Post/Author/DateTime	Post
The Vorpal Tribble 11-11-06, 09:00 PM	For all I know this has already been brought up a thousand times, but I just noticed something strange as I was choosing weapons for a character... the sai is listed as a bludgeoning weapon in both the PHB 3.5 and the SRD, and there is nothing in the errata fixing it. Now, just to make sure I'm not completely insane, does this look like a bludgeoner? http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/ca/Sai.jpg
Dalthbar 11-11-06, 09:03 PM	Sais don't actually have points - they're blunt on the end. I believe they were primarily parrying weapons - not stabbing weapons. For what I know of sais, the listing is consistent.
The Vorpal Tribble 11-11-06, 09:05 PM	Sais don't actually have points - they're blunt on the end. I believe they were primarily parrying weapons - not stabbing weapons. For what I know of sais, the listing is consistent. *looks real closely* :uh-huh: Could have fooled me... and I've watched a number of shows with folks using these, and they always seem to be jabbing with them.
crimsonwolf 11-11-06, 09:11 PM	its true becuse of the constant parrying and catching of weapons they often lost there sharpness or the metal grew weak so instead is relly more of a rob then a point.
Wyrd Bearer 11-11-06, 09:24 PM	Yup, sais are bludgeoning weapons. Have you by chance held one? They are very heavy, with most of the weight in the grip. Very good for beating someone over the head with while using the other to catch their weapon.
Dalthbar 11-11-06, 09:34 PM	It looks like that image is ganked from the wikipedia entry (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sai_%28weapon%29) - go ahead and read it for some information that supports what's being said.
The Vorpal Tribble 11-11-06, 09:51 PM	It looks like that image is ganked from the wikipedia entry (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sai_%28weapon%29) - go ahead and read it for some information that supports what's being said. Yeah, was reading up on it awhile ago. Grrr, I'm beginning to get really sick of Hollywood and their misteachings. However, it does mention they can skewer armor and pin feet to the ground, so its not entirely used for bludgeoning. Btw, this gave me an idea for a feat... Skewering Thrust You can pin your opponent to a surface with your powerful thrusts. Prerequisite: Power attack, Str 13, base attack bonus +6 Benefit: If you are fighting with a piercing weapon the Skewering thrust feat grants you access to three special tactical maneuvers. Pin Them To The Ground: You use a piercing weapon or sai to pin your opponent's foot to the ground. If you use your Power Attack feat to take a -4 penalty to your attack, you may attempt to successfully strike an opponent's supporting limb and drive your blade through it, and into the ground, instead of doing extra damage. Your weapon must be able to do at least 1 point of damage to the surface to stick within. You opponent is unable to move from their square until their turn and may not move from the direction they face without suffering 1 extra point of damage for each square they turn to face besides the one before them. Upon their turn they must use a move action to make an opposed strength check to remove the blade from the ground and their foot, dealing damage equal to half the initial damage the weapon dealt. An opponent who succeeds on a DC 15 Heal check can remove the weapon without further injury. The creature’s speed is reduced by one-half because its foot is wounded. This movement penalty lasts for 24 hours, or until the creature is successfully treated with a DC 15 Heal check, or until it receives magical curing equal to the damage of the attack. Special: A fighter can select Skewering Thrust as one of his fighter bonus feats. I was originally going to make three different varieties of this, including one where you can use, say, a spear to drive someone into a wall. However, I'm wondering if this is not already too powerful.
ShinAkuma2 11-12-06, 12:14 AM	Could have fooled me... and I've watched a number of shows with folks using these, and they always seem to be jabbing with them. Yes, jabbing with the dull, rounded end, causing bruises. Much like using a pool cue. You don't pierce the cue ball, do you?
Solo_Phoenix 11-12-06, 12:44 AM	A cue ball is far tougher than human skin, and it gets pushed away easily, a human gut is very vulnerable to being run through with a pool cue.
Grimmsfeld 11-12-06, 12:49 AM	At exactly what speeds are we talking about, here?
bruiserdeck 11-12-06, 12:50 AM	scroll down a few pages. you will see 2 or 3 full threads on the same topic.
ShinAkuma2 11-12-06, 01:52 AM	A cue ball is far tougher than human skin, and it gets pushed away easily, a human gut is very vulnerable to being run through with a pool cue. :waits: Yeah, ok. A cue would break before it pierced anyone's skin.
The Vorpal Tribble 11-12-06, 07:59 AM	:waits: Yeah, ok. A cue would break before it pierced anyone's skin. In shows sai tend to be pointed and do serious piercage. This may not be what it was originally meant to do, but it is what was shown.
Kyuketsukiouji 11-12-06, 09:26 AM	Well, you have to remember that a major use of the sai (the jitte, actually, but let's not quibble too much) was by japanese law enforcement in pre-meiji era. Basically, it was a weapon used by people who needed to fight swordsmen and who wanted to take their enemies down without killing them. Too many pointy/sharp bits would have made that hard.
crimsonwolf 11-12-06, 11:02 AM	i know we can get magicaly harden leather cord tie it around he grip and make it a ranged blunt object.............
Tyler Do'Urden 11-12-06, 12:12 PM	For all I know this has already been brought up a thousand times...Woah yeah. Yeah, there was a thread on this last week. Sai is a striking weapon. It is not deliberately sharpened in any way. Now you can probably stab things with a sai, but you can also impale someone with a bokken if you're moving fast enough. Doesn't make it a piercing weapon. Do not attempt to adjust your PHB: The sai deals bludgeoning damage.