Post/Author/DateTime	Post
NicoRavas 04-04-04, 09:47 AM	Hi, i am guiding my pcs through the adventure City of the Spider Queen. They are already within Castle Maerymidra (level 5). they ll soon reach the undying temple and there is a lot of stuff i dont understand about this temple... 1.) i dont understand how to manage that stuff with the ethereal plane. what happend to this temple...can anyone explain it to me? How can one part be within the material plane and the other part within the ethereal? isnt the ethereal plane a copy of the material plane? 2.) What kind of spell is Irea Tsarran researching? i cant find the great revenance spell in any book i got?!
Dargoth 04-04-04, 10:06 AM	The Great Revance spell would most closely resemble the Epic Spell Horriable Army of the Dead in the PGTF
Cunning Linguist 04-04-04, 10:11 AM	Well, one part of the temple is in the etheral plane, and one is on the material plane. You need to pass into the plane via the door at the bottom or the top of the temple. It's not a copy, there is a map, and index for the rooms on the etheral plane as well as for the material plane. As for the spell, think of it as a huge undead spell, that will raise so many undead that it's not even funny.
NicoRavas 04-04-04, 12:29 PM	Originally posted by Dargoth The Great Revance spell would most closely resemble the Epic Spell Horriable Army of the Dead in the PGTF what does PGTF mean=?
Darian 04-04-04, 12:37 PM	PGTF = Players Guide to Fearûn ;)
NicoRavas 04-04-04, 12:38 PM	i actually red the chapter 4 several times to learn more bout the ethereal plane... Can you explain how to describe ethereal characters... Imagine the PC uses True Seeing and thus is able to see an ethereal character, how can you describe this ethereal creature? E.g in the Undying Temple...there are parts on the ethereal plane, that are not coexistent with the material plane...you can only enter by passing through the portal or the orb.. Its walls are black and you cant pass thru them like u can do it with walls on the material plane... Can the PC see these ethereal walls...and can he see thru them?
NicoRavas 04-04-04, 12:40 PM	Originally posted by Darian PGTF = Players Guide to Fearûn ;) i ve never heard of anything like this!???!
Darian 04-04-04, 12:51 PM	PM for you ;)
NicoRavas 04-04-04, 12:53 PM	Originally posted by Darian PM for you ;) can u do this again... please!
Darian 04-04-04, 12:54 PM	ok, just wait a second ;) - Done
Cunning Linguist 04-04-04, 01:36 PM	Etheral looks like... a milky white thing.. and.. a screw it, just say it looks like the world that Frodo sees when he puts on the ring, without the sound.
Dargoth 04-04-04, 08:16 PM	Originally posted by NicoRavas i ve never heard of anything like this!???! its the latest FR book it came out last month
Klyden 04-05-04, 07:07 AM	A carefully worded Miracle spell can destroy the Undying Temple. Then you can pic off the evil villains in a massive battle, assuming of course you don't word the miracle spell to destory the Undying Temple and the villains with it. Thats probably not likely to work though on the villains as they might be able to save successfully. I don't know for sure though. Do victims of a Miracle spell even get a save DC? I thought the Miracle spells of the Celestial Paragons save DC's.
Cunning Linguist 04-05-04, 07:59 AM	Ok, heres one, If the players manage to close the negative energy portal, will the temple die, and be severed from it's other part? And if so, where will the last battle be?
Klyden 04-05-04, 11:02 PM	If the orb is destroyed the temple is destroyed. I don't see why your PC's would use a Wish or Miracle Spell to seperate the Orb from the Temple when they can just use them same spells to "to destroy the Undying Temple and all inside it".
Cunning Linguist 04-06-04, 09:29 AM	I don't think a miracle has that much power. The temple itself is a 20HD creature, the peole inside make up another 40-50HD, so a single miracle would take down over 70HD? I don't think so..
