Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Rhomphaia 09-26-06, 03:52 AM	I read somewhere months ago that there was a general boards consensus that was generally accepted on what the stats on a katana should be, and that these greatly differed from RAW. I also remembering liking the stats very much but forgot to write them down. If I remember right, it was something like this. 2d4 slashing damage, 18-20/x2 crit, 4 lbs, exotic one-handed weapon Is this about right? I am asking because the issue is coming up in an online game I am in.
Raymond_Luxury_Yacht 09-26-06, 04:52 AM	One-handed exotic weapon, 1d8 slashing, 18-20/X2, weight as bastard sword. Can be used in two hands as a martial weapon.
babysamurai 09-26-06, 05:26 AM	One-handed exotic weapon, slashing, 1d10/19-20. Or, two-handed martial weapon, slashing, 1d10/19-20. That works for my group.
Rulebook 09-26-06, 05:31 AM	yeah, concensus around here follows 2 lines pretty much the "Default" MW bastard sword and 1d8 18-20/x2 bastard mechanic
Archangel62 09-26-06, 10:20 AM	I used d8 since that is a more or less direct translation from 2nd ed.
babysamurai 09-26-06, 10:23 AM	and 1d8 18-20/x2 bastard mechanic Those are the exact stats for the Great Scimitar (Sandstorm).
Rulebook 09-26-06, 10:42 AM	yeah, but the board came up with it before sandstorm so :P
angryman 09-26-06, 11:02 AM	Are you guys still arguing about katanas? They're just swords, you know.
babysamurai 09-26-06, 11:22 AM	Are you guys still arguing about katanas? They're just swords, you know. No one seems to be arguing in this thread.
_Chaz_ 09-26-06, 12:22 PM	Well we are now, damnit. We were doing so well... If it's d8, why use a falchion? Didn't that get upped to 1d10? That's what I houseruled... And the new DM thinks it's silly...
Rhomphaia 09-26-06, 12:26 PM	1d8 and not 2d4...almost seems a little on the weak side for an exotic weapon, but okay. Even if it was 2d4, there is still a very good reason to want to use a falchion; not blow a feat on a single weapon proficiency.
Tony Vargas 09-26-06, 12:45 PM	Even if it was 2d4, there is still a very good reason to want to use a falchion; not blow a feat on a single weapon proficiency.Well, it would be a falchion as far as damage goes at that point - just lighter, IIRC. The falchion is a little underpowered though, compared to other martial weapons, and, especially in the presence of a d8 katana, upping the falchion to d10 certainly wouldn't hurt.
jaelis 09-26-06, 12:49 PM	I agree about the falchion. It also suffers compared to the scythe, which does the same damage and can also trip. I think the 1d10 falchion makes sense. I like the 1d8 18-20/x2 katana, but the standard one is fine too. I personally don't think it should be possible to wield a katana in two hands as a martial weapons unless asian-themed weapons are common in your campaign. But that is just a flavor issue.
Rhomphaia 09-26-06, 12:52 PM	Actually, that is an important mechanical issue since Strength mods and Power Attack all increase in damage when you use a weapon two handed.
Salla 09-26-06, 01:04 PM	A katana is a masterwork bastard sword. Says so in both the DMG and Oriental Adventures.
jaelis 09-26-06, 01:12 PM	Actually, that is an important mechanical issue since Strength mods and Power Attack all increase in damage when you use a weapon two handed. Yes, but you can wield any 1H weapon in two hands and get those advantages. The question is only whether a person without EWP(katana) can do so proficiently.
Vaalingrade Ashland 09-26-06, 01:19 PM	1d8 18-20/x2 bastard I simply can't stop laughing when people suggest a weapon should be 'always masterwork'. Just because the designers didn't think of the implications doesn't mean you can't.
Bulletproof_Condom 09-26-06, 02:49 PM	three-handed erotic flashing weapon, 5d1, 11-20/x1 always considered bastardwork, can be used four-handed as a marital weapon I've never been able to figure out why this miniscule nonissue gets under so many people's skins.
CryoSilver 09-26-06, 02:55 PM	Because people are silly.
Archangel62 09-26-06, 03:37 PM	Are you guys still arguing about katanas? They're just swords, you know. True, I just don't think that they're BASTARD swords.
