Bearded Drow? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Bearded Drow? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Dxzauvrinn
05-22-07, 02:03 PM Not sure if anyone else caught this, but on page 36 under appearance in the new DotU book, it says that 1 in 10 drow can grow beards, mustaches or both.

I guess that explains why we occassionally see the odd picture of drow with a mustache, but I find it kind of odd that any elf, other than half-elves, could grow facial hair.

I mean, if elves are supposed to be completely hairless (except for head hair and eyebrows) why would drow all-of-a-sudden be able to do this? Is it the underdark radiation? Did some duergar get slipped in their gene pool or something?

What do you guys think?
bondious
05-22-07, 02:52 PM What do you guys think?

I think it's dumb. As far as I'm concerned, "Elves/Drow" and "beards/facial hair" just don't go together. I mean, unless they have like a Hat of Disguise or are using magic to grow a beard (possibly a quirk of a cursed item), then maybe I can see it. But if not, then I'd say "no".

I wonder if this stems from the cover of 'Sea of Swords' where Drizzt looks like he has a 5 o'clock shaddow.
Lord_Steve
05-22-07, 03:24 PM From what I remember, all elves grow facial hair via magic if they ever want any.....it's not genetics, just determination. I remember this one wizard in war of the spider queen whom used magick to grow a beard, though his name escapes me.
Faraer
05-22-07, 05:02 PM Yes, some Realms elves have facial hair, including Merith Strongbow.
The Ubbergeek
05-22-07, 05:43 PM My take allow some beards and mustaches.... It was said that Dragonlance elves dont have facial hairs, but I think it was not said of FR ones. Plus, outside of D&D, it happens..

*shrugs* I allow it, just nothing on the range of dwarves or even humans. Never too long, more subtile, like Cardinal de Richelieu cuts.

And on a related note, dwarf girls DON'T have hairs. Yuck.
GothicDan
05-22-07, 05:59 PM And remember, in the Realms canon, at least, Dwarven women also have hair. What's attractive to us doesn't matter to other races, per se.
The Ubbergeek
05-22-07, 06:20 PM Just say no to body hairs on women of any race, just... Ugh.

Now, you may not mind (not offence to any homosexuals around), but no. No.
GothicDan
05-22-07, 06:25 PM I don't think it's appropriate to change canon of a world based on one's sexual preferences for a fantasy race...
Another Gnome
05-22-07, 06:44 PM Eh. I think I finally understand why so many oldtimers had issues with 3E...

DotU is starting to sound more and more like a compilation of obscure details turned into the whole truth and nothing but the truth, nevermind it not being even a setting-specific book. :noway:

(Yes, I am aware of what Ed has to say about elven facial hair, but that's not the point, it's the attitude I'm reading into the book. The same problem I have with Planescape. :weep:)

Well, I should probably address the actual topic too... so I'll just say that I see nothing actually suggesting that drow are any hairier than other elves.
MarkusTay63
05-22-07, 06:47 PM I don't change canon, I just don't let the bearded ones out in public. ;)

And besides, Dwarven women have their beards somewhere else...

In their armpits! :P

I hear they even braid it. :dancin:

As far as Elves go, I thought I remember reading somewhere that they can grow facial hair as a matter of choice, but it doesn't happen automatically. In the case of Drow, it might occur without the owner wanting it, but I would expect something got into the gene pool at some point.
The Ubbergeek
05-22-07, 08:06 PM Eh. I think I finally understand why so many oldtimers had issues with 3E...

DotU is starting to sound more and more like a compilation of obscure details turned into the whole truth and nothing but the truth, nevermind it not being even a setting-specific book. :noway:

(Yes, I am aware of what Ed has to say about elven facial hair, but that's not the point, it's the attitude I'm reading into the book. The same problem I have with Planescape. :weep:)

Well, I should probably address the actual topic too... so I'll just say that I see nothing actually suggesting that drow are any hairier than other elves.

The problem that FR oldtimers may not know...

