carrying only magical equipment. [Archive] - Wizards Community

carrying only magical equipment. [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
shades of eternity
11-21-06, 10:49 AM carrying only magical equipment.

I am building a 6th level human warmage and was selecting equipment with my 13,000 starting money and got the following.

1,100 mithral shirt
4,000 cloak of charisma +2
5,400 metamagic rod, sculpting, lesser
2,500 ring of sustenence

It was then that I realized I was out of money.

I then did some thinking.

Is it possible to start with no standard equipment and actually do well enough to make sure you have money.

Thanks to the ring of sustenence, I do not need food and only 2 hours of sleep so I should be able to keep my costs to virtually nil.

plus it gives me a very good excuse to adventure. Heck the copper coins that low level adventurers go for actually would have value for the character.

plus I think I have enough spells that don't need material components to survive till I can get my hands on a spell component pouch?

Opinions?
tarkin
11-21-06, 01:00 PM Yes, it is possible to live without non-magical stuff.

But, honestly, I don't think the ring of sustance is worth it.

Also, while the rod of sculpting is nice, but there are other things I would rather have spent my money on.

Even the Mithral shirt looks like a poor choice to me. I would instead suggest getting a +1 buckler shield, and taking Mage Armor as a spell. Giving up a first level spell for 7 hours of +4 FORCE armor AC is a good choice for me.

The only time I would take the ring and rod is for a ship voyage,
shades of eternity
11-21-06, 01:06 PM bare in mind mage armor isn't on the spell list for a warmage.

still any ideas on what to get would be helpful.
aukef
11-21-06, 01:12 PM Question is, where did you lose all your mundane items?

Presumably you did use a spell component pouch in your career until 7th level, right? A bedroll?

And your character most likely already did some adventuring, given his level and gear. So the argument of 'giving incentive to go adventure' is not too strong.

Ask yourself: how did your character get to 7th level? Did he use mundane items in that period? If so, where did they go? If not, why not?

Hope this helps...

Auke
tarkin
11-21-06, 01:15 PM I realized that immediately and tried to edit it fixed, but the FREAKIN new edit does not work.

Please disregard the comment about mage armor, but still forget about silly mithral.

You don't need mithral.

Get a +1 Chain Shirt, it is +1 higher AC, about the same cost, and all around a better choice for him. Or go with a shield or something, as in one more level you can get Medium armor and get Mithrail Full Plate if you so desire.
wonlee76
11-21-06, 01:52 PM I would honestly go with a masterwork chain shirt and masterwork buckler instead of the mithral chain shirt. That should free up a good chunk of change for mundane gear. Is your dex so high that the Max Dex bonus of +4 for a regular chain shirt will be a problem (I guess you could be an elf with a 20 dex but even then it doesn't seem to be worth it to me)? I would imagine at later levels it may become an issue but for right now its a wasted expense that could be fixed at a future date.
Green_eyes
11-21-06, 02:26 PM Look at Survival Pouch from RoW and get all the items stored in it as mundane items. And get a Handy Hoversack
Thunder Dragonbane
11-22-06, 12:51 AM Tarken is right many of the things you have taken are got good purchases.

I would suggest you buy some chlothing and a good set of boots.
Mundane items do sometimes make more sense than magic items.
shades of eternity
11-22-06, 11:27 AM revised equipment list to the following

13000 base starting wealth

4,000 cloak of charisma +2
5,400 metamagic rod, sculpting, lesser
2,500 ring of sustenence

11900 magic item subtotal

250 MW Chain Shirt
159 mw light metal shield
5 spiked gauntlet
2 spear
35 light xbow
5 50 bolts
/ sling (wrapped around left shoulder)
4 2 daggers

460 weapon and armor subtotal

treating the below items as Tool, Masterwork
50 mw Tome: principles of casting (+2 to any knowledge arcana checks)
50 mw Tome: War Tome (adds +2 to all knowledge: history checks)
50 mw Tome: beyond the earthly realm (+2 to all knowledge: plane checks)
60 wooden book covers (3)
1 scrolls : 10
1 scroll case.
0.1 ink pen (metal)
16 two vials of ink

2 Backpack
0.5 Blanket, winter 3 lb
0.1 10 candles
1 Flint and steel
10 Tent
1 Oil (1-pint flask) (10)
1 Waterskin

133.7 misc equipment subtotal

12603.7 grand total

any better?
Nephlite
11-22-06, 11:39 AM Tarken is right many of the things you have taken are got good purchases.

I would suggest you buy some chlothing and a good set of boots.
Mundane items do sometimes make more sense than magic items.