Jhaelen 09-26-06, 05:16 PM	True, I just don't think that they're BASTARD swords.They aren't. They just have the same stats :)
Archangel62 09-26-06, 05:20 PM	They aren't. They just have the same stats :) Let the hair splitting begin :rolleyes: I like the d8 version more but that's also from a direct translation of the Katana from 2nd edition. Maybe I'm biased that way, I dunno. But the idea of making a Katana a masterwork bastard sword just seems a bit silly. Mostly because of how the balance and design of the weapon would be. The Katana would likely be a bit frailer but I think it would have a bit of a stronger cutting edge, which to me translates into a higher threat range but lower damage.
Vaalingrade Ashland 09-26-06, 06:07 PM	Lets not forget the fact that if they're ALWAYS masterwork, they simply don't exist because no one could learn to make them through practice.
demonsinmyhead 09-26-06, 06:15 PM	speaking of all the 2e swords, what was the one that was 3d6?
jaelis 09-26-06, 06:15 PM	Lets not forget the fact that if they're ALWAYS masterwork, they simply don't exist because no one could learn to make them through practice. Actually, that point is not so bad as it seems... all those apprentice smiths trying to make (mwk version) katanas just end up with bastard swords instead. Eventually they get good enough and the result is a katana.
Tony Vargas 09-26-06, 06:20 PM	speaking of all the 2e swords, what was the one that was 3d6?IIRC, that was a two-handed sword, when used against a larger-than-man-sized creature. The 1E (or 2E) notation would have been Sword, Two-Handed 1-10/3-18, etc.. The 1E OA katana was 1-10/1-12, BTW, while the 1E Bastard Sword was 2-8/2-16 (used two handed) and 1-8/1-12 (used one handed - exactly the same as the longsword).
Vaalingrade Ashland 09-26-06, 06:52 PM	Actually, that point is not so bad as it seems... all those apprentice smiths trying to make (mwk version) katanas just end up with bastard swords instead. Eventually they get good enough and the result is a katana. So its 'okay' that they end up making straight, double edged swords in thier attempts to make curved, single edged swords... because they simply aren't skilled enough? Wouldn't it take something more along the lines of some form of insanity for them to achieve that effect?
Rowan_Whispercloak 09-26-06, 07:02 PM	If you go by some of the stories the first katanas were the result of cutting a chinese style double edged sword in half maybe that is the masterwork problem.
jaelis 09-26-06, 07:10 PM	So its 'okay' that they end up making straight, double edged swords in thier attempts to make curved, single edged swords... because they simply aren't skilled enough? Wouldn't it take something more along the lines of some form of insanity for them to achieve that effect? See, you just have to allow for the fact that some bastard swords look just like katanas, aside from not being masterwork of course. IE, you have to be willing to broaden your notion of what a bastard sword is. Given how loosely the game plays with other weapons terminology, there's no real grounds for objecting to this. Not that I disagree with you... the masterwork thing is pretty silly. It's just that I don't think the designers threw common sense out the window when they made the rule. (Historical accuracy, perhaps, but that window was already long broken.)
Vaalingrade Ashland 09-26-06, 08:06 PM	It's just that I don't think the designers threw common sense out the window when they made the rule. I think its part of an indicative pattern, actually.
risner 09-26-06, 08:10 PM	I've never been able to figure out why this miniscule nonissue gets under so many people's skins. How about Mythbusters showing a Katana was no more powerful than a Longsword? I see no need to make Katana stats better than your traditional Longsword stats.
OamuTheMonk 09-26-06, 08:10 PM	I've never been able to figure out why this miniscule nonissue gets under so many people's skins. Duh-hitto. Lets not forget the fact that if they're ALWAYS masterwork, they simply don't exist because no one could learn to make them through practice. This is a silly argument. It's like saying that all Ferraris can't be fast because the Model T could barely get above 3MPH. Apprentice swordsmiths could practice all the time, making all manner of things--their shoddy work just isn't given to the noble's son. It's melted down to make new swords, or broken down into Tanto blades, or whatever. The katana blades are always masterwork, because of quality control, that's all.
overelemental 09-26-06, 08:17 PM	speaking of all the 2e swords, what was the one that was 3d6? No-dachi? (sp) A two-handed japanese sword thingy
Vaalingrade Ashland 09-26-06, 09:08 PM	This is a silly argument. It's like saying that all Ferraris can't be fast because the Model T could barely get above 3MPH. Nothing of the like. The alsways masterwork is like implying that every single car is the peak of performance and engineering beyond the scope of novices and therefore nothing a novice ever builds is, in fact, a car. And if a novice builds a horseless carriage, it will have an entirely different body and engine configuration. Just because.
