Star Warlocks [Archive] - Wizards Community

Star Warlocks [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
MerrikCale
12-21-07, 11:16 AM In the new Races and Classes deal, they talk about the variuos pacts the warlocks make to gain power. They, of course, mention pacts with demons, devils and fey. But they also note a fourth type of pact, one with the "stars and the darkness between them". I immediately thought that perhaps warlocks will be front and center in the war between Shar and Selune on both sides. Thoughts?
Lord Karsus
12-21-07, 08:36 PM -Star Warlocks, nothing but Star Warlocks...

-Hmm..."stars and the darkness between them", eh? Could be implemented into the Realms as Shar and Selūne, but as neither of the two are Generic D&D deities, I don't think they are what is being alluded to.

-With luck, maybe it's some kind of hidden Spelljammer reference.
Dark Wizard
12-21-07, 09:13 PM Sounds like some Far Realms stuff to me.
Alediran
12-21-07, 09:16 PM Sounds like some Far Realms stuff to me.

I was going to say the same.
MerrikCale
12-21-07, 09:28 PM Hmm..."stars and the darkness between them", eh? Could be implemented into the Realms as Shar and Selūne, but as neither of the two are Generic D&D deities, I don't think they are what is being alluded to.

-With luck, maybe it's some kind of hidden Spelljammer reference.

Spelljammer eh?

I was thinking that it would be adapted to the Realms in either the Campaign book or, more likely, the subsequent Player's Guide
Lord Karsus
12-21-07, 10:34 PM Spelljammer eh?

-Well, the first thing that came to mind was 'void'. And, the void is a major concept in Spelljammer, so...Not very likely, but...
MerrikCale
12-21-07, 11:18 PM -Well, the first thing that came to mind was 'void'. And, the void is a major concept in Spelljammer, so...Not very likely, but...

we can always dream.....
Lord Karsus
12-21-07, 11:20 PM we can always dream.....

-Exactly. And, I don't think that a mage type (that's what warlocks are) drawing power from the literal universe around them isn't a bad idea. I think there's a PrC in Oriental Adventures like that...The 'Void Mage', or something to that effect.
MerrikCale
12-21-07, 11:21 PM No. I like the expansion of the warlock concept to include fey and the universe. I suspect there will be other Pacts in the future
Dark Wizard
12-21-07, 11:46 PM That's already better than 3e Sorcerers from the get-go who were dragons-blooded ... and ... only dragon-blooded apparently. There really wasn't company support for the different bloodlines until 3e's twilight.
johnkretzer
12-22-07, 04:14 PM Sounds like some Far Realms stuff to me.

Got to agree here.
johnkretzer
12-22-07, 04:15 PM That's already better than 3e Sorcerers from the get-go who were dragons-blooded ... and ... only dragon-blooded apparently. There really wasn't company support for the different bloodlines until 3e's twilight.

Yeah but when that support came it was by far 100% better then Warlocks ever were. I mean while it was said they could have fey heritage...then name of invocations really never supported it. I really think Warlocks were a waste of space.
Suin Bahhar
12-22-07, 04:33 PM Stars and pacts. I can taste the flavour already. Really like the new warlocks direction. The hot elf warlock pick helps too. ^^
MerrikCale
12-22-07, 09:22 PM Really like the new warlocks direction.

I have to agree. The new options open up the class but there is still that "pact with the devil" edge to them
Dark Wizard
12-22-07, 09:41 PM Yeah but when that support came it was by far 100% better then Warlocks ever were. I mean while it was said they could have fey heritage...then name of invocations really never supported it. I really think Warlocks were a waste of space.

I think taking into account that the Warlock only came out in 3.5e and was never a core class to begin with yet still had a decent amount of support (any at all) for it pushes the scales in favor of the warlock. We expect the warlock to get little support, plenty of the Complete and PHB2 base classes got left at the curb. The sorcerer appeared in the PHB from the beginning and WotC's flavor on them included bloodlines that never materialized until the last two years or so. They really were an afterthought.
GothicDan
12-22-07, 09:50 PM I liked Warlocks more than Sorcerers, which is saying a lot. I'm quite glad they got rid of Sorcerers and just made the base Wizard more versatile, and are supporting Warlocks for the role Sorcerers were once supposed to be.
MerrikCale
12-22-07, 10:02 PM I liked Warlocks more than Sorcerers, which is saying a lot. I'm quite glad they got rid of Sorcerers and just made the base Wizard more versatile, and are supporting Warlocks for the role Sorcerers were once supposed to be.

