Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Necroramo 05-27-07, 10:49 AM	Hi, In the game where I play, the DM has it so that when someone coup de graces, he takes the entire round to do it and it actually hits at initiative 0. Logically, it makes sense, but is that how it works? I think it's like that with spells with full-round casting times, but why doesn't something similar take place with other actions that take the entire round, like charging and attacking?
ShinAkuma2 05-27-07, 11:00 AM	He's a little confused. A Full-Round action consumes both your Move and Standard action to perform, but it happens immediately, just like any other action. He might be confusing it with spells that have 1 Round casting time, like a Summon spell or Enlarge Person. Those do take an entire round to perform, and are finished right before your next round's actions.
Necroramo 05-27-07, 11:10 AM	source plz
Peregrine_Wolf 05-27-07, 11:14 AM	Phb, Srd, Dmg...........
Obi-Wan Shinobi 05-27-07, 11:27 AM	yeah, i agree with everyone here. i cant think of ANYTHING that actually makes you go on a specifc number during initiative order, other than actually going on that number cuz thats what you rolled :)
BugHunter 05-27-07, 11:44 AM	It sounds like your DM is trying to make the person doing the coup de grace subject to more attacks then just AoOs. How would your DM rule if someone takes the Death Blow feat that makes a coup de grace a standard action?
Toloran 05-27-07, 01:44 PM	I'm not sure what your DM is on but.... A Full-Round action is defined as a Move Action combined with a Standard Action. Because of this you can either do them both on the same turn, or do one on one turn, and the other on the next turn. So unless your DM wants to change how Full Attacks work (also a full round action), he is wrong. That said, you can just bypass the issue by taking the feat from Complete Warrior (or Complete Adventurer?) that allows you to to CdG as a Move action (or was it standard? I forget).
Vegepygmy 05-29-07, 12:14 AM	source plzPHB, page 138: Each round’s activity begins with the character with the highest initiative result and then proceeds, in order, from there. Each round of a combat uses the same initiative order. When a character’s turn comes up in the initiative sequence, that character performs his entire round’s worth of actions. (For exceptions, see Attacks of Opportunity, page 137, and Special Initiative Actions, page 160.) For almost all purposes, there is no relevance to the end of a round or the beginning of a round. You perform your entire round's worth of actions on your turn, not at some other point in the round. (There are a few exceptions, however.) Good luck convincing your DM of the general rule.
jaelis 05-29-07, 12:18 AM	If you'd like some more rules text, here is a discussion of the difference between a full-round action and an action that take 1 round to complete: Sorcerers and bards must take more time to cast a metamagic spell (one enhanced by a metamagic feat) than a regular spell. If a spell’s normal casting time is 1 standard action, casting a metamagic version of the spell is a full-round action for a sorcerer or bard. Note that this isn’t the same as a spell with a 1-round casting time—the spell takes effect in the same round that you begin casting, and you aren’t required to continue the invocations, gestures, and concentration until your next turn. The same logic applies to any full round action... you finish it at the end of your turn, not the beginning of your next turn.
penchant 05-31-07, 12:48 AM	I wonder what your DM says about the full attack action which is also a full round action?
Alvoros Darkleaf 05-31-07, 03:36 PM	Hi, In the game where I play, the DM has it so that when someone coup de graces, he takes the entire round to do it and it actually hits at initiative 0. Logically, it makes sense, but is that how it works? I think it's like that with spells with full-round casting times, but why doesn't something similar take place with other actions that take the entire round, like charging and attacking? The situations that arise for our group for the CdG are like this: A character in the group does something to an enemy that disables them in some way (hold person etc.) - i.e. makes them subject to a CdG. Of course, the other party members want to take action on this ASAP. So...if another party member is within 5' of the helpess enemy, on that party members initiative he takes a 5' step and performs a CdG (as a full round action) which takes place immediately. Damage roll, save or die etc. There is no way to interupt this, there is no waiting until the end of the round etc. If the character performing the CdG did it on iniative 15, then the enemy dies on iniative 15 (unless the damage is not enough and the save throw is made). If a party member was NOT within 5' of the helpless enemy, than a party member (on his initiative) must MOVE to the helpless enemy, and use a STANDARD action to do the "Start/Complete Full Round Action (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsInCombat.htm#startCompleteFullRou ndAction)" action to begin the CdG. On the party members NEXT turn, he can use ANOTHER standard action to do the "Start/Complete Full Round Action" AGAIN, to complete the CdG. He then has a move action left for that turn. Note: This split full round action CAN be interupted is our interpretation...i.e. should the "helpless" enemy on his initiative break out of the hold person etc. the CdG fails as it was not completed. I have seen no other situations come up. Alvo
pres_man 05-31-07, 03:48 PM	Man, charge must really suck in your group. Fighter: I charge the lead guy. DM: The lead guy moves behind someone else. ok, init 0, you complete your charge but your target is gone. Fighter: Dang it, not again!
BugHunter 05-31-07, 08:31 PM	Man, charge must really suck in your group. Fighter: I charge the lead guy. DM: The lead guy moves behind someone else. ok, init 0, you complete your charge but your target is gone. Fighter: Dang it, not again! The last sentence of the Start/Complete Full round action covers your description it states "You can't use this action to to start or complete a full attack, [U]charge [U], run, or withdraw. That being said the charge must be started and finished on your initiative.
Empiro 05-31-07, 09:03 PM	The action completes on your turn, but making CdG a 1 round action isn't too terrible as a house rule. In fact, as a player, I'd prefer it. I don't know how often it happens to you guys, but I've played under enough killer DMs who like to have monsters delay after one another such that one can immediately hit you with a paralyzing attack or a hold person/monster, and then have another monster immediately step in and CdG you. Having it be 1 round actually will let the party have time to save you by dragging you or by casting remove paralysis, or simply killing the opponent that's threatening you.
pres_man 05-31-07, 10:05 PM	The last sentence of the Start/Complete Full round action covers your description it states "You can't use this action to to start or complete a full attack, [U]charge [U], run, or withdraw. That being said the charge must be started and finished on your initiative. I was speaking of the person in the OP, then did not say their DM was using the Start/Complete Full round action.
BugHunter 05-31-07, 11:14 PM	I was speaking of the person in the OP, then did not say their DM was using the Start/Complete Full round action. Thanks for clearing that up and I will have to agree with you. If the OP's DM runs other full round actions the same as for the CdG it would lead to a big mess. A fighter with multiple attacks getting taken out by the target of their first attack while waiting to take their remaining attacks.