NicoRavas 04-08-04, 01:57 AM	I still got some questions.... - how many clerics do you need to destroy the negativ energy orb of the undying temple ? - if the ethereal plane is coexistant to the material plane, how can there be some parts that only exist in the ethereal plane (e.g in the undying temple) =??? - i always thought ghosts are "only" incorporal ? Are they usually etheareal? (i would look it up but i dont have any books beside me) - which creatures are usually ethereal? - my PCs really like to know more about Irea Tsarrans spell research. What can i present the Players after they killed her=? i think she wont have the spell completed, will she? - To those who already completed this adventure...Can anyone give me some hints how to play IRea? One the one hand considering her role play (or my one) and on the other hand how she will act tactically... - and last but not least: How can the PCs get back on the surface? THX!!!!
NicoRavas 04-08-04, 07:08 AM	please answer !!!
Cunning Linguist 04-08-04, 08:06 AM	my PCs really like to know more about Irea Tsarrans spell research. What can i present the Players after they killed her=? i think she wont have the spell completed, will she? Tell them its a epic spell, then just make up alot about how it will transform dead to undead, and power them, and shot of healing magic and such. Since it's a epic spell, they can't take the spell for themselves. i always thought ghosts are "only" incorporal ? Are they usually etheareal? (i would look it up but i dont have any books beside me) Im not 100% on this, but I think incorporal is etheral. But then, I never read ghost as a random encounter on the etheral plane.. and thats kind of strange, if every ghost is etheral, then there would be alot of ghosts there. how many clerics do you need to destroy the negativ energy orb of the undying temple ? Well, a heal spell does so and so much damage, and the temple has so and so much HP.. just sit down and do the math. My PC's have this crystral, thats the size of a man, that they are going to have to use to destroy it. Im really looking forward to it, since they have all made huge plans for things they want to buy with that rock. The other questions, I don't know..
Purple Dragon Knight 04-08-04, 12:18 PM	Originally posted by NicoRavas I think you have a lot of reading ahead of you, because some of these things are very technical, but I'll try to give a shot to some of these in 5min... - if the ethereal plane is coexistant to the material plane, how can there be some parts that only exist in the ethereal plane (e.g in the undying temple) =??? Ok: the ethereal plane IS coexistant with the material plane, just like the Plane of Shadow. While in ethereal form, creatures are in the ethereal plane. An ethereal creature can pass through physical objects that are located in the material plane (that's why a ghost can fly right through walls). PCs in ethereal form can hit ethereal creatures normally (the ethereal creatures are not "incorporeal" anymore if the players shift in the ethereal plane). The Ghost Touch weapon or armor ability allows you to "touch" ethereal creatures normally, same if you are in the ethereal and want to touch something on the prime. That's why CotSQ has a ghost with a Ghost Touch weapon at the beginning of the book... the Ghost can whack the PCs normally as a melee attack (which is better if the Ghost has class levels and is good with a blade). The Ghost Touch weapon also allows the Ghost to defend itself if some PCs shift to the ethereal (otherwise the Ghost would be suddenly unarmed against them). - i always thought ghosts are "only" incorporal ? Are they usually etheareal? (i would look it up but i dont have any books beside me) Ghosts are funny. Go read them well before a battle. Yes, they are ethereal, ALL THE TIME. But they have a power called "Manifestation" which allows them to hit PCs that are on the MATERIAL PLANE through melee touch attacks. This manifestation also allows the PCs to strike back, but they need a magical weapon and have a 50% chance to miss (the standard "incorporeal" requirements). When they are manifesting, ghosts are considered "incorporeal". - which creatures are usually ethereal? A whole load of them. Whether they are or not will be mentioned in the monster's entry. What you have to remember is that ethereal creatures CAN'T DO A THING against PCs unless they have a funny way to "manifest" themselves into the material plane (pun intended! :) ) However, by being ethereal, they can see the PCs while the PCs cannot see them (unless the PCs have True Seeing or See Invisibility). If you have a 3.5 DMG, go read the ETHEREAL and INCORPOREAL definitions. If you don't go online to check the SRD (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=d20/article/srd35) Hope this helped... I gotta go now! :angel:
