Post/Author/DateTime	Post
ElberethSilverleaf 05-27-07, 03:25 PM	This may have already been discussed before but I just love the 2-handed swords used by the elves in the opening scene of one of the LOTR trilogy. Beautiful, elegant and seems to be a primarily slashing type weapon that may or may not be considered "exotic". Has anyone stated the weapon for d20 and possible requirements for its use? If anyone also knows a link to a thread already discussing this or to another web site regarding its use in d20 please post the relevant links. Also any d20 info on the elven armor, particulary what Elrond's wearing in the battle against Sauron. Thanks.
GeneticChaos 05-27-07, 04:42 PM	Races of Wild has the Elven Courtblade. Basically the elven version of the greatsword. It can be used with weapon finesse, but does less damage (d10).
DinwathSereglin 05-27-07, 10:14 PM	I'd go falchion and call it even.
Another Gnome 05-27-07, 10:55 PM	Or a standard issue greatsword described as having a slight curve... that has absolutely no effect on the weapon stats whatsoever.
captaincarot 05-28-07, 02:32 AM	This may have already been discussed before but I just love the 2-handed swords used by the elves in the opening scene of one of the LOTR trilogy. Beautiful, elegant and seems to be a primarily slashing type weapon that may or may not be considered "exotic". Also any d20 info on the elven armor, particulary what Elrond's wearing in the battle against Sauron. Thanks. they are falchions, played about with by the design crew to make em look pretty, as for the armour can't remember the scene.
JolanthusTrel 05-28-07, 09:56 AM	There is a similar looking weapon in the arms & equipment guide called a flax or falx. I think it had Falchion stats but it fits somewhere between a falchion and a glaive.
ClobberinTime 05-28-07, 11:34 AM	Just for fun though I would give it the stats of the elven courtblade.
Diffan 05-28-07, 02:33 PM	Just for fun though I would give it the stats of the elven courtblade. Yea, same here. Although I might make it's crit. 18-20/x2 instead of 19-20. As for Elrond's armor, it honestly looked like scale mail. Probably really light weight scale and probably magical but scale non the less.
MerrikCale 05-28-07, 09:57 PM	The design aspect of them that I liked in particular, besides the curvature, was that the handle was a long as the blade so they were held with hands fairly wide apart. I would love to see them described somewhere
GothicDan 05-28-07, 10:00 PM	And the idea of long-handled blades is present in Faerunian Elven weaponry, too, because the Tel'Quessir have longer fingers.
MerrikCale 05-28-07, 11:24 PM	And the idea of long-handled blades is present in Faerunian Elven weaponry, too, because the Tel'Quessir have longer fingers. I agree. But I do not recall a blade such as the one depicted in LOTR
GothicDan 05-28-07, 11:39 PM	It's started in Cormanthyr that the handles are longer, that's all I mean. So the design would at least be fitting for Faerunian Elves.
Suin Bahhar 05-29-07, 06:25 PM	If their fingers are longer the grip of elven swords would be wider, not necesarily longer. Longer grip and hilt could be used on a greatsword to acommodate a different fightingstyle i.e. making halfsword attacks or faster downward slashing sweeps. In the LOTR movies the regimented elves used a downward wavelike motion in defence of a charge of Uruk Hai. These blades could mayhaps have the set to recieve a charge ability (nice and sweet double damage vs charging opponents).
Penknight 05-30-07, 08:12 PM	I would like to ask a LoTR item question, if I may. Has their gear (like their weapons, armor and the like) ever been translated over to 3e/3.5? And if so, could someone please post a link to it? Thanks!!
GothicDan 05-31-07, 09:18 PM	If their fingers are longer the grip of elven swords would be wider, not necesarily longer. They could be longer if they held them differently (at a sharper angle).
ClobberinTime 05-31-07, 10:10 PM	I would like to ask a LoTR item question, if I may. Has their gear (like their weapons, armor and the like) ever been translated over to 3e/3.5? And if so, could someone please post a link to it? Thanks!! For me personally I freely mix match everything, as far as pcs are concerned if they want to wear a chain shirt but have it look like plate mail because they think it makes their character look cool its fine by me, so long as it has the stats as a chain shirt, uses up a chain shirt spot, etc...etc... My favorite one is the buckler, lets face it bucklers look goofy, but in game terms they are a necesity if you are twf or using a two handed weapon. So why not make something that uses the buckler slot, and has the same stats but looks cool like armbands of shield or something like Wonder Woman, you can still use regular bracers underneath.