GhostStepper 09-26-06, 09:32 PM	Occording to the rules, a crappy katana is just a bastardsword then. People apparently got really good at making these special curved bastardswords by folding crappy iron and such and when they were able to make them well enough, they dubbed them "katana". lol
PhaedrusXY 09-26-06, 09:36 PM	If there was a message board equivalent to grenades, I would hurl one into every katana thread on general principles.
GhostStepper 09-26-06, 09:39 PM	How about Mythbusters showing a Katana was no more powerful than a Longsword? I see no need to make Katana stats better than your traditional Longsword stats. The whole time i watched that episode, i was imagining so many of the people on here that have posted on the armor and katana threads just fuming in their chairs. While they went all out with the katanas, getting both cheap stainless steel and high quality "real" carbon steel variations, for all their european swords it looked like they settled for the cheap replicas they sell at the knife store in the mall.
GhostStepper 09-26-06, 09:40 PM	If there was a message board equivalent to grenades, I would hurl one into every katana thread on general principles. And the katana threads would cut them in half, along with the tank you drove in with. lol
Raymond_Luxury_Yacht 09-26-06, 11:44 PM	No-dachi? (sp) A two-handed japanese sword thingy No, the no-dachi was 1d10/1d20, which became brutal with Weapon Grand Mastery, which made it 1d12/1d100.
Bulletproof_Condom 09-26-06, 11:49 PM	So its 'okay' that they end up making straight, double edged swords in thier attempts to make curved, single edged swords... because they simply aren't skilled enough? Dude... no. The appearance of the weapon has absolutely nothing to do with its game statistics.
Vaalingrade Ashland 09-27-06, 01:07 AM	Then what exactly changed when a Bastard Sword becomes masterwork? Why is there no such thing as a non-masterwork katana if there are non-masterwork swords that look and function exactly like a katana? The always MW blurb is complete crap. Either its not always masterwork, or something about the process of masterworking magically transforms a bastard sword into a katana. A katana is a katana no matter what the quality of the craftsmanship. The only justification for 'always MW' possible is the same justification for the 1d12 15-20x3 specs some rather overly enthusiastic people come up with.
Dire Celestial Bonobo 09-27-06, 01:08 AM	If there was a message board equivalent to grenades, I would hurl one into every katana thread on general principles. Recent evidence suggests that would be asking whether katanas are powerful enough to prevent Fighters from sucking. This seems a fairly reasonable thread, though - the two sensible and common options for katana stats have been noted, and there isn't much arguing so far. Thread was basically over after post #4.
Dire Celestial Bonobo 09-27-06, 01:16 AM	No, the no-dachi was 1d10/1d20, which became brutal with Weapon Grand Mastery, which made it 1d12/1d100. Nah, it was just 3d6+6/3d6+2 with Grand Mastery (Primary = Missiles/Monsters), although it did have both Stun and Deflect(3), which was nice. The +8/+6 to hit was good when using Smash, too. (Where "no-dachi" = "two-handed sword", and "rules" = "old school"...)
Salla 09-27-06, 02:21 AM	I've never been able to figure out why this miniscule nonissue gets under so many people's skins. I blame Japanimation. "Dude, that guy just cut twelve giant alien robots in half with a single WHOO-AAAAAAAHHH! katana swing, that's WAY more than d10 damage!"