who says that. The new Races & Classes book seems to indicate there will be sorcerers at some point and they will have distinct spell list.
GothicDan
12-22-07, 10:10 PM Well, then. So much for me liking a change...
Chance87
12-22-07, 11:47 PM :devil: Best warlock depiction ever...

http://www.lfgcomic.com/page/1
MerrikCale
12-22-07, 11:54 PM Well, then. So much for me liking a change...

sorry
Lord Karsus
12-23-07, 12:30 AM :devil: Best warlock depiction ever...

http://www.lfgcomic.com/page/1

-Why is the pale Elf supposed to be evil?
Chance87
12-23-07, 01:35 AM *shrug* Always assumed LFG is loosely based on WoW or some other MMORPG that I'm not familiar with.
Richard has the best lines - his character really shows through in the first ten or so pages...they even have a clip on youtube of him doing a musical number (a la Disney) for a animated film they're working on.

-Why is the pale Elf supposed to be evil?
Lord Karsus
12-23-07, 01:43 AM *shrug* Always assumed LFG is loosely based on WoW or some other MMORPG that I'm not familiar with.
Richard has the best lines - his character really shows through in the first ten or so pages...they even have a clip on youtube of him doing a musical number (a la Disney) for a animated film they're working on.

-Oh, there's an entire backstory there. Alright, I thought it was just a single cartoon, and that I was missing something apparently obvious.
johnkretzer
12-23-07, 04:44 AM I think taking into account that the Warlock only came out in 3.5e and was never a core class to begin with yet still had a decent amount of support (any at all) for it pushes the scales in favor of the warlock. We expect the warlock to get little support, plenty of the Complete and PHB2 base classes got left at the curb. The sorcerer appeared in the PHB from the beginning and WotC's flavor on them included bloodlines that never materialized until the last two years or so. They really were an afterthought.

The reason the oushed Warlocks so much was because it was a teast for 4th edition. I just don't like them that much. I did like the sorcerer bloodlines support that they got in finally. Also I really like the mystery that the sorcerer had...to it. It's arcane might came from a unknown souce...it was just better then in my opinion just giving straight answears.
GreenKnight
12-23-07, 06:19 AM Well, then. So much for me liking a change...

Sorcerer - From Wizards Presents: Races & Classes: Made more distant from the wizard. They barely control their spells, but unleash enough energy every time that some remains around them. For example after a fireball, they are cloaked in fire which sears enemies nearby.

It is stated that Sorcerers will barely be in control of their magical abilities, but whether or not this means they’ll function somewhat like wild mages is unclear. It does mention that a Sorcerer who casts a cold spell might have a protective aura of freezing cold around him afterwards for a short while.

Just thought you might be interested in seeing what they've got in mind for the 4E Sorcerer.
Another Gnome
12-23-07, 09:03 AM But they also note a fourth type of pact, one with the "stars and the darkness between them".

Midi-chlorians?

Oh come on, I can't be the only one who looked at the topic name and thought it was a pun.

You know.

Star War(lock)s? Anyone..? :hides:
Lord Karsus
12-23-07, 10:59 AM The reason the oushed Warlocks so much was because it was a teast for 4th edition. I just don't like them that much. I did like the sorcerer bloodlines support that they got in finally. Also I really like the mystery that the sorcerer had...to it. It's arcane might came from a unknown souce...it was just better then in my opinion just giving straight answears.

-Because I don't have the book that Warlock is in, they're non-players in any D&D activity I participate in. I personally felt that the Warlock would have been a better PrC than a base class. The idea that a Wizard/Sorcerer "sells his soul" for additional Arcane power and Eldrich Blasts and all that is a cool one, I think.

Just thought you might be interested in seeing what they've got in mind for the 4E Sorcerer.

-That's interesting. So, in 4e, the Sorcerer seems to be a Wilder (Psionic Handbook) who uses Arcane Magic. I don't know if I like that or not yet, but it sure is interesting.
GothicDan
12-23-07, 11:02 AM Just thought you might be interested in seeing what they've got in mind for the 4E Sorcerer.