NicoRavas 04-09-04, 03:53 AM	Originally posted by Purple Dragon Knight I think you have a lot of reading ahead of you, because some of these things are very technical, but I'll try to give a shot to some of these in 5min... [B]- if the ethereal plane is coexistant to the material plane, how can there be some parts that only exist in the ethereal plane (e.g in the undying temple) =??? Ok: the ethereal plane IS coexistant with the material plane, just like the Plane of Shadow. While in ethereal form, creatures are in the ethereal plane. An ethereal creature can pass through physical objects that are located in the material plane (that's why a ghost can fly right through walls). PCs in ethereal form can hit ethereal creatures normally (the ethereal creatures are not "incorporeal" anymore if the players shift in the ethereal plane). The Ghost Touch weapon or armor ability allows you to "touch" ethereal creatures normally, same if you are in the ethereal and want to touch something on the prime. That's why CotSQ has a ghost with a Ghost Touch weapon at the beginning of the book... the Ghost can whack the PCs normally as a melee attack (which is better if the Ghost has class levels and is good with a blade). The Ghost Touch weapon also allows the Ghost to defend itself if some PCs shift to the ethereal (otherwise the Ghost would be suddenly unarmed against them). Thx for all the answers....but this answer above does not fit to my question... I never thought that the ethereal plane has its own walls (you cant pass through), see the part of the undying temple, which lies completly in the ethereal plane... I always thought that there was nothing in the ethereal plane...everything is foggy an black... The only thing you see is the stuff on the material plane, where you can easily travel through (e.g through a wall in the material plane) So, does the ethereal plane consist of furniture, walls, buildings, eg. tooo=???
NicoRavas 04-09-04, 07:33 AM	Originally posted by NicoRavas So, does the ethereal plane consist of furniture, walls, buildings, eg. tooo=??? No replies? The next rpg evening will start in 5 hours...:plz... By the way... can anyone reply to the question on what spell Irea Tsarran is researching for.. Someone told me its an epic one... But i thought you have to be at least level 21 to develop an epic spell....irea is 20.. What shall i tell the characters when they ve destroyed her and search for her spell researches??????
Cunning Linguist 04-09-04, 08:10 AM	Etheral has walls and things like that. Some people live there youknow, they need there privacy. So what if she is 20 level, and you need to be 21 to make a epic spell? When did you tell the pc's her level? She could be a weak 30 level character for all they know.
NicoRavas 04-10-04, 12:00 PM	some new questions came up after i guided the party through the material part of the undying temple.... A Cleric (PC) was ethereal... Tharrak (Ghost Champion) used his manifestation ability to fight against the other party members (they were of course on the material plane) So the question is: Does the Cleric PC see Tharak in both planes? Or is Tharak /(when manifestated) only in the material plane? If Tharak is in both planes at once..can he see and attack this ethereal PC cleric???? All right, the last question... How long does it take Irea Tsarran to create a silveraith.??? There s no description bout it..only that the ethereal scouts take important dead NPC back to the undying temple.. Bye the way..how can they do this? They cant touch anything in the material plane when manifestated.... Hope you understand my questions.....and hope you can reply them all.... Stop.: Can anyone tell me how to play irea???? COmbat Tactics.? why does she fight in the etheral plane? will she fight until death or leave the undying temple with a teleport spell or anything like that? What will the temple do if Irea is destroyed....will he be friendly aligned to the characters and accept them as his new inhabitants? Funily..the PCs dont know who is alway talking to them...:D.D.D
Cunning Linguist 04-10-04, 12:10 PM	I think your cleric can see Tharrak in the etheral plane, even when he is manifested in the material plane, and he could attack him in the etheral plane, and hurt him there. Tharrak can also see him in the etheral plane, it would be kind of silly for the PC's in the material plane, wathing Tharrak trying to kill some unseen foe, as he fights the PC cleric in the Etheral plane. Creating a silveraith is a specific application of the create greater undead spell, and it has a casting time of 1 hour.
NicoRavas 04-10-04, 01:22 PM	Originally posted by Cunning Linguist Creating a silveraith is a specific application of the create greater undead spell, and it has a casting time of 1 hour. Where can i find this spell?
