Post/Author/DateTime	Post
laxrulz7 09-23-07, 06:26 PM	I've been wondering about the reason for the "Class Chronicles" articles... Is there going to be a renewed commitment from WotC to tie and support the additional "base" classes that they've created. I'm really excited about the possibility of having a large pool of classes to choose from in 4th edition... It also means that we're almost definitely looking at a source book (or books) that port the various rules over to 4th edition. I for one would love to see one mammoth "Class Update" book that would update ALL of the classes (I'm not keen on buying 8 different supplements, however)... Does everyone else want to see continued support for some or all of the "extra" base classes?
Fabius Maximus 09-23-07, 07:25 PM	No. 4e will reduce the number of base classes. Check the 4e classes boards. Several of the newer ones will probably be redone as talent trees, such as the Scout.
MerrikCale 09-23-07, 09:32 PM	No. 4e will reduce the number of base classes. Check the 4e classes boards. Several of the newer ones will probably be redone as talent trees, such as the Scout. darn.
Fabius Maximus 09-24-07, 06:38 AM	darn. Why? This flood of base classes in 3rd edition was just ridiculous. Despite the fact that some were fairly decent.
Valgard 09-24-07, 07:11 AM	Why? This flood of base classes in 3rd edition was just ridiculous. Despite the fact that some were fairly decent.I'm also with you. One of the main reasons for the new edition (at least from my point of view) is that they are re-considering all character options to make them simplier. What I like to see is some way to make these classes. Maybe someones like the Tome of Battle ones will be the "standard" for the warrior classes and they probably lose their stuff, but mechanics will 'go on'.
Fabius Maximus 09-24-07, 10:19 AM	Since James Wyatt called the ToB an 'early draft' for the changes in the melee system, these classes are out as they are. And that's a good thing in my book.
EytanBernstein 09-24-07, 06:28 PM	When I started this series (and even near the end), I had no definitive knowledge of 4e coming up. It was just an idea I had that Wizards wanted to run with.
Dark Wizard 09-24-07, 06:45 PM	Since James Wyatt called the ToB an 'early draft' for the changes in the melee system, these classes are out as they are. And that's a good thing in my book. While I like the ToB material, I will agree, a more integrated system usable right from the start of the 4E Core would be ideal. Hopefully the make it sound more setting neutral so the "It's so Animu!" complaints will stop. Though with the way even arcane wizardry is going, that might not work out.
MerrikCale 09-24-07, 08:02 PM	Despite the fact that some were fairly decent. There's your answer. I like the base class thing despite the fact some were just plain stupid. I will miss the swashbuckler, scout, favored soul, etc etc even if I don't like the hexblade, duskblade, spellthief, etc etc
Fabius Maximus 09-25-07, 08:42 AM	Die 4ED DIE!!!Shut up, please. There's your answer. I like the base class thing despite the fact some were just plain stupid. I will miss the swashbuckler, scout, favored soul, etc etc even if I don't like the hexblade, duskblade, spellthief, etc etc But there are so many of them that it's just not funny anymore. We had 2e class kits all over again.
MarkusTay63 09-25-07, 11:34 AM	They aren't going to have less - they just want to sell them to us one splatbook at a time.... :rolleyes: I figure by the time 4.5 rolls around, we will have another abysmal mess of unuseable PrCs and useless Feats. Which they are always willing to 'fix' by selling us the fixes in '½ editions'. Haven't you guys figured it out yet? :confused: We are just 'cows'........
sleyvas 09-26-07, 03:25 PM	>>Which they are always willing to 'fix' by selling us the fixes in '½ editions'. >>Haven't you guys figured it out yet? Yep, it was like with 3.0 where they did so much play testing. It didn't take me 2 months of learning the rules to see that multi-classing was the way to just rack up a ton of powers... all because they put the best abilities at 1st level. Dipping a level in monk was great for all its abilities, plus the saves. Dipping a level in paladin (if you were willing to be LG) was great. Want two weapon fighting AND tracking.. take a level of ranger. What rocket science did it take to realize that they needed to fix that? Sure enough, 3.5 came along 2 or 3 years later. This all being said, there's some fixes that I think D&D needs. The save DC system could use some work and it will have to get it if they're doing away with 9 levels of spells. Otherwise, if you're casting a "20th" lvl spell in 4e, noone will be able to make the saves. This of course will mean that a +5 resistance bonus for saves on a cloak won't be nearly as powerful as it is now.... which means spells will have to be rewritten.... cost for making magic items revamped. Lots of math changes will need to come in.
MerrikCale 09-26-07, 10:15 PM	But there are so many of them that it's just not funny anymore. We had 2e class kits all over again. what do you think is going to happen with talent trees and PrCs in 4e?