GothicDan 05-31-07, 10:12 PM	I love the idea of metallic bracers as armor.
TomCosta 06-01-07, 12:42 PM	I would treat them as an exotic pole arm and not a sword, but make it a pole arm you can use Weapon Finesse with.
captaincarot 06-03-07, 02:35 PM	I would like to ask a LoTR item question, if I may. Has their gear (like their weapons, armor and the like) ever been translated over to 3e/3.5? And if so, could someone please post a link to it? Thanks!! they were translated into 1st ed in a white dwarf. for the mines of moria. only bit i can remember is that aragorn was an 8th lvl ranger paladin. i might still have it somewhere. but when it comes down to it. D&D doesn't translate well to middle earth in any of it's incarnations. which is why i played rolemaster for many years. the downside of RM being it can take half a lifetime to make a charachter. which is why i now like the way that D20 has developed.
Purple Dragon Knight 06-04-07, 01:15 AM	This may have already been discussed before but I just love the 2-handed swords used by the elves in the opening scene of one of the LOTR trilogy.If you are talking about the two-handed/two-blade swords the elf rows are using to break the orc charge, you are looking at the "Sword, two-bladed" from the PHB, which is yes, an Exotic Weapon.
Diffan 06-04-07, 10:00 AM	If you are talking about the two-handed/two-blade swords the elf rows are using to break the orc charge, you are looking at the "Sword, two-bladed" from the PHB, which is yes, an Exotic Weapon. I don't remember them being a two-bladed sword. I'm pretty sure this is the weapon everyone is talking about..... http://www.swordsdirect.com/high-elven-warrior-sword.html
DojiHoturi 06-04-07, 10:20 AM	They are not two-bladed. They are about the lenght of a Two-Handed or Bastard Sword. The blade is only slightly longer than the handle and they have a curve from pommel to the tip of the blade that makes it look like a very loose 'S'. I would make them Two-Handed Swords with a Weapon Finesse option, as well. I think that fits it best in my book. YMMV Doji ps. Oh, and it is arguably banded mail that Elrond was wearing. I cannot remember the scene very well. I might be thinking of the regular elves.
Darakhoranon 06-04-07, 03:51 PM	Yes, the tree-huggers are probably wearing banded mail. And a "modified" greatsword with the option to use weapon finesse seems to fit - but wouldn´t that make it an exotic weapon?
northernranger 06-04-07, 09:12 PM	In terms of weither or not the swords are two sided, it depends on which scene you were talking about. During the first battle of The fellowship of the Ring the swords the elves used when fighting goblins and orcs in front of mount doom were two sided. The swords twin towers were single sided with really long handles. I would say that the two sided swords would be two sided scimitars like the one described in the arms and equipment guide.
Fencerboy 06-04-07, 11:10 PM	I would like to ask a LoTR item question, if I may. Has their gear (like their weapons, armor and the like) ever been translated over to 3e/3.5? And if so, could someone please post a link to it? Thanks!! This is my current big project! Expect a thread on it sometime at the end of summer. Very thorough I am attempting to be! /yodaness
Red_Wizard 06-07-07, 12:05 PM	For those two of you stating the use of double ended/ two bladed swords, I hate to burst your bubbles, but they are the same single bladed weapon, used later by the light infantry elves of Helms Deep (In the movies that is). I'm sure debate will spring from this, sooooo. Opening Battle (http://www.xenite.org/faqs/lotr_movie/pics/cinefex_03.jpg) Helms deep (http://img-nex.theonering.net/movie/preview/images/33_0201.jpg)
nightside_samurai 06-07-07, 03:03 PM	Also, I doubt anybody in the movie had "magical" armor since the setting is quite low magic. Even one of the most powerful Wizards in the setting fought with staff and sword more than magic.
Khaelieth 06-07-07, 06:42 PM	Also, I doubt anybody in the movie had "magical" armor since the setting is quite low magic. Even one of the most powerful Wizards in the setting fought with staff and sword more than magic. Both of which were magical. ;)
Ranger REG 06-07-07, 07:47 PM	Even one of the most powerful Wizards in the setting fought with staff and sword more than magic. Yeah, but how is it that Saruman and Gandalf fought each other with their staves without coming into contact with one another? :smirk: How is it that Saruman lifted Gandalf unto the tower's ceiling and roof?
Dark Wizard 06-07-07, 10:38 PM	They look like modified nagamaki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nagamaki
GothicDan 06-07-07, 10:40 PM	Only curvier!