Why not go naked! The less you wear, the more hidden you are. Ask Elan:
http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0025.html
Green_eyes
11-22-06, 12:23 PM U forgot clothes. Other than that it is ok, i guess (=
Also hooded lantern is better than 10 candles.
Actually having both is nice.
And... Do u really need that ring? If not - take Everlasting Rations from Heroes of Battle and Heward's Handy Haversack straight from DMG. Both a very nice.
shades of eternity
11-23-06, 10:48 AM When it comes to the ring of sustenence, it's not the food and water that I'm worried about.

It's the reduction to 2 hours of sleep of night.

Even if you have to wait for the rest of the party, you get 6 hours of prep time that you can use for your own purposes.

for my own character, it gives me a chance to "take 20" on my knowledge skills on past creatures we've fought for knowing which spell does the most damage to which creature as well as figuring out what tactics to expect when we get closer to our goals.

By the time the rest of the party wakes up, we already know where we are heading and what we need to do.

Not only that, it means that your awake and ready more often then not during a night encounter.

Never underestimate another set of eyes on watch.

Plus if staying at a hotel, or other unknown area, I'd rather be awake when the assassin comes then not.

Finally, the rest of the party has a tendency to take them, so I kinda feel left out sleeping while they are doing kewl stuff.
MingThing
11-23-06, 04:54 PM if im not mistaken, u need 8 hours of rest or something for spells, even if u dont need that much sleep.

correct me if im wrong.:P
Thunder Dragonbane
11-23-06, 05:18 PM if im not mistaken, u need 8 hours of rest or something for spells, even if u dont need that much sleep.

correct me if im wrong.:P

No you still need 8 hours of rest and prep time. The ring is a complete waste of money.

Think about it. If spellcasters did not need the rest and prep time Elves who do not need to sleep anyway would be the only casters ever played.
Thunder Dragonbane
11-23-06, 05:21 PM [QUOTE=shades of eternity;10717785]When it comes to the ring of sustenence, it's not the food and water that I'm worried about.

It's the reduction to 2 hours of sleep of night.QUOTE]

