Post/Author/DateTime	Post
18DELTA 10-15-07, 01:39 PM	Bruce Cordell said this today (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?p=14082651#post14082651) on his blog. Well Waterdeep may just be a ruin in my game, while Mystra lives.:P Bruce Cordell must be stopped!!!:rant: :banghead: :uh-huh: :bored:
Keahi19 10-15-07, 03:01 PM	Yeah I read that too and am very happy. Though destroying Waterdeep in your game makes me a little. MMM what's the word. Filled with rage. Yes that's it. Rage
18DELTA 10-15-07, 04:21 PM	Yeah I read that too and am very happy. Though destroying Waterdeep in your game makes me a little. MMM what's the word. Filled with rage. Yes that's it. Rage I sense great anger in you grasshopper!;) :P MarkusTay63 must be stopped!!!!!!!;) :P :D :rant: :banghead: :nonono: :uh-huh: :bored: :ahem:
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin 10-16-07, 10:03 PM	There they go again with their "beloved areas of the Realms" talking point.
18DELTA 10-16-07, 10:11 PM	There they go again with their "beloved areas of the Realms" talking point. True. Me I prefer "Shining South" myself. Points of lightish, no uber npcs for the players to try(key word try) and kill.:rolleyes: Yet I also like "Silver Marches" too. I just wonder what they will look like in 4E? :D OR :(
SgtAnjay 10-17-07, 01:58 AM	We've got an awesome story to tell. A story that takes place in a world that contains thousands of players and readers. People care what happens within FR's borders because they have a lot invested in the campaign.Umm....I'm all for good story, but is it too much to ask to ease up on the kill/destroy/erase/eliminate? There's a difference between a "big" story and a "good" story.
Charles Phipps 10-17-07, 02:10 AM	So, you're now mad about Waterdeep NOT being destroyed? Okay, officially people are just :censored: just to :censored:
18DELTA 10-17-07, 02:11 AM	Umm....I'm all for good story, but is it too much to ask to ease up on the kill/destroy/erase/eliminate? There's a difference between a "big" story and a "good" story. Didnt you know that the big stories are like WWE pay per views. ;) Its Mystra and Cyric vs Stone Cold Steve Austin in "The Condemed!!!":P
Charles Phipps 10-17-07, 02:21 AM	There's a law that any Gamer conversation, if it lasts long enough, will turn to Monty Python and the Holy Grail. Gamers: We have found a witch! (A witch! a witch!) Burn her burn her! Me: How do you known she is a witch? Gamers: Because she supports 4E Realms! Witch: But but....I was saying the Dales WOULD be around! Gamers: BURN HER ANYWAY!
SgtAnjay 10-17-07, 02:45 AM	There's a law that any Gamer conversation, if it lasts long enough, will turn to Monty Python and the Holy Grail. Gamers: We have found a witch! (A witch! a witch!) Burn her burn her! Me: How do you known she is a witch? Gamers: Because she supports 4E Realms! Witch: But but....I was saying the Dales WOULD be around! Gamers: BURN HER ANYWAY! :rolleye2: Ok, so Waterdeep's around. Nice and all, but that doesn't un-destroy all the things they've already stated as being destroyed. Its not that Waterdeep being around is a bad thing, and its good to be able to eliminate that bit of speculation related to the Orc King prelude. :thumbsup: But the fact remains that their story so far hinges on destruction. By the way, nice attempt to humorously paint your opposition as mindless peasants devoid of rational thinking. Or perhaps you resorted to that because you were incapable of understanding what was being gotten at?
Charles Phipps 10-17-07, 03:06 AM	By the way, nice attempt to humorously paint your opposition as mindless peasants devoid of rational thinking. Or perhaps you resorted to that because you were incapable of understanding what was being gotten at? So you're Strawmaning something by accusing it of being a Strawman? Wow, nice job there. I'm saying that a thread of negativity about a reassurance something will remain is silly.
SgtAnjay 10-17-07, 03:17 AM	So you're Strawmaning something by accusing it of being a Strawman? Wow, nice job there. I'm saying that a thread of negativity about a reassurance something will remain is silly. No, I'm calling you out on your actions, then adding in a riposte. This isn't a thread of negativity. Sorry, but the oh-so-popular "You're being negative. I win!" argument is rather lacking in substance. Once again, I will try to get across the point: the "reassurance", while nice as far as it goes, does nothing to alleviate any of the real things that have many reticent and downright woefull about the upcomming changes.
Uzzy 10-17-07, 06:06 AM	Yay for no destruction of Waterdeep. I'm interested in how they will deal with the Melairshield, given the whole destruction of Mystra and the Weave. Boo for the 'beloved, well-trodden areas of Faerūn' bit. Who decided which areas are beloved? And the lack of a date, again. Waterdeep may still be around, but if it's a hundred years in the future, we lose nearly all the NPC's there. And am I the only one who took the 'A story that takes place in a world that contains thousands of players and readers' to be referring to the Living Realms for 4th Edition?
