Am I reading this right? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Am I reading this right? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Dargoth
07-25-03, 03:26 AM 1) In order to create a Holy/Unholy item a character must be able to cast Holy smite/Unholy Blight

2) Holy smite/Unholy blight are 4th level Domain spells for Good/Evil ONLY ie they are not regular cleric spells

There fore a weapon with the Holy/Unholy ability can only be created by a 7+ level Cleric with the Good/Evil Domain.

If this is true am I the only one who find this just a bit restrictive?

This would mean that a 20th level Cleric of Tyr with the Law and war domains could not create a Holy weapon....

It would even mean Fzoul the chosen of Bane is unable to create an Unholy weapon!! (Fzouls domains are Tyranny and Hatred)
Cthulhu
07-25-03, 04:16 AM So house rule it for god's sake! Its just a spell so its possible for a cleric to make a standard list version perhaps a level higher.
Another Gnome
07-25-03, 04:29 AM Well, more reason for clerics to actually take alignment domains then.

At any rate, spells can come from outside sources, so you can get any cleric with the domain spell to cast it for you. If there's shortage of 7th-level clerics, a lower-level one can still cast the spell from a scroll. And if all else fails, summon an outsider to cast the spell for you. Or even contact your local god for a bit of assistance.

* * *

Divining pool: *ring, ring*
Bane's secretary: Bane's office. How may I help you?
Fzoul: Hello, Fzoul here. Is Lord Bane around?
Bane's secretary: I'm sorry, Mr. Bane is currently in a meeting. He should be back soon, though. Will you hold?
Fzoul: Well, it's not that urgent. But could you take a message?
Bane's secretary: Of course.
Fzoul: Okay. Uh, would you tell him that I need someone to cast unholy blight for this weapon I've been working on. So, if he could point me to the right direction so as to find the nearest cleric with access to the spell. Or if he can just send someone over, it'd be swell.
Bane's secretary: Excuse me, hold on for a sec. Mr. Bane just arrived.
Background voices: Sir, Mr. Fzoul is on line one, trying to reach you. Shall I put him through?
Background voices: Fzoul? Oh sure, put him through.
Bane's secretary: Mr. Fzoul? Please wait.
Bane: Bane here. Wassup?
Fzoul: Greetings, my Lord. I...
Bane: Ah, drop the formalities, man. It's not like anyone's eavesrdopping on this.
Fzoul: Righty. How's the family?
Bane: Well, Xvim's still dead as far as I know. Didn't stop me, though.
Fzoul: That's nice to hear. Anyway, I have this little issue with spellcasting I...
Background voices: Excuse me, Sir, here's Mr. Fzoul's message.
Background voices: Fine.
Bane: Okay, let's see... trouble with domain spells, eh?
Fzoul: Yeah, those silly rules and stuff.
Bane: Well, I have a few other things to take care of at the moment, so whaddya say I'll just whip up this weapon and ask my secretary to drop it over to your place? There, done. You can thank me later.
Background voices: You called, Sir?
Background voices: Have this weapon taken to Fzoul. The paperwork is already done.
Background voices: Very good, Sir. Anything else?
Background voices: Not at the moment. Dismissed.
Bane: Righty, that's taken care of. Hey, I gotta go now, but we'll be in touch, okay?
Fzoul: Yeah, I'll call you when we're planning our next fishing trip. Thanks, man.
Bane: No prob.
Divining pool: *click*
Dargoth
07-25-03, 04:38 AM Originally posted by Cthulhu
So house rule it for god's sake! Its just a spell so its possible for a cleric to make a standard list version perhaps a level higher.

actually I wanted to know if its really meant to be that way after all Unholy Aura/Holy Aura and Unhallow/Halow arent Domain only spells.

Why isnt Holy smite/Unholy blight in the same boat as Holy aura/Unholy aura where the spell is both a Domain spell and cleric spell of the same level?

Come to think of it

Chaos Hammer, Unholy blight, Holy smite and orders wrath may be the only Domain only spells in the players handbook

I surely cant be the first person to notice this
Cthulhu
07-25-03, 04:50 AM Nah! I noted it the first time I stocked up on Order's Wrath spells for my cleric (we were fighting champions of chaos), and at the end of the night I noticed that it was domain only. Kinda sucked.
Cthulhu
07-25-03, 04:53 AM Another Gnome...