You still have no CHLOTHES. As for the ring, you still need the spell prep time which is a part of the 8 hours of rest.
Jaid
11-23-06, 07:35 PM also you can't take 20 on knowledge checks, because you cannot retry. you either know or you don't (unless, of course, you are a psion with the appropriate power, in which case it costs you as much PP as a level 10 spell slot, but you can actually take 20 on a knowledge check)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
shades of eternity 11-21-06, 10:49 AM	carrying only magical equipment. I am building a 6th level human warmage and was selecting equipment with my 13,000 starting money and got the following. 1,100 mithral shirt 4,000 cloak of charisma +2 5,400 metamagic rod, sculpting, lesser 2,500 ring of sustenence It was then that I realized I was out of money. I then did some thinking. Is it possible to start with no standard equipment and actually do well enough to make sure you have money. Thanks to the ring of sustenence, I do not need food and only 2 hours of sleep so I should be able to keep my costs to virtually nil. plus it gives me a very good excuse to adventure. Heck the copper coins that low level adventurers go for actually would have value for the character. plus I think I have enough spells that don't need material components to survive till I can get my hands on a spell component pouch? Opinions?
tarkin 11-21-06, 01:00 PM	Yes, it is possible to live without non-magical stuff. But, honestly, I don't think the ring of sustance is worth it. Also, while the rod of sculpting is nice, but there are other things I would rather have spent my money on. Even the Mithral shirt looks like a poor choice to me. I would instead suggest getting a +1 buckler shield, and taking Mage Armor as a spell. Giving up a first level spell for 7 hours of +4 FORCE armor AC is a good choice for me. The only time I would take the ring and rod is for a ship voyage,
shades of eternity 11-21-06, 01:06 PM	bare in mind mage armor isn't on the spell list for a warmage. still any ideas on what to get would be helpful.
aukef 11-21-06, 01:12 PM	Question is, where did you lose all your mundane items? Presumably you did use a spell component pouch in your career until 7th level, right? A bedroll? And your character most likely already did some adventuring, given his level and gear. So the argument of 'giving incentive to go adventure' is not too strong. Ask yourself: how did your character get to 7th level? Did he use mundane items in that period? If so, where did they go? If not, why not? Hope this helps... Auke
tarkin 11-21-06, 01:15 PM	I realized that immediately and tried to edit it fixed, but the FREAKIN new edit does not work. Please disregard the comment about mage armor, but still forget about silly mithral. You don't need mithral. Get a +1 Chain Shirt, it is +1 higher AC, about the same cost, and all around a better choice for him. Or go with a shield or something, as in one more level you can get Medium armor and get Mithrail Full Plate if you so desire.
wonlee76 11-21-06, 01:52 PM	I would honestly go with a masterwork chain shirt and masterwork buckler instead of the mithral chain shirt. That should free up a good chunk of change for mundane gear. Is your dex so high that the Max Dex bonus of +4 for a regular chain shirt will be a problem (I guess you could be an elf with a 20 dex but even then it doesn't seem to be worth it to me)? I would imagine at later levels it may become an issue but for right now its a wasted expense that could be fixed at a future date.
Green_eyes 11-21-06, 02:26 PM	Look at Survival Pouch from RoW and get all the items stored in it as mundane items. And get a Handy Hoversack
Thunder Dragonbane 11-22-06, 12:51 AM	Tarken is right many of the things you have taken are got good purchases. I would suggest you buy some chlothing and a good set of boots. Mundane items do sometimes make more sense than magic items.
shades of eternity 11-22-06, 11:27 AM	revised equipment list to the following 13000 base starting wealth 4,000 cloak of charisma +2 5,400 metamagic rod, sculpting, lesser 2,500 ring of sustenence 11900 magic item subtotal 250 MW Chain Shirt 159 mw light metal shield 5 spiked gauntlet 2 spear 35 light xbow 5 50 bolts / sling (wrapped around left shoulder) 4 2 daggers 460 weapon and armor subtotal treating the below items as Tool, Masterwork 50 mw Tome: principles of casting (+2 to any knowledge arcana checks) 50 mw Tome: War Tome (adds +2 to all knowledge: history checks) 50 mw Tome: beyond the earthly realm (+2 to all knowledge: plane checks) 60 wooden book covers (3) 1 scrolls : 10 1 scroll case. 0.1 ink pen (metal) 16 two vials of ink 2 Backpack 0.5 Blanket, winter 3 lb 0.1 10 candles 1 Flint and steel 10 Tent 1 Oil (1-pint flask) (10) 1 Waterskin 133.7 misc equipment subtotal 12603.7 grand total any better?
Nephlite 11-22-06, 11:39 AM	Tarken is right many of the things you have taken are got good purchases. I would suggest you buy some chlothing and a good set of boots. Mundane items do sometimes make more sense than magic items. Why not go naked! The less you wear, the more hidden you are. Ask Elan: http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0025.html
Green_eyes 11-22-06, 12:23 PM	U forgot clothes. Other than that it is ok, i guess (= Also hooded lantern is better than 10 candles. Actually having both is nice. And... Do u really need that ring? If not - take Everlasting Rations from Heroes of Battle and Heward's Handy Haversack straight from DMG. Both a very nice.
shades of eternity 11-23-06, 10:48 AM	When it comes to the ring of sustenence, it's not the food and water that I'm worried about. It's the reduction to 2 hours of sleep of night. Even if you have to wait for the rest of the party, you get 6 hours of prep time that you can use for your own purposes. for my own character, it gives me a chance to "take 20" on my knowledge skills on past creatures we've fought for knowing which spell does the most damage to which creature as well as figuring out what tactics to expect when we get closer to our goals. By the time the rest of the party wakes up, we already know where we are heading and what we need to do. Not only that, it means that your awake and ready more often then not during a night encounter. Never underestimate another set of eyes on watch. Plus if staying at a hotel, or other unknown area, I'd rather be awake when the assassin comes then not. Finally, the rest of the party has a tendency to take them, so I kinda feel left out sleeping while they are doing kewl stuff.
MingThing 11-23-06, 04:54 PM	if im not mistaken, u need 8 hours of rest or something for spells, even if u dont need that much sleep. correct me if im wrong.:P
Thunder Dragonbane 11-23-06, 05:18 PM	if im not mistaken, u need 8 hours of rest or something for spells, even if u dont need that much sleep. correct me if im wrong.:P No you still need 8 hours of rest and prep time. The ring is a complete waste of money. Think about it. If spellcasters did not need the rest and prep time Elves who do not need to sleep anyway would be the only casters ever played.
Thunder Dragonbane 11-23-06, 05:21 PM	[QUOTE=shades of eternity;10717785]When it comes to the ring of sustenence, it's not the food and water that I'm worried about. It's the reduction to 2 hours of sleep of night.QUOTE] You still have no CHLOTHES. As for the ring, you still need the spell prep time which is a part of the 8 hours of rest.
Jaid 11-23-06, 07:35 PM	also you can't take 20 on knowledge checks, because you cannot retry. you either know or you don't (unless, of course, you are a psion with the appropriate power, in which case it costs you as much PP as a level 10 spell slot, but you can actually take 20 on a knowledge check)