Post/Author/DateTime	Post
flamepheonix182 04-13-08, 11:19 PM	I'm was trying to make an item that would let me enlarge person for a bit each day however i'm confused because when I look at the belt of growth it doesn't seem to follow the formula for creating magic items as outlined in the SRD. So can someone tell me if I'm doing this right? Belt of Growth ( from magic item compendium it costs 3000gp market) This is the formula from the SRD Command word Spell level × caster level × 1,800 gp Spell level = 1 x caster level 10 x 1,800 gp = 18 000 gp market When I use th formula from the SRD it seems really expensive. Any help would be appreciated.
jaelis 04-13-08, 11:42 PM	Your math is right, but you may have overlooked this part: Not all items adhere to these formulas directly. The reasons for this are several. First and foremost, these few formulas aren’t enough to truly gauge the exact differences between items. The price of a magic item may be modified based on its actual worth. The formulas only provide a starting point. In the particular case of the belt of growth, I'd say the price reduction is because the caster level increase doesn't get you all that much. Ten minutes is usually not much more useful than 1 minute... most of the time, it is just one encounter.
groveborn 04-14-08, 12:11 AM	Those are guidelines to help pricing, sometimes it's not the best way to make the items. Consider reducing the cost until the item seems to be worth it, without being too cheap.
Lincht 04-14-08, 01:01 AM	Excuse me, may I use your topic to add some doubts of my own about magic item creation? Oh, well, the case is that one of my players (a Necromancer, to be more specific) is asking me about some item and the way to create it, but he wants to know if is it possible to imbue a feat characteristic into the item, instead of a spell. The feat he is looking forward to put to use is probably from Libris Mortis, it allows you to control five times your HD of undead creatures. As you see, very useful, but may represent a small army if put together with some other spells and/or feats. Also, what would happen if he got the item and the feat himself? Would it be (double) beneficial in some way or just maintain the same statistics? Thanks ;)
risner 04-14-08, 03:46 AM	i'm confused because when I look at the belt of growth it doesn't seem to follow the formula for creating magic items as outlined in the SRD. First, you ignored rules #1 and #2 in item creation and you skipped directly to rule #3. Rule #3 is "use the formulas." Rule #1 is "find a similar item." Rule #2 is "if no similar item, find an item of roughly equivalent power level." Then you fall back to rule #3 or as I call it "Oh My God I can't begin to dream up a price for this item." what would happen if he got the item and the feat himself? Would it be (double) beneficial in some way or just maintain the same statistics? Follow standard D&D stacking rules.
flamepheonix182 04-14-08, 11:41 AM	Thanks for the help. So if I wanted to take the belt and add lets say 3 times a day instead of 1? what would I do? would I just multiply the cost by 3? On the topic of an item with roughly equivalent power level. So if I eventually wanted to get a continuous enlarge I would just look for an item that had a continuous level 1 spell with the same duration?
jaelis 04-14-08, 12:22 PM	So if I wanted to take the belt and add lets say 3 times a day instead of 1? what would I do? would I just multiply the cost by 3? That's what I would do. On the topic of an item with roughly equivalent power level. So if I eventually wanted to get a continuous enlarge I would just look for an item that had a continuous level 1 spell with the same duration? No, you'd have to look for an item with a continuous enlarge person effect. The point being that not all first level spells are equivalent. I don't know of any such item, but I'd probably peg it at around 5 times the belt. It would be great not to need activation, but there are also a lot of downsides to it being active all the time.
risner 04-14-08, 12:40 PM	1) So if I wanted to take the belt and add lets say 3 times a day instead of 1? what would I do? would I just multiply the cost by 3? 2) On the topic of an item with roughly equivalent power level. So if I eventually wanted to get a continuous enlarge I would just look for an item that had a continuous level 1 spell with the same duration? 1) I wouldn't, since 3 times a day is going to make it nearly as good as continuous. 2) No, of course not. You didn't get my point? Continuous True Strike is worth more than Continuous Enlarge Person which is worth more than Continuous Greater Mage Hand. Do you now see how these three items are NOT of similar power?
narack 04-14-08, 12:44 PM	for feat item i use the exp formula by adding all the prerequisite level price ex: if powerattack would be a 2th level gained feat on the fighter automatically and cleave would be 5th lets say. i use the spell xp cost formula which didn't fail me yet for feats 5 gp per 1 XP (2th level xp + 5th level xp) * 5 = price since exp table is not open content ill put stupid number 2th level you hit it at 10 xp and 5th level at 200 xp it would be a total of 210xp 210 X 5 = 1050 gp for an item giving cleave which is in this case a 5th level feat equivalent.
flamepheonix182 04-14-08, 12:46 PM	If I did make it I would probably make it be activated, I'm just trying to get an idea on the process of making an item, and get approximate costs. My DM will have the final say on the price of course, but he likes us to make a skeleton of the item first and then he will tweak it. So how do you guys judge the price when comparing adventuring uses to combat uses? like which one is generally judged more valuable or is this very situational as well? Risner: Ya sorry about that, I thought about that after I posted
groveborn 04-14-08, 03:21 PM	1) I wouldn't, since 3 times a day is going to make it nearly as good as continuous. 2) No, of course not. You didn't get my point? Continuous True Strike is worth more than Continuous Enlarge Person which is worth more than Continuous Greater Mage Hand. Do you now see how these three items are NOT of similar power? I'd disagree on the uses per day. The cost assumes continuous, or 5/day. 3/day would be less expensive than continuous, but yes, approximately 3x more than 1x. It may be better to treat it as 1 casting, broken up into how ever many round/minutes the caster level would allow, distributed through the day as the caster likes. If you wanted to make it continuous, consider pricing it as a +2 strength enhancement, ignoring that it also reduces the Dex, as most fighting types don't really care for that anyway. All in all, I'd argue that a Belt of Giant size (my term) would be about 18000gp, for 10 minutes of use throughout the day. The cost vs. usefulness isn't off balance. Belt of Giant Size: This Belt enlarges one humanoid creature to 1 size category larger than it was, as the Enlarge spell. The creature gains all benefits of the spell, including +2 to strength, -2 to dexterity, -1 to attack and AC. Activating the Belt of Giant Size is a standard action, requiring a spoken command. The wearer may use the belt for up to ten minutes per day, however the wearer likes. These need not be continuous. Moderate transmutation; CL 10th; Craft Wondrous Item, Enlarge Person, Caster Level 10. Price 15000. Cost to create 7500. It's really not so useful that an increase beyond the standard pricing is needed, but it's not so useless that a continual usage is called for. 10 minutes should do the trick. Seeing as how it's only usable for Humanoids, I think a small discount is in order.
jaelis 04-14-08, 04:42 PM	All in all, I'd argue that a Belt of Giant size (my term) would be about 18000gp15000gp, for 10 minutes of use throughout the day. The cost vs. usefulness isn't off balance. You could buy five belts of gowth for that price, giving you a total of 50 minutes of effect at the disadvantage of having to change your belt periodically. Your cost seems too high to me.