Custom Jump item? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Custom Jump item? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
symphonic_tempest
10-29-07, 02:04 PM I apologize for posting a relatively simple question, but after consulting the rules on custom items several times, they just won't stick in my head.

I want a custom item that can cast the Jump spell. I'm pretty sure the relevant information in determining price is: caster level, body slot, times/day (or continuous), and comparison to similar officially published items.

Ok, so Jump would need either caster level 1st or 5th, depending on whether I wanted +10 or +20 bonus. Body slot would seem to be feet by affinity, but ring seems right as well for an item that just casts a spell. Times/day could be either 1 or 3 - I'd prefer 3, but it'd depend on the price. The obvious similar item would be Boots of Striding and Springing (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#bootsofStridingandSpri nging), which are 5.5k gp.

I've...totally confused myself now. Either something like Belkar's +20 Jumping ring, or just a ring that cast Jump 1 or 3/day would be awesome to get a price estimate on. Help?

...and while you're at it, can the same formula be applied to an item of Expansion (either normal or boosted to be a 2-size expansion)?

Thanks in advance, O knowledgeable rules gurus.
BruceLeeroy
10-29-07, 04:52 PM Well, skill bonus = (bonus squared x 100)/(5/times per day).

You really shouldn't try to circumvent this pricing using the spell effect pricing.

So, a +20 to jump, 3 times per day would look like [(20 x 20)100]/(5/3) = 24k.

Not bad, as a 5 minute use per charge.

Whereas, with the spell effect pricing, you get (CL x SL x 2000)2 which, in this case would be (5 x 1 x 2000)2 = 20k. As a constant effect.

If you wanted an item that you could vary, say, a +10 here, +20 there, +30 over there, etc, I would look to the items in the MIC as guidance. A pair of boots with 5 charges per day, with 1 charge being a +10, 3 charges being a +20, and 5 charges being a +30 seems consistent. I would price that item at about 5k, nearly the same as the boots of striding and springing. Versatility vs constant effect. Seems like a fair trade-off.

Edit: Note that this is a competence bonus. You could, in theory, create an item with an enhancement bonus, and it would stack with any other competence bonus items, however I would recommend doubling the price. Same as the difference between resistance bonus on saves vs other types.
symphonic_tempest
10-29-07, 05:55 PM Ah, good formula to know - thanks.

I wasn't trying to circumvent any pricing rules, I just didn't know about the formula you stated. Promise.

So since you're implying that trying to price by spell level, etc makes prices too low - is there a doable way to price a ring of Expansion, or would a per day item to be two size larger be too powerful?
Decinious
10-29-07, 06:49 PM Keep in mind that skill bonuses that are (bonus x bonus x100) are for an all day item... so nerfing it to be uses only a few times per day doesn't net you much of a discount. +20 ring of jumping, 40,000 compared to one usable 3 times per day at 24,000. Now you could always use potions of jump at 50 gp for +10, 1250 gp for +20...
ScipioX
10-30-07, 01:38 AM jump is one of those skills where its ok to ignore the skill bonus guidelines. Since jump is completely outdone by a ring of flying, an infinite bonus to jump should still be less than a ring of flying.
symphonic_tempest
10-30-07, 04:59 AM I'm not familiar with the ring of flying (sorry). What's your recommendation on the price, then?
BruceLeeroy
10-30-07, 06:32 AM I disagree, Scipio. For melee characters, jump is still useful. Leap attack + Battle Jump are two of my favorites, and there are a few other very nice feats that take advantage of jumping rather than flying.

An item based on a spell should follow the formula presented on page 285 of the DMG, table 7-33. Note that the prices are changed based on the duration of the spell, I've seen a lot of people miss that in their item price calculations. Read the fine print under the table.

Also remember: these are guidelines, not hard and fast rules. If it feels like you're exploiting the rules by creating an item using this formula, then you probably are. One way to adjust the price without changing the gold cost is (if you happen to be the DM, that is) to make it difficult for the character to acquire, as in a long-term goal or hard-won treasure. Or make them sacrifice something else they enjoy. This is often a better way to adjust the value of an item than just raising the market price (which can have other consequences).

