Dervishes and animated bucklers [Archive] - Wizards Community

Dervishes and animated bucklers [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
LarryMac
04-09-06, 01:59 AM Here's my quandry.

A Dervish character loses their Dervish abilites if they carry a shield. Would this apply if the character had an animated buckler? The animated description says that it still confers all penalties, so by the text the only thing that an animated shield does is free up the second hand - in which case an animated buckler (such as the Spiteful Imp from Complete Arcane) serves no useful purpose. Furthermore, would a two-weapon fighter with an animated buckler need the Improved Buckler Defense feat to keep the extra attack(s)?
draconic_swine
04-09-06, 12:15 PM Animated
Upon command, an animated shield floats within 2 feet of the wielder, protecting her as if she were using it herself but freeing up both her hands. Only one shield can protect a character at a time. A character with an animated shield still takes any penalties associated with shield use, such as armor check penalty, arcane spell failure chance, and nonproficiency.

Since an animated shield works just as if a character is using it, including the associated penalties, I'd say that a dervish using an animated buckler loses his dervish abilities. Likewise for a monk.

I'm not sure what Improved Buckler Defence does, but you can make off-hand attacks with a buckler no matter what. All you do is take an additional -1 penalty to attack with your off hand.
StevenO
04-09-06, 10:32 PM Improved Buckler Defence (if IIRC) wouldn't make any difference if using an animated buckler. It would make a difference if the buckler was strapped to your arm however.

From my point of view, an Animated Shield (of whatever type) still counts as being wielded with all the associated penalties EXCEPT that you now have a free hand that can be used normally. Simply think of the Animated Shield being wielded by an extra arm that still leave your two real hands free.
Plothos
04-09-06, 11:20 PM Improved Buckler Defence (if IIRC) wouldn't make any difference if using an animated buckler. It would make a difference if the buckler was strapped to your arm however.

From my point of view, an Animated Shield (of whatever type) still counts as being wielded with all the associated penalties EXCEPT that you now have a free hand that can be used normally. Simply think of the Animated Shield being wielded by an extra arm that still leave your two real hands free.That's my reading as well.
LarryMac
04-10-06, 12:22 AM That was sort of the way I figured. So, the next question is: what purpose is served by animating a buckler (which leaves the hand free already)? Were it not for the fact that specific animated bucklers exist in the book, I'd say that there's none - but maybe I'm giving the books too much credit for not having realized that. :confused:
yuenglingdragon
04-10-06, 12:37 AM That was sort of the way I figured. So, the next question is: what purpose is served by animating a buckler (which leaves the hand free already)? Were it not for the fact that specific animated bucklers exist in the book, I'd say that there's none - but maybe I'm giving the books too much credit for not having realized that. :confused:
You can ignore the to hit penalties associated with using the hand the buckler is on.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
LarryMac 04-09-06, 01:59 AM	Here's my quandry. A Dervish character loses their Dervish abilites if they carry a shield. Would this apply if the character had an animated buckler? The animated description says that it still confers all penalties, so by the text the only thing that an animated shield does is free up the second hand - in which case an animated buckler (such as the Spiteful Imp from Complete Arcane) serves no useful purpose. Furthermore, would a two-weapon fighter with an animated buckler need the Improved Buckler Defense feat to keep the extra attack(s)?
draconic_swine 04-09-06, 12:15 PM	Animated Upon command, an animated shield floats within 2 feet of the wielder, protecting her as if she were using it herself but freeing up both her hands. Only one shield can protect a character at a time. A character with an animated shield still takes any penalties associated with shield use, such as armor check penalty, arcane spell failure chance, and nonproficiency. Since an animated shield works just as if a character is using it, including the associated penalties, I'd say that a dervish using an animated buckler loses his dervish abilities. Likewise for a monk. I'm not sure what Improved Buckler Defence does, but you can make off-hand attacks with a buckler no matter what. All you do is take an additional -1 penalty to attack with your off hand.
StevenO 04-09-06, 10:32 PM	Improved Buckler Defence (if IIRC) wouldn't make any difference if using an animated buckler. It would make a difference if the buckler was strapped to your arm however. From my point of view, an Animated Shield (of whatever type) still counts as being wielded with all the associated penalties EXCEPT that you now have a free hand that can be used normally. Simply think of the Animated Shield being wielded by an extra arm that still leave your two real hands free.
Plothos 04-09-06, 11:20 PM	Improved Buckler Defence (if IIRC) wouldn't make any difference if using an animated buckler. It would make a difference if the buckler was strapped to your arm however. From my point of view, an Animated Shield (of whatever type) still counts as being wielded with all the associated penalties EXCEPT that you now have a free hand that can be used normally. Simply think of the Animated Shield being wielded by an extra arm that still leave your two real hands free.That's my reading as well.
LarryMac 04-10-06, 12:22 AM	That was sort of the way I figured. So, the next question is: what purpose is served by animating a buckler (which leaves the hand free already)? Were it not for the fact that specific animated bucklers exist in the book, I'd say that there's none - but maybe I'm giving the books too much credit for not having realized that. :confused:
yuenglingdragon 04-10-06, 12:37 AM	That was sort of the way I figured. So, the next question is: what purpose is served by animating a buckler (which leaves the hand free already)? Were it not for the fact that specific animated bucklers exist in the book, I'd say that there's none - but maybe I'm giving the books too much credit for not having realized that. :confused: You can ignore the to hit penalties associated with using the hand the buckler is on.