Still not a good thing as far as I'm concerned. I was happy when I thought they were getting rid of them. I do not think they have a reason to mechanically exist, when you could have just basically had a Wizard with appropriate Feats doing the same thing.
MerrikCale
12-23-07, 11:48 AM Midi-chlorians?

Oh come on, I can't be the only one who looked at the topic name and thought it was a pun.

You know.

Star War(lock)s? Anyone..? :hides:

look at the second post
Dark Wizard
12-23-07, 02:47 PM The reason the oushed Warlocks so much was because it was a teast for 4th edition. I just don't like them that much. I did like the sorcerer bloodlines support that they got in finally. Also I really like the mystery that the sorcerer had...to it. It's arcane might came from a unknown souce...it was just better then in my opinion just giving straight answears.

I'll agree on the 4E tease part, but I look at it a different way. WotC tried many experimental systems as a prelude to 4E: Warlocks and Invocations, Incarnum, Initiate martial maneuvers, Pact/Shadow/Truename magic, various base classes. Some of these worked, some of them were well received by players, others not so much. The Warlock was one of those classes and systems that seemed to work. I think it is because they filled a niche in the D&D system. So that is why I feel they are a legitimate aspect, especially of 4E. It probably was a true effort to provide something interesting for the game.

(Maybe it's because I see it as an 'evolutionary' way to innovate the game. Throw decent variation out into the actual system, see what sticks and adapt it for the next edition. And I try not to toss around the term evolution lightly.)

The sorcerer I felt got a wishy-washy treatment. Are they bloodline based, draconic only based, mysterious background up to players and DM? Sure they hinted at all of these, but it really felt like they didn't know what to do with them rather than any purposeful design decision. It seemed to me like a lot of blind feeling around, some designers trying to figure out what to do with them, some didn't care. For a long time, it wasn't even mysterious background, draconic was the only thing available. (The most flavorful crunch I saw for sorcerers were the bloodline feats from Dragon magazine.)

Warlocks had their invocation and eldritch blast remain more or less exclusive to invocation classes (the two that appeared). The sorcerer unfortunately faced dilution, as 3e expanded wizards received ever increasing options and prestige classes that diminished the uniqueness of the sorcerer's main feature.

I'm glad that in 4E they are trying to address the main weakness of the Warlock; that of background flavor with a rules backing, different origins. I also like what the preview book said of sorcerers. They do seem like the psionic wilder using arcane magic, which I think is a step up from second rate wizard with one semi-special feature that other classes could easily encroach upon. This 'wild magic' feel in 4E is very much in line with the flavor text of the 3e sorcerer, someone who uses raw will and talent to fling magic around rather than the more controlled, more refined approach of wizards.
Suin Bahhar
12-23-07, 05:51 PM I hope the flavour for sorcerers is less about what origin they have and more about the way they are magical prodigies who can shape magic through their force of presence, personality and will. I really like the linguring auras idea the more I think about it.

Baker said spellfire could come back in 4ed. Does this mean spellfire also didn't use the weave? I thougt it was a special atunement to the weave on Toril.
GothicDan
12-23-07, 07:01 PM Don't ask about lore-based questions, Suin. It's bad for the digestion.
Rauric
12-23-07, 11:15 PM I hope the flavour for sorcerers is less about what origin they have and more about the way they are magical prodigies who can shape magic through their force of presence, personality and will. I really like the linguring auras idea the more I think about it.

Baker said spellfire could come back in 4ed. Does this mean spellfire also didn't use the weave? I thougt it was a special atunement to the weave on Toril.

What if the Weave still exists, but in a warped form?
Suin Bahhar
12-24-07, 09:29 AM The weave is surely gone without Mystra. Magic will be accesible as it was for all planewalker mages. Directly from the AEther, the ethereal cosmic magical force. Torilian planewalkers must have an advantage being able to have both an understanding of drawing magic through the buffer/accelerator of the weave and on other worlds from the AEther. After the weaves disappearance I suspect the speed of magical manipulations will be reduced as the source of magic is farther removed than it was previously.

Star warlocks perhaps seek out a way to get closer to the cosmic magic by guidance of the stars. Making pacts with entities between the stars is a bit foolish though, as they are up to no good...

