Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Etharion 05-09-07, 06:22 PM	Hy, i was wondering... Do drows lose their spell like abilities and spell resistance when they arrive to the surface world under the sun? And if they do, is it permanent, or do they lose them only for the duration of time they spend on the surface? Do they have to go through a certain period to regain them then when they return to the Underdark? For i know drow weapons and items disintegrate when they leave the Underdark. I thought that they lose them..at least while on surface.. and a friend of mine says it isnt so.. So whats the deal?
Zandilar 05-09-07, 06:31 PM	Heya, Hy, i was wondering... Do drows lose their spell like abilities and spell resistance when they arrive to the surface world under the sun? And if they do, is it permanent, or do they lose them only for the duration of time they spend on the surface? Do they have to go through a certain period to regain them then when they return to the Underdark? For i know drow weapons and items disintegrate when they leave the Underdark. I thought that they lose them..at least while on surface.. and a friend of mine says it isnt so.. So whats the deal? None of this has applied in 3rd Edition - Drow retain their special abilities while on the surface, and normal magical items that are made by/belonged to Drow don't disintergrate in sunlight (I seem to vaguely recall something about a particular type of item - drowcrafted, I think it's called - that still does disintergrate in sunlight, but that they're far rarer among the kinds of ordinary magical items you'd find the drow using. I think drowcrafted items are mentioned in Underdark). Drow, however, do suffer from Light Blindness - but taking the feat Daylight Adaption will eliminate the penalties due to that.
Alac Luin 05-09-07, 07:02 PM	They DID loose those powers in 2ed. It changed for 3.x as Zandilar mentioned. (due to lore from the novel Windwalker, for a in game explanation) Drowcraft is in Underdark. Off the top of my head, it was loose one power per month on surface, regained at one per week while in the underdark. Another change with drow, is 2ed drow did not have sleep resistance, yet now in 3.X they have sleep immunity just as any elf.
Tevin Kevlak 05-09-07, 08:27 PM	Heya, None of this has applied in 3rd Edition - Drow retain their special abilities while on the surface, and normal magical items that are made by/belonged to Drow don't disintergrate in sunlight (I seem to vaguely recall something about a particular type of item - drowcrafted, I think it's called - that still does disintergrate in sunlight, but that they're far rarer among the kinds of ordinary magical items you'd find the drow using. I think drowcrafted items are mentioned in Underdark). Drow, however, do suffer from Light Blindness - but taking the feat Daylight Adaption will eliminate the penalties due to that. Or you can fork over a mere 10 gold to buy a pair of Sundark Goggles from Races of The Dragon.
The Ubbergeek 05-09-07, 10:43 PM	Or you can fork over a mere 10 gold to buy a pair of Sundark Goggles from Races of The Dragon. It's inferior and a crutch - they are not always available, they are to be worn always, can be costly and broken.... Why to take the risk when you can start being used to sun since years?
Zandilar 05-10-07, 12:46 AM	Heya, Or you can fork over a mere 10 gold to buy a pair of Sundark Goggles from Races of The Dragon. I'd rule that to be only a temporary solution. As the poster below you noted - they can be broken, or lost, or stolen. Anyone in a fight might take an action to pinch them from you at the most inoportune time, especially if they realise you're going to be at a disadvantage without them. :) Any drow who is going to spend the majority of their time on the surface, would be far better off splashing out on the feat, IMHO.
Zanan 05-10-07, 04:18 AM	The Drow of the Underdark, much like Underdark, features items and spells to sustain natural sunlight and spells. The problem lies not just with editions. RAS has Drizzt still use his SLAs despite AD&D ruled aeons ago that he could not. A detailed descriptions about SLAs in AD&D and how they come about or get lost can be found in the appendix of Demihuman Deities. Do note that only adamantite (i.e. specially treated adamantine, faerzress et al) dissolved in AD&D. A drow could have walked all day long back then with "mundane" magical quipment without problem. In 3E, adamantite has not yet resurfaced and only drow equipment subjected to faerzress during its production = drowcraft suffers in direct natural sunlight.