That was hysterical!:D
Dargoth
07-25-03, 04:55 AM Originally posted by Cthulhu
Nah! I noted it the first time I stocked up on Order's Wrath spells for my cleric (we were fighting champions of chaos), and at the end of the night I noticed that it was domain only. Kinda sucked.

yeah it strikes me as a very strange and unnessary restriction
Dargoth
07-25-03, 05:28 AM SPeaking of Clerics

What happpans to a clerics domain spells if they take PrC that has Spells per Da: +1 level of existing class?

For example if a Cleric takes the Law and Evil domains at first level and then takes a PRc for his 7th level (Thus being a Cleric 6 / PrC 1)

Does the Cleric get Orders wrath/Unholy Blight as his 4th level Domain spells?
Darkmore
07-25-03, 05:45 AM Originally posted by Another Gnome
Fzoul: Righty. How's the family?
Bane: Well, Xvim's still dead as far as I know. Didn't stop me, though.
:rofl:
I just looove this part !
Savras
07-25-03, 08:02 AM Another Gnome, please leave alias and temple name for the adolation of the masses.

That was just hilarious!!!

Savras
Dargoth
07-25-03, 08:08 AM Originally posted by Dargoth
SPeaking of Clerics

What happpans to a clerics domain spells if they take PrC that has Spells per Da: +1 level of existing class?

For example if a Cleric takes the Law and Evil domains at first level and then takes a PRc for his 7th level (Thus being a Cleric 6 / PrC 1)

Does the Cleric get Orders wrath/Unholy Blight as his 4th level Domain spells?

One of you guys know the answer to this?
Savras
07-25-03, 08:34 AM Yes, Dargoth.

He casts spells as a Clr 7, he gains a domain spell of the 4th level.

If the domain power depends on "clr level" then it won't rise during the PrC, though.

Savras
Dargoth
07-25-03, 08:45 AM Originally posted by Savras
Yes, Dargoth.

He casts spells as a Clr 7, he gains a domain spell of the 4th level.

If the domain power depends on "clr level" then it won't rise during the PrC, though.

Savras

hmm ok

What do you think of Holy Smite/Unholy blight being a Domain only spell
Savras
07-25-03, 08:53 AM Well, Holy Smit\Unholy Blight\Order's Wrath\Chaos Hammer aren't great enough for me to go "Drat, I wanted those!" and are more-or-less the only reason to go Good, Evil, Law, Chaos.

In other words- these domains need that boost.

Savras
cwslyclgh
07-25-03, 03:27 PM I agree that they should stay domain only.... however note that wizard/sorcerers over 13th level and clerics over 17th level can make any holy/unholy/axiomatic/anarchic weapon through use of limited wish or miracle to simulate the needed spells (although clerics are still some what restricted by no opposite alignment.)
The Thayan Menace
07-25-03, 03:46 PM Wizards do not suffer from the inability to use spells that are diametrically opposed to their ethos.

Therefore:

A cleric with the Magic domain could use an arcane scroll of limited wish or wish to bypass his/her alignment restrictions when it comes to creating alignment-based items.
Green Giant
07-25-03, 04:39 PM Another problem with the holy smite\unholy blight\order's wrath\chaos hammer is finding a scroll with those spells. Does the cleric need those domains in order to cast the spells or can he/she automatically cast them?
Cthulhu
07-25-03, 04:44 PM Since those spells are not on a clerics list if he lacks the appropriate domain they become spells he is unable to use in scroll form.
primemover003
07-25-03, 04:56 PM There's nothing wrong with this restriction if you look at how many gods have good or evil as domains. It's really a question of which domains you choose. Someone who wants to really fight evil will take the good domain, and vice versa.
Dargoth
07-25-03, 08:03 PM Originally posted by cwslyclgh
I agree that they should stay domain only.... however note that wizard/sorcerers over 13th level and clerics over 17th level can make any holy/unholy/axiomatic/anarchic weapon through use of limited wish or miracle to simulate the needed spells (although clerics are still some what restricted by no opposite alignment.)