NicoRavas 04-10-04, 01:24 PM	:) where can i find this create greater undead spell?
Cunning Linguist 04-10-04, 02:03 PM	Players Handbook 3.5, page 215, under the C's for "Create Greater Undead". Functions like a "create undead" also on the same page, under Create Undead.
Morgrym 04-18-04, 11:22 PM	A Cleric (PC) was ethereal... Tharrak (Ghost Champion) used his manifestation ability to fight against the other party members (they were of course on the material plane) So the question is: Does the Cleric PC see Tharak in both planes? Or is Tharak /(when manifestated) only in the material plane? If Tharak is in both planes at once..can he see and attack this ethereal PC cleric???? Most of your questions are answered in the adventure itself. Yes he can attack both and see both it says so on page 104 ( i suggest looking at the sidebar on ethereal plane features on pg110) tactically sound no kill the cleric then th observers. PC cleric can see the manifested ghost but cant do anything to it (still has 50% chance to miss) Plus if ghost chooses to attack PC cleric it will return to etheral therby cleric gets slammed with horrifying gaze and such while the other party members can do nothing. Originally posted by NicoRavas Stop.: Can anyone tell me how to play irea???? Page 114 tells you the tactics she uses. However if you dislike that.. Play Irae as intellignetly (granted she is nearly insane but yo ushould make it as challenging as possible this is the climax battle) as possibly she wants that to exact revenge against the surface dwellers and Lloth followers. If the players are walking through it disregard the tactics section written and have everyone work cohesively "for the betterment and rule of Kiransalee" Also the beginning of the adventure states play evil intelligently. COmbat Tactics.? why does she fight in the etheral plane? will she fight until death or leave the undying temple with a teleport spell or anything like that? The research and where she is in the temple is in the ethereal plane hence why she fights there. If the players cant get there she completes the spell and the world is buried in undead yippie. What will the temple do if Irea is destroyed....will he be friendly aligned to the characters and accept them as his new inhabitants? Funily..the PCs dont know who is alway talking to them...:D.D.D [/B][/QUOTE] If Irea is destroyed and the temple is not... First the temple detects evil if none are it tries do Dominate Monster one of the PC's (usually a fighter) - this should have happen upon trying to enter the temple if it didnt DO IT NOW:schemes: If none of the PC's follow Kiransalee or don't wish to and are evil. Temple can lure them into false sense of security and then annihilate the party. If the PC cleric is to a good diety no deals and the party dies. I have a question for you What is your party make up and how is the party doing. I am running it now (They are in Szith Morcane) but they are using the blindsight spell and reeking havoc. they litterally are walking through everything. Plus the 26pt buy system the adventure uses is horrible an average AC of 19 w/out buffs or 25 w/ buffs is paltry to this group. (F4 Halfdragon/feral lizardman) 12 level F/Samurai/Master Samurai/Devoted Defender, W10/Loremaster2) the fighter are averaging about +18 - 25 to hit which makes the opp. push overs. The blindsight negates all ambush through invisibility or hide/move silently as well as most defensive spells including displacement/invisibility/mirror image. I have started restatting every major villain and changed their spell repetoire (the list they got are horrible) and will try to restate the warrior/casters next. Looking for any suggestions.
