Healing in a Grapple [Archive] - Wizards Community

Healing in a Grapple [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Odette
08-29-07, 11:39 PM I am currently playing a minotaur fighter, who loves to grapple. Unfortunately, I am not always prudent in choosing my grapple opponents and occasionally bite off more than I can chew.

The way my group views the rules on touch spells in a grapple, a touch attach has an equal chance of hitting anyone in the grapple and a percentage die needs to be rolled to determine who is healed. I would tend to view it differently for a healing spell. Especially when done by a cleric. The cleric is focusing the power of their deity into the healing. I would think if they touched an enemy, the healing wouldn't work.

Does anyone else play it a different way?
The WarOverlord
09-02-07, 07:42 AM I am currently playing a minotaur fighter, who loves to grapple. Unfortunately, I am not always prudent in choosing my grapple opponents and occasionally bite off more than I can chew.

The way my group views the rules on touch spells in a grapple, a touch attach has an equal chance of hitting anyone in the grapple and a percentage die needs to be rolled to determine who is healed. I would tend to view it differently for a healing spell. Especially when done by a cleric. The cleric is focusing the power of their deity into the healing. I would think if they touched an enemy, the healing wouldn't work.

Does anyone else play it a different way?

In the SSI PC Games I have accidently healed Enemies, Same is true of Neverwinter Nights PC game so...Yeah, you can accidently heal an enemy

The Spell is granted to the Cleric during the Praying Session for the Spell and the Cleric himself/Herself can even convert availible spells within the Being that was granted into Healing Energy so there is no Direct intervention during the Healing Process and godlings and their minions have better things to do then monitor Clerics and their potential "oopies" with the spell granted to them.

I mean it takes a special person of the Faith to be granted the spell of 3rd level or higher while 1st and 2nd level spells actually seem to come from a mixture of understanding the faith and the Clerics own "divine Spark" (Clerics can sometimes cast 1st and 2nd level spells with no Patron god approval much like a "Mystic" though Mystics can "grant themselves up to 7th Level Spells from their own "divine Spark" while Classical Clerics require a Minion for 3rd through 4th, a demi-god/High level minion for 5th level Spells, a lower level god/really High level minion for 6th level spells and a Greater God to grant 7th level spells )

Oh and the gods and minions may not even consciously "grant" the spell much like Cryic had no control in inadvertently granting spells to Followers of Bane and Such that opposed him as their new god.
godbeepit
09-09-07, 01:18 AM I was always under the impression that only ranged attacks held the possibility for accidentally striking the wrong creature. But then, they are the infamous grapple rules and I would not swear to anything without reading through the entire section about 12 dozen times in the last hour before coming to any conclusions.
Borris
09-09-07, 04:47 AM godbeepit is right. Only ranged attacks have a chance of hitting the wrong target in a grapple. Melee attacks still work normally (though the defender loses his Dex bonus to AC). Since cure spells are melee touch attacks, there's no risk of healing the wrong target.
Wenin
09-09-07, 12:20 PM I wouldn't even consider a cure spell a melee touch "attack", unless the cleric casting was attempting to "attack" something. Since a cleric doesn't have to roll to hit for doing a cure on a friendly target, there is no chance to miss.

I'm wondering if your group has a problem with you grappling everything, hence their advesarial ruling.
godbeepit
09-09-07, 10:24 PM Well, technically, you would have to make a touch attack if you were using it against undead. The only reason you dont have to roll to hit to heal a party member is because he is willing and won't try to avoid your hand. In a grapple, it is entirely possible the opponent would spellcraft it and realize you are attempting to cure him, and attempt to pull him out of your reach.
MarkHall
09-10-07, 04:20 AM Or position himself so you'd hit him because, hey, free healing.
Suin Bahhar
09-10-07, 07:20 AM Great roleplay ideas, but mechanicly unsupported. Houserule it to require the cleric to join the grapple momentarily and roll an opposed grapplecheck with the enemy grappler? If enemy wins he'll get healed?
Bit broken but it'll do in my campaign ^^
MarkusTay63
09-11-07, 01:16 PM Everyone knows Grapple is only useful if you are in love with a Troll. :P

