Bull Rushing into Walls - Rules Clarification [Archive] - Wizards Community

Bull Rushing into Walls - Rules Clarification [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
TheFlamingCow
07-11-06, 01:54 PM I recall a rule for Bull Rushes, that when an opponent is subject to a bull rush and cannot move backwards due to hard cover (such as a wall), the opponent takes 1d6 damage, and 1d6 per additional 5' that he would have been pushed back, and is knocked prone.

This is how we've been playing for some time, but last night when we went to look it up, it was no where to be found!? Is this a legacy 3.0 rule? If so, are there any official rules for being bull rushed into a wall? If not, what house rules does the community use?

I have searched the PHB, the SRD, the FAQ, the errata, WotC website & the Complete Warrior for any rules on this, but cannot find it.

Thanks ahead for the input,
Cow
mvincent
07-11-06, 02:08 PM I recall a rule for Bull Rushes, that when an opponent is subject to a bull rush and cannot move backwards due to hard cover (such as a wall), the opponent takes 1d6 damage, and 1d6 per additional 5' that he would have been pushed back, and is knocked proneThat sounds similar to the knockback rules from champions. It does not appear to be from the 3.0 description of Bull Rush (http://www.opengamingfoundation.org/srd/SRDCombatActions.rtf).

This seems like a fine house rule, however, from the description of Awesome blow (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsterFeats.htm#awesomeBlow), I'd figure in D&D it would be closer to 1d6 per 10'.
kjenks
07-11-06, 03:14 PM There is no such rule. Using Bull Rush to shove an opponent into a wall does not cause any damage to the opponent or to the wall, and it cannot make the opponent prone. (Unless you're thinking of the Domino Rush tactic of the Shock Trooper feat from Complete Warrior.)

If the opponent accidentally ends movement in an illegal square (like being bull rushed into a wall), the DM moves the opponent to his previous square, or, since it's likely to be occupied by the character who attacked with Bull Rush, to the nearest legal square. If more than one square is legal and the same distance away (remembering that squares along the diagonal are also 5 ft. away), the DM rolls randomly to determine which square the opponent ends up in.

This is all explained in the Player's Handbook.
Xeviat-DM
07-11-06, 03:26 PM I have implimented a similar rule in my games, but it isn't a core rule. If you bull rush your target into a wall or other immovable surface, both the target and the surface take 1d6 damage for every 10 points you beat their bull rush check (so basically 1d6 for every 10 feet you would have pushed them back); remember, stone has an 8 hardness, so it won't take too much damage too easily.

Why is it tied to distance? It is nice and symetrical with falling damage, and the distance is pushed in the same amount of time; so more distance means more force.

The great thing about this is that it opens up high level games for some crazy things, such as bullrushing an opponent through a wall (which is why the wall takes damage too).

This does work for Awesome Blow.
dengarbountyhunter
07-11-06, 08:25 PM I have implimented a similar rule in my games, but it isn't a core rule. If you bull rush your target into a wall or other immovable surface, both the target and the surface take 1d6 damage for every 10 points you beat their bull rush check (so basically 1d6 for every 10 feet you would have pushed them back); remember, stone has an 8 hardness, so it won't take too much damage too easily.

Why is it tied to distance? It is nice and symetrical with falling damage, and the distance is pushed in the same amount of time; so more distance means more force.

The great thing about this is that it opens up high level games for some crazy things, such as bullrushing an opponent through a wall (which is why the wall takes damage too).

This does work for Awesome Blow.

Images of hill giants using halflings to go smash through stone walls come to my mind. I assure you that it's not pretty.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
TheFlamingCow 07-11-06, 01:54 PM	I recall a rule for Bull Rushes, that when an opponent is subject to a bull rush and cannot move backwards due to hard cover (such as a wall), the opponent takes 1d6 damage, and 1d6 per additional 5' that he would have been pushed back, and is knocked prone. This is how we've been playing for some time, but last night when we went to look it up, it was no where to be found!? Is this a legacy 3.0 rule? If so, are there any official rules for being bull rushed into a wall? If not, what house rules does the community use? I have searched the PHB, the SRD, the FAQ, the errata, WotC website & the Complete Warrior for any rules on this, but cannot find it. Thanks ahead for the input, Cow
mvincent 07-11-06, 02:08 PM	I recall a rule for Bull Rushes, that when an opponent is subject to a bull rush and cannot move backwards due to hard cover (such as a wall), the opponent takes 1d6 damage, and 1d6 per additional 5' that he would have been pushed back, and is knocked proneThat sounds similar to the knockback rules from champions. It does not appear to be from the 3.0 description of Bull Rush (http://www.opengamingfoundation.org/srd/SRDCombatActions.rtf). This seems like a fine house rule, however, from the description of Awesome blow (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsterFeats.htm#awesomeBlow), I'd figure in D&D it would be closer to 1d6 per 10'.
kjenks 07-11-06, 03:14 PM	There is no such rule. Using Bull Rush to shove an opponent into a wall does not cause any damage to the opponent or to the wall, and it cannot make the opponent prone. (Unless you're thinking of the Domino Rush tactic of the Shock Trooper feat from Complete Warrior.) If the opponent accidentally ends movement in an illegal square (like being bull rushed into a wall), the DM moves the opponent to his previous square, or, since it's likely to be occupied by the character who attacked with Bull Rush, to the nearest legal square. If more than one square is legal and the same distance away (remembering that squares along the diagonal are also 5 ft. away), the DM rolls randomly to determine which square the opponent ends up in. This is all explained in the Player's Handbook.
Xeviat-DM 07-11-06, 03:26 PM	I have implimented a similar rule in my games, but it isn't a core rule. If you bull rush your target into a wall or other immovable surface, both the target and the surface take 1d6 damage for every 10 points you beat their bull rush check (so basically 1d6 for every 10 feet you would have pushed them back); remember, stone has an 8 hardness, so it won't take too much damage too easily. Why is it tied to distance? It is nice and symetrical with falling damage, and the distance is pushed in the same amount of time; so more distance means more force. The great thing about this is that it opens up high level games for some crazy things, such as bullrushing an opponent through a wall (which is why the wall takes damage too). This does work for Awesome Blow.
dengarbountyhunter 07-11-06, 08:25 PM	I have implimented a similar rule in my games, but it isn't a core rule. If you bull rush your target into a wall or other immovable surface, both the target and the surface take 1d6 damage for every 10 points you beat their bull rush check (so basically 1d6 for every 10 feet you would have pushed them back); remember, stone has an 8 hardness, so it won't take too much damage too easily. Why is it tied to distance? It is nice and symetrical with falling damage, and the distance is pushed in the same amount of time; so more distance means more force. The great thing about this is that it opens up high level games for some crazy things, such as bullrushing an opponent through a wall (which is why the wall takes damage too). This does work for Awesome Blow. Images of hill giants using halflings to go smash through stone walls come to my mind. I assure you that it's not pretty.