DOTU is a book about the GREYHAWK/CORE Drow, not the FR Drow. We all know that the FR Elves =/= Greyhawk ones =/= Dragonlance ones, etc... And so, the same is expected from Drow and other races, no? So, peoples shouldn't get too worked about lores differences - it's not the same world. Not the same rules, not the same lore.

And it had been my imagination, but I have seen drow with facial hairs on some artworks, including videogames (not necessarly always canon, yadda yadda).

And even elves with facial hairs appears in fictions... so... *shrugs* I allow facial hairs on both things, at least when canon dont say a word or allow it.

(And GothicDan, I was semi-serious, kidding around ya know. But on the dwarf debate, I am always on the no facial hairs for women side - it's too vile for me.)
Faraer
05-22-07, 08:35 PM If the new Drow of the Underdark is like the other core-D&D books, the Greyhawk references are just familiar examples, and don't mean it's describing the World of Greyhawk (which has no current 'canon'), or even Greyhawk Light. (It directly contradicts what we know about the drow of Oerth.)

Also, I say boo to the xenogynotrichophobes.
BrennonGoldeye
05-22-07, 09:00 PM Um, some people are fuzzier than others, no matter the race. Hows that?
The Ubbergeek
05-22-07, 09:07 PM If the new Drow of the Underdark is like the other core-D&D books, the Greyhawk references are just familiar examples, and don't mean it's describing the World of Greyhawk (which has no current 'canon'), or even Greyhawk Light. (It directly contradicts what we know about the drow of Oerth.)

Also, I say boo to the xenogynotrichophobes.

Well, it sures lean more toward Greyhawk than Forgotten Realms - the only two settings who have those classic drow, if I judge by the reviews and all.

And I say bah to bearded women, ughs.
theartistformerlyknownas
05-22-07, 09:11 PM You must be an elf, Ubbergeek (see below). Dwarf women can grow beards. Get over it... ;)

As for drow (or any FR elf for that matter) I believe that it's a sign of human blood (although this would be scandalous among drow, of course) as it has been said in a number of novels that a few elves are capable of growing beards, giving them a "wild, almost feral appearance, which many elves find exotic, and others find distasteful."

I play such an elf, a Sy'Tel'Quess with a cursed belt of dwarvenkind. It has all the normal abilities, but makes the wearer grow a beard a dwarvish rate. It can only be removed by the priest of a dwarvish deity, and they have all thought it far too ironic to indulge the unfortunate elf.
Old Sage
05-22-07, 09:27 PM Yes, some Realms elves have facial hair, including Merith Strongbow.And Ed had something more to add back in Dec. '04 -

"Now, as for the rather delicate matter of elven body hair, you KNOW Ed isn’t the guy to go to for WotC rules battles. The PHBs rule, of course, with one note Ed added (as we laughed together on the phone, remembering the “Do dwarven females have beards?” furor that arose at least thrice, down the years), to whit:

If you always treat the comments in rulebooks as “racial norms” rather than absolutes, and as DM encourage your campaign to be roleplaying-heavy and rules-light (so that book-quoting rules-lawyers can be calmly replied with, “Oh? Really? That’s odd, because standing right in front of you is an individual you can clearly see to be the elf lord you were just introduced to, and yes, he has a pencil-thin moustache and razor-edged, line-of-chin beard. Are you going to tell him to drop the silly magical disguise, or ask him why he’s a freak, or just trust your eyes and accept that he has the hair and go on with life?”), you can ‘explain away’ variants from the ever-changing game rules as “individuals who are different, that’s all.”

As it happens, all of the Knights can attest that Merith Strongbow has both (scant, but dark in hue and definitely present) facial and body hair (though unlike human males, he doesn’t get facial stubble if he doesn’t shave every morning, and in fact never needs to shave) and Torm of the Knights can tell you that certain elf ladies of his acquaintance definitely have genital hair abundant enough to be trimmed into shapes. A subject I’d probably better say nothing more about. :}"
BrennonGoldeye
05-22-07, 09:33 PM Just like a suped-up ape to think they have the monopoly on treasure trails......:P
Philalexandros
05-22-07, 09:53 PM Wait, how does one have "definitely present" facial hair... yet never needs to shave?
GothicDan
05-22-07, 09:58 PM Magic!