Silverthumb128 09-27-06, 04:13 AM	Nothing of the like. The alsways masterwork is like implying that every single car is the peak of performance and engineering beyond the scope of novices and therefore nothing a novice ever builds is, in fact, a car. I'm legitimately confused by this statement: The way I'm reading this, it sounds like every car would be Masterwork, but, the point was that Ferrari would be Masterwork, in terms of being likened to a weapon. A Longsword is a sword, a Bastard Sword is a sword, but a Longsword isn't a Bastard Sword. How is a novice car-maker going to make a car like a Ferrari? Wouldn't you have to be an expert to make something of that quality(please let's not deviate into if they're quality cars or not, that's stupid and off-topic)? What if every Masterwork Bastard Sword were called a Katana? You can still call it a Masterwork Bastard Sword, that wouldn't matter. Its not a different weapon, its still a Bastard Sword either way. There's non-masterwork Bastard Swords, and there's Masterwork Bastards Swords. Non-Masterwork Bastard Swords exist, people just don't call them Katanas. I blame Japanimation. "Dude, that guy just cut twelve giant alien robots in half with a single WHOO-AAAAAAAHHH! katana swing, that's WAY more than d10 damage!" I agree. Though, its not so much Japanimation's fault as it is the person saying that isn't taking into consideration the character's level of skill or modifiers, such as those from feats, Strength, class abilities etc. Have some hobo off the street pick up Kenshin's sword and tell me he's going to cut through 50 armed guards in a round. They could do the same thing with a dagger, and people would still say "That's way more than 1d3." Yeah, it is way more. Its 1d3+a lot more than I want to add up.
CryoSilver 09-27-06, 11:25 AM	Actually, it's 1d4. Which is more than 1d3, so technically dagger fan-boys would be right :P
Silverthumb128 09-27-06, 12:01 PM	Actually, it's 1d4. Which is more than 1d3, so technically dagger fan-boys would be right :P Ya know, I was this close to typing 1d4, I must've had a momentary lapse of memory. :embarrass
Vaalingrade Ashland 09-27-06, 01:36 PM	People suck at transcribing pop culture into a balanced game environment. See also: "Guns should totally blow holes in people the size of a ham".
Raymond_Luxury_Yacht 09-27-06, 02:03 PM	People suck at transcribing pop culture into a balanced game environment. See also: "Guns should totally blow holes in people the size of a ham". With certain guns (read: shotguns with slugs at point blank), that's perfectly accurate.
Joush Mark 09-27-06, 02:42 PM	Fun fact: Katana is the japanise word for sword. Given that most katanas they should be roughly equvalant to a espada. ((The above is a joke, makeing fun of the fact that katana is a japanise word meaning "sword" and encompasses everything from small, cheaply made blades that are little more then long knives intended for use as disposble assasnation weapons to the beatful swords that are as pretty as they are pratical and represent national treasures. Espada is spanish for sword.. a people that created beatful swords of there own, and possessed remarkble swordsmenship.)) When fuctionaly and sprirtualy vary different weapons it isn't unreasonble to suggest that a katana and the "longsword" are simalr weapons that fill the same nitch. (That nitch being a weapon made to be used mounted or not, with one or two hands.) So.. Most daitō should do about 1d8 damage. d20 x2 crit is fine. Oh, and they are no harder to use then an arming sword, so they should be marital. Though literaly exotic in most games there is no reason to consider them exotic as far as game rules are concerned.
PhaedrusXY 09-27-06, 02:48 PM	With certain guns (read: shotguns with slugs at point blank), that's perfectly accurate.Alot of guns can do that if you're using hollowpoint rounds (or "soft-tips", or some of the crazier "shredder" type rounds). If there was a message board equivalent to grenades, I would hurl one into every katana thread on general principles. Recent evidence suggests that would be asking whether katanas are powerful enough to prevent Fighters from sucking. They are only powerful enough to prevent fighters from sucking if they're made of Uranium.
supernerd8916 09-27-06, 06:10 PM	Originally Posted by PhaedrusXY If there was a message board equivalent to grenades, I would hurl one into every katana thread on general principles Actually, I find it's more effective to throw bacon at katana threads. Even a katana can't beat properly cooked homestyle bacon.
Cold Napalm 09-27-06, 08:30 PM	Actually, in the old days, remelting swords was a good way to make them stronger which is why there are so many legends about reforged swords. So those mistakes the novices made were a good foundation for their real sword. Anyways a good explanation of why a katana has to MW is because the iron in japan is just THAT BAD. Basically none MW katanas would just break if you swung it (well not that bad, but pretty close to). If you dont fold the iron (a tradition used my master swordsmiths all over the world), you dont have a servicable sword in japan. The rest of the world on the otherhand can mass produce swords and be happy.
WizO_Cat 09-27-06, 10:49 PM	Ok, this is the equipment and combat boards. Katanas are equipment, so discussion of them is permitted. If you don't want to talk about katanas, then don't post in the thread and more on to the next thread. There's no requirement that each guest has to post in every thread.