TomCosta 06-08-07, 04:56 PM	Here's what I worked some time ago for the weapons and armor from the movies (I named the sword in question the elven handle sword).... Arms of Middle Earth Martial Weapons1 Cost Dmg (S)2 Dmg (M) Critical Range Increment Weight Type One-Handed Melee Weapons Elven scimitar 20 gp 1d4 1d6 18-20/x2 – 3 lb. Slashing Two-Handed Melee Weapons Elven spear 20 gp 1d8 1d10 x3 – 9 lb. Slashing Exotic Weapons1 Cost Dmg (S)2 Dmg (M) Critical Range Increment Weight Type Light Melee Weapons Orc fell knife 6 gp 1d3 1d4 18-20/x2 – 1 lb. Slashing One-Handed Melee Weapons Orc fell axe 25 gp 1d6 2d4 x3 – 7 lb. Slashing Orc fell scimitar 25 gp 1d6 1d8 19-20/x2 – 5 lb. Piercing or slashing Orc fell sword 20 gp 1d4 1d6 18-20/x2 – Slashing Orc sickle stick 8 gp 1d4 1d6 x3 – Slashing Two-Handed Melee Weapons Easterling poleaxe 9 gp 1d8 1d10 x3 – 11 lb. Slashing Easterling long poleaxe 12 gp 1d8 1d10 x3 – 15 lb. Slashing Elven handle sword 40 gp 1d8 1d10 19-20/x2 – 6 lb. Slashing Orc fell halberd 25 gp 2d4 2d6 x3 – 14 lb. Piercing or slashing 1 See the weapon descriptions for additional details and rules. These weapons otherwise follow all the rules in the PH. 2 None of these weapons are known to come in any size but Medium. Nevertheless, Small weapons weigh half as much, and Large weapons weigh twice as much. Easterling long poleaxe: This nine-foot weapon appeared almost exactly like its shorter cousin, but had only one spike at its head and was used to defend against an enemy charge. An Easterling long poleaxe has reach. You can strike opponents 10 feet away with it, but you can’t use it against an adjacent foe. In addition, if you use a ready action to set an elven spear against a charge, you deal double damage on a successful hit against a charging character. You can also use the spike on the end of the weapon to make trip attacks. If you are tripped during your own trip attempt, you can drop the long poleaxe to avoid being tripped. Easterling poleaxe: This five-foot pole-weapon was fitted with a serrated blade and tipped with curved spikes at both ends. The Easterlings used it in close combat. You can use the spike on the ends of the weapon to make trip attacks. If you are tripped during your own trip attempt, you can drop the poleaxe to avoid being tripped. Elven spear: More of a glaive than a spear, this pole-weapon had a slightly curved blade sharpened along one edge. The elves use this eight-foot long spear like a long-handled sword to slash their opponents from a distance. Many elves take the Melee Reach feat to wield this weapon in close combat as well. Like a glaive, an elven spear has reach. You can strike opponents 10 feet away with it, but you can’t use it against an adjacent foe. In addition, like a spear, if you use a ready action to set an elven spear against a charge, you deal double damage on a successful hit against a charging character. Elven handle sword: This weapon is a little over five feet in length with an overall recurved shape resembling that of an elongated S. The handle took up half the weapon length and was usually etched with gold-inlayed patterns. The long handle allowed the elves to rotate the sword with both hands into devastatingly fast sweeps. You can use the Weapon Finesse feat (see the PH) to apply your Dexterity modifier instead of your Strength modifier to attack rolls with an elven handle sword sized for you, even though it isn’t a light weapon for you. Elven scimitar: This blade has a slightly recurved blade of elegant design. You can use the Weapon Finesse feat (see the PH) to apply your Dexterity modifier instead of your Strength modifier to attack rolls with an elven scimitar sized for you, even though it isn’t a light weapon for you. Orc fell axe: The orcs of Mordor are fond of crafting or reworking spikes, hooks, and jagged edges into their battleaxes, increasing their damage. The weapon is otherwise identical to a battleaxe. Orc fell halberd: As with their battleaxes, the orcs of Mordor are fond of crafting or reworking spikes, hooks, and jagged edges into their halberds, increasing their damage. The weapon is otherwise identical to a halberd. If you use a ready action to set a fell halberd against a charge, you deal double damage on a successful hit against a charging character. You can use the hook on the back of the fell halberd to make trip attacks. If you are tripped during your own trip attempt, you can drop the fell halberd to avoid being tripped. Orc fell knife: These single-edged knives, often wielded by warg riders, bore a resemblance to the fell swords of the Moria