Lord_Steve 05-10-07, 12:49 PM	The Drow of the Underdark, much like Underdark, features items and spells to sustain natural sunlight and spells. The problem lies not just with editions. RAS has Drizzt still use his SLAs despite AD&D ruled aeons ago that he could not. A detailed descriptions about SLAs in AD&D and how they come about or get lost can be found in the appendix of Demihuman Deities. Do note that only adamantite (i.e. specially treated adamantine, faerzress et al) dissolved in AD&D. A drow could have walked all day long back then with "mundane" magical quipment without problem. In 3E, adamantite has not yet resurfaced and only drow equipment subjected to faerzress during its production = drowcraft suffers in direct natural sunlight. Forgive my ignorance but what is SLA????
Alac Luin 05-10-07, 02:47 PM	Forgive my ignorance but what is SLA???? Spell Like Ability
Straploknight 05-10-07, 08:31 PM	Drow, however, do suffer from Light Blindness - but taking the feat Daylight Adaption will eliminate the penalties due to that. While not Realms specific, you can also get that as essentially a free feat by adopting the Kinslayer class from the new DotU (however short lived the character will be given the nature of the prestige class)
Burningspear 05-10-07, 09:29 PM	While not Realms specific, you can also get that as essentially a free feat by adopting the Kinslayer class from the new DotU (however short lived the character will be given the nature of the prestige class) And what is precisely the nature of the prestige class? :) (dont have that book, cant keep up with all those freaking releases, will cost to much money if i tried)
Straploknight 05-10-07, 10:16 PM	pretty much boils down to a drow psychopath hell bent on hunting down and killing every surface elf they come across.... Okay, that may describe your average drow, but magnify that by about fifty eleven times and you get the picture, these guys take racial prejudice to a higher level. To be honest, they are really only suitable in an all drow campaign or as an NPC adversary IMO, to much trouble otherwise.
Lord_Steve 05-10-07, 10:20 PM	pretty much boils down to a drow psychopath hell bent on hunting down and killing every surface elf they come across.... Okay, that may describe your average drow, but magnify that by about fifty eleven times and you get the picture, these guys take racial prejudice to a higher level. To be honest, they are really only suitable in an all drow campaign or as an NPC adversary IMO, to much trouble otherwise. *scratches chin* Basicaly the Kuklux Klan but focused on Drow instead of White peeps...lol
Straploknight 05-10-07, 10:22 PM	*scratches chin* Basicaly the Kuklux Klan but focused on Drow instead of White peeps...lol bloodier I'd say
Dielzen 05-11-07, 12:05 AM	Personally, I'd find the reverse version (the Adaption section of the PrC) to be a great character concept/bulid -- Course, I'm just in love with Mettle.
Straploknight 05-11-07, 12:44 AM	Y'know when I first saw the name "Kinslayer" it conjured up an image of someone like Zaknafein.
Realms Walker 05-11-07, 01:31 AM	Drow are not drow without the 2e lore and Flaws etc. I think anyone who considers themselves a true fan of dark elves (though it is a subject that has been beaten like a dead horse) is doing themselves a disservice by allowing a novel set to destroy some of the more creative aspects of a race which in turn just makes em your average run of the mill elves with dark skin and a bad disposition. But it is true that elves equipment and Spell Like abilities perty much remain intact now.
The Ubbergeek 05-11-07, 01:48 AM	Drow are not drow without the 2e lore and Flaws etc. I think anyone who considers themselves a true fan of dark elves (though it is a subject that has been beaten like a dead horse) is doing themselves a disservice by allowing a novel set to destroy some of the more creative aspects of a race which in turn just makes em your average run of the mill elves with dark skin and a bad disposition. But it is true that elves equipment and Spell Like abilities perty much remain intact now. But then, you seems to imply that, to use the famous example, the Eberron elves, being for some cases RADICALY different from the common PHB/MM elves, are not elves. The Eberron drow, similarly, ARE drow, like it or not. Apparently, a race must ALWAYS be the same or it is not the race anymore.... Static, never change, never options to make things different.
