Complete rule falure? Quick Question [Archive] - Wizards Community

Complete rule falure? Quick Question [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Spikes01k
02-25-08, 12:21 AM OK, I can't believe I have gotten this wrong, I am wielding a jovar two handed, I use a full leap attack for -12 to hit and confirm on a critical. How much bonus damage should I do?
jaelis
02-25-08, 12:24 AM No one really knows. Leap attack is confusing. Ask your DM.

The crit part is clear enough though, that multiplier comes after all the power attack damage is added in.
Spikes01k
02-25-08, 12:53 AM No one really knows. Leap attack is confusing. Ask your DM.

The crit part is clear enough though, that multiplier comes after all the power attack damage is added in.

Ok ignoring the leap attack.

I have a jovar wielded two handed, I power attack for -12, and critical. How much bonus damage do I do.
jaelis
02-25-08, 12:55 AM A total of +48. (24 for the power attack, and then doubled for the crit). You don't use the normal multiplier stacking rule here, because they are different things being multiplied.
Spikes01k
02-25-08, 01:01 AM A total of +48. (24 for the power attack, and then doubled for the crit). You don't use the normal multiplier stacking rule here, because they are different things being multiplied.

THANK YOU, my GM and other game players all think the normal multiplier rules DO apply. Can you please give me reference?

http://www.d20srd.org/
mplindustries
02-25-08, 02:52 AM THANK YOU, my GM and other game players all think the normal multiplier rules DO apply. Can you please give me reference?

http://www.d20srd.org/

P.S. This will be sick because if I pull off a critical on the very next round, I will be effectively doing a x10 power attack bonus damage!!!! I just leap attacked, with shock trooper, and used an item (belt of battle) to move away as a swift action. Now with Combat brute, makes my next attack x3 multiplier, so if I leap attack again, that will make it x5, and with improved crit this grants me 15-20 crit, I will possible crit doing effectively x10 power attack damage.

Leap attack increases your power attack multiplier by 1 (the errata lists it at +100%), so it would only be x4 power attacking damage.

Critical damage multiplication is a totally different equation. You don't just multiply straight out, you roll all your damage another time (or two more times if you have x3 for example). So lets say you score a crit with a x2 weapon and you're doing 2d6 + 48 (I have no idea what a Jovar's damage is, so lets pretend its 2d6). You would not roll 2d6, total the dice, add it to 48 and then double it, you would actually roll 2d6+48 twice. In other words, there is no question of power attack and critical multiplying adding.
BruceLeeroy
02-25-08, 03:31 AM Leap attack increases your power attack multiplier by 1 (the errata lists it at +100%), so it would only be x4 power attacking damage.

Critical damage multiplication is a totally different equation. You don't just multiply straight out, you roll all your damage another time (or two more times if you have x3 for example). So lets say you score a crit with a x2 weapon and you're doing 2d6 + 48 (I have no idea what a Jovar's damage is, so lets pretend its 2d6). You would not roll 2d6, total the dice, add it to 48 and then double it, you would actually roll 2d6+48 twice. In other words, there is no question of power attack and critical multiplying adding.

Where are you getting x4 PA damage? Normal PA return is 2:1 for a two handed. Leap attack simply bumps that up to 3:1.

With Leap Attack, you would be getting a 3:1 return ratio for every point invested in your power attack with a two handed weapon. So if you took -12 to hit, on a successful hit, you would add +36 to your bonus damage. This would then be multiplied by your critical. On a jovar, with improved crit (15-20 x2) this would come out to 4d6 + 72 on a successful critical.

Jovars + Leap Attack + Battle Jump + Valorous Weapon + Imp. Crit = Much win.
mplindustries
02-25-08, 03:44 AM Where are you getting x4 PA damage? Normal PA return is 2:1 for a two handed. Leap attack simply bumps that up to 3:1.

He specified also that he was using Combat Brute, hence the x4 on attacks following the intial charge.
Spikes01k
02-25-08, 07:06 AM You know, I KNOW everything you guys are saying. My GM and players are just VERY miss informed. Could you PLEASE give me a source, page #, etc. I just can't find this information any where.

P.S. I am looking for a FAQ but maybe I will just E-mail him this forum.

A critical hit means that you roll your damage more than once, with all your usual bonuses, and add the rolls together. Unless otherwise specified, the threat range for a critical hit on an attack roll is 20, and the multiplier is ×2.

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsInCombat.htm
Spikes01k
02-25-08, 07:55 AM He specified also that he was using Combat Brute, hence the x4 on attacks following the intial charge.