Then why arent Dispel Good/Dispel Law/Dispel Evil/Dispel Chaos, Blasphemy/Word of Chaos/Holy word/Dictum and Unholy aura/Cloak of Chaos/Holy aura/Shield of law Domain only spells?
cwslyclgh
07-25-03, 08:19 PM becuase all clerics should beable to sue them... whre as the direct attacks against any creature of neutral or opposite alignment are perks for taking the domain... if put all the domain spells into the general spell list there is no reason to take the alignment domains.
Green Giant
07-25-03, 08:32 PM Looks like if any cleric wants to cast holy smite\unholy blight\order's wrath\chaos hammer from a scroll he/she should take ranks in UMD.:(
Dargoth
07-25-03, 09:50 PM Originally posted by cwslyclgh
becuase all clerics should beable to sue them... whre as the direct attacks against any creature of neutral or opposite alignment are perks for taking the domain... if put all the domain spells into the general spell list there is no reason to take the alignment domains.

Tehn the obvious solution is to redo the spell list

For example make Holy smite/Unholy Blight a 3rd level domain spell. This would make the Alignment domains more attractive as they get access to spells sooner than a cleric who doesnt have an Alignment domain.
FineasBoggs
07-26-03, 08:15 PM Well you sholdn't be able to make EVERYTHING. D&D isn't like UO. ;)
GoodOlWillickers
07-26-03, 11:10 PM Originally posted by Another Gnome
Divining pool: *ring, ring*
Bane's secretary: Bane's office. How may I help you?
Fzoul: Hello, Fzoul here. Is Lord Bane around?
Bane's secretary: I'm sorry, Mr. Bane is currently in a meeting. He should be back soon, though. Will you hold?
Fzoul: Well, it's not that urgent. But could you take a message?
Bane's secretary: Of course.
Fzoul: Okay. Uh, would you tell him that I need someone to cast unholy blight for this weapon I've been working on. So, if he could point me to the right direction so as to find the nearest cleric with access to the spell. Or if he can just send someone over, it'd be swell.
Bane's secretary: Excuse me, hold on for a sec. Mr. Bane just arrived.
Background voices: Sir, Mr. Fzoul is on line one, trying to reach you. Shall I put him through?
Background voices: Fzoul? Oh sure, put him through.
Bane's secretary: Mr. Fzoul? Please wait.
Bane: Bane here. Wassup?
Fzoul: Greetings, my Lord. I...
Bane: Ah, drop the formalities, man. It's not like anyone's eavesrdopping on this.
Fzoul: Righty. How's the family?
Bane: Well, Xvim's still dead as far as I know. Didn't stop me, though.
Fzoul: That's nice to hear. Anyway, I have this little issue with spellcasting I...
Background voices: Excuse me, Sir, here's Mr. Fzoul's message.
Background voices: Fine.
Bane: Okay, let's see... trouble with domain spells, eh?
Fzoul: Yeah, those silly rules and stuff.
Bane: Well, I have a few other things to take care of at the moment, so whaddya say I'll just whip up this weapon and ask my secretary to drop it over to your place? There, done. You can thank me later.
Background voices: You called, Sir?
Background voices: Have this weapon taken to Fzoul. The paperwork is already done.
Background voices: Very good, Sir. Anything else?
Background voices: Not at the moment. Dismissed.
Bane: Righty, that's taken care of. Hey, I gotta go now, but we'll be in touch, okay?
Fzoul: Yeah, I'll call you when we're planning our next fishing trip. Thanks, man.
Bane: No prob.
Divining pool: *click*

:rofl:
Dargoth
07-26-03, 11:21 PM Originally posted by FineasBoggs
Well you sholdn't be able to make EVERYTHING. D&D isn't like UO. ;)

I think limiting a spell to domain only is to restrictive
Cthulhu
07-27-03, 12:12 AM I agree with Dargoth. So just adjust the domain spell a level or two up and it makes a great standard cleric spell.
Enriqe
07-27-03, 12:52 AM Another Gnome

that was brilliant i olmost died that was so funny:)
Dargoth
07-27-03, 01:11 AM Originally posted by Cthulhu
I agree with Dargoth. So just adjust the domain spell a level or two up and it makes a great standard cleric spell.

Ill probably house rules it

There should be some sort of restriction

It needs something so Good clerics cant cast Unholy blight etc
cwslyclgh
07-27-03, 01:48 AM There should be some sort of restriction

It needs something so Good clerics cant cast Unholy blight etc

there already is it is called the [Evil] discriptor.
Sarelle
07-27-03, 07:20 AM Bane has a secretary?

