Post/Author/DateTime	Post
DM-Scott 03-27-08, 04:28 AM	Ok, this one sorta miffed on of my players in an online game I run now and then. Essentially the party of 5th level characters goes up against a bandit leader and her army of mooks (1st level warriors, adepts, experts, and the odd 1st level fighter). Well most of the flunkies have certain things they do during the fight, such as aid-anothers, flankers, wall of spears (multiple flunkies standing with spears to make movement tricky) and so forth. Most of the NPC warriors are geared up with Ransuers (which are 2handed reach weapons that give +2 to disarm attempts), so their favorite thing is to disarm people. Well one of the players had his first weapon disarmed, and later they attempted to disarm his shield which he was using to make shield bash attacks with (he uses a heavy shield). Well they succeeded (he had the advantage, but many of them were trying) and tossed his shield. Well, there was some hub-ub made about them being to disarm his shield at all. I read the entry for shields, and the individual shield's description, and the rules for disarming. As best as I can tell, unless you have a shield actually LOCKED in place (via a locked gauntlet), a shield is no harder to disarm than a weapon you're holding onto. A shield has 2 straps, 1 on your forearm and 1 you hold onto to keep the shield from flying around. You can drop a shield as a free action, just like any other weapon. So I ruled that the shield could be disarmed, despite how unlikely it seemed "in real life" for someone to force the shield off his arm. I also gave him a +4 modifier, but apparently that still didn't really make him happy. :( Anyone feel this was a fair ruling? If so, why? If not, why? I'd like to know. Thank you, Peace out, Game on.
EvilCouch 03-27-08, 04:51 AM	I think you ruled correctly. I'd probably give the player a circumstance bonus on his opposed disarm rule, because a shield is more sturdily affixed to him, but I'd certainly let someone try to do it. After all, if they hook and pull the shield in the right direction, all they have to do is beat one hand's grip strength, which is easily done when you're pulling a polearm; two arms, two shoulders and a lever will beat someone's ability to clench their fist every time. Add in another bonus if the only thing he has in his hands is the shield, though. I'd say a total +4 bonus is fair, under the circumstances. +2 for it having a stabilizing strap. +2 for opposing with both hands.
RavenDrake 03-27-08, 06:29 AM	Given that a shield is not merely held in in the hands, but rather strapped to the arm, I would rule that attempting to disarm is is the same as disarming any other Well Secured item. IE: It can only be done when the defender is pinned and the defender gets a +4 bonus to avoid being disarmed. That's why readying and loosing a shield are both move actions, they shield is physically attached to your arm, rather firmly, which I would say would make it more difficult to disarm.
Metafictional 03-27-08, 08:42 AM	Wow, a situation where Sunder would be better than Disarm. You don't see that every day.
Slimgauge 03-27-08, 10:31 AM	You can drop a shield as a free action, just like any other weapon. Not always. From the Online SRD section on Move Actions (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsInCombat.htm#readyorLooseaShield) (emphasis mine) Ready or Loose a Shield Strapping a shield to your arm to gain its shield bonus to your AC, or unstrapping and dropping a shield so you can use your shield hand for another purpose, requires a move action. If you have a base attack bonus of +1 or higher, you can ready or loose a shield as a free action combined with a regular move. Dropping a carried (but not worn) shield is a free action. So it takes a move action, but not a dedicated move action, that is you can do a move action AND drop the shield as a (free) part of it (unless your BAB is < +1).
Nezkrul 03-27-08, 07:28 PM	You can "disarm" someone's armor, but you have to pin them in a grapple :P (you can also "loot the living", if you have them pinned, by making disarm checks to get well-secured stuff off them)
DM-Scott 03-28-08, 12:54 AM	I'm glad everyone has been so helpful. After reading a the posts that were made, I will say that I think I made the correct choice in allowing him to be disarmed (not that it mattered, he just grabbed his sword and went to town on them again :P), but it's good to know. Most of the mooks in my games generally have things they do to hinder characters (for example, disarming, tossing nets, healing the tougher bad-guys, and so forth), and disarming is likely to come up again, so it'd be good figure this out, y'know? :)
Nezkrul 03-28-08, 09:30 AM	tossing nets Oh god, they have nets.! WHY DO THEY HAVE TO HAVE NETS?!? ARRRGGH! played a 2nd edition game based on Middle Earth, the goblins liked to use nets on us