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
symphonic_tempest 10-29-07, 02:04 PM	I apologize for posting a relatively simple question, but after consulting the rules on custom items several times, they just won't stick in my head. I want a custom item that can cast the Jump spell. I'm pretty sure the relevant information in determining price is: caster level, body slot, times/day (or continuous), and comparison to similar officially published items. Ok, so Jump would need either caster level 1st or 5th, depending on whether I wanted +10 or +20 bonus. Body slot would seem to be feet by affinity, but ring seems right as well for an item that just casts a spell. Times/day could be either 1 or 3 - I'd prefer 3, but it'd depend on the price. The obvious similar item would be Boots of Striding and Springing (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#bootsofStridingandSpri nging), which are 5.5k gp. I've...totally confused myself now. Either something like Belkar's +20 Jumping ring, or just a ring that cast Jump 1 or 3/day would be awesome to get a price estimate on. Help? ...and while you're at it, can the same formula be applied to an item of Expansion (either normal or boosted to be a 2-size expansion)? Thanks in advance, O knowledgeable rules gurus.
BruceLeeroy 10-29-07, 04:52 PM	Well, skill bonus = (bonus squared x 100)/(5/times per day). You really shouldn't try to circumvent this pricing using the spell effect pricing. So, a +20 to jump, 3 times per day would look like [(20 x 20)100]/(5/3) = 24k. Not bad, as a 5 minute use per charge. Whereas, with the spell effect pricing, you get (CL x SL x 2000)2 which, in this case would be (5 x 1 x 2000)2 = 20k. As a constant effect. If you wanted an item that you could vary, say, a +10 here, +20 there, +30 over there, etc, I would look to the items in the MIC as guidance. A pair of boots with 5 charges per day, with 1 charge being a +10, 3 charges being a +20, and 5 charges being a +30 seems consistent. I would price that item at about 5k, nearly the same as the boots of striding and springing. Versatility vs constant effect. Seems like a fair trade-off. Edit: Note that this is a competence bonus. You could, in theory, create an item with an enhancement bonus, and it would stack with any other competence bonus items, however I would recommend doubling the price. Same as the difference between resistance bonus on saves vs other types.
symphonic_tempest 10-29-07, 05:55 PM	Ah, good formula to know - thanks. I wasn't trying to circumvent any pricing rules, I just didn't know about the formula you stated. Promise. So since you're implying that trying to price by spell level, etc makes prices too low - is there a doable way to price a ring of Expansion, or would a per day item to be two size larger be too powerful?
Decinious 10-29-07, 06:49 PM	Keep in mind that skill bonuses that are (bonus x bonus x100) are for an all day item... so nerfing it to be uses only a few times per day doesn't net you much of a discount. +20 ring of jumping, 40,000 compared to one usable 3 times per day at 24,000. Now you could always use potions of jump at 50 gp for +10, 1250 gp for +20...
ScipioX 10-30-07, 01:38 AM	jump is one of those skills where its ok to ignore the skill bonus guidelines. Since jump is completely outdone by a ring of flying, an infinite bonus to jump should still be less than a ring of flying.
symphonic_tempest 10-30-07, 04:59 AM	I'm not familiar with the ring of flying (sorry). What's your recommendation on the price, then?
BruceLeeroy 10-30-07, 06:32 AM	I disagree, Scipio. For melee characters, jump is still useful. Leap attack + Battle Jump are two of my favorites, and there are a few other very nice feats that take advantage of jumping rather than flying. An item based on a spell should follow the formula presented on page 285 of the DMG, table 7-33. Note that the prices are changed based on the duration of the spell, I've seen a lot of people miss that in their item price calculations. Read the fine print under the table. Also remember: these are guidelines, not hard and fast rules. If it feels like you're exploiting the rules by creating an item using this formula, then you probably are. One way to adjust the price without changing the gold cost is (if you happen to be the DM, that is) to make it difficult for the character to acquire, as in a long-term goal or hard-won treasure. Or make them sacrifice something else they enjoy. This is often a better way to adjust the value of an item than just raising the market price (which can have other consequences).