Vaalingrade Ashland 09-28-06, 01:05 AM	Anyways a good explanation of why a katana has to MW is because the iron in japan is just THAT BAD. Basically none MW katanas would just break if you swung it (well not that bad, but pretty close to). *checks Forgotten Realms CS* *checks Eberron CS* What 'Japan'? Is this a Dragonlance thing? I don't have that book. Seriously, fictional worlds don't require reflection of the socio-economic--politcal-geological structure of a place to have reasonable facsimiles of the weapon. In fact, the really just don't have that. They barely have a functioning economy or reasource allocation system.
Subedei 09-28-06, 01:33 AM	Yeah, they really should have used better quality European swords on that Mythbusters episode, they certainly have the funding. Around $600-$800 per good Albion sword isn't at all unreasonable and they're about as close as you can get now days to an authentic renaissance weapon. The problem with a lot of swords now days (the ones intended for actual use) is not the blade so much as the grip, they fall appart quite easily with repeated use. I think with the whole masterwork issue it really has to do with the rather unique Japanese forging process. I may not agree with it but it makes enough sense. However, if the Japanese had Eurasian metalurgical technology I'm pretty sure they would have made swords like the rest of the world. Not having blast furnace technology = serious disadvantage for the Japanese. Folding the steel is a good answer to this problem but it's just not going to create as poor and homogenous a steel as a steel as a blast furnace is capable of. Another interesting note - As has been shown in test cutting, completely dull swords with proper edge geometry cut nearly as well as razor sharp ones Oh, and as someone who trains with a Katana among other swords, and has actually sparred against a few other styles I must say - It's not a terribly effective weapon on foot. A longsword is just as fast, it doesn't cut quite as well but that doesn't really matter considering it will still kill or disable you easily. Longswords are generally longer which is an overpowering advantage in combat, they're double edged meaning they can generally outmaneuver the katana and to top it all off their better at thrusting. If you're wearing armor then neither sword will be terribly effective at cutting (just look at how the samurai did against Mongol armor, for instance. They quite clearly stated in documentation of the time that cutting was not seen as effective and thrusting was the better option). The longswords tip is considerable better at penetrating things (for obvious reasons) thus it has the advantage here too. Regardless of any forging differences, by it's shape, it's geometry, the katana is just a saber with a slightly different grip. Sabers were generally considered excellent cavalry weapons but weren't very popular with infantry. The Japanese modeled their katana off the native Ainu swords, which were curved and yes, the katana was originally a cavalry weapon and that remains the only area in which it really shines. Oh yeah, one other thing - Nodachi means "battlefield sword", it refers to pretty much any battlefield sword and so is roughly equivalent to saying "broadsword". The word you're looking for is Odachi(Oodachi) which just means "Big Sword".
Bulletproof_Condom 09-28-06, 01:49 AM	Then what exactly changed when a Bastard Sword becomes masterwork?Nothing becomes masterwork. Weapons are either created masterwork or they aren't. Either nobody is trying to make katana that aren't masterwork, or attempting to do so simply fails. Seriously, it's just a game. If you want a katana at 1st level, play a samurai.
Moon-Lancer 09-28-06, 06:00 AM	well for stats, i think if one wants to few the katana as something mystical, maybe for a oa game or a eastern flavor d&d game, what does everyone think about the elven court blade as a katana. its a d10 weapon 18-20/x2 and is finessable.
babysamurai 09-28-06, 06:46 AM	well for stats, i think if one wants to few the katana as something mystical, maybe for a oa game or a eastern flavor d&d game, what does everyone think about the elven court blade as a katana. its a d10 weapon 18-20/x2 and is finessable. The only problem is that you have to use it 2-handed.
Lord Gwydion 09-28-06, 06:46 AM	First of all, I'd like to point out that the "katana" in the DMG is just an example of what a fictional DM is doing to create a more Asian themed world. That fictional DM chose to make the katana equivalent to a masterwork bastard sword. In the DMG, it's just an example of one way to do it. In OA, there is actually an in-game reason for using the same idea (the all katana are masterwork thing--keeping it the same as a bastard sword stat-wise seems to have just been for simplicity rather than make yet another two-hand martial/one-hand exotic weapon). The reason for katana all being masterwork in OA is that the Samurai class needs to have masterwork weapons in order to properly use his Ancestral Daisho ability. As only masterwork weapons can be enchanted, the Samurai needs a masterwork weapon. In order to ensure that any katana can be upgraded as an Ancestral Daisho, they decided all katana are masterwork. Also, there's likely some influence from L5R/Rokugan, which often takes romanticized notions of feudal Japan to odd extremes. Anyway, katana can realistically be bastard swords (masterwork or not), or could follow the 1d8/18-20x2 model (following the system for other curved swords which take a reduction in damage for an increase in threat range, again masterwork or not as you like). Both are balanced. Pick the one you like.