orcs, incorporating the handgrip and guard into the blade. Orc fell scimitar: More of a one-handed falchion than a scimitar, this single-edged and straight-edged blade was designed for and wielded by the Uruk-hai. It looks like a large meat cleaver or a machete, having a rectangular blade, except for a spike on the back end of the blade’s flattened head. You can use the spike on the back of the blade to make trip attacks. If you are tripped during your own trip attempt, you can drop the fell scimitar to avoid being tripped. Orc fell sword: The orcs of Moria, most likely in imitation of the Balrog, crafted three-foot single-edged swords, which incorporated the handgrip and guard into the blade. Though crudely crafted, these blades were brutally efficient. Orc sickle stick: The warg riders often mounted sickles on short poles, allowing them to wield these wicked weapons from the backs of their wretched steeds and gain more power by leveraging the pole. Because of its shape, you can use it to make trip attacks. If you are tripped during your own trip attempt, you can drop the sickle stick to avoid being tripped Sharpened shields: Among elves and orcs, it was common to sharpen the edges of their heavy shields and/or add spikes to the edges, allowing them to be wielded as slashing or piercing weapons. Elven shields featured sharpened points at top and bottom and sharpened edges on both sides of the shields lower half. The shields wielded by the orcs of Moria resembled bat wings with multiple sharpened points on both ends. And the shields of the Uruk-hai featured two large points on either end of the shield top. When added to your shield, these edges turn it into a martial piercing and/or slashing weapon that increases the damage dealt by a shield bash as if the shield were designed for a creature one size category larger than you (from 1d4 to 1d6, for instance). You can’t effectively wield a buckler or tower shield with sharpened edges. Otherwise, attacking with a sharpened shield is like making a shield bash attack (see individual shield entries in the PH). An enhancement bonus on a sharpened shield does not improve the effectiveness of shield bash made with it, but a sharpened shield can be made into a magic weapon in its own right. Most simple and martial weapons found in the PH are equally common in Middle Earth, with the exception of the punching dagger. The kukri of Middle Earth is a slimmer weapon used by the elves and made famous by Legolas. The only exotic weapons in the PH commonly found in Middle Earth are the bastard sword, dwarven waraxe, net, and whip. Orc-crafted weapons often include additional flourishes, most often spikes and barbs, on their weapons. For example, the greatsword wielded by Uruk-hai berserkers has a foot long double pointed horizontal spike at its ‘tip.’ These flourishes usually don’t change the statistics of the weapon in a meaningful way, the fell battleaxe and fell halberd being notable exceptions. The mountain trolls of Mordor commonly use Large mauls from the Complete Warrior. Armor of Middle Earth Armor Cost Armor Bonus Max. Dex Bonus Check Penalty Arcane Spell Failure Chance Speed (30 ft.) Speed (20 ft.) Weight1 Light Armor Cloth & leathers 12 gp +1 +10 0 0% 30 ft. 20 ft. 10 lb. Uruk-hai berserker 15 gp +1 +10 0 10% 30 ft. 20 ft. 8 lb. Reinforced leather 25 gp +3 +5 -1 15% 30 ft. 20 ft. 15 lb. Medium Armor Reinforced hide 30 gp +4 +3 -4 25% 20 ft. 15 ft. 30 lb. Plate & hide 100 gp +5 +1 -6 35% 20 ft. 15 ft. 35 lb. Leather plate & chain shirt 175 gp +5 +2 -4 25% 20 ft. 15 ft. 35 lb. Heavy Armor Dwarven leather plate mail 225 gp +6 +1 -7 40% 20 ft.2 15 ft. 2 50 lb. Reinforced scale mail, masterwork 400 gp +6 +1 -5 35% 20 ft. 2 15 ft. 2 35 lb. Elven laminated & mail 1,000 gp +7 +1 -6 35% 20 ft. 2 15 ft. 2 45 lb. Plate mail 1,000 gp +8 +0 -8 45% 20 ft. 2 15 ft. 2 60 lb. Elven plate & jazeraint 2,000 gp +9 +1 -6 35% 20 ft. 2 15 ft. 2 45 lb. 1 Weight figures are for armor sized to fit Medium characters. Armor fitted for Small characters weighs half as much, and armor fitted for Large characters weights twice as much. 2 When running in heavy armor, you move only triple your speed, not quadruple. Cloth & leathers: Not technically armor, but rather layers of cloth and soft leather that can come in innumerable styles. It does not include a helmet, but usually includes leather gloves and boots. Nevertheless, it provides a small amount of protection. This type of “armor” is popular with wizards, certain elven archers, and the less-armored Wild Men of Dunland. Due to its construction, it cannot be enchanted as regular