Fabius Maximus 09-27-07, 08:53 AM	I suspect there will be less PrC's. Talent trees take away less space, so they can put more of them into one book. That doesn't mean they will do it...
Diffan 09-27-07, 09:01 AM	4e will reduce the number of base classes. Check the 4e classes boards. Several of the newer ones will probably be redone as talent trees, such as the Scout. These classes from what I'm told are going to be as follows: 1. Cleric 2. Fighter 3. Rogue 4. Wizard 5. Barbarian 6. Paladin 7. Ranger 8. Warlord They've also said that the Ranger has basically killed the scout and taken his abilities, so probably no scout in 4e. Also, alignment will be changed so things like Smite Evil, will probably end up being like the smite feature for the Cleric with the Destruction domain or the Crusader's smite. Source- http://forums.gleemax.com/leaving.php?destination=http://www.enworld.org/index.php%3Fpage%3D4e
Straploknight 09-27-07, 09:00 PM	What the heck is a warlord and why would I buy one anyway? and why not just have 1. Fighter 2. Rogue 3. Mage 4. Cleric thats all you need to make a barbarian, bard, monk, paladin, ranger, etc. Hell, do away with PrC's as well. feats, skills, and a mixture of ftr/rog/mag/clr and you can replicate anything you need
MerrikCale 09-27-07, 09:15 PM	I suspect there will be less PrC's. At first sure, but as more books hit the marker, there will be just as many feats and PrCs
Fabius Maximus 09-28-07, 08:04 AM	The Warlord is a non-magical bard. Rumors say the class will be able to heal. :banghead:
Diffan 09-28-07, 09:20 AM	The Warlord is a non-magical bard. Rumors say the class will be able to heal. :banghead: It might be considered a "Leader" class or maybe some sorta buff character like a bard/marshal mix that has auras, healing, group spells that adds to hit/damage/saves/etc.....?
MarkusTay63 09-28-07, 03:35 PM	At first sure, but as more books hit the marker, there will be just as many feats and PrCsYup. In EVERY edition, the iniitial release was excellent and worked well. Then they proceed to spend the next 7-10 years breking it. Why you may ask? So they can sell us a new one again. :bored: PrCs as they were originally intended are an excellent concept - providing flavor and unique abilities to members of elitle organizations and groups. What they became was a complete disaster - just a way to fill page counts in splat books. :(
MerrikCale 09-28-07, 09:33 PM	Yup. PrCs as they were originally intended are an excellent concept - providing flavor and unique abilities to members of elitle organizations and groups. What they became was a complete disaster - just a way to fill page counts in splat books. :( I wouldn't call them a disaster, But you are correct, they (along with feats to a lesser degree) were a way to fill up enough pages to throw out another $29.95 book. All along they should have been that was added to sourcebooks if appropriate
Diffan 10-01-07, 08:05 AM	I dunno, Many PrC's make some classes tolerable to play (espically at high levels) when your not casting 9th level spells. And I hope they add more weapon style feats, those I love! Add that to the fact that fighters and other melee oriented classes will have something similar to stances and maneuvers make playing them just as much fun as a wizard.
Muddman 10-01-07, 03:56 PM	I'd like to make the point that since none of the splat books were neccessary to play the game, why don't you just ignore them and play with the three main books? The reasons they release new books and new material is two fold: first to make more money (duh) and second to appease the population that wants more materials and more options. I have a friend that won't buy a book unless it has at least 5 prestige classes and a few pages of new spells and feats. While I disagree with his philosophy, you can't say there aren't people out there that want more than the base 3 books. More options isn't a bad thing. BTW - The new Star Wars RPG is a rough version of 4 ed, so what we're getting next year is really kind of like 4.5 :)
MerrikCale 10-01-07, 08:35 PM	I'd like to make the point that since none of the splat books were neccessary to play the game, why don't you just ignore them and play with the three main books? True. But some of the stuff in the splatbooks was interesting and worth adding to campaigns. The books were at best 40% useful and a lot of that 60% was useless PrCs and feats
Diffan 10-02-07, 07:51 AM	True. But some of the stuff in the splatbooks was interesting and worth adding to campaigns. The books were at best 40% useful and a lot of that 60% was useless PrCs and feats The only problem I saw was that they re-printed the same feat in multipul source books. We've always played it that if it's in the generic DnD books, it's application can be used in ANY setting. But then again, we've incorporated feats only printed in Eberron into FR and vice versa.
MerrikCale 10-02-07, 08:55 PM	The only problem I saw was that they re-printed the same feat in multipul source books. We've always played it that if it's in the generic DnD books, it's application can be used in ANY setting. But then again, we've incorporated feats only printed in Eberron into FR and vice versa. PrCs more so than feats seem more setting-oriented to me. I always preferred setting PrCs