Decanter of Endless Holy Water [Archive] - Wizards Community

Decanter of Endless Holy Water [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Deacon Liadon
04-21-05, 05:37 PM Since no DM in their right mind would ever allow an item that does 480d4 holy damage (1200 damage average) I'm posing this question merely for the sake of getting it off my mind.

How much would a decanter of endless holy water (functions as the decanter of endless water exept with holy water) cast to make?
Gloriam Etriae
04-21-05, 06:59 PM The Decanter of Endless Water requires CL 9th, Craft Wondrous Item, and control water. The Decanter of Endless Holy Water would also require bless water.

I'd rule that only one pint of the stream is made holy per instance of blessing (since the spell description says that only one pint touched is blessed each casting), meaning that there'd only be an extra 2d4 damage each round to undead and outsiders. I'd also rule that since this effect is inherent to a DEHW, the geyser command word also automatically activates the blessing, which means it would be a "use-activated" power in my book.

So, the Decanter of Endless Holy Water would be....CL 9th; Craft Wondrous Item; control water, bless water; Price 13,500gp; Weight 2 lbs.
masterofmayhem
04-21-05, 07:10 PM Heh. Yeah, they'll never allow it.

I posted a thread on this exact same topic long ago (OK, not that long . . .), but I can't seem to find the thread. It must have been deleted in the boards change.

The basic consensus was a gigantic "[b]NO[b]."

It's not even remotely feasible for epic levels. An average damage of 1200 takes out all but the toughest of demons, and pretty much any undead since they have no constitution bonus to HP.

It would be a major artifact, if I recall correctly.
Fenris Frost
04-21-05, 07:33 PM Well, look at it this way. If you were to upend a vat of holy water on a demon, shouldn't it take that damage? Why would it be different from spraying that out of a hose? You could spray the demon down in acid. Why wouldn't the extra acid to the extra damage?
Big Tom
04-21-05, 10:30 PM I think that a Decanter of Endless Water, a ring of command activated Bless water, a Portable Hole and a liot of time could concievably produce a large reserve of Holy water for what ever you need it for. (think Harvey Keitel in From Dusk Till Dawn).

It would be a pain to do, but it can be done. As a DM I'd be pretty crankey about how this would work though.
Loren Pechtel
04-21-05, 11:47 PM Immersion in acid (or other listed things) tops out at 20d6. Thus immersion in holy water should top out likewise.

As a directed weapon you're only going to hit one side of the target unless you're directly above it. Thus 10d6 in most circumstances.

For the millions it's going to cost (you need a *LOT* of bless water spells on it to deal with the volume it produces) this is a joke.
masterofmayhem
04-22-05, 06:24 PM Well, look at it this way. If you were to upend a vat of holy water on a demon, shouldn't it take that damage? Why would it be different from spraying that out of a hose? You could spray the demon down in acid. Why wouldn't the extra acid to the extra damage?
Because it would not even be remotely balanced to deal 481d4 damage to a target as a standard action with no repercussions to your person. That's enough damage to take out anything that's undead, and most outsiders, as well.

Immersion in acid (or other listed things) tops out at 20d6. Thus immersion in holy water should top out likewise.

As a directed weapon you're only going to hit one side of the target unless you're directly above it. Thus 10d6 in most circumstances.

It could be argued that a stream of acid moves old acid out of the way, thereby not dealing 20d6, but rather 480 little groups of 1d4 damage.

I'm just playing Devil's Advocate here; I don't necessarily support that argument.

For the millions it's going to cost (you need a *LOT* of bless water spells on it to deal with the volume it produces) this is a joke.
I believe that, when making items with a material component, you pay 100 times the material component's price if the item has an unlimited use. Bless water is 25 gold per casting, so you add 2,500 gold onto the end price, right? If that's correct, well, it's pretty obvious that that minor cost is a paltry sum compared to the benefit of instantly killing any evil outsiders or undead creatures.

In other words, it is horribly imbalanced. So say no to drugs, especially synthetic acid. ;)
Deacon Liadon
04-22-05, 06:37 PM I believe that, when making items with a material component, you pay 100 times the material component's price. Bless water is 25 gold per casting, so you add 2,500 gold onto the end price, right? If that's correct, well, it's pretty obvious that that minor cost is a paltry sum compared to the benefit of instantly killing any evil outsiders or undead creatures.

A material componant of 25 GP per pint. We want 30 gallons.
Dartanel
04-22-05, 10:08 PM And since you don't want to bless the water after the fact, you need to have the bless water spell quickened.
epifreak
04-22-05, 10:29 PM And since you don't want to bless the water after the fact, you need to have the bless water spell quickened.