Moon-Lancer 09-28-06, 06:52 AM	The only problem is that you have to use it 2-handed. why is that a problem. A katana is a two handed weapon as well. Well i wouldent let someone take exotic weapon katana to hold it in one hand if it had the stats of a cout blade. what do you take me for?
babysamurai 09-28-06, 06:55 AM	why is that a problem. A katana is a two handed weapon as well. Well i wouldent let someone take exotic weapon katana to hold it in one hand if it had the stats of a cout blade. what do you take me for? I take you for a lovely person. I’m just saying that regardless of what stats you’re using for a Katana, it should be usable with just one hand.
Moon-Lancer 09-28-06, 12:57 PM	Thanks, im touched :embarrass I alwayse saw it as a twohanded weapon. I think the move thats used as apart of unsheathing the weapon wouldstill be ok (ijitsu strike) as long as the other hand was on the sheath. But i know its been said before, good alternat stats for a katana are d8 18-20/x2. This would be for a one handed version (with a exotic feat) . if one really wants to go katana krazy perhaps d6 18-20/x3. Thiers only so many stats a katana can have
Karma 09-28-06, 03:06 PM	In a world without Samurai, this is a non-issue. IF one of my players really wants a Katana, I may leave a broken one in a treasure horde and make him work for it. When all is said and done, yeah he will have spent all sorts of money having it reforged, but I would give it stats that make it worth his effort. Fortunately, I am the only Japanophile in the group and I could give a :censored: about giving my character a katana... since it is not finnessable, it is worthless to most of my characters. The Elven Court Blade on the other hand is something to get my jollies off.
supernerd8916 09-28-06, 03:49 PM	Originally posted by Lord_Gwydion Anyway, katana can realistically be bastard swords (masterwork or not), or could follow the 1d8/18-20x3 model (following the system for other curved swords which take a reduction in damage for an increase in threat range, again masterwork or not as you like). I assume you mean x2?
Lord Gwydion 09-28-06, 11:17 PM	Whoops, typo. I'll edit that now. :) Thanks for catching it.
PhaedrusXY 09-28-06, 11:23 PM	Nothing becomes masterwork. Weapons are either created masterwork or they aren't. Either nobody is trying to make katana that aren't masterwork, or attempting to do so simply fails. Seriously, it's just a game. If you want a katana at 1st level, play a samurai.Oh yeah!? What if my wizard uses Fabricate to turn a masterwork katana into a non-masterwork katana? What happens? Does the world implode? Does baby jesus come down and give him a spanking with a wet piece of spagetti? Huh? What? I have a theory. I think there is such a thing as a non-masterwork katana: it is a SPORK! That's right, the almighty SPORK! All hail the SPORK, Slayer of Wyrms! Righter of Wrongs! Ruler of Riceroni!
Dire Celestial Bonobo 09-28-06, 11:45 PM	Oh yeah!? What if my wizard uses Fabricate to turn a masterwork katana into a non-masterwork katana? The Katana Maker's Guild insists it be called a Bastard Sword, and uses the Cease and Desist Order[1] against anyone who doesn't cooperate. So there are plenty of non-masterwork Bastard Swords that look just like a Katana, but they're not called Katanas. Why not? 'cuz Jim did that, and look what happened to him... Really, you can solve the issue by just calling it a good PR campaign - Katana(tm) is just a brand name. [1]The Cease and Desist Order is a venerable and much-feared order of powerful vampiric assassins who work only for the Katana Maker's Guild; those who fall into their clutches are drained dry...
babysamurai 09-29-06, 04:05 AM	I have a theory. I think there is such a thing as a non-masterwork katana: it is a SPORK! That’s it; I want a masterwork spork!
Tetsubo 09-29-06, 09:07 AM	That’s it; I want a masterwork spork! I know that there is a company that makes titanium sporks. Would that be considered masterwork?