Crafting down a level? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Crafting down a level? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
aleko
08-02-06, 10:50 PM Okay, so I am the assistant dm of a campaign. I am pretty much the rules guy. Recently a question came up over crafting magic items. If you go under exp total to put you into the next level under, do you actually level down or do you have some sort of IOU system to keep that from happening?
SageBahamut
08-02-06, 10:56 PM I believe there's a rule somewhere that says you cannot craft an item if the XP cost would be sufficient to cost you a level. If anyone can prove me right or wrong, go for it.
Personally I don't agree with that - I say craft all you want, it'll just be a while before you ever see another level.
risner
08-03-06, 12:57 AM You can not go below the minimum for your current level.
So you never need to worry.

If you know you wish to do a lot of item creation, you can choose to NOT level up when you get the exp to level. For example, if you are level 3 and gain enough exp to be level 4, you can remain at level 3 and be able to burn off that exp down to 3,000 exp (the minimum to be level 3)
runestar
08-03-06, 09:03 AM Risner, can you show me where that rule on opting not to lv is found? Not that I am doubting you, but another person is inquiring about the same thing, and I cannot find a simply iota of evidence in the PHB or DMG to substantiate my claim...

Thanks in advance. :)
Bulletproof_Condom
08-03-06, 09:42 AM PHB p. 174 talks about spells with XP costs. "You cannot spend so much XP that you lose a level, so you cannot cast the spell unless you have enough XP to spare. However, you may, on gaining enough XP to attain a new level, use those XP for casting a spell rather than keeping them and advancing a level."

'Course that's spells. I guess you have to kind of assume the same goes for item crafting.
shruggar
08-03-06, 09:47 AM (edit: damn you Condom! :))

I remember that rule being in the secion on components for spells.. I dont remember ever specifically reading it in a section on crafting magic items, but logically it should apply to that too.

from http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicOverview/spellDescriptions.htm:

XP Cost (XP)
Some powerful spells entail an experience point cost to you. No spell can restore the XP lost in this manner. You cannot spend so much XP that you lose a level, so you cannot cast the spell unless you have enough XP to spare. However, you may, on gaining enough XP to attain a new level, use those XP for casting a spell rather than keeping them and advancing a level. The XP are treated just like a material component—expended when you cast the spell, whether or not the casting succeeds.

that's (technically) talking about spells only, but.. come on :)
Dalthbar
08-03-06, 09:48 AM It would make sense to extend that to crafting as well.

If you craft something with an XP cost, lose a level, at what point do you take into account the fact that you'd lose any skill points added to your craft, remove any ability stat increases you may have gained when advancing level, etc. Simply given the variables involved, you shouldn't do this.

On the other hand, letting you lose a level at no detriment would allow a wizard to gain a high level, then just make magic items forever until they had 0, but still had all their powers - which is obviously not something that any sane person would allow. His "IOU" pool would be great, but it wouldn't matter because he'd already achieved a very high level.
risner
08-04-06, 02:49 PM PHB p88

"XP Cost: A character cannot spend so much XP on an item that he or she loses a level. However, upon gaining enough XP to attain a new level, he or she can immediately expend XP on creating an item rather than keeping the XP to advance a level."
Bulletproof_Condom
08-04-06, 03:03 PM See, why is this in the PHB? Or rather, why is it only in the PHB? You'd think everything relevant to item creation would be repeated in the DMG somewhere.

'Course it might be, but I ain't lookin' for it.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
aleko 08-02-06, 10:50 PM	Okay, so I am the assistant dm of a campaign. I am pretty much the rules guy. Recently a question came up over crafting magic items. If you go under exp total to put you into the next level under, do you actually level down or do you have some sort of IOU system to keep that from happening?
SageBahamut 08-02-06, 10:56 PM	I believe there's a rule somewhere that says you cannot craft an item if the XP cost would be sufficient to cost you a level. If anyone can prove me right or wrong, go for it. Personally I don't agree with that - I say craft all you want, it'll just be a while before you ever see another level.
risner 08-03-06, 12:57 AM	You can not go below the minimum for your current level. So you never need to worry. If you know you wish to do a lot of item creation, you can choose to NOT level up when you get the exp to level. For example, if you are level 3 and gain enough exp to be level 4, you can remain at level 3 and be able to burn off that exp down to 3,000 exp (the minimum to be level 3)
runestar 08-03-06, 09:03 AM	Risner, can you show me where that rule on opting not to lv is found? Not that I am doubting you, but another person is inquiring about the same thing, and I cannot find a simply iota of evidence in the PHB or DMG to substantiate my claim... Thanks in advance. :)
Bulletproof_Condom 08-03-06, 09:42 AM	PHB p. 174 talks about spells with XP costs. "You cannot spend so much XP that you lose a level, so you cannot cast the spell unless you have enough XP to spare. However, you may, on gaining enough XP to attain a new level, use those XP for casting a spell rather than keeping them and advancing a level." 'Course that's spells. I guess you have to kind of assume the same goes for item crafting.
shruggar 08-03-06, 09:47 AM	(edit: damn you Condom! :)) I remember that rule being in the secion on components for spells.. I dont remember ever specifically reading it in a section on crafting magic items, but logically it should apply to that too. from http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicOverview/spellDescriptions.htm: XP Cost (XP) Some powerful spells entail an experience point cost to you. No spell can restore the XP lost in this manner. You cannot spend so much XP that you lose a level, so you cannot cast the spell unless you have enough XP to spare. However, you may, on gaining enough XP to attain a new level, use those XP for casting a spell rather than keeping them and advancing a level. The XP are treated just like a material component—expended when you cast the spell, whether or not the casting succeeds. that's (technically) talking about spells only, but.. come on :)
Dalthbar 08-03-06, 09:48 AM	It would make sense to extend that to crafting as well. If you craft something with an XP cost, lose a level, at what point do you take into account the fact that you'd lose any skill points added to your craft, remove any ability stat increases you may have gained when advancing level, etc. Simply given the variables involved, you shouldn't do this. On the other hand, letting you lose a level at no detriment would allow a wizard to gain a high level, then just make magic items forever until they had 0, but still had all their powers - which is obviously not something that any sane person would allow. His "IOU" pool would be great, but it wouldn't matter because he'd already achieved a very high level.
risner 08-04-06, 02:49 PM	PHB p88 "XP Cost: A character cannot spend so much XP on an item that he or she loses a level. However, upon gaining enough XP to attain a new level, he or she can immediately expend XP on creating an item rather than keeping the XP to advance a level."
Bulletproof_Condom 08-04-06, 03:03 PM	See, why is this in the PHB? Or rather, why is it only in the PHB? You'd think everything relevant to item creation would be repeated in the DMG somewhere. 'Course it might be, but I ain't lookin' for it.