Post/Author/DateTime	Post
kaor 08-14-07, 07:31 PM	Okay, I tried a google and didn't find an answer to my question. The magelord gets a feature towards the end of the Prestige Class, that allows him to use feats on the spells he can spontaneously cast (10th level, I know it is hard to do it pre-epic). My question is, can he use quicken spell with this? Spontaneous casting for Clerics is a full action thing and can't be quickened. Is it the same for magelords? It isn't spelled out for me reading this, so I'd like to know. And the same for using other feats, if I convert a fifth level spell to a silent dimension door, does it take a regular action, or a full? If they can't spontaneously use quicken, this class is a lot less interesting. It would make sense that they can't, to me at least, but why not just play a sorcerer then? Oh and something that came up the other night (again I googled and didn't find much), are quickened spells silent and still?
kaor 08-15-07, 01:30 AM	Bump.
Dielzen 08-15-07, 10:15 AM	Oh and something that came up the other night (again I googled and didn't find much), are quickened spells silent and still? If quickened spells were silent and still, there'd be no reason to have Silent Spel or Still Spell feats.
sleyvas 08-15-07, 12:08 PM	quickened spells are not silent and stilled.
MarkHall 08-15-07, 01:40 PM	If quickened spells were silent and still, there'd be no reason to have Silent Spel or Still Spell feats. I have a feat called "Subtle Spell" which has Silent and Still as prereqs, but allows both to be used for a +1 level adjustment. http://rpg-crank.livejournal.com/5297.html
Andyr 08-15-07, 01:55 PM	The magelord gets a feature towards the end of the Prestige Class, that allows him to use feats on the spells he can spontaneously cast (10th level, I know it is hard to do it pre-epic). Sorry for the slight diversion--I am away from books, but I had in my mind that due to skill/spell requirements it wasn't possible to finish the class pre-epic? Have the prerequisities been Errata'd, or are there some inventive builds lurking around to get you in before level 11?
kaor 08-15-07, 02:29 PM	I've seen some threads on these boards that have ways to get around the written requirements. There is something called a combat medic that can be used somehow. And some sort of shadow template (not the shade one) from a splatbook that gives you uncanny dodge. Edit: I mean evasion. If you are interested in these do a google on magelord and requirements. That one should be easy to find. But we are just going to change the requirements in my game. I've read that the class designer for this wanted it to be fourth level spells. We are going to make it third level spells. I'm not really an optimizer so I would go into it as a 2/2/5 Rogue/Fighter/Wizard. If I go that route. And probably pick save my personal hide spells as my mastered ones.
runestar 08-16-07, 06:15 AM	My question is, can he use quicken spell with this? Yes. The ability is simply a very roundabout way of saying that you may apply metamagic feats to your spells without increasing their casting time.:) If they can't spontaneously use quicken, this class is a lot less interesting. It would make sense that they can't, to me at least, but why not just play a sorcerer then? Barring the 2 crap rogue lvs you must pick up, the magelord promises to let you cast more spontaneous spells than a sorc eventually. This in addition to the normal repertoire of spells you can memorize...:eek:
kaor 08-16-07, 08:54 AM	"Quicken Spell [Metamagic] Benefit Casting a quickened spell is an swift action. You can perform another action, even casting another spell, in the same round as you cast a quickened spell. You may cast only one quickened spell per round. A spell whose casting time is more than 1 full round action cannot be quickened. A quickened spell uses up a spell slot four levels higher than the spell’s actual level. Casting a quickened spell doesn’t provoke an attack of opportunity. Special This feat can’t be applied to any spell cast spontaneously (including sorcerer spells, bard spells, and cleric or druid spells cast spontaneously), since applying a metamagic feat to a spontaneously cast spell automatically increases the casting time to a full-round action. " The text of the class says it spontaneously converts spells as a cleric uses his spontaneous casting ability, the one that converts prepped spells to cure/inflict's. And from the srd on a full round action: "Clerics must take more time to spontaneously cast a metamagic version of a cure or inflict spell. Spontaneously casting a metamagic version of a spell with a casting time of 1 standard action is a full-round action, and spells with longer casting times take an extra full-round action to cast." I'm not a good rules lawyer, but another reading makes me think a spontaneous converted spell is usually the same casting time as casting it as though it were prepped. Except when you use a meta-magic feat. Maybe it is some kind of holdover from 3.0 but I had thought a spontaneous converted cure spell was a full round. Looks like I was wrong. As I understand it, a magelord can't use quicken when he uses his spontaneous casting ability. So those quickened true strikes, dimension doors, and blinks and stoneskins would have to be prepped spells. I guess you could prep quickened versions in upper level slots, and convert those to fireballs or chain lightnings or black tentacles, but the metamagic thing seems less useful than I would have thought. Not being able to get that last magelord level, the one where you can apply feats isn't as big a deal anymore. If you are making a roguish mage, maybe sorcerer would be better. If your dm lets you, you could use that option to drop the familiar. Or regular wizard, since magelords wind up being kind of feat starved. I would rather they substituted point blank and precise shots as requirements over signature spell and weapon focus ray. Or maybe arcane trickster or daggerspell mage or something would be better prestige classes to take. From a flavor standpoint they aren't what I'm looking for though.
runestar 08-17-07, 11:14 PM	Ah...but he is not applying a metamagic feat to a spell here. He is swapping out, say, a fireball to cast an empowered magic missile.:)