Post/Author/DateTime	Post
NthDegree256 10-30-06, 10:11 PM	In movies with lots of fencing, I always see the swordsman who has the upper hand driving their opponent backwards... not by shoving against them with pure muscle, but by pressing the attack so threateningly that their opponent steps back to remain safe. (And then tosses their sword into their right hand, and fights back even harder...) It's almost like they're Finessing a bull rush. Would this perhaps be fodder for a feat? Something to let you use your Dex score in place of Str when bull rushing? I was thinking something like this... --- Your quick, nimble fighting style allows you to force your opponent backwards with the mere threat of injury, and to turn the tables on your less-agile foes. Prerequisite: Weapon Finesse Benefit: You may use your Dexterity score instead of your Strength score when initiating a bull rush, or defending against one. Additionally, when you successfully defend against a bull rush in this manner, you may choose to switch places with the attacker. This movement does not provoke attacks of opportunity, either on you or your opponent. --- What do you all think? Is something like this worthwhile? Do the mechanics need to be re-examined? Does anyone have any idea for a good name for this feat?
flipoflak92 10-30-06, 10:20 PM	sounds pretty cool, especially switching places with you're opponent... this can be used to your advantage but as for a name, how about fancy fighter, or dancing driver?
draconic_swine 10-30-06, 10:21 PM	Due to its emphasis on Dexterity, I might be tempted to add a minimum Dexterity of 13 as a prerequisite, especially since this also allows you to switch spots with your opponent, which I think is a neat little mechanic. Other than that, it looks pretty balanced to me. One thing you might want to consider writing up is an Improved Bullrush equivalent for Dex-based characters. If they're interested in Bull Rushing, they'd want the bonuses from IBR, but a Strength of 13 and especially Power Attack aren't necessarily common things for Dex-based characters. As for a name, what about something with "artful" or "nimble" in it? I'm sure others can think of something better, but it's a start.
NthDegree256 10-30-06, 10:35 PM	Due to its emphasis on Dexterity, I might be tempted to add a minimum Dexterity of 13 as a prerequisite, especially since this also allows you to switch spots with your opponent, which I think is a neat little mechanic. Probably a good idea. I'd left out an explicit Dex requirement, as taking Weapon Finesse generally implies that the character has a fairly good Dex to begin with, but I can see how it might be worth including. One thing you might want to consider writing up is an Improved Bullrush equivalent for Dex-based characters. If they're interested in Bull Rushing, they'd want the bonuses from IBR, but a Strength of 13 and especially Power Attack aren't necessarily common things for Dex-based characters. Thanks for pointing that out. I'd written this up with the assumption that it would work well with Improved Bull Rush, but I hadn't even thought to look at IBR's prerequisites, and they are pretty incongruous. I'll have to ponder this for a bit...
crossp 10-31-06, 01:11 AM	I did something like this once in one of my games. Make a combat maneuver called pressing. Then make the feat called Imp. Pressing. Make the prereqs 13 dex and Combat Expertise. (this puts it on equal terms with things like Imp. bull rush, Imp. Overrun, Imp Disarm, and Imp. Trip) Pressing: Pressing can be done as a full round action to force an opponent out of a square or knock the opponent prone. It can only be performed by a character who threatens their own square. Step 1: Move into your opponent's space and incur an attack of opportunity. Step 2: Your opponent chooses to either relinquish the space by taking a 5-foot, or you and the defender make opposed attack rolls with your respective weapons. The wielder of shield gets a +4 bonus on this roll, and a character who lacks the ability to threaten their own square takes a -4. If the combatants are of different sizes, the larger combatant gets a bonus on the attack roll of +4 per difference in size category. Step 3: If the opponent relinquishes the space, the press ends there. Otherwise the loser of the opposed attack roll falls prone in the square. Imp. Pressing removes the attack of opportunity, gives a +4 to opposed attack rolls, and allows the presser to choose which way the opponent dodges if he chooses to do so. If the presser successfully knocks the opponent prone she may make one attack at her highest attack bonus. (including the +4 against prone targets) In order to do it with Dex, you just need to use a finessed weapon. This rule worked really well the few times it came up in my group, and it neatly solved the "what happens if I simply decide to walk into that guy's square and not leave?" problem.
WhiteSatyr 10-31-06, 06:59 AM	In movies with lots of fencing, I always see the swordsman who has the upper hand driving their opponent backwards... not by shoving against them with pure muscle, but by pressing the attack so threateningly that their opponent steps back to remain safe. (And then tosses their sword into their right hand, and fights back even harder...) It's almost like they're Finessing a bull rush. The way you explain this, I'd say it's more intimidation than finesse. It could be another use for the intimidate skill in combat (it might already exist, haven't checked it)
NthDegree256 10-31-06, 04:31 PM	The way you explain this, I'd say it's more intimidation than finesse. It could be another use for the intimidate skill in combat (it might already exist, haven't checked it) Hmm, possibly. The "intimidation" seems to have more to do with your skill in attacking than with your force of personality, though, which is what a Charisma check like Intimidate is. I really like crossp's solution. I mean, really like it. I daresay I'll be using this, perhaps with some modifications (not sure,) as a house rule the next time I run an adventure, or at least a swashbuckly adventure... I'll see how my players like it. I've always felt that D&D combat could do with more maneuverability.
Black_Puffin 10-31-06, 05:51 PM	I think there's a feat in the minitures handbook that allows you to swap places with an opponent using grapple.