A Spellfire channeler perhaps can retie his link to raw magic with enough meditation and training. They could very well be imune to the spellplague (if more details are revealed soon). Maybe the resulting powers are even more explosive as control is largely suppressed to acces the new magic source...
MerrikCale
12-24-07, 11:24 AM A Spellfire channeler perhaps can retie his link to raw magic with enough meditation and training. They could very well be imune to the spellplague (if more details are revealed soon). Maybe the resulting powers are even more explosive as control is largely suppressed to acces the new magic source...

will there still be spellfire post spellplague?
Dark Wizard
12-24-07, 11:40 PM There could every well be, since Spellfire could be cool, but apparently the weave is not. What could be cool? If Spellfire weavers were the last of the old weaver adherents. It would give a nod to both sides, the coolness of Spellfire but also the reverence for the old weave. Warlock invocations probably come closest to Spellfire in terms of the mechanics-flavor relationship.
Lord Karsus
12-25-07, 01:54 AM will there still be spellfire post spellplague?

-Well, Silverfire/Spellfire is (mostly) unprocessed pure magic, not filtered by the Weave. So, theoretically, it could...
Elbereth_Silverleaf
12-30-07, 12:20 AM I am Grey.
I stand between the candle and the star.
We are Grey.
We stand between the darkness ... and the light.

lol
Lord Karsus
01-11-08, 09:26 PM I am Grey.
I stand between the candle and the star.
We are Grey.
We stand between the darkness ... and the light.

lol

-I'm actually green right now, considering all the changes and everything. :yuck:
Taita_of_Imaskar
01-18-08, 06:18 PM -Why is the pale Elf supposed to be evil?

Yeah Looking For Group, LFG is common thing in WoW.

Plus its an Undead warlock and Blood Elf ranger.

The good elves are purple in WoW. :rofl:

EDIT: its hunters, not rangers... been around a year since I played...
Lord Karsus
01-19-08, 01:35 AM Yeah Looking For Group, LFG is common thing in WoW.

Plus its an Undead warlock and Blood Elf ranger.

The good elves are purple in WoW. :rofl:

-Yes, all of that was lost on me.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
MerrikCale 12-21-07, 11:16 AM	In the new Races and Classes deal, they talk about the variuos pacts the warlocks make to gain power. They, of course, mention pacts with demons, devils and fey. But they also note a fourth type of pact, one with the "stars and the darkness between them". I immediately thought that perhaps warlocks will be front and center in the war between Shar and Selune on both sides. Thoughts?
Lord Karsus 12-21-07, 08:36 PM	-Star Warlocks, nothing but Star Warlocks... -Hmm..."stars and the darkness between them", eh? Could be implemented into the Realms as Shar and Selūne, but as neither of the two are Generic D&D deities, I don't think they are what is being alluded to. -With luck, maybe it's some kind of hidden Spelljammer reference.
Dark Wizard 12-21-07, 09:13 PM	Sounds like some Far Realms stuff to me.
Alediran 12-21-07, 09:16 PM	Sounds like some Far Realms stuff to me. I was going to say the same.
MerrikCale 12-21-07, 09:28 PM	Hmm..."stars and the darkness between them", eh? Could be implemented into the Realms as Shar and Selūne, but as neither of the two are Generic D&D deities, I don't think they are what is being alluded to. -With luck, maybe it's some kind of hidden Spelljammer reference. Spelljammer eh? I was thinking that it would be adapted to the Realms in either the Campaign book or, more likely, the subsequent Player's Guide
Lord Karsus 12-21-07, 10:34 PM	Spelljammer eh? -Well, the first thing that came to mind was 'void'. And, the void is a major concept in Spelljammer, so...Not very likely, but...
MerrikCale 12-21-07, 11:18 PM	-Well, the first thing that came to mind was 'void'. And, the void is a major concept in Spelljammer, so...Not very likely, but... we can always dream.....
Lord Karsus 12-21-07, 11:20 PM	we can always dream..... -Exactly. And, I don't think that a mage type (that's what warlocks are) drawing power from the literal universe around them isn't a bad idea. I think there's a PrC in Oriental Adventures like that...The 'Void Mage', or something to that effect.
MerrikCale 12-21-07, 11:21 PM	No. I like the expansion of the warlock concept to include fey and the universe. I suspect there will be other Pacts in the future
Dark Wizard 12-21-07, 11:46 PM	That's already better than 3e Sorcerers from the get-go who were dragons-blooded ... and ... only dragon-blooded apparently. There really wasn't company support for the different bloodlines until 3e's twilight.
johnkretzer 12-22-07, 04:14 PM	Sounds like some Far Realms stuff to me. Got to agree here.
johnkretzer 12-22-07, 04:15 PM	That's already better than 3e Sorcerers from the get-go who were dragons-blooded ... and ... only dragon-blooded apparently. There really wasn't company support for the different bloodlines until 3e's twilight. Yeah but when that support came it was by far 100% better then Warlocks ever were. I mean while it was said they could have fey heritage...then name of invocations really never supported it. I really think Warlocks were a waste of space.
Suin Bahhar 12-22-07, 04:33 PM	Stars and pacts. I can taste the flavour already. Really like the new warlocks direction. The hot elf warlock pick helps too. ^^
MerrikCale 12-22-07, 09:22 PM	Really like the new warlocks direction. I have to agree. The new options open up the class but there is still that "pact with the devil" edge to them
Dark Wizard 12-22-07, 09:41 PM	Yeah but when that support came it was by far 100% better then Warlocks ever were. I mean while it was said they could have fey heritage...then name of invocations really never supported it. I really think Warlocks were a waste of space. I think taking into account that the Warlock only came out in 3.5e and was never a core class to begin with yet still had a decent amount of support (any at all) for it pushes the scales in favor of the warlock. We expect the warlock to get little support, plenty of the Complete and PHB2 base classes got left at the curb. The sorcerer appeared in the PHB from the beginning and WotC's flavor on them included bloodlines that never materialized until the last two years or so. They really were an afterthought.
GothicDan 12-22-07, 09:50 PM	I liked Warlocks more than Sorcerers, which is saying a lot. I'm quite glad they got rid of Sorcerers and just made the base Wizard more versatile, and are supporting Warlocks for the role Sorcerers were once supposed to be.
MerrikCale 12-22-07, 10:02 PM	I liked Warlocks more than Sorcerers, which is saying a lot. I'm quite glad they got rid of Sorcerers and just made the base Wizard more versatile, and are supporting Warlocks for the role Sorcerers were once supposed to be. who says that. The new Races & Classes book seems to indicate there will be sorcerers at some point and they will have distinct spell list.
GothicDan 12-22-07, 10:10 PM	Well, then. So much for me liking a change...
Chance87 12-22-07, 11:47 PM	:devil: Best warlock depiction ever... http://www.lfgcomic.com/page/1
MerrikCale 12-22-07, 11:54 PM	Well, then. So much for me liking a change... sorry
Lord Karsus 12-23-07, 12:30 AM	:devil: Best warlock depiction ever... http://www.lfgcomic.com/page/1 -Why is the pale Elf supposed to be evil?