Charles Phipps 10-17-07, 10:28 AM	No, I'm calling you out on your actions, then adding in a riposte. This isn't a thread of negativity. Sorry, but the oh-so-popular "You're being negative. I win!" argument is rather lacking in substance. Once again, I will try to get across the point: the "reassurance", while nice as far as it goes, does nothing to alleviate any of the real things that have many reticent and downright woefull about the upcomming changes. Perhaps for you, but I think it's important to recognize that they understand that the less developed regions of the Realms *ARE* the best places to do changes in because they're more likely to need to be updated in order to attract new customers and people. And you can say I'm being silly or not, but guess what. *I AM RELIEVED* to find Waterdeep is fine. With that, any concerns I have are gone.
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin 10-17-07, 12:35 PM	Waterdeep isn't the only place I'm concerned about, so no, I'm not going to jump for joy that it's "still around". It doesn't undo the other changes I know about that I dislike. And yes, the fact that something is "still around" doesn't tell us very much! It could be around, but different (for better or for worse). You have to read inbetween the lines here, pay attention to what is being said and NOT make assumptions.
Charles Phipps 10-17-07, 12:41 PM	That's my argument Nothing is destroyed, for all we know, until we find out it's destroyed. Until the timeline is out, we could find all the gods are still alive but now Archangel equivalents with Mystra resurrected.
18DELTA 10-17-07, 01:42 PM	Yay for no destruction of Waterdeep. I'm interested in how they will deal with the Melairshield, given the whole destruction of Mystra and the Weave. Boo for the 'beloved, well-trodden areas of Faerūn' bit. Who decided which areas are beloved? And the lack of a date, again. Waterdeep may still be around, but if it's a hundred years in the future, we lose nearly all the NPC's there. And am I the only one who took the 'A story that takes place in a world that contains thousands of players and readers' to be referring to the Living Realms for 4th Edition? I just realized why the Realms are getting hit with a big stick! This Living Realms crud! Plus the novels, plus they think Mystra sucks and Cyric is teh sex, Shar is teh sex. Its going to make the Realms accessible to all the former Living Greyhawk players!:raincloud :noway: :allalone: :nonono: :censored: Living Realms must be stopped!!!:P Just say no to a watered down campain setting that WotC wants for the masses! The realms were special, now the setting is so easy that everybody gets a ride! Sad WotC, sad!:(
Stigger 10-17-07, 03:51 PM	You don't have to obliterate Waterdeep off of the map in order to destroy it. Get rid of its spirit, what made Waterdeep Waterdeep as it were, and you destroy it just as effectively as by tossing a nuke on the city and watching it go boom... That started for me in 3.5 to be honest, when they started in with this whole overwhelming tide of evil, Waterdeep to hell in a handbasket crap... although I must admit I was getting a funny feeling about where the story was heading after they altered Xara Tantlor in Silver Marches and made her a minor villain... which may seem minor, but she was one of my campaigns rather major NPCs that was just tossed in some fit of pique because someone probably didn't feel like doing a write up of Faerie Dragons at the time, and so they just tossed out the whole Evil with Imp thing for want of a better idea...
MarkusTay63 10-17-07, 03:58 PM	I have been eagerly 'absorbing' every morsel and 4e tidbit they have been throwing our way, hoping to catch some glimpse of the future. The last two things we learned was that Waterdeep goes untouched, and Warforged will not make it into the Realms. The ONLY two changes I was looking forward to.... :noway: Guess THIS edition really isn't for me after all. :(
SgtAnjay 10-17-07, 09:12 PM	Perhaps for you, but I think it's important to recognize that they understand that the less developed regions of the Realms *ARE* the best places to do changes in because they're more likely to need to be updated in order to attract new customers and people.Ah Ah Ah. They never said "less developed", they said "less loved". Considering so many of the things they dislike (pantheon, NPCs, et all) are things I enjoy, I have a very good reason to be wary of this statement. And you can say I'm being silly or not, but guess what. *I AM RELIEVED* to find Waterdeep is fine. With that, any concerns I have are gone. I'm relieved Waterdeep is fine too. I've run many an adventure out of Waterdeep. But I have many more concerns with things they've confirmed are true; I have many more concerns, though less worrisome and more hopeful, about some of the things they've hinted about. I, therefore, remain very concerned. You being relieved does not force the "relieved" state upon the rest of us. That's my argument Nothing is destroyed, for all we know, until we find out it's destroyed. Until the timeline is out, we could find all the gods are still alive but now Archangel equivalents with Mystra resurrected. As for your assumptions....several of the things they've already stated they're doing make me unhappy, so even if they say "nothing else dies", which they haven't, I've plenty of cause for concern. Moreover, if I like the current pantheon, why do you think I would want the vast majority of it demoted to a bunch of of servitors to "real" deities? Especially since none of my favorites are Greater dieties. In addition.....if they ressurected Mystra, it will be in a completely different form; they've already stated they dont want Mystra as she's been from her inception.