Treskin 04-26-04, 03:46 AM	I've been reworking Irae T'sarran, because frankly she's a complete gimp in the book. If she rolls poorly on initiative she would be dead before she did anything, based on the module setup: all it would take is a greater dispel and/or 2 archers and she's dead. Among other things her wisdom is asinine, so I gave her a wisdom item and had her cast Miracles for a +3 inherent bonus. Here's my stats for her completely buffed, though I may still rework some of her spell list. Several spells are from magic of Faerun. Divine Power not included, as I removed it from my campaign - also insta-death spells now deal damage instead. Irae T’sarran Female drow Cleric 17 / Hierophant 3 of Kiaransalee Medium-size humanoid (elf) HD: 17d8+51 plus 3d8+9 (150 hp) AC: 35 (+5 armor, +5 natural, +5 deflection, +10 cover) Attack: +16/+11/+6 melee (1d4+1 plus 1d6 negative energy/19-20) Special Attacks: blast infidel, divine reach, spell power +2, rebuke undead Special Qualities: drow traits, SR 31 Saves: Fort +20, Reflex +12, Will +27 Stats: Str 10 (14), Dex 10, Con 12 (16), Int 14, Wis 26, Cha 16 Skills: Concentration +23, Knowledge (arcane) +15, Knowledge (religion) +25, Listen +6, Scry +12, Search +4, Spellcraft +25, Spot +6 Feats: Craft Wondrous Item, Extra Turning, Greater Spell Focus (Necromancy), Heighten Spell, Iron Will, Lightning Reflexes, Spell Focus (Necromancy), Spell Penetration Possessions: Claw of the revenancer, eyes of the spider, rod of the twisted Weave (34 levels remaining), masterwork dagger, plain mithral ring (Umaerth’s phylactery), ring of counterspells (greater dispelling), robe of wisdom +4, scroll of break enchantment. Spells Prepared: (6/7/7/7/7/5/5/4/3/1 plus domain, save DC 20 + spell level, or 24 + spell level for Necromancy spells) 1st: deathwatch, divine favor (2), shield of faith, endure elements (3), detect undead* 2nd: bull’s strength, silence (3), aid, desecrate (2), endurance* 3rd: protection from elements (5), cure serious wounds, animate dead* 4th: death ward, dimensional anchor, cure critical wounds (3), freedom of movement, spell immunity, fire shield* 5th: heightened inflict critical wounds, flame strike, slay living (2), plane shift, circle of doom* 6th: spellmantle, greater dispelling (2), harm, heal, banishment* 7th: heightened inflict critical wounds, destruction, holy star, fortunate fate, spell turning* 8th: stormrage, unholy aura, wall of greater dispel magic, spell turning* 9th: implosion, energy drain* Blast Infidel: Any spell using negative energy that Irae casts on an opponent who does not worship Kiaransalee functions as if under the effect of the Maximize Spell feat, without using a higher-level spell slot. Undead affected by this ability heal the appropriate amount of damage, regardless of their patron. Divine Reach: Irae can use touch spells on targets up to 30 feet away. If the spell requires a melee touch attack, she must make a ranged touch attack instead. Spell Power: Irae adds +2 to the save DC’s and to the caster level checks for her divine spells. Spells in Effect: (Permanent) spell phylactery (break enchantment), death pact. (20 hours) endurance, bull’s strength. (200 minutes) spell turning, fortunate fate, spellmantle, death ward, deathwatch, protection from elements (fire, cold, electricity, acid, sonic), freedom of movement. (20 minutes) shield of faith, aid. (20 rounds) stormrage, holy star, unholy aura, fire shield (warm). (10 rounds) divine favor End. As for tactics, her room is going to have several Symbols within it, though my players will likely have the Supress Symbol spell in effect. The entrance area is going to be covered in Silence spells, just beyond which they will find her Wall of Greater Dispel Magic. Once they overcome these obstacles she becomes irate and instead of just lobbing in a Divine Reached inflict spell, Irae will start using the heavy stuff. Maximized (blast infidel) Empowered (weave corruption) Energy Drain should be nice. Her protection against magic has also been greatly increased. She is immune to the first 240 damage of every energy type; A ring of counterspells as well as the Spellmantle spell protect her from 2 Greater Dispel Magics; Spell Immunity will protect from common lower-level damage spells; Holy Star can be changed from a +10 AC cover bonus to a spell absorbtion utility... and if all that fails they still have the Rod of the Twisted Weave, fairly good saving throws and SR to contend with. With her much improved AC she should be a little more resiliant against melee attacks, and Stormrage makes Irae all but immune to arrows. If her apparent magic defenses are withered away and she is killed before she can Heal, the Fortunate Fate spell will, in most circumstances, return her to full health. Should she die, the Death Pact returns her to her room 2 levels below, where she may choose to continue the fight, or flee. To summarize: I'm not letting her go down easily :)