I dunno, that could have rather amusing effects:

*player turns flask on a demon*
*demon gets soaked in ordinary water*
Demon: "insolent fool! What did you intend to do, bathe me to death?"
Player: *smiles knowingly*
*bless spell kicks in*
Demon: :weep:
TheEvilBob
04-22-05, 11:23 PM A material componant of 25 GP per pint. We want 30 gallons.

Well there is 8 pints per gallon so 2500 X 8 (pints per gallon) X 30 (number of gallons) so we just have to add in a paltry 600,000 gp's to the base cost for a continuous effect. I'd say its only effective for a few rounds out of the bottle but that should be enough.
Loren Pechtel
04-22-05, 11:39 PM I believe that, when making items with a material component, you pay 100 times the material component's price if the item has an unlimited use. Bless water is 25 gold per casting, so you add 2,500 gold onto the end price, right? If that's correct, well, it's pretty obvious that that minor cost is a paltry sum compared to the benefit of instantly killing any evil outsiders or undead creatures.

Remember the AOE of Bless Water! There is *FAR* more water coming out than that--I would require enough Bless Water spells to deal with all the water coming out. Use one spell and you get 1 pint mixed in with gallons of normal water. I doubt it would do any harm. From my experience in chemistry class, the common acids diluted that much were no big deal. So long as you didn't have a cut you wouldn't even feel it. Even at 1 pint in one gallon most of us were unaffected.
epifreak
04-23-05, 12:35 AM Remember the AOE of Bless Water! There is *FAR* more water coming out than that--I would require enough Bless Water spells to deal with all the water coming out. Use one spell and you get 1 pint mixed in with gallons of normal water. I doubt it would do any harm. From my experience in chemistry class, the common acids diluted that much were no big deal. So long as you didn't have a cut you wouldn't even feel it. Even at 1 pint in one gallon most of us were unaffected.

Okay, fine, so 240 clerics worked together to make it. That's 1 bless water each. If you're powerful enough to make an item of this magnitude, getting a bunch of clerics together shouldn't be that difficult, since you're probably a deity with at least that many worshipers.
Sakaki22
04-23-05, 03:58 AM If you're powerful enough to make an item of this magnitude, getting a bunch of clerics together shouldn't be that difficult, since you're probably a deity with at least that many worshipers.

In other words, as the second poster noted, it'd be a major artifact. Right?
Need_A_Life
04-23-05, 03:00 PM Seems like a fun idea....

*Cleric is trying to keep undead at bay*
*Joe walks over, carrying his decanter*
Joe: "Need help? Geyser!"
Cleric: How the :censored: did you kill those :censored: fiends?