Straploknight 05-11-07, 01:48 AM	Drow are not drow without the 2e lore and Flaws etc. I think anyone who considers themselves a true fan of dark elves (though it is a subject that has been beaten like a dead horse) is doing themselves a disservice by allowing a novel set to destroy some of the more creative aspects of a race which in turn just makes em your average run of the mill elves with dark skin and a bad disposition. But it is true that elves equipment and Spell Like abilities perty much remain intact now. Meh, 2e was all about making generic PCs out of monster races, by the time the CHBoE got finished with the drow who operated on the surface for any length of time, they were essentially dark skinned surface evles with better infravision - all thier extra abilites were non divine in nature and were expressly a result of living in the Underdark. As for drowcraft weapons, I can dig that to a point (IIRC under 3e rules drowcraft weapons are cheaper and faster to manufacture hence the decaying penalty on the surface) and it makes sense if your looking to mass produce magical weaponry on a large scale so that you are better equipped than your foes, but I don't see drow being so technically limited as to only being able to produce drowcraft weapons and armor (another artifact of racial level limits possibly in 1e & 2e - perhaps drow were unable to reach sufficient level to craft permanent magic items - well that was until the 2e DotU came out).
The Ubbergeek 05-11-07, 01:52 AM	Plus, some older editions things where not the product of flavour (a very misshandled and abused term) or anything, but limits of many reasons, often out of game. The older editions are not sacred, and some changes may be made for a good reasons, and for good. Drow living on the surface are expected to be different in some aspects, at least culturaly, duh.
Straploknight 05-11-07, 02:05 AM	Drow living on the surface are expected to be different in some aspects, at least culturaly, duh. No, I dont consider them sacred, but it seems odd to me that the drow gained very specific powers (SLA's) simply due to being exposed to the "strange radiations" of the underdark (one could argue that magic resistance would actually be one of them) and would lose them on the surface due to inexposure to the UD radiation. Okay, you could argue further that drow somehow absorbed the UD radiation like living batteries and converted it into magical energy to empower thier SLA's, but why only those specific powers and not being able to learn to shape different effects or even having abberations which could will wholely different effects into exsistance. That further brings into question the females which had aditional powers (which obviously are divine in nature due to the average females association with the church of Lolth). Anyways, I saw the 3.5e drow are just as good as the older 1&2e drow.
Lord Dracul 05-11-07, 04:20 AM	If you refer to the trilogy with Liriel and her human companion, Liriel used the Windwalker to enable ALL Drow magic and items to retain their potency. Therefore, they will not disintergrate under the sun. P.S. The book where she acyually completed the transition is in Tangled Webs.
Zanan 05-11-07, 07:29 AM	If you refer to the trilogy with Liriel and her human companion, Liriel used the Windwalker to enable ALL Drow magic and items to retain their potency. Therefore, they will not disintergrate under the sun. P.S. The book where she acyually completed the transition is in Tangled Webs. Do note that the events described in the Liriel series are things that Liriel thinks is happening because of her dabbling with Windwalker etc.. So far, no sourcebook has backed up her / this line of thought. And, as I said, drow had all options available to them with regard to normal magical items too. A simple +2 longsword or cloak of resistance of a drow would not have disintegrated in sunlight. Only the equipment which was subjected to faerzress didn't work or fell apart. And, BTW, the drowcraft enhancement reaffirmed this notion. Apart from Drizzt, I cannot think of any drow character who ventured on the surface long enough to make him or her loose her SLA's. Thus, how would they know that this has changed? Because the priestesses told them? Just as food for thought.
Ramenth 05-12-07, 03:55 AM	I always assumed that the SLA's were a biological abilitiy as opposed to... I dont know. Radiation posioning or something. I mean, if its just the Faerez that gives the abilties, why don't non-drow elves suddenly gain the ability to use Fairy Fire and Darkness SLA's in the underdark?
Zanan 05-12-07, 04:19 AM	I always assumed that the SLA's were a biological abilitiy as opposed to... I dont know. Radiation posioning or something. I mean, if its just the Faerez that gives the abilties, why don't non-drow elves suddenly gain the ability to use Fairy Fire and Darkness SLA's in the underdark? Essentially, the musings about why drow have the ability of this and that and developed SR / Magic Resistance are all more or less theoretical, even in the sourcebooks. Faerzress might or might not have something to do with this. TDotUD has a nice story about Zinzerena, a heroine/demigoddess of illusion and assassins, who, after "being caught" appeared to have been killed, yet her body was never found. But from that day onwards, drow were able to cast their racial SLAs. At least that is how the legend goes ...
Straploknight 05-12-07, 09:45 AM	I could see SR being the result of faerzress, but I always considered the SLA's more divine in nature and increased darkvision/reduced stature just plain old adaptation to the environment. As for racial adjustments I'd attribute that to selective breeding.