Chance87 12-23-07, 01:35 AM	shrug Always assumed LFG is loosely based on WoW or some other MMORPG that I'm not familiar with. Richard has the best lines - his character really shows through in the first ten or so pages...they even have a clip on youtube of him doing a musical number (a la Disney) for a animated film they're working on. -Why is the pale Elf supposed to be evil?
Lord Karsus 12-23-07, 01:43 AM	shrug Always assumed LFG is loosely based on WoW or some other MMORPG that I'm not familiar with. Richard has the best lines - his character really shows through in the first ten or so pages...they even have a clip on youtube of him doing a musical number (a la Disney) for a animated film they're working on. -Oh, there's an entire backstory there. Alright, I thought it was just a single cartoon, and that I was missing something apparently obvious.
johnkretzer 12-23-07, 04:44 AM	I think taking into account that the Warlock only came out in 3.5e and was never a core class to begin with yet still had a decent amount of support (any at all) for it pushes the scales in favor of the warlock. We expect the warlock to get little support, plenty of the Complete and PHB2 base classes got left at the curb. The sorcerer appeared in the PHB from the beginning and WotC's flavor on them included bloodlines that never materialized until the last two years or so. They really were an afterthought. The reason the oushed Warlocks so much was because it was a teast for 4th edition. I just don't like them that much. I did like the sorcerer bloodlines support that they got in finally. Also I really like the mystery that the sorcerer had...to it. It's arcane might came from a unknown souce...it was just better then in my opinion just giving straight answears.
GreenKnight 12-23-07, 06:19 AM	Well, then. So much for me liking a change... Sorcerer - From Wizards Presents: Races & Classes: Made more distant from the wizard. They barely control their spells, but unleash enough energy every time that some remains around them. For example after a fireball, they are cloaked in fire which sears enemies nearby. It is stated that Sorcerers will barely be in control of their magical abilities, but whether or not this means they’ll function somewhat like wild mages is unclear. It does mention that a Sorcerer who casts a cold spell might have a protective aura of freezing cold around him afterwards for a short while. Just thought you might be interested in seeing what they've got in mind for the 4E Sorcerer.
Another Gnome 12-23-07, 09:03 AM	But they also note a fourth type of pact, one with the "stars and the darkness between them". Midi-chlorians? Oh come on, I can't be the only one who looked at the topic name and thought it was a pun. You know. Star War(lock)s? Anyone..? :hides:
Lord Karsus 12-23-07, 10:59 AM	The reason the oushed Warlocks so much was because it was a teast for 4th edition. I just don't like them that much. I did like the sorcerer bloodlines support that they got in finally. Also I really like the mystery that the sorcerer had...to it. It's arcane might came from a unknown souce...it was just better then in my opinion just giving straight answears. -Because I don't have the book that Warlock is in, they're non-players in any D&D activity I participate in. I personally felt that the Warlock would have been a better PrC than a base class. The idea that a Wizard/Sorcerer "sells his soul" for additional Arcane power and Eldrich Blasts and all that is a cool one, I think. Just thought you might be interested in seeing what they've got in mind for the 4E Sorcerer. -That's interesting. So, in 4e, the Sorcerer seems to be a Wilder (Psionic Handbook) who uses Arcane Magic. I don't know if I like that or not yet, but it sure is interesting.
GothicDan 12-23-07, 11:02 AM	Just thought you might be interested in seeing what they've got in mind for the 4E Sorcerer. Still not a good thing as far as I'm concerned. I was happy when I thought they were getting rid of them. I do not think they have a reason to mechanically exist, when you could have just basically had a Wizard with appropriate Feats doing the same thing.
MerrikCale 12-23-07, 11:48 AM	Midi-chlorians? Oh come on, I can't be the only one who looked at the topic name and thought it was a pun. You know. Star War(lock)s? Anyone..? :hides: look at the second post
Dark Wizard 12-23-07, 02:47 PM	The reason the oushed Warlocks so much was because it was a teast for 4th edition. I just don't like them that much. I did like the sorcerer bloodlines support that they got in finally. Also I really like the mystery that the sorcerer had...to it. It's arcane might came from a unknown souce...it was just better then in my opinion just giving straight answears. I'll agree on the 4E tease part, but I look at it a different way. WotC tried many experimental systems as a prelude to 4E: Warlocks and Invocations, Incarnum, Initiate martial maneuvers, Pact/Shadow/Truename magic, various base classes. Some of these worked, some of them were well received by players, others not so much. The Warlock was one of those classes and systems that seemed to work. I think it is because they filled a niche in the D&D system. So that is why I feel they are a legitimate aspect, especially of 4E. It probably was a true effort to provide something interesting for the game. (Maybe it's because I see it as an 'evolutionary' way to innovate the game. Throw decent variation out into the actual system, see what sticks and adapt it for the next edition. And I try not to toss around the term evolution lightly.) The sorcerer I