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Deacon Liadon 04-21-05, 05:37 PM	Since no DM in their right mind would ever allow an item that does 480d4 holy damage (1200 damage average) I'm posing this question merely for the sake of getting it off my mind. How much would a decanter of endless holy water (functions as the decanter of endless water exept with holy water) cast to make?
Gloriam Etriae 04-21-05, 06:59 PM	The Decanter of Endless Water requires CL 9th, Craft Wondrous Item, and control water. The Decanter of Endless Holy Water would also require bless water. I'd rule that only one pint of the stream is made holy per instance of blessing (since the spell description says that only one pint touched is blessed each casting), meaning that there'd only be an extra 2d4 damage each round to undead and outsiders. I'd also rule that since this effect is inherent to a DEHW, the geyser command word also automatically activates the blessing, which means it would be a "use-activated" power in my book. So, the Decanter of Endless Holy Water would be....CL 9th; Craft Wondrous Item; control water, bless water; Price 13,500gp; Weight 2 lbs.
masterofmayhem 04-21-05, 07:10 PM	Heh. Yeah, they'll never allow it. I posted a thread on this exact same topic long ago (OK, not that long . . .), but I can't seem to find the thread. It must have been deleted in the boards change. The basic consensus was a gigantic "[b]NO[b]." It's not even remotely feasible for epic levels. An average damage of 1200 takes out all but the toughest of demons, and pretty much any undead since they have no constitution bonus to HP. It would be a major artifact, if I recall correctly.
Fenris Frost 04-21-05, 07:33 PM	Well, look at it this way. If you were to upend a vat of holy water on a demon, shouldn't it take that damage? Why would it be different from spraying that out of a hose? You could spray the demon down in acid. Why wouldn't the extra acid to the extra damage?
Big Tom 04-21-05, 10:30 PM	I think that a Decanter of Endless Water, a ring of command activated Bless water, a Portable Hole and a liot of time could concievably produce a large reserve of Holy water for what ever you need it for. (think Harvey Keitel in From Dusk Till Dawn). It would be a pain to do, but it can be done. As a DM I'd be pretty crankey about how this would work though.
Loren Pechtel 04-21-05, 11:47 PM	Immersion in acid (or other listed things) tops out at 20d6. Thus immersion in holy water should top out likewise. As a directed weapon you're only going to hit one side of the target unless you're directly above it. Thus 10d6 in most circumstances. For the millions it's going to cost (you need a LOT of bless water spells on it to deal with the volume it produces) this is a joke.
masterofmayhem 04-22-05, 06:24 PM	Well, look at it this way. If you were to upend a vat of holy water on a demon, shouldn't it take that damage? Why would it be different from spraying that out of a hose? You could spray the demon down in acid. Why wouldn't the extra acid to the extra damage? Because it would not even be remotely balanced to deal 481d4 damage to a target as a standard action with no repercussions to your person. That's enough damage to take out anything that's undead, and most outsiders, as well. Immersion in acid (or other listed things) tops out at 20d6. Thus immersion in holy water should top out likewise. As a directed weapon you're only going to hit one side of the target unless you're directly above it. Thus 10d6 in most circumstances. It could be argued that a stream of acid moves old acid out of the way, thereby not dealing 20d6, but rather 480 little groups of 1d4 damage. I'm just playing Devil's Advocate here; I don't necessarily support that argument. For the millions it's going to cost (you need a LOT of bless water spells on it to deal with the volume it produces) this is a joke. I believe that, when making items with a material component, you pay 100 times the material component's price if the item has an unlimited use. Bless water is 25 gold per casting, so you add 2,500 gold onto the end price, right? If that's correct, well, it's pretty obvious that that minor cost is a paltry sum compared to the benefit of instantly killing any evil outsiders or undead creatures. In other words, it is horribly imbalanced. So say no to drugs, especially synthetic acid. ;)
Deacon Liadon 04-22-05, 06:37 PM	I believe that, when making items with a material component, you pay 100 times the material component's price. Bless water is 25 gold per casting, so you add 2,500 gold onto the end price, right? If that's correct, well, it's pretty obvious that that minor cost is a paltry sum compared to the benefit of instantly killing any evil outsiders or undead creatures. A material componant of 25 GP per pint. We want 30 gallons.
Dartanel 04-22-05, 10:08 PM	And since you don't want to bless the water after the fact, you need to have the bless water spell quickened.
epifreak 04-22-05, 10:29 PM	And since you don't want to bless the water after the fact, you need to have the bless water spell quickened. I dunno, that could have rather amusing effects: player turns flask on a demon demon gets soaked in ordinary water Demon: "insolent fool! What did you intend to do, bathe me to death?" Player: smiles knowingly bless spell kicks in Demon: :weep:
TheEvilBob 04-22-05, 11:23 PM	A material componant of 25 GP per pint. We want 30 gallons. Well there is 8 pints per gallon so 2500 X 8 (pints per gallon) X 30 (number of gallons) so we just have to add in a paltry 600,000 gp's to the base cost for a continuous effect. I'd say its only effective for a few rounds out of the bottle but that should be enough.
Loren Pechtel 04-22-05, 11:39 PM	I believe that, when making items with a material component, you pay 100 times the material component's price if the item has an unlimited use. Bless water is 25 gold per casting, so you add 2,500 gold onto the end price, right? If that's correct, well, it's pretty obvious that that minor cost is a paltry sum compared to the benefit of instantly killing any evil outsiders or undead creatures. Remember the AOE of Bless Water! There is FAR more water coming out than that--I would require enough Bless Water spells to deal with all the water coming out. Use one spell and you get 1 pint mixed in with gallons of normal water. I doubt it would do any harm. From my experience in chemistry class, the common acids diluted that much were no big deal. So long as you didn't have a cut you wouldn't even feel it. Even at 1 pint in one gallon most of us were unaffected.
epifreak 04-23-05, 12:35 AM	Remember the AOE of Bless Water! There is FAR more water coming out than that--I would require enough Bless Water spells to deal with all the water coming out. Use one spell and you get 1 pint mixed in with gallons of normal water. I doubt it would do any harm. From my experience in chemistry class, the common acids diluted that much were no big deal. So long as you didn't have a cut you wouldn't even feel it. Even at 1 pint in one gallon most of us were unaffected. Okay, fine, so 240 clerics worked together to make it. That's 1 bless water each. If you're powerful enough to make an item of this magnitude, getting a bunch of clerics together shouldn't be that difficult, since you're probably a deity with at least that many worshipers.
Sakaki22 04-23-05, 03:58 AM	If you're powerful enough to make an item of this magnitude, getting a bunch of clerics together shouldn't be that difficult, since you're probably a deity with at least that many worshipers. In other words, as the second poster noted, it'd be a major artifact. Right?
Need_A_Life 04-23-05, 03:00 PM	Seems like a fun idea.... Cleric is trying to keep undead at bay Joe walks over, carrying his decanter Joe: "Need help? Geyser!" Cleric: How the :censored: did you kill those :censored: fiends?