<3 Ed.

And people wonder why some of us like him so much. No one ever stops to think it could because we ACTUALLY LIKE what he says, rather than just following him slavishly.

I'm an atheist. I don't follow nothin' slavishly.
BrennonGoldeye
05-22-07, 10:03 PM I'm an atheist. I don't follow nothin' slavishly.

Everybody think about that for a bit........I tried....It hurt my noggin.....argh...
GothicDan
05-22-07, 10:54 PM *Gives Brennon some wine!*
Faraer
05-22-07, 11:02 PM Wait, how does one have "definitely present" facial hair... yet never needs to shave?It grows to a certain length, then, if you want to keep it, you don't have to shave or trim it.
Zandilar
05-22-07, 11:15 PM Heya,

Wait, how does one have "definitely present" facial hair... yet never needs to shave?

It grows only in certian places (like along the jaw, or only in a thin line on the upper lip), and slowly enough that normal wear and tear prevents it from getting overly long?
theartistformerlyknownas
05-23-07, 12:23 AM I'm an atheist. I don't follow nothin' slavishly.

Mayhaps that explains why you never know where you're going? ;)
GothicDan
05-23-07, 12:36 AM No. I know exactly where I'm going.

Other people are just going places in HOPES the tenants they're following are true. ;)
Zanan
05-23-07, 08:54 AM Unless I am mistaken, the AD&D as well as 3E PHB stated that elves (i.e. drow) grow no facial or body hair. (What was before that in D&D, I do not know.) That is Core stuff, of course. Now, unless I am mistaken again, neither the old nor the new DotUD said anything to the contrary, even Plot & Poison kept the notion.

So be default, I would say no body hair bar the head.

In my campaigns, I'd have nothing against a decently bearded drow male ... you see, it is close enough to the main part of the body with hair and I know quite a number of drow females who'd give a sarcastic remark about no better use of a drow male's brain than to concentrate on growing and grooming facial hair :D .
Lord Karsus
05-23-07, 05:53 PM -I can't help but read the title of the thread, and think to myself, "Yar, ye' son o' a Bearded Drow!"

So be default, I would say no body hair bar the head.

-Ed's quote up there nullifies that, concerning Elven women, anyway.
Khaelieth
05-23-07, 07:28 PM Unless I am mistaken, the AD&D as well as 3E PHB stated that elves (i.e. drow) grow no facial or body hair.

Which is how I like it. I always play that dwarf females need to shave and elves never need to shave.
godbeepit
05-23-07, 08:28 PM I could've sworn the FRCS said something about elves being able to have beards if they wanted to but I might just be imagining things. If so, however, it would be logical drow would also be able to have beards. But, all in all Old Sage definitely has it right.

One thing I would like to point out for all those people who were disgusted at body hair you could just assume this: Lolth hates men. Of course I think that's just funny.
Old Sage
05-23-07, 08:38 PM Unless I am mistaken, the AD&D as well as 3E PHB stated that elves (i.e. drow) grow no facial or body hair. (What was before that in D&D, I do not know.) That is Core stuff, of course. Now, unless I am mistaken again, neither the old nor the new DotUD said anything to the contrary, even Plot & Poison kept the notion.

So be default, I would say no body hair bar the head.However, as I, Faraer, and Ed noted above... elves with facial and body hair are possible in the Realms.
Shiftkitty
05-23-07, 10:14 PM I always figured one of two schools regarding elves and body hair. First is that they grow it if they want it (or else just manifest it) and to the length/style they want. One of the benefits of being a magical race. The other leans more toward an explanation of wild elves in various climates. If it's beneficial, like in a very cold climate, facial hair is the default for male elves (female mammal and mammal-type creatures generate natural body heat that doesn't require the excess hair, if I remember my biology class right). A wild elf from these climates who doesn't want facial hair has to use magic (or a razor) to get rid of it.