Great fun Another Gnome! Loved the "about the family" bit.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Dargoth 07-25-03, 03:26 AM	1) In order to create a Holy/Unholy item a character must be able to cast Holy smite/Unholy Blight 2) Holy smite/Unholy blight are 4th level Domain spells for Good/Evil ONLY ie they are not regular cleric spells There fore a weapon with the Holy/Unholy ability can only be created by a 7+ level Cleric with the Good/Evil Domain. If this is true am I the only one who find this just a bit restrictive? This would mean that a 20th level Cleric of Tyr with the Law and war domains could not create a Holy weapon.... It would even mean Fzoul the chosen of Bane is unable to create an Unholy weapon!! (Fzouls domains are Tyranny and Hatred)
Cthulhu 07-25-03, 04:16 AM	So house rule it for god's sake! Its just a spell so its possible for a cleric to make a standard list version perhaps a level higher.
Another Gnome 07-25-03, 04:29 AM	Well, more reason for clerics to actually take alignment domains then. At any rate, spells can come from outside sources, so you can get any cleric with the domain spell to cast it for you. If there's shortage of 7th-level clerics, a lower-level one can still cast the spell from a scroll. And if all else fails, summon an outsider to cast the spell for you. Or even contact your local god for a bit of assistance. * * * Divining pool: ring, ring Bane's secretary: Bane's office. How may I help you? Fzoul: Hello, Fzoul here. Is Lord Bane around? Bane's secretary: I'm sorry, Mr. Bane is currently in a meeting. He should be back soon, though. Will you hold? Fzoul: Well, it's not that urgent. But could you take a message? Bane's secretary: Of course. Fzoul: Okay. Uh, would you tell him that I need someone to cast unholy blight for this weapon I've been working on. So, if he could point me to the right direction so as to find the nearest cleric with access to the spell. Or if he can just send someone over, it'd be swell. Bane's secretary: Excuse me, hold on for a sec. Mr. Bane just arrived. Background voices: Sir, Mr. Fzoul is on line one, trying to reach you. Shall I put him through? Background voices: Fzoul? Oh sure, put him through. Bane's secretary: Mr. Fzoul? Please wait. Bane: Bane here. Wassup? Fzoul: Greetings, my Lord. I... Bane: Ah, drop the formalities, man. It's not like anyone's eavesrdopping on this. Fzoul: Righty. How's the family? Bane: Well, Xvim's still dead as far as I know. Didn't stop me, though. Fzoul: That's nice to hear. Anyway, I have this little issue with spellcasting I... Background voices: Excuse me, Sir, here's Mr. Fzoul's message. Background voices: Fine. Bane: Okay, let's see... trouble with domain spells, eh? Fzoul: Yeah, those silly rules and stuff. Bane: Well, I have a few other things to take care of at the moment, so whaddya say I'll just whip up this weapon and ask my secretary to drop it over to your place? There, done. You can thank me later. Background voices: You called, Sir? Background voices: Have this weapon taken to Fzoul. The paperwork is already done. Background voices: Very good, Sir. Anything else? Background voices: Not at the moment. Dismissed. Bane: Righty, that's taken care of. Hey, I gotta go now, but we'll be in touch, okay? Fzoul: Yeah, I'll call you when we're planning our next fishing trip. Thanks, man. Bane: No prob. Divining pool: click
Dargoth 07-25-03, 04:38 AM	Originally posted by Cthulhu So house rule it for god's sake! Its just a spell so its possible for a cleric to make a standard list version perhaps a level higher. actually I wanted to know if its really meant to be that way after all Unholy Aura/Holy Aura and Unhallow/Halow arent Domain only spells. Why isnt Holy smite/Unholy blight in the same boat as Holy aura/Unholy aura where the spell is both a Domain spell and cleric spell of the same level? Come to think of it Chaos Hammer, Unholy blight, Holy smite and orders wrath may be the only Domain only spells in the players handbook I surely cant be the first person to notice this
Cthulhu 07-25-03, 04:50 AM	Nah! I noted it the first time I stocked up on Order's Wrath spells for my cleric (we were fighting champions of chaos), and at the end of the night I noticed that it was domain only. Kinda sucked.