Actually, If I am not mistaken, brute combaten does x3 damage, so does a two handed weapon with leap attack, this brings it to x5 damage, I have a VERY high crit rang which would then double it making it a total of x10 with a crit.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Spikes01k 02-25-08, 12:21 AM	OK, I can't believe I have gotten this wrong, I am wielding a jovar two handed, I use a full leap attack for -12 to hit and confirm on a critical. How much bonus damage should I do?
jaelis 02-25-08, 12:24 AM	No one really knows. Leap attack is confusing. Ask your DM. The crit part is clear enough though, that multiplier comes after all the power attack damage is added in.
Spikes01k 02-25-08, 12:53 AM	No one really knows. Leap attack is confusing. Ask your DM. The crit part is clear enough though, that multiplier comes after all the power attack damage is added in. Ok ignoring the leap attack. I have a jovar wielded two handed, I power attack for -12, and critical. How much bonus damage do I do.
jaelis 02-25-08, 12:55 AM	A total of +48. (24 for the power attack, and then doubled for the crit). You don't use the normal multiplier stacking rule here, because they are different things being multiplied.
Spikes01k 02-25-08, 01:01 AM	A total of +48. (24 for the power attack, and then doubled for the crit). You don't use the normal multiplier stacking rule here, because they are different things being multiplied. THANK YOU, my GM and other game players all think the normal multiplier rules DO apply. Can you please give me reference? http://www.d20srd.org/
mplindustries 02-25-08, 02:52 AM	THANK YOU, my GM and other game players all think the normal multiplier rules DO apply. Can you please give me reference? http://www.d20srd.org/ P.S. This will be sick because if I pull off a critical on the very next round, I will be effectively doing a x10 power attack bonus damage!!!! I just leap attacked, with shock trooper, and used an item (belt of battle) to move away as a swift action. Now with Combat brute, makes my next attack x3 multiplier, so if I leap attack again, that will make it x5, and with improved crit this grants me 15-20 crit, I will possible crit doing effectively x10 power attack damage. Leap attack increases your power attack multiplier by 1 (the errata lists it at +100%), so it would only be x4 power attacking damage. Critical damage multiplication is a totally different equation. You don't just multiply straight out, you roll all your damage another time (or two more times if you have x3 for example). So lets say you score a crit with a x2 weapon and you're doing 2d6 + 48 (I have no idea what a Jovar's damage is, so lets pretend its 2d6). You would not roll 2d6, total the dice, add it to 48 and then double it, you would actually roll 2d6+48 twice. In other words, there is no question of power attack and critical multiplying adding.
BruceLeeroy 02-25-08, 03:31 AM	Leap attack increases your power attack multiplier by 1 (the errata lists it at +100%), so it would only be x4 power attacking damage. Critical damage multiplication is a totally different equation. You don't just multiply straight out, you roll all your damage another time (or two more times if you have x3 for example). So lets say you score a crit with a x2 weapon and you're doing 2d6 + 48 (I have no idea what a Jovar's damage is, so lets pretend its 2d6). You would not roll 2d6, total the dice, add it to 48 and then double it, you would actually roll 2d6+48 twice. In other words, there is no question of power attack and critical multiplying adding. Where are you getting x4 PA damage? Normal PA return is 2:1 for a two handed. Leap attack simply bumps that up to 3:1. With Leap Attack, you would be getting a 3:1 return ratio for every point invested in your power attack with a two handed weapon. So if you took -12 to hit, on a successful hit, you would add +36 to your bonus damage. This would then be multiplied by your critical. On a jovar, with improved crit (15-20 x2) this would come out to 4d6 + 72 on a successful critical. Jovars + Leap Attack + Battle Jump + Valorous Weapon + Imp. Crit = Much win.
mplindustries 02-25-08, 03:44 AM	Where are you getting x4 PA damage? Normal PA return is 2:1 for a two handed. Leap attack simply bumps that up to 3:1. He specified also that he was using Combat Brute, hence the x4 on attacks following the intial charge.
Spikes01k 02-25-08, 07:06 AM	You know, I KNOW everything you guys are saying. My GM and players are just VERY miss informed. Could you PLEASE give me a source, page #, etc. I just can't find this information any where. P.S. I am looking for a FAQ but maybe I will just E-mail him this forum. A critical hit means that you roll your damage more than once, with all your usual bonuses, and add the rolls together. Unless otherwise specified, the threat range for a critical hit on an attack roll is 20, and the multiplier is ×2. http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsInCombat.htm
Spikes01k 02-25-08, 07:55 AM	He specified also that he was using Combat Brute, hence the x4 on attacks following the intial charge. Actually, If I am not mistaken, brute combaten does x3 damage, so does a two handed weapon with leap attack, this brings it to x5 damage, I have a VERY high crit rang which would then double it making it a total of x10 with a crit.