The Drow on my campaign don't grow facial hair but will manifest it to enhance a ferocious appearance if they want to frighten an enemy. The Drow pictured in the 1e Fiend Folio has a moustache (I thought he had a Castro Street Bull's Eye, but nope, just a 'stache), but I can't think of any other illustrations that depict facial hair. As a "confrontational" culture, I see facial hair as a detriment if someone wants to get you at a fast disadvantage. Even a short, trimmed beard can become a great way to yank someone around, like to bring their throat into deep contact with your blade. Of course, any hair can be used that way, but you have to draw the line somewhere.
Zanan
05-24-07, 03:55 AM -Ed's quote up there nullifies that, concerning Elven women, anyway.

Unless I missed something, he only speaks of male elven facial hair ... edit ... oh, that Merris novel guy? Dear me, we have to set tons of lorebooks vs. THO's words and a novel character. Ach well, it is a surface elf and Lolth knows what they do to look like humans :evillaugh
JaiaDrottsingr
05-24-07, 08:40 AM http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j215/blabla-bluh-blah/fr27.jpg

Nuff said.

EDIT:
Image tags seem not to be working right now.
Lord Karsus
05-24-07, 11:12 PM EDIT:
Image tags seem not to be working right now.

-Something is telling me that is for the better.
Straploknight
05-25-07, 01:38 AM I always thought the facial hair thing for drow was kinda neat, I like the whole cast out of heaven idea for the drow and as a result, they have become a more feral, shorter lived elf(with incisors mind you) compared to thier brethern who still bask in the light of the selderaine.
Manshoon
05-25-07, 06:26 PM Maybe bearded elves are afflicted with lycanthropy?
I'd be more careful when meeting one.
JaiaDrottsingr
05-25-07, 06:29 PM Hey, Manshoon, interesting CT tag there.

*Pokes unoriginal badge.*
Manshoon
05-25-07, 07:28 PM Hey, Manshoon, interesting CT tag there.

*Pokes unoriginal badge.*

Better?
JaiaDrottsingr
05-25-07, 09:55 PM How'd you get it?

Did you spend an entire year unregistered?

EDIT:
Oh, I wasn't talking about your avy. I was commenting on the fact that your CT says "Registered."
BrennonGoldeye
05-26-07, 10:22 PM Wait, how does one have "definitely present" facial hair... yet never needs to shave?

I would like to introduce you to a few japanese friends of mine. All facial hair doesn't grow at the same rate it does amongst the Indo-Europeans. My bud "Toshi" hasn't had to use more than clippers in the past 8 years, and he happens to be human.

No. I know exactly where I'm going.

Other people are just going places in HOPES the tenants they're following are true. ;)

Wow Dan, you keep making this easier and easier. Tell me this was meant as sarcasm..;)
GothicDan
05-26-07, 10:32 PM Maybe it was sarcastic.... Maybe it wasn't....
BrennonGoldeye
05-26-07, 10:35 PM Maybe it was sarcastic.... Maybe it wasn't....

Just the answer I was expecting.:P
GothicDan
05-26-07, 10:37 PM I'm a mystery wrapped in an enigma wrapped in blond.
Lord Karsus
05-26-07, 11:37 PM :: Says something about bottle blondes ::
GothicDan
05-26-07, 11:40 PM Those who try to push past their inborn limitations, and not resulting on natural 'talent' or randomness, are the only people I can truly respect.
Zanan
05-27-07, 04:59 AM Obviously, all those drow depicted with beards were simply using magic ... just to look more attractive (to whomever finds drow males attractive). :P
JaiaDrottsingr
05-27-07, 07:50 AM Obviously, all those drow depicted with beards were simply using magic ... just to look more attractive (to whomever finds drow males attractive). :P

Hey!

at least Jaia doesn't have a goatee...
ChuutRiit
06-01-07, 01:59 PM Hmm. Interesting subject, since beards work as awesome-multipliers. :D

