Could a spiked chain be used as a bludgeoning weapon? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Could a spiked chain be used as a bludgeoning weapon? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
paulb104
05-25-06, 02:56 AM Hey :)

A situation came up recently, with me as a player, and nobody could decide about this.

My pc is proficient with a spiked chain, a roughly ten foot long piercing weapon. Specifically, it's a +1 Spiked Chain of Shock.

Here are the questions:

Could a chain wielder fold the chain in half and use it as a bludgeoning weapon and lose the 10 foot reach?

Would the welder earn a penalty, something akin to the -4 for using a weapon s/he is not proficient with?

If the chain *could* be used as a bludgeoning weapon in the above fashion, would the shock, or even the +1, even apply? It's not like a quarterstaff where each end can be a different magic - the chain as a whole is +1 Shock...

Thanks for your input!!!!

Paul
Bulletproof_Condom
05-25-06, 03:35 AM Easy way out = use the stats of a club. If I was in a good mood, I might apply shock anyway.
Silverthumb128
05-25-06, 04:21 AM I'm having a hard time visualising this, I think. Wouldn't folding a chain in half just make it... half as long? It'd still probably do piercing damage, it just wouldn't be as long. I'm thinking of the spiked chain in this picture:
http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/ph35_gallery/PHB35_PG119_WEB.jpg

Are you talking about using the non-spiked area as the weapon?
paulb104
05-25-06, 09:22 AM I'm having a hard time visualising this, I think. Wouldn't folding a chain in half just make it... half as long? It'd still probably do piercing damage, it just wouldn't be as long. I'm thinking of the spiked chain in this picture:
http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/ph35_gallery/PHB35_PG119_WEB.jpg

Are you talking about using the non-spiked area as the weapon?

The idea is specifically NOT to use the spikes, but to use the length of the chain. "Folding it in half" is a simplified statement. I guess a more accurate, and longer, way might be "folding the chain or holding it and swinging it in such a way that the target is hit with a long length of the links, like a club, not by any sharp pointy part of it"

We envision it like swinging the chain like a baseball bat. Like it's done in the 50's movies when two gangs fight. There's always a guy with a chain...

This might help: a spiked chain wielder comes across a skeleton. Does he put the chain away and take out the flail, or does he re-adjust the way the chain is held and swung so the skeleton target receives bludgeoning damage and thus the attacker avoids the DR 10/slashing?
Tony Vargas
05-25-06, 11:56 AM You can probably use almost anything as a bludgeoning weapon, it's just up to the DM how effective it'll be.

Improvised weapon penalty (-4) should apply.

Weapon enchantments shouldn't apply.

Damage will probaby be reduced.

So, yes, in general, you'd be better off carrying a backup bludgeoning weapon, even if it's just a normal club.
tarkin
05-25-06, 11:56 AM I would allow any PC to do this kind of thing with almost any weapon, with the following limitations:

1) You are not using the blade/weapon head, so you get NONE of the magical enchantments. No flaming, no +1 to hit, no nothing.

2) Look up subduing someone with the flat of a sword. It is called doing 'non-lethal' damage. You are using the weapon in an almost identical method.

As such, you have the same -4 to hit that you would get if you try to subdue someone with the flat of a sword.

However, I do rule that the damage is in fact lethal unless you are trying to do non-lethal, despite being almost identical to what you describe.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
paulb104 05-25-06, 02:56 AM	Hey :) A situation came up recently, with me as a player, and nobody could decide about this. My pc is proficient with a spiked chain, a roughly ten foot long piercing weapon. Specifically, it's a +1 Spiked Chain of Shock. Here are the questions: Could a chain wielder fold the chain in half and use it as a bludgeoning weapon and lose the 10 foot reach? Would the welder earn a penalty, something akin to the -4 for using a weapon s/he is not proficient with? If the chain could be used as a bludgeoning weapon in the above fashion, would the shock, or even the +1, even apply? It's not like a quarterstaff where each end can be a different magic - the chain as a whole is +1 Shock... Thanks for your input!!!! Paul
Bulletproof_Condom 05-25-06, 03:35 AM	Easy way out = use the stats of a club. If I was in a good mood, I might apply shock anyway.
Silverthumb128 05-25-06, 04:21 AM	I'm having a hard time visualising this, I think. Wouldn't folding a chain in half just make it... half as long? It'd still probably do piercing damage, it just wouldn't be as long. I'm thinking of the spiked chain in this picture: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/ph35_gallery/PHB35_PG119_WEB.jpg Are you talking about using the non-spiked area as the weapon?
paulb104 05-25-06, 09:22 AM	I'm having a hard time visualising this, I think. Wouldn't folding a chain in half just make it... half as long? It'd still probably do piercing damage, it just wouldn't be as long. I'm thinking of the spiked chain in this picture: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/ph35_gallery/PHB35_PG119_WEB.jpg Are you talking about using the non-spiked area as the weapon? The idea is specifically NOT to use the spikes, but to use the length of the chain. "Folding it in half" is a simplified statement. I guess a more accurate, and longer, way might be "folding the chain or holding it and swinging it in such a way that the target is hit with a long length of the links, like a club, not by any sharp pointy part of it" We envision it like swinging the chain like a baseball bat. Like it's done in the 50's movies when two gangs fight. There's always a guy with a chain... This might help: a spiked chain wielder comes across a skeleton. Does he put the chain away and take out the flail, or does he re-adjust the way the chain is held and swung so the skeleton target receives bludgeoning damage and thus the attacker avoids the DR 10/slashing?
Tony Vargas 05-25-06, 11:56 AM	You can probably use almost anything as a bludgeoning weapon, it's just up to the DM how effective it'll be. Improvised weapon penalty (-4) should apply. Weapon enchantments shouldn't apply. Damage will probaby be reduced. So, yes, in general, you'd be better off carrying a backup bludgeoning weapon, even if it's just a normal club.
tarkin 05-25-06, 11:56 AM	I would allow any PC to do this kind of thing with almost any weapon, with the following limitations: 1) You are not using the blade/weapon head, so you get NONE of the magical enchantments. No flaming, no +1 to hit, no nothing. 2) Look up subduing someone with the flat of a sword. It is called doing 'non-lethal' damage. You are using the weapon in an almost identical method. As such, you have the same -4 to hit that you would get if you try to subdue someone with the flat of a sword. However, I do rule that the damage is in fact lethal unless you are trying to do non-lethal, despite being almost identical to what you describe.