MerrikCale 10-17-07, 10:49 PM	The last two things we learned was that Waterdeep goes untouched, and Warforged will not make it into the Realms. The ONLY two changes I was looking forward to.... :noway: Guess THIS edition really isn't for me after all. :( warforged...yuck
johnkretzer 10-18-07, 03:22 AM	I just realized why the Realms are getting hit with a big stick! This Living Realms crud! Plus the novels, plus they think Mystra sucks and Cyric is teh sex, Shar is teh sex. Its going to make the Realms accessible to all the former Living Greyhawk players!:raincloud :noway: :allalone: :nonono: :censored: Living Realms must be stopped!!!:P Just say no to a watered down campain setting that WotC wants for the masses! The realms were special, now the setting is so easy that everybody gets a ride! Sad WotC, sad!:( So the changes are so far for: 1) The authors of the Realms who have to write nothing but RSE and not be bothered with the lore and history of the world. 2) The RPGA crowd(I really want to know their numbers) so it has to be brought to as close as possible to base 4th edition D&D that it is a gneric setting. 3) Fans who have hated the Realms but for some reason getting them to start playing in the Realms is more important to them then keeping the older fans. Even though many of them still buy WotC campaign world of Eberron(I mean isn't it silly to compete with yourself?) So looks like we get a vague thing Waterdeep will still be their. But in what shape? Also what of Undermountain?(I didn't get the super adventure...I have extreme dislike for any module so if anybody has a spoiler?). My guess with how thing have gone...is that the evil merchants have taken the city killed all the old heroes and rule in tyrrantical fury over the city(though they worshipp Cyric and Shar, not Bane for some reason)....and THE CITY NEEDS NEW HEROES...and only the PCs can be heroes....:rolleyes: I would suggest stopping with these useless tidbits of infomation. If they are using them to test ideas for fan reactions then I just say present them as such....If they are just going for hype...they can really stop because I really haven't felt any excitement at any of the hype yet...I mean don't they have a advertisment department at Hasbro?
Stigger 10-18-07, 06:19 AM	I've felt excitement at some of the hype... unfortunately its the sort of excitement that stems from brushing off the old White Wolf books and figuring out how to rectify the Storyteller system with d20... not as hard as I thought it would be actually.
Alediran 10-18-07, 08:31 AM	I've felt excitement at some of the hype... unfortunately its the sort of excitement that stems from brushing off the old White Wolf books and figuring out how to rectify the Storyteller system with d20... not as hard as I thought it would be actually. Send me some notes, because since the announcement of 4ed FR I haven't touched a single of my D&D books and I concentrated of Mage: Ascension
Suin Bahhar 10-18-07, 09:02 AM	Got myself a copy of 4ed......Ars-Magica. Looks like a perfectly fine system for a wizardbased realms campaign in Thay or Halruaa.
Stigger 10-18-07, 09:28 AM	*snickers* Sent you a pm about what little I've put together so far Alediran.
Alediran 10-18-07, 09:37 AM	I've replied with some sphere/school conversion.
MarkusTay63 10-18-07, 12:12 PM	Like Rats fleeing a sinking ship. :P ;) :D
Alediran 10-18-07, 12:20 PM	I'm wood rat in the Chinese calendar. My behavior is completely reasonable.
Andyr 10-18-07, 01:28 PM	I have been eagerly 'absorbing' every morsel and 4e tidbit they have been throwing our way, hoping to catch some glimpse of the future. The last two things we learned was that Waterdeep goes untouched, and Warforged will not make it into the Realms. Warforged are *not* coming to the Realms? I thought they were... when/where was their absence confirmed?
SgtAnjay 10-18-07, 01:47 PM	Rich Baker promised they wouldn't be in the Realms in the "Ask the Realms authors/designers thread".
MarkusTay63 10-18-07, 01:52 PM	You can view it HERE. (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=14052953&postcount=764) ;)
18DELTA 10-18-07, 02:06 PM	Well what if in my game they are Trobriands creations. The ultimate killing machines for Undermountain!!! Then when the spellplague from hell hits they rise forth and conquer Waterdeep!!!:D Their you go MarkusTay63, the best of both worlds!!!:smirk: :whatsthis :looloo: :lightbulb :dancin: :evillaugh
MarkusTay63 10-18-07, 02:17 PM	I've already placed them in the UtterEast, which GHotR backs up to some degree. It is quite simple to have an awakened Bloodforged use the Warforged's stats.
18DELTA 10-18-07, 02:21 PM	Well darn, dude you are such a buzz kill!!!:P I can still use it in my game huh? Darn right I can!;) :P
Charles Phipps 10-18-07, 03:23 PM	I have the "Mageforged" (vulgarly known as 'Clanks') from Tilverton and Haruula with lots more in Lantan.