Post/Author/DateTime	Post
savant_warlord13 09-10-06, 02:54 PM	If I had a 2 oz vial, is there any reason I couldn't use a double dose of a potion? What about mixed potions?
InkBlot 09-10-06, 03:00 PM	You could put a double-dose into a bigger vial, but it would take twice as long to drink. You would have to take two actions to drink it all. Mixing potions is more complicated. It's all covered in the Potion Miscibility article (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dnd/20060401b) published on the D&D website.
savant_warlord13 09-10-06, 03:30 PM	Well that doesn't make much sense. Are you aware how little 1 fluid oz is?
RobbyPants 09-10-06, 03:44 PM	Well that doesn't make much sense. Are you aware how little 1 fluid oz is? Another option your DM might allow is to drink two in one round (easy enough for 2 ounces), but only have one affect you that round, and the second doesn't work until the next round. It keeps you from getting the full effect of two CSW potions in one round, but it's still a little more powerful than usual in that you get two potion effects for the cost of one action. Of course, this would only work if you had to two potions mixed in one container. Grabbing and opening two seperate vials begins to become time consuming. Just an idea.
savant_warlord13 09-10-06, 04:05 PM	I agree about 1 action per container.
Bulletproof_Condom 09-10-06, 06:09 PM	I think some experimentation is in order. Where's my shotglass?
Salla 09-10-06, 06:14 PM	You could put a double-dose into a bigger vial, but it would take twice as long to drink. You would have to take two actions to drink it all. Mixing potions is more complicated. It's all covered in the Potion Miscibility article (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dnd/20060401b) published on the D&D website. It bears noting that article is reprinting, largely for comedic purposes, a 2nd or 1st edition rule. In 3rd, potions are simply 'liquid spell effects', and thus you can have as many running on you at one time as you wish, because there's no limit to how many spells can be cast upon you. "No, don't cast Bull's Strength *and* Invisibility on me!" doesn't happen, for instance. Since drinking a potion is a standard action, and you only get one of those a round, you can only get one effect out of a potion, even if you have a 2oz vial created by pouring two of the same potion into it. Either just drink half of it, or waste your money. As far as mixing potions go, I'd probably invoke some really weird pseudo-physics and make one float atop the other, completely separate due to their densities and cohesion or somesuch. Really ... this is just trying to break the rules. :)
CryoSilver 09-10-06, 06:22 PM	I'd let someone mix 2 potions together: it isn't so terribly game breaking, IMO. You're still paying for both potions, and well, if my experience with certain mixed drinks tells me anything, it is that you can down a shocking amount of liquid in 2-3 seconds.
Bulletproof_Condom 09-10-06, 06:44 PM	Experimentation is goin gwell. it looks liek downing more than one potion in one action at one time is pretty easy. I'll keep worknig...
CryoSilver 09-10-06, 07:29 PM	Experimentation is goin gwell. it looks liek downing more than one potion in one action at one time is pretty easy. I'll keep worknig... Your typing is too coherent; try more at once. I humbly I suggest an Irish carbomb. Or three.
feartheinvinceblehamster 09-10-06, 07:37 PM	Having two separate potions in one container is easy: Just make a container with two different chambers, and a trigger to release the stopper between them. I also don't see why you couldn't make a 2 Oz. vial and drink half to get the benefits of a potion.
Zobdek 09-10-06, 07:39 PM	wouldn't three Irish carbombs, in one standard action, fall under the category of drunken master speed?
KingSpoom 09-10-06, 07:47 PM	Solution: Just make potions bigger. Instead of 1 ounce, just make it 8 or however many you feel you can drink with a standard action. The amount of ounces in a potion is all fluff.
Loki5654 09-10-06, 07:48 PM	I'd let someone mix 2 potions together: it isn't so terribly game breaking, IMO. You're still paying for both potions, and well, if my experience with certain mixed drinks tells me anything, it is that you can down a shocking amount of liquid in 2-3 seconds. OK, but what about 3 potions at once? How about 4? 7? Where do you draw the line? Once you open the "multiple potions at once" door, its awfully hard to close it again. 'Scuse me now, I need to make sure BC isn't going to be driving any time soon.
shift244 09-11-06, 12:41 AM	A quick lesson in the oddity of containing magical effects in liquids also known commonly as potions. "With the great advance in the science of potion making, we're now able to overcome certain limitations in mixing potion effects which our forefathers encountered. However, there is still one peculiar thing we have not worked out. The magic seems to have a dose per time limitation. Multiple doses over time works, but increased doses within a fixed time-frame does not. Hence, we need increased strength potions, such as Cure Light, Cure Moderate, Cure Serious, instead of just simply doubling or tripling the effects. If it worked, I'm sure some would have done so already."
risner 09-11-06, 12:51 AM	Well that doesn't make much sense. Are you aware how little 1 fluid oz is? Makes sense to me that it would take two standard actions to drink a 2 oz potion. Unless you allow daggers extra attacks because they are lighter, then by all means, allow drinking two potions in less time.
runestar 09-11-06, 03:14 AM	Mechanics wise, its to stop players from downing like 100+ potions at 1 go, thus allowing them to quaff all their buff potions at 1 go. You have a limit of 1 potion/round, it is expected to be enforced in the interest of preserving game balance. You could allow it, I daresay it would benefit NPCs more. Simply give each of your foes multiple potions of buff spells like bulls str/casts grace/endurance/haste etc, then have him drink them them all at 1 shot.:P
scienceman47 09-11-06, 04:20 AM	Logic must bow to game mechanics and balance occasionally.