Cthulhu 07-25-03, 04:53 AM	Another Gnome... That was hysterical!:D
Dargoth 07-25-03, 04:55 AM	Originally posted by Cthulhu Nah! I noted it the first time I stocked up on Order's Wrath spells for my cleric (we were fighting champions of chaos), and at the end of the night I noticed that it was domain only. Kinda sucked. yeah it strikes me as a very strange and unnessary restriction
Dargoth 07-25-03, 05:28 AM	SPeaking of Clerics What happpans to a clerics domain spells if they take PrC that has Spells per Da: +1 level of existing class? For example if a Cleric takes the Law and Evil domains at first level and then takes a PRc for his 7th level (Thus being a Cleric 6 / PrC 1) Does the Cleric get Orders wrath/Unholy Blight as his 4th level Domain spells?
Darkmore 07-25-03, 05:45 AM	Originally posted by Another Gnome Fzoul: Righty. How's the family? Bane: Well, Xvim's still dead as far as I know. Didn't stop me, though. :rofl: I just looove this part !
Savras 07-25-03, 08:02 AM	Another Gnome, please leave alias and temple name for the adolation of the masses. That was just hilarious!!! Savras
Dargoth 07-25-03, 08:08 AM	Originally posted by Dargoth SPeaking of Clerics What happpans to a clerics domain spells if they take PrC that has Spells per Da: +1 level of existing class? For example if a Cleric takes the Law and Evil domains at first level and then takes a PRc for his 7th level (Thus being a Cleric 6 / PrC 1) Does the Cleric get Orders wrath/Unholy Blight as his 4th level Domain spells? One of you guys know the answer to this?
Savras 07-25-03, 08:34 AM	Yes, Dargoth. He casts spells as a Clr 7, he gains a domain spell of the 4th level. If the domain power depends on "clr level" then it won't rise during the PrC, though. Savras
Dargoth 07-25-03, 08:45 AM	Originally posted by Savras Yes, Dargoth. He casts spells as a Clr 7, he gains a domain spell of the 4th level. If the domain power depends on "clr level" then it won't rise during the PrC, though. Savras hmm ok What do you think of Holy Smite/Unholy blight being a Domain only spell
Savras 07-25-03, 08:53 AM	Well, Holy Smit\Unholy Blight\Order's Wrath\Chaos Hammer aren't great enough for me to go "Drat, I wanted those!" and are more-or-less the only reason to go Good, Evil, Law, Chaos. In other words- these domains need that boost. Savras
cwslyclgh 07-25-03, 03:27 PM	I agree that they should stay domain only.... however note that wizard/sorcerers over 13th level and clerics over 17th level can make any holy/unholy/axiomatic/anarchic weapon through use of limited wish or miracle to simulate the needed spells (although clerics are still some what restricted by no opposite alignment.)
The Thayan Menace 07-25-03, 03:46 PM	Wizards do not suffer from the inability to use spells that are diametrically opposed to their ethos. Therefore: A cleric with the Magic domain could use an arcane scroll of limited wish or wish to bypass his/her alignment restrictions when it comes to creating alignment-based items.
Green Giant 07-25-03, 04:39 PM	Another problem with the holy smite\unholy blight\order's wrath\chaos hammer is finding a scroll with those spells. Does the cleric need those domains in order to cast the spells or can he/she automatically cast them?
Cthulhu 07-25-03, 04:44 PM	Since those spells are not on a clerics list if he lacks the appropriate domain they become spells he is unable to use in scroll form.
primemover003 07-25-03, 04:56 PM	There's nothing wrong with this restriction if you look at how many gods have good or evil as domains. It's really a question of which domains you choose. Someone who wants to really fight evil will take the good domain, and vice versa.
Dargoth 07-25-03, 08:03 PM	Originally posted by cwslyclgh I agree that they should stay domain only.... however note that wizard/sorcerers over 13th level and clerics over 17th level can make any holy/unholy/axiomatic/anarchic weapon through use of limited wish or miracle to simulate the needed spells (although clerics are still some what restricted by no opposite alignment.) Then why arent Dispel Good/Dispel Law/Dispel Evil/Dispel Chaos, Blasphemy/Word of Chaos/Holy word/Dictum and Unholy aura/Cloak of Chaos/Holy aura/Shield of law Domain only spells?