I guess I'll use "Elven males can grow beards through magic/force of will if wanted" as some sort of house rule. :)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Dxzauvrinn 05-22-07, 02:03 PM	Not sure if anyone else caught this, but on page 36 under appearance in the new DotU book, it says that 1 in 10 drow can grow beards, mustaches or both. I guess that explains why we occassionally see the odd picture of drow with a mustache, but I find it kind of odd that any elf, other than half-elves, could grow facial hair. I mean, if elves are supposed to be completely hairless (except for head hair and eyebrows) why would drow all-of-a-sudden be able to do this? Is it the underdark radiation? Did some duergar get slipped in their gene pool or something? What do you guys think?
bondious 05-22-07, 02:52 PM	What do you guys think? I think it's dumb. As far as I'm concerned, "Elves/Drow" and "beards/facial hair" just don't go together. I mean, unless they have like a Hat of Disguise or are using magic to grow a beard (possibly a quirk of a cursed item), then maybe I can see it. But if not, then I'd say "no". I wonder if this stems from the cover of 'Sea of Swords' where Drizzt looks like he has a 5 o'clock shaddow.
Lord_Steve 05-22-07, 03:24 PM	From what I remember, all elves grow facial hair via magic if they ever want any.....it's not genetics, just determination. I remember this one wizard in war of the spider queen whom used magick to grow a beard, though his name escapes me.
Faraer 05-22-07, 05:02 PM	Yes, some Realms elves have facial hair, including Merith Strongbow.
The Ubbergeek 05-22-07, 05:43 PM	My take allow some beards and mustaches.... It was said that Dragonlance elves dont have facial hairs, but I think it was not said of FR ones. Plus, outside of D&D, it happens.. shrugs I allow it, just nothing on the range of dwarves or even humans. Never too long, more subtile, like Cardinal de Richelieu cuts. And on a related note, dwarf girls DON'T have hairs. Yuck.
GothicDan 05-22-07, 05:59 PM	And remember, in the Realms canon, at least, Dwarven women also have hair. What's attractive to us doesn't matter to other races, per se.
The Ubbergeek 05-22-07, 06:20 PM	Just say no to body hairs on women of any race, just... Ugh. Now, you may not mind (not offence to any homosexuals around), but no. No.
GothicDan 05-22-07, 06:25 PM	I don't think it's appropriate to change canon of a world based on one's sexual preferences for a fantasy race...
Another Gnome 05-22-07, 06:44 PM	Eh. I think I finally understand why so many oldtimers had issues with 3E... DotU is starting to sound more and more like a compilation of obscure details turned into the whole truth and nothing but the truth, nevermind it not being even a setting-specific book. :noway: (Yes, I am aware of what Ed has to say about elven facial hair, but that's not the point, it's the attitude I'm reading into the book. The same problem I have with Planescape. :weep:) Well, I should probably address the actual topic too... so I'll just say that I see nothing actually suggesting that drow are any hairier than other elves.
MarkusTay63 05-22-07, 06:47 PM	I don't change canon, I just don't let the bearded ones out in public. ;) And besides, Dwarven women have their beards somewhere else... In their armpits! :P I hear they even braid it. :dancin: As far as Elves go, I thought I remember reading somewhere that they can grow facial hair as a matter of choice, but it doesn't happen automatically. In the case of Drow, it might occur without the owner wanting it, but I would expect something got into the gene pool at some point.