SageBahamut 09-11-06, 10:35 AM	The problem I find more and more, the more I read these boards, is that "occasionally" has a tendency to become "Every time you sit down to play D&D". Why is it so hard for people to simply admit the system as written is buggered like there's no tomorrow, and try to come up with something better? (You know, like those guys over there with the fangs and the fur and the open-ended magic system did.)
CryoSilver 09-11-06, 12:04 PM	OK, but what about 3 potions at once? How about 4? 7? Where do you draw the line? 6. I can down 6 oz in 3 seconds, which is half a round.
Neutronium_Dragon 09-11-06, 12:11 PM	> thus allowing them to quaff all their buff potions at 1 go. That actually makes me wonder whether you couldn't have this idea work, but the potion cost is determined as per multi-function item pricing. Your potion of Cure Light Wounds x2 (caster level 1) thus costs 125 GP (50 + (50 x 1.5)) and heals 2d8+2 (which makes it a bit less expensive and a bit less effective than the Cure Moderate one). Etc.
CryoSilver 09-11-06, 12:16 PM	Quite honestly, I have never purchased a potion of cure anything but Light; the geometric price spike with only linear benefit increase just makes it silly, IMO.
HauptSin 09-11-06, 12:18 PM	Multiple doses of a single potion in one vial? Maybe. Mixing multiple doses of different potions in one vial? Never. It'd probably have horrible, possibly disatrous, effects, as the ingredients and methods that go into making potions tend to be *very* precise.
risner 09-11-06, 12:18 PM	Why is it so hard for people to simply admit the system as written is buggered like there's no tomorrow, and try to come up with something better? Maybe because not everyone believes the system is buggered? I find the system very clean.
Neutronium_Dragon 09-11-06, 12:56 PM	> Mixing multiple doses of different potions in one vial? Sure. Using the above suggestion of multi-property pricing, it's viable. You're paying a premium for the privilege, and there's no reason why someone couldn't thematically just use a different formula for a combined Potion of Bull's Strength and Eagle's Splendor for the paladin to quaff at the start of combat. It'd end up costing 750 GP for the one potion (rather than two separate 300 GP ones), but in all honesty it might be something that would actually have PCs *using* potions in combat situations, something they rarely seem to do in any game I've played (because giving up your attacks or other actions for the round usually isn't worth the effect of the potion even if you happen to have your hands empty and don't mind drawing AoOs).
stevetom 09-11-06, 06:12 PM	if my DM let me have multiple doses of the same potion in a vial or container, id enter combat weilding a longsword in one hand and a pint of cure moderate wounds in the other :D id start having my druid mixing big batches and carry it in my waterskin. haha hey, who isnt to say you cant hold an ounce of potion in your mouth, and swallow it at some later point in time as a free action? im assuming a potion takes affect after you swallow it of course..
Loki5654 09-11-06, 07:02 PM	6. I can down 6 oz in 3 seconds, which is half a round.OK, so that works for you. But what about Ogres? Sprites? Ettins (more than one mouth)? Allowing things to go beyond the one potion per action point needlessly complicates the rules and creates more work for both DMs and players alike. Its an issue of simplification over realism.
CryoSilver 09-11-06, 08:13 PM	OK, so that works for you. But what about Ogres? Sprites? Ettins (more than one mouth)? Allowing things to go beyond the one potion per action point needlessly complicates the rules and creates more work for both DMs and players alike. Its an issue of simplification over realism. Based on the Enlarge Person spell, potion sizes scale with your own size; a larger potion that is proportionately the same size for the larger/smaller creature has the same effect.
Toptomcat 09-11-06, 11:03 PM	An option was presented a few posts back that I absolutely love to bits. It solves all the problems presented while more-or-less keeping the balance. Another option your DM might allow is to drink two in one round (easy enough for 2 ounces), but only have one affect you that round, and the second doesn't work until the next round. It keeps you from getting the full effect of two CSW potions in one round, but it's still a little more powerful than usual in that you get two potion effects for the cost of one action. Extend this to however many can be plausibly downed in one action (call it 6, doubled for every size category above Large, multiplied by the number of mouths the creature has), and you end up with something that respects logic and balance both.
shift244 09-12-06, 12:33 AM	The problem I find more and more, the more I read these boards, is that "occasionally" has a tendency to become "Every time you sit down to play D&D". Why is it so hard for people to simply admit the system as written is buggered like there's no tomorrow, and try to come up with something better? (You know, like those guys over there with the fangs and the fur and the open-ended magic system did.)Yes. The whole point of the rule set IS to introduce balance and "a mechanic that allows playability with sufficient challenges to the players". If you must have logic or common sense over rule the rules (even if the rules do not make direct sense), the what is the point of the rules? That they happen to be based partially off real life experience is not a matter of discussion. They have to be based of something. That it's "buggered" is a relative point of view. Those of us who do not see it as "buggered" choose to because it is AD&D 3.5E and that is the game we're playing. If we wanted something else, we'd have played something else. It is accepted that anything this complex will have peculiarities that are at best amusing and at times annoying. I'm all for improving the weakness of the system, but there are things like the Vancian magic (I too, hate it at times) that makes it D&D, that, if changed just isn't right. Extra large doses are perhaps part of what I find no problem with and do not think needs changing, not as per suggested anyway.
scienceman47 09-12-06, 03:42 AM	Fair enough. So maybe pooling healing potions is okay. Definitely not pooling buff potions. In addition to being a very cheap way to buff yourself at an unacceptable rate, this can be explained very easily with the dangers of mixing certain medicines and drugs together. (two people sitting by eachother) Hey. you got alchohol in my valium! Well, you got valium in my alchohol! Together, they are even more fatal!