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Odette 08-29-07, 11:39 PM	I am currently playing a minotaur fighter, who loves to grapple. Unfortunately, I am not always prudent in choosing my grapple opponents and occasionally bite off more than I can chew. The way my group views the rules on touch spells in a grapple, a touch attach has an equal chance of hitting anyone in the grapple and a percentage die needs to be rolled to determine who is healed. I would tend to view it differently for a healing spell. Especially when done by a cleric. The cleric is focusing the power of their deity into the healing. I would think if they touched an enemy, the healing wouldn't work. Does anyone else play it a different way?
The WarOverlord 09-02-07, 07:42 AM	I am currently playing a minotaur fighter, who loves to grapple. Unfortunately, I am not always prudent in choosing my grapple opponents and occasionally bite off more than I can chew. The way my group views the rules on touch spells in a grapple, a touch attach has an equal chance of hitting anyone in the grapple and a percentage die needs to be rolled to determine who is healed. I would tend to view it differently for a healing spell. Especially when done by a cleric. The cleric is focusing the power of their deity into the healing. I would think if they touched an enemy, the healing wouldn't work. Does anyone else play it a different way? In the SSI PC Games I have accidently healed Enemies, Same is true of Neverwinter Nights PC game so...Yeah, you can accidently heal an enemy The Spell is granted to the Cleric during the Praying Session for the Spell and the Cleric himself/Herself can even convert availible spells within the Being that was granted into Healing Energy so there is no Direct intervention during the Healing Process and godlings and their minions have better things to do then monitor Clerics and their potential "oopies" with the spell granted to them. I mean it takes a special person of the Faith to be granted the spell of 3rd level or higher while 1st and 2nd level spells actually seem to come from a mixture of understanding the faith and the Clerics own "divine Spark" (Clerics can sometimes cast 1st and 2nd level spells with no Patron god approval much like a "Mystic" though Mystics can "grant themselves up to 7th Level Spells from their own "divine Spark" while Classical Clerics require a Minion for 3rd through 4th, a demi-god/High level minion for 5th level Spells, a lower level god/really High level minion for 6th level spells and a Greater God to grant 7th level spells ) Oh and the gods and minions may not even consciously "grant" the spell much like Cryic had no control in inadvertently granting spells to Followers of Bane and Such that opposed him as their new god.
godbeepit 09-09-07, 01:18 AM	I was always under the impression that only ranged attacks held the possibility for accidentally striking the wrong creature. But then, they are the infamous grapple rules and I would not swear to anything without reading through the entire section about 12 dozen times in the last hour before coming to any conclusions.
Borris 09-09-07, 04:47 AM	godbeepit is right. Only ranged attacks have a chance of hitting the wrong target in a grapple. Melee attacks still work normally (though the defender loses his Dex bonus to AC). Since cure spells are melee touch attacks, there's no risk of healing the wrong target.
Wenin 09-09-07, 12:20 PM	I wouldn't even consider a cure spell a melee touch "attack", unless the cleric casting was attempting to "attack" something. Since a cleric doesn't have to roll to hit for doing a cure on a friendly target, there is no chance to miss. I'm wondering if your group has a problem with you grappling everything, hence their advesarial ruling.
godbeepit 09-09-07, 10:24 PM	Well, technically, you would have to make a touch attack if you were using it against undead. The only reason you dont have to roll to hit to heal a party member is because he is willing and won't try to avoid your hand. In a grapple, it is entirely possible the opponent would spellcraft it and realize you are attempting to cure him, and attempt to pull him out of your reach.
MarkHall 09-10-07, 04:20 AM	Or position himself so you'd hit him because, hey, free healing.
Suin Bahhar 09-10-07, 07:20 AM	Great roleplay ideas, but mechanicly unsupported. Houserule it to require the cleric to join the grapple momentarily and roll an opposed grapplecheck with the enemy grappler? If enemy wins he'll get healed? Bit broken but it'll do in my campaign ^^
MarkusTay63 09-11-07, 01:16 PM	Everyone knows Grapple is only useful if you are in love with a Troll. :P