The Ubbergeek 05-22-07, 08:06 PM	Eh. I think I finally understand why so many oldtimers had issues with 3E... DotU is starting to sound more and more like a compilation of obscure details turned into the whole truth and nothing but the truth, nevermind it not being even a setting-specific book. :noway: (Yes, I am aware of what Ed has to say about elven facial hair, but that's not the point, it's the attitude I'm reading into the book. The same problem I have with Planescape. :weep:) Well, I should probably address the actual topic too... so I'll just say that I see nothing actually suggesting that drow are any hairier than other elves. The problem that FR oldtimers may not know... DOTU is a book about the GREYHAWK/CORE Drow, not the FR Drow. We all know that the FR Elves =/= Greyhawk ones =/= Dragonlance ones, etc... And so, the same is expected from Drow and other races, no? So, peoples shouldn't get too worked about lores differences - it's not the same world. Not the same rules, not the same lore. And it had been my imagination, but I have seen drow with facial hairs on some artworks, including videogames (not necessarly always canon, yadda yadda). And even elves with facial hairs appears in fictions... so... shrugs I allow facial hairs on both things, at least when canon dont say a word or allow it. (And GothicDan, I was semi-serious, kidding around ya know. But on the dwarf debate, I am always on the no facial hairs for women side - it's too vile for me.)
Faraer 05-22-07, 08:35 PM	If the new Drow of the Underdark is like the other core-D&D books, the Greyhawk references are just familiar examples, and don't mean it's describing the World of Greyhawk (which has no current 'canon'), or even Greyhawk Light. (It directly contradicts what we know about the drow of Oerth.) Also, I say boo to the xenogynotrichophobes.
BrennonGoldeye 05-22-07, 09:00 PM	Um, some people are fuzzier than others, no matter the race. Hows that?
The Ubbergeek 05-22-07, 09:07 PM	If the new Drow of the Underdark is like the other core-D&D books, the Greyhawk references are just familiar examples, and don't mean it's describing the World of Greyhawk (which has no current 'canon'), or even Greyhawk Light. (It directly contradicts what we know about the drow of Oerth.) Also, I say boo to the xenogynotrichophobes. Well, it sures lean more toward Greyhawk than Forgotten Realms - the only two settings who have those classic drow, if I judge by the reviews and all. And I say bah to bearded women, ughs.
theartistformerlyknownas 05-22-07, 09:11 PM	You must be an elf, Ubbergeek (see below). Dwarf women can grow beards. Get over it... ;) As for drow (or any FR elf for that matter) I believe that it's a sign of human blood (although this would be scandalous among drow, of course) as it has been said in a number of novels that a few elves are capable of growing beards, giving them a "wild, almost feral appearance, which many elves find exotic, and others find distasteful." I play such an elf, a Sy'Tel'Quess with a cursed belt of dwarvenkind. It has all the normal abilities, but makes the wearer grow a beard a dwarvish rate. It can only be removed by the priest of a dwarvish deity, and they have all thought it far too ironic to indulge the unfortunate elf.
Old Sage 05-22-07, 09:27 PM	Yes, some Realms elves have facial hair, including Merith Strongbow.And Ed had something more to add back in Dec. '04 - "Now, as for the rather delicate matter of elven body hair, you KNOW Ed isn’t the guy to go to for WotC rules battles. The PHBs rule, of course, with one note Ed added (as we laughed together on the phone, remembering the “Do dwarven females have beards?” furor that arose at least thrice, down the years), to whit: If you always treat the comments in rulebooks as “racial norms” rather than absolutes, and as DM encourage your campaign to be roleplaying-heavy and rules-light (so that book-quoting rules-lawyers can be calmly replied with, “Oh? Really? That’s odd, because standing right in front of you is an individual you can clearly see to be the elf lord you were just introduced to, and yes, he has a pencil-thin moustache and razor-edged, line-of-chin beard. Are you going to tell him to drop the silly magical disguise, or ask him why he’s a freak, or just trust your eyes and accept that he has the hair and go on with life?”), you can ‘explain away’ variants from the ever-changing game rules as “individuals who are different, that’s all.” As it happens, all of the Knights can attest that Merith Strongbow has both (scant, but dark in hue and definitely present) facial and body hair (though unlike human males, he doesn’t get facial stubble if he doesn’t shave every morning, and in fact never needs to shave) and Torm of the Knights can tell you that certain elf ladies of his acquaintance definitely have genital hair abundant enough to be trimmed into shapes. A subject I’d probably better say nothing more about. :}"