cwslyclgh 07-25-03, 08:19 PM	becuase all clerics should beable to sue them... whre as the direct attacks against any creature of neutral or opposite alignment are perks for taking the domain... if put all the domain spells into the general spell list there is no reason to take the alignment domains.
Green Giant 07-25-03, 08:32 PM	Looks like if any cleric wants to cast holy smite\unholy blight\order's wrath\chaos hammer from a scroll he/she should take ranks in UMD.:(
Dargoth 07-25-03, 09:50 PM	Originally posted by cwslyclgh becuase all clerics should beable to sue them... whre as the direct attacks against any creature of neutral or opposite alignment are perks for taking the domain... if put all the domain spells into the general spell list there is no reason to take the alignment domains. Tehn the obvious solution is to redo the spell list For example make Holy smite/Unholy Blight a 3rd level domain spell. This would make the Alignment domains more attractive as they get access to spells sooner than a cleric who doesnt have an Alignment domain.
FineasBoggs 07-26-03, 08:15 PM	Well you sholdn't be able to make EVERYTHING. D&D isn't like UO. ;)
GoodOlWillickers 07-26-03, 11:10 PM	Originally posted by Another Gnome Divining pool: ring, ring Bane's secretary: Bane's office. How may I help you? Fzoul: Hello, Fzoul here. Is Lord Bane around? Bane's secretary: I'm sorry, Mr. Bane is currently in a meeting. He should be back soon, though. Will you hold? Fzoul: Well, it's not that urgent. But could you take a message? Bane's secretary: Of course. Fzoul: Okay. Uh, would you tell him that I need someone to cast unholy blight for this weapon I've been working on. So, if he could point me to the right direction so as to find the nearest cleric with access to the spell. Or if he can just send someone over, it'd be swell. Bane's secretary: Excuse me, hold on for a sec. Mr. Bane just arrived. Background voices: Sir, Mr. Fzoul is on line one, trying to reach you. Shall I put him through? Background voices: Fzoul? Oh sure, put him through. Bane's secretary: Mr. Fzoul? Please wait. Bane: Bane here. Wassup? Fzoul: Greetings, my Lord. I... Bane: Ah, drop the formalities, man. It's not like anyone's eavesrdopping on this. Fzoul: Righty. How's the family? Bane: Well, Xvim's still dead as far as I know. Didn't stop me, though. Fzoul: That's nice to hear. Anyway, I have this little issue with spellcasting I... Background voices: Excuse me, Sir, here's Mr. Fzoul's message. Background voices: Fine. Bane: Okay, let's see... trouble with domain spells, eh? Fzoul: Yeah, those silly rules and stuff. Bane: Well, I have a few other things to take care of at the moment, so whaddya say I'll just whip up this weapon and ask my secretary to drop it over to your place? There, done. You can thank me later. Background voices: You called, Sir? Background voices: Have this weapon taken to Fzoul. The paperwork is already done. Background voices: Very good, Sir. Anything else? Background voices: Not at the moment. Dismissed. Bane: Righty, that's taken care of. Hey, I gotta go now, but we'll be in touch, okay? Fzoul: Yeah, I'll call you when we're planning our next fishing trip. Thanks, man. Bane: No prob. Divining pool: click :rofl:
Dargoth 07-26-03, 11:21 PM	Originally posted by FineasBoggs Well you sholdn't be able to make EVERYTHING. D&D isn't like UO. ;) I think limiting a spell to domain only is to restrictive
Cthulhu 07-27-03, 12:12 AM	I agree with Dargoth. So just adjust the domain spell a level or two up and it makes a great standard cleric spell.
Enriqe 07-27-03, 12:52 AM	Another Gnome that was brilliant i olmost died that was so funny:)
Dargoth 07-27-03, 01:11 AM	Originally posted by Cthulhu I agree with Dargoth. So just adjust the domain spell a level or two up and it makes a great standard cleric spell. Ill probably house rules it There should be some sort of restriction It needs something so Good clerics cant cast Unholy blight etc
cwslyclgh 07-27-03, 01:48 AM	There should be some sort of restriction It needs something so Good clerics cant cast Unholy blight etc there already is it is called the [Evil] discriptor.
Sarelle 07-27-03, 07:20 AM	Bane has a secretary? Great fun Another Gnome! Loved the "about the family" bit.