a flat cost of 2,700 gold. Light Fortification is a +1 enhancement equivalent. Twilight special ability is an armor enhancement equivalent to +1 bonus, that reduces arcane failure chance by 10% (and makes it transluscent). To put any bonus on the armor you need at least a +1 enhanced piece. Elven Chain base cost 4150g, add a total of +3 enhancement armor bonus (+1 armor, +1 Light Fort, +1 Twilight) for total cost of 9000g. End result is +1 Twilight Elven Chainmail with Light Fortification: AC: 6, Check Penalty -2, Arcane Failure Chance 10%, 25% chance to negate crits Currently there is no way to get elven chainmail below a 10% failure rate unless you are counting character abilities like armored mage. If you want to houserule something like Greater Twilight for 20% reduction in failure, I would think that would count as a +3 bonus instead of a +1. Alternatively you could figure out how to enchant it in a way that grants armored mage? Edit: It can't really be unbalanced unless you go over a +10 total enhancement to armor, but the issue is whether you want that item to exist in the game when it is worth so much. It is also quite possible that it was an intentional balance issue to limit Twilight to 10%, but with the money you could probably work some other way around it, like just getting big bracers of armor.
runestar 03-06-07, 01:59 AM	You could just say that elven mithril chainshirt variants exist, not just chainmail(who in their right mind would waste good mithril on crafting chainmail?):confused:
Yokomohoyo 03-06-07, 05:01 AM	Mith Chain would have a 10% ASF but if you have added Twilight to it it drops to 0%. I highly suspect that your DM added to the armor he gave you.
Kouk 03-06-07, 09:27 AM	Elven Mithril Chainmail is the item under discussion, but obviously there exists much confusion between the elven chainmail and a mithril chain shirt. Probably owes to shorthands used in the item's name itself (Elven Chain is mithril chainmail). Anyway, confirm what the item is with the DM (unless that's you). If the item in actuality is a Mithril Chain Shirt that happened to be made by Elves, and not an enchanted suit of Elven Chainmail, then the 0% spell failure would be doable with existing mechanics (Twilight enchantment). If it is Elven Chainmail for sure, then it should have a 10% failure chance with normal Twilight enchantment.
WinDReiN 03-06-07, 09:36 AM	It seems to me that's an item from Baldur's Gate. If you're trying to convert it by D&D rules, the guys above did it...
starfire311 03-06-07, 09:36 AM	It starts with "t" and is called twilight. ;) As to whether it's "balanced" or not - it would depend on the value given to the "no arcane spell failure" piece of the armor. lol, yeah it is quite good, my wife got a suit of +1 twilight mithril chainmail at the Gen Con special last year for her level 2 Wizard. Talk about rediculous, they just hand out great items, I got +1 Fireshaped Mithril Breastplate for my level 2 Barbarian. This was all in living greyhawk. anyway, the glamoured, light fort, twilight mithril chainmail, is not too powerful IMO, I can see a 5th or 6th level character getting access to something like that, and yes it would be on the high powered end, but not gamebreaking.
Tharivol_Nailo 03-06-07, 05:45 PM	Its a set of elven chainmail, and im level 15. The armour was from a black dragons treasure horde.
Vegepygmy 03-06-07, 07:36 PM	I have a set of very unique elven chain. It is glammered and has light fortification. Also this armour was made by a now dead mage to have no arcane spell failure chance. Does the last property make it too unbalancing?That depends on how it is priced, doesn't it? Off the top of my head, I'd consider pricing it as bracers of armor +5 (to reflect the armor bonus without any ASF), maybe give it a 20% price break because it does still count as light armor and have an ACP...call it 20,000 gp. Then I'd add light fortification and whatever enhancement bonus (let's assume +1) it has: that's a +2 price modifier (4,000 gp), for a total of 24,000 gp. (I'd throw in the glamered ability for free, since bracers don't look like armor, either.) So essentially, you'd be paying about 10,000 gp more than for twilight elven chain for having no ASF. That seems reasonable to me.
Tharivol_Nailo 03-07-07, 09:42 PM	Ok thank you all.