BrennonGoldeye 05-22-07, 09:33 PM	Just like a suped-up ape to think they have the monopoly on treasure trails......:P
Philalexandros 05-22-07, 09:53 PM	Wait, how does one have "definitely present" facial hair... yet never needs to shave?
GothicDan 05-22-07, 09:58 PM	Magic! <3 Ed. And people wonder why some of us like him so much. No one ever stops to think it could because we ACTUALLY LIKE what he says, rather than just following him slavishly. I'm an atheist. I don't follow nothin' slavishly.
BrennonGoldeye 05-22-07, 10:03 PM	I'm an atheist. I don't follow nothin' slavishly. Everybody think about that for a bit........I tried....It hurt my noggin.....argh...
GothicDan 05-22-07, 10:54 PM	Gives Brennon some wine!
Faraer 05-22-07, 11:02 PM	Wait, how does one have "definitely present" facial hair... yet never needs to shave?It grows to a certain length, then, if you want to keep it, you don't have to shave or trim it.
Zandilar 05-22-07, 11:15 PM	Heya, Wait, how does one have "definitely present" facial hair... yet never needs to shave? It grows only in certian places (like along the jaw, or only in a thin line on the upper lip), and slowly enough that normal wear and tear prevents it from getting overly long?
theartistformerlyknownas 05-23-07, 12:23 AM	I'm an atheist. I don't follow nothin' slavishly. Mayhaps that explains why you never know where you're going? ;)
GothicDan 05-23-07, 12:36 AM	No. I know exactly where I'm going. Other people are just going places in HOPES the tenants they're following are true. ;)
Zanan 05-23-07, 08:54 AM	Unless I am mistaken, the AD&D as well as 3E PHB stated that elves (i.e. drow) grow no facial or body hair. (What was before that in D&D, I do not know.) That is Core stuff, of course. Now, unless I am mistaken again, neither the old nor the new DotUD said anything to the contrary, even Plot & Poison kept the notion. So be default, I would say no body hair bar the head. In my campaigns, I'd have nothing against a decently bearded drow male ... you see, it is close enough to the main part of the body with hair and I know quite a number of drow females who'd give a sarcastic remark about no better use of a drow male's brain than to concentrate on growing and grooming facial hair :D .
Lord Karsus 05-23-07, 05:53 PM	-I can't help but read the title of the thread, and think to myself, "Yar, ye' son o' a Bearded Drow!" So be default, I would say no body hair bar the head. -Ed's quote up there nullifies that, concerning Elven women, anyway.
Khaelieth 05-23-07, 07:28 PM	Unless I am mistaken, the AD&D as well as 3E PHB stated that elves (i.e. drow) grow no facial or body hair. Which is how I like it. I always play that dwarf females need to shave and elves never need to shave.
godbeepit 05-23-07, 08:28 PM	I could've sworn the FRCS said something about elves being able to have beards if they wanted to but I might just be imagining things. If so, however, it would be logical drow would also be able to have beards. But, all in all Old Sage definitely has it right. One thing I would like to point out for all those people who were disgusted at body hair you could just assume this: Lolth hates men. Of course I think that's just funny.
Old Sage 05-23-07, 08:38 PM	Unless I am mistaken, the AD&D as well as 3E PHB stated that elves (i.e. drow) grow no facial or body hair. (What was before that in D&D, I do not know.) That is Core stuff, of course. Now, unless I am mistaken again, neither the old nor the new DotUD said anything to the contrary, even Plot & Poison kept the notion. So be default, I would say no body hair bar the head.However, as I, Faraer, and Ed noted above... elves with facial and body hair are possible in the Realms.