armor is. Dwarven leather plate mail: This heavy armor is common to the dwarves and consists of an open-faced helmet, augmented mail hauberk, boiled leather pieces to further protect the arms and legs, all under and on top of mixed layers of cloth and leather, including leather gloves and boots. There is enough metal in the armor for it to be made of mithral and be treated as mithral armor. Elven laminated & mail: This armor was the height of elven technology in the Second Age. It consisted of a highly-shaped, open-faced helmet and a laminated cuirass over a double mail hauberk, all on top of mixed layers of silk and soft leather, including leather gloves and boots. Most sets of this armor were of masterwork quality. Elven plate & jazeraint: This armor is the height of elven technology in the Third Age, building upon the laminated and mail armor of an earlier age, and is worn by the elves of Lothlórien. It consists of a highly-shaped, open-faced helmet, ribbed plate cuirass over a leaf-shaped jazeraint (a type of scale mail) with additional metal pieces to further protect the arms and legs, all over mixed layers of silk and soft leather. Most sets of this armor were of masterwork quality. Leather plate & chain shirt: This armor was most common among the soldiers of Rohan (and was worn by Éowyn in the battle of Pelennor Fields). Though it differed slightly by clan, it generally consists of an open-faced helmet and a boiled leather cuirass over a mail hauberk, as well as leather gloves and boots. Plate & hide: In the Second Age, the orcs of Mordor wore a variety of armor, as they do today. In that age, much of the armor consisted of layers of animal hides, including gloves, with metal pauldrons, vambraces, plackarts, grieves, and sometimes bits of mail. The quality was often very poor. However, the orcs did pride themselves on their full helms designed to frighten their enemies. By the time of the Third Age, the orcs craftsmanship had improved to the point where they were able to craft lamellar armor of their own design. Plate mail: The precursor to plate armor, this armor was as protective but much heavier in that it combined various pieces of plate armor on top of a full suit of mail. It included an open-faced helmet, gauntlets or gloves, and boots. This armor was popular among the Númenóreans of the Second Age and is worn by the nobility of Rohan, such as by Théoden and Éomer. Reinforced hide: This armor is popular among many of the orc warg riders. It consists of a helmet made of bone (usually an animal skull) and a full set of hide armor studded with bits of bone, including a hide jerkin usually reinforced with the bones of a horse’s ribcage. It includes leather gloves. Reinforced leather: This armor is less a standard form of armor than a well thought out form of traveling armor. It was worn by Boromir during his time with the Fellowship of the Ring. His armor consisted of several layers of leather and cloth reinforced with boiled leather and around the arms, small amounts of mail. It included leather glove and boots, but not a helmet. Numerous variations of reinforced leather armor exist, however. Reinforced scale mail: Worn by the royal guard of Rohan, this masterwork armor combines a helmet with a sleeveless jazeraint hauberk of tightly-overlapping steel scales and a steel collar, vambraces, and pauldrons. The armor also included leather gloves and boots. It has only ever been crafted in masterwork form. Uruk-hai berserker: The Uruk-hai berserkers are well feared by all fighting men and women. Their armor, such as it is, includes a full metal helm, two spiked gauntlets (treat as normal spiked gauntlets in the PH), and grieves. Most other D&D armors are found in Middle Earth as well, including padded, leather (Rangers of Ithilien), studded leather, chain shirt, hide, scale mail, chainmail, breastplate (mountain trolls of Mordor), half-plate (Moria orc and Uruk-hai), and full plate (Gondor and the Nazgûl), as well as bone (Haradrim) and lamellar (Easterlings and Mordor orcs) armors from Oriental Adventures.
MerrikCale 06-09-07, 09:19 AM	very very nice
varyar 06-09-07, 09:35 AM	Shiny! (Now I want to use the elf weapons in my Deities and Demigods of the Realms netbook. Please, sir? :))
TomCosta 06-12-07, 02:49 PM	Thanks. Sure you can use it in a netbook.
varyar 06-12-07, 03:14 PM	Thanks. Sure you can use it in a netbook. Awesome, thanks. :)
Penknight 06-14-07, 04:19 AM	This is my current big project! Expect a thread on it sometime at the end of summer. Very thorough I am attempting to be! /yodanessBest of luck, and keep me apprised! :)