felt got a wishy-washy treatment. Are they bloodline based, draconic only based, mysterious background up to players and DM? Sure they hinted at all of these, but it really felt like they didn't know what to do with them rather than any purposeful design decision. It seemed to me like a lot of blind feeling around, some designers trying to figure out what to do with them, some didn't care. For a long time, it wasn't even mysterious background, draconic was the only thing available. (The most flavorful crunch I saw for sorcerers were the bloodline feats from Dragon magazine.) Warlocks had their invocation and eldritch blast remain more or less exclusive to invocation classes (the two that appeared). The sorcerer unfortunately faced dilution, as 3e expanded wizards received ever increasing options and prestige classes that diminished the uniqueness of the sorcerer's main feature. I'm glad that in 4E they are trying to address the main weakness of the Warlock; that of background flavor with a rules backing, different origins. I also like what the preview book said of sorcerers. They do seem like the psionic wilder using arcane magic, which I think is a step up from second rate wizard with one semi-special feature that other classes could easily encroach upon. This 'wild magic' feel in 4E is very much in line with the flavor text of the 3e sorcerer, someone who uses raw will and talent to fling magic around rather than the more controlled, more refined approach of wizards.
Suin Bahhar 12-23-07, 05:51 PM	I hope the flavour for sorcerers is less about what origin they have and more about the way they are magical prodigies who can shape magic through their force of presence, personality and will. I really like the linguring auras idea the more I think about it. Baker said spellfire could come back in 4ed. Does this mean spellfire also didn't use the weave? I thougt it was a special atunement to the weave on Toril.
GothicDan 12-23-07, 07:01 PM	Don't ask about lore-based questions, Suin. It's bad for the digestion.
Rauric 12-23-07, 11:15 PM	I hope the flavour for sorcerers is less about what origin they have and more about the way they are magical prodigies who can shape magic through their force of presence, personality and will. I really like the linguring auras idea the more I think about it. Baker said spellfire could come back in 4ed. Does this mean spellfire also didn't use the weave? I thougt it was a special atunement to the weave on Toril. What if the Weave still exists, but in a warped form?
Suin Bahhar 12-24-07, 09:29 AM	The weave is surely gone without Mystra. Magic will be accesible as it was for all planewalker mages. Directly from the AEther, the ethereal cosmic magical force. Torilian planewalkers must have an advantage being able to have both an understanding of drawing magic through the buffer/accelerator of the weave and on other worlds from the AEther. After the weaves disappearance I suspect the speed of magical manipulations will be reduced as the source of magic is farther removed than it was previously. Star warlocks perhaps seek out a way to get closer to the cosmic magic by guidance of the stars. Making pacts with entities between the stars is a bit foolish though, as they are up to no good... A Spellfire channeler perhaps can retie his link to raw magic with enough meditation and training. They could very well be imune to the spellplague (if more details are revealed soon). Maybe the resulting powers are even more explosive as control is largely suppressed to acces the new magic source...
MerrikCale 12-24-07, 11:24 AM	A Spellfire channeler perhaps can retie his link to raw magic with enough meditation and training. They could very well be imune to the spellplague (if more details are revealed soon). Maybe the resulting powers are even more explosive as control is largely suppressed to acces the new magic source... will there still be spellfire post spellplague?
Dark Wizard 12-24-07, 11:40 PM	There could every well be, since Spellfire could be cool, but apparently the weave is not. What could be cool? If Spellfire weavers were the last of the old weaver adherents. It would give a nod to both sides, the coolness of Spellfire but also the reverence for the old weave. Warlock invocations probably come closest to Spellfire in terms of the mechanics-flavor relationship.
Lord Karsus 12-25-07, 01:54 AM	will there still be spellfire post spellplague? -Well, Silverfire/Spellfire is (mostly) unprocessed pure magic, not filtered by the Weave. So, theoretically, it could...
Elbereth_Silverleaf 12-30-07, 12:20 AM	I am Grey. I stand between the candle and the star. We are Grey. We stand between the darkness ... and the light. lol
Lord Karsus 01-11-08, 09:26 PM	I am Grey. I stand between the candle and the star. We are Grey. We stand between the darkness ... and the light. lol -I'm actually green right now, considering all the changes and everything. :yuck:
Taita_of_Imaskar 01-18-08, 06:18 PM	-Why is the pale Elf supposed to be evil? Yeah Looking For Group, LFG is common thing in WoW. Plus its an Undead warlock and Blood Elf ranger. The good elves are purple in WoW. :rofl: EDIT: its hunters, not rangers... been around a year since I played...
Lord Karsus 01-19-08, 01:35 AM	Yeah Looking For Group, LFG is common thing in WoW. Plus its an Undead warlock and Blood Elf ranger. The good elves are purple in WoW. :rofl: -Yes, all of that was lost on me.