Shiftkitty 05-23-07, 10:14 PM	I always figured one of two schools regarding elves and body hair. First is that they grow it if they want it (or else just manifest it) and to the length/style they want. One of the benefits of being a magical race. The other leans more toward an explanation of wild elves in various climates. If it's beneficial, like in a very cold climate, facial hair is the default for male elves (female mammal and mammal-type creatures generate natural body heat that doesn't require the excess hair, if I remember my biology class right). A wild elf from these climates who doesn't want facial hair has to use magic (or a razor) to get rid of it. The Drow on my campaign don't grow facial hair but will manifest it to enhance a ferocious appearance if they want to frighten an enemy. The Drow pictured in the 1e Fiend Folio has a moustache (I thought he had a Castro Street Bull's Eye, but nope, just a 'stache), but I can't think of any other illustrations that depict facial hair. As a "confrontational" culture, I see facial hair as a detriment if someone wants to get you at a fast disadvantage. Even a short, trimmed beard can become a great way to yank someone around, like to bring their throat into deep contact with your blade. Of course, any hair can be used that way, but you have to draw the line somewhere.
Zanan 05-24-07, 03:55 AM	-Ed's quote up there nullifies that, concerning Elven women, anyway. Unless I missed something, he only speaks of male elven facial hair ... edit ... oh, that Merris novel guy? Dear me, we have to set tons of lorebooks vs. THO's words and a novel character. Ach well, it is a surface elf and Lolth knows what they do to look like humans :evillaugh
JaiaDrottsingr 05-24-07, 08:40 AM	http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j215/blabla-bluh-blah/fr27.jpg Nuff said. EDIT: Image tags seem not to be working right now.
Lord Karsus 05-24-07, 11:12 PM	EDIT: Image tags seem not to be working right now. -Something is telling me that is for the better.
Straploknight 05-25-07, 01:38 AM	I always thought the facial hair thing for drow was kinda neat, I like the whole cast out of heaven idea for the drow and as a result, they have become a more feral, shorter lived elf(with incisors mind you) compared to thier brethern who still bask in the light of the selderaine.
Manshoon 05-25-07, 06:26 PM	Maybe bearded elves are afflicted with lycanthropy? I'd be more careful when meeting one.
JaiaDrottsingr 05-25-07, 06:29 PM	Hey, Manshoon, interesting CT tag there. Pokes unoriginal badge.
Manshoon 05-25-07, 07:28 PM	Hey, Manshoon, interesting CT tag there. Pokes unoriginal badge. Better?
JaiaDrottsingr 05-25-07, 09:55 PM	How'd you get it? Did you spend an entire year unregistered? EDIT: Oh, I wasn't talking about your avy. I was commenting on the fact that your CT says "Registered."
BrennonGoldeye 05-26-07, 10:22 PM	Wait, how does one have "definitely present" facial hair... yet never needs to shave? I would like to introduce you to a few japanese friends of mine. All facial hair doesn't grow at the same rate it does amongst the Indo-Europeans. My bud "Toshi" hasn't had to use more than clippers in the past 8 years, and he happens to be human. No. I know exactly where I'm going. Other people are just going places in HOPES the tenants they're following are true. ;) Wow Dan, you keep making this easier and easier. Tell me this was meant as sarcasm..;)
GothicDan 05-26-07, 10:32 PM	Maybe it was sarcastic.... Maybe it wasn't....
BrennonGoldeye 05-26-07, 10:35 PM	Maybe it was sarcastic.... Maybe it wasn't.... Just the answer I was expecting.:P
GothicDan 05-26-07, 10:37 PM	I'm a mystery wrapped in an enigma wrapped in blond.
Lord Karsus 05-26-07, 11:37 PM	:: Says something about bottle blondes ::
GothicDan 05-26-07, 11:40 PM	Those who try to push past their inborn limitations, and not resulting on natural 'talent' or randomness, are the only people I can truly respect.
Zanan 05-27-07, 04:59 AM	Obviously, all those drow depicted with beards were simply using magic ... just to look more attractive (to whomever finds drow males attractive). :P
JaiaDrottsingr 05-27-07, 07:50 AM	Obviously, all those drow depicted with beards were simply using magic ... just to look more attractive (to whomever finds drow males attractive). :P Hey! at least Jaia doesn't have a goatee...
ChuutRiit 06-01-07, 01:59 PM	Hmm. Interesting subject, since beards work as awesome-multipliers. :D I guess I'll use "Elven males can grow beards through magic/force of will if wanted" as some sort of house rule. :)