Could it happen? Wild speculation. (Minor Spoilers) [Archive] - Wizards Community

Could it happen? Wild speculation. (Minor Spoilers) [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Meldread
09-05-07, 11:39 PM I was reading a few posts in another thread and a wild speculative thought hit me. Hold the flames, I know 95% of the people here on these forums will want to set me on fire after reading this...

To understand how my speculation came about, we really need to look at the big picture and Wizard's actions with the Realm's thus far. When 3E first came out they introduced the Great Tree in an effort to make the setting more independent. Over the course of many years the Realm's has undergone a lot of changes. WotC has shown that they have some level of dislike for areas outside of Faerun and their real world-ish cultures.

Speculation due to events in the world has led many to believe that the Mulhorandi and Faerunian Pantheons will eventually merge, and at least some of us think this will happen during the transition between 3.5E to 4E.

Looking at recent events with the Drow Deities, it seems that there will eventually only be a single deity left standing. The pantheon is rapidly being weeded out. Eilistraee seems to be taking a strong swerve toward neutral, and it could even be possible that she swings toward evil. Keep in mind that Eilistraee is a Realms-Centric Deity and has no connection with other settings.

The Elves are returning to Faerun in large numbers... if we believe the Mulhorandi Pantheon will merge with the Faerunian Pantheon because of their worshipers colliding in the Old Empires region, then should we not think the same about the Elven deities?

From what I understand Gnomes are being written out of 4E entirely, although this may or may not apply to the Realm's there is little reason to believe it doesn't. If that is the case it would wipe out the entire Gnomish Pantheon.

Over the years, we've seen a consistent slide and bias placed on the Faerunian Pantheon. In a sense, it is no longer just a "human" pantheon, but seems to be spreading to many different races and cultures.

Could it be that in 4E that we will only have a single pantheon for the entire planet? (Or at least all known regions of the planet.)

If the speculative rumors about FR taking a 100 leap forward into the future are true that would give things plenty of time to take place.

It is all wild speculation, but if we look at the general WotC attitude and their actions it seems plausible.

I'm going to go hide now. ;)

:hides:
Dark Wizard
09-05-07, 11:50 PM That's crazy. Crazy like a fox. A villainous fox. So crazy it might just be what WotC is thinking.
Meldread
09-06-07, 12:21 AM Look at how things have been sliding toward a Faerunian-Centric world.

If I remember correctly the Dwarven deities did some sort of ritual to help Dwarven women become more fertile and produce more dwarves. Last I heard there was some success, but what if things went horribly wrong? There goes the Dwarven Deities. The Maztica Deities are already dead or near death, but since Maztica won't be touched by WotC that holds little relevance.

If Gnomes are written out so are their deities. You then have the Orcish Deities, and who can say what will happen there?

The Halfling Deities are easy enough to write out of existence due to lack of importance, similar to how easy it is to write out Gnomes. Halflings also already seem to have a knack for worshiping human deities anyway.

Give the following races a single deity to jump behind and everyone else can be split between the rest: Drow, Dwarves, Elves and Orcs. Outside of that everyone else can more or less be maneuvered into worshiping deities from the Faerunian Pantheon.

Ask the Sahuagin who now seem to be worshipers of Umberlee. ;)

So that basically leaves us with...
Elves: Corellon Larethian
Dwarves: Moradin
Orcs: Gruumsh
Drow: Eilistraee/Lolth hybrid

Hell, if you want to really cut down the list, you can kill all of the non-human deities and just leave the Drow and Dwarves their single deity. The Elves can worship Tymora, Chauntea and Mielikki (ooh! ooh! Good Elves now have something in common with Drizzt. You know it's in now! :P). Orcs can worship Garagos/Cyric/Some other Chaotic Evil Deity.

There has also been mention (if I remember correctly) that FR will be stepping away from it's 30 subraces for every race syndrome. So apparently, the moment the Sun Elves had to begin worshiping a Human Deity they all committed ritualistic suicide. :P
Eli_the_Tanner
09-06-07, 12:23 AM Tired of the same old Gnomes!
Confused over your out-standing pantheons!!
Worried your gods aren't insured for future RSE's!!!

Well despair no more, as we here at WotC can solve your troubles. By consolidating your deities into one easy pantheon, we can save you time and money with a more managable Forgotten Realms system. All for just a nominal fee.

So sign up today at: www.gleemax.hasbro.wizards.paizo/4E.co.org (www.wizards.com) and we can clear away any and all unnecassary parts of your collective imagination!

-WARNING!! This process may involve the crushing of your childhood memories and/or hopes for future gaming experiences.
Krash
09-06-07, 12:33 AM I think what 4E is saying about gnomes is that they won't be playable as PCs. Gnomes will not be eliminated Faerūn-wide. That would be a ridiculous state of affairs.

-- George Krashos
Meldread
09-06-07, 12:45 AM That sounds more plausible. Of course, it wouldn't be any worse than the whole Great Tree fiasco. Getting rid of Gnomes would do what, at worst? Make Lantan (a region of Toril for which almost no lore exists, and is so insular that almost no one visits) a big empty island?

Don't get me wrong. I love Gnomes, it is just that overall they don't impact the setting overly much for them to be missed. After all, most people miss them anyway because they don't look down. :P

Maybe if RAS polymorphed Drizzt into a Gnome for a few novels they'd get more respect!
Wellin_Adipocere
09-06-07, 01:29 AM There will come a time Meldread, when they fate of all will rest with but one small gnome.
Meldread
09-06-07, 01:39 AM Of course... on the issue of Gnomes, it wouldn't be hard to retcon their pantheon out of existence. I could be wrong, but the only major settlement they have in the Realm's is Lantan. Most if not all the Gnome's there worship Gond, who is a Human deity.

Gond himself could be retconned into being more Gnomish than Human and then... ta da... :P
MarkHall
09-06-07, 02:07 AM Actually, the gnomes have settlements in the Great Dale as well as Thesk, and throughout the Western Heartlands.

And am I the only one who thought the dwarves of the first Moonshaes Trilogy would've worked really well as gnomes?
MarkusTay63
09-06-07, 03:20 PM Notice, in the September and Beyond (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/4pr/20070905a) part of the WotC site, it specifically mentions the newly formed kingdom of Yaļmmunahar, but NO mention of the Gnomish kingdom Songfarla from the same Dragon article?

Then again, Songfarla would have been founded before the fall of Netheril...

And yeah, people are confusing 4e rules with 4e FR - Gnomes will more then likely be a playable race in PHB II.

I agree that the pantheons seem to be merging, though - many gods already operate outside of their areas.

BTW, from all the mention of Maztica in that "sneak peak", I would go so far as to assume that we will see some adventuring in Maztica with 4e, just like the Stormreach thing in Eberron.
Sroblin
09-06-07, 03:31 PM Eilistraie turning neutral/evil? Doesn't that sort of undermine what she's all about?

Unless there's been another book released, the only things I've heard is that a few of her servants in the battle against Lolth are straying from the path of good, not that the goddess was as well. But then, I'm behind with the times.

It seemed strange that they killed of Vhaerun after building up his importance for so many years in 3.0. I would be sad to see Eilistraie go evil- I mean, that was what made her unique, after all.
MarkusTay63
09-06-07, 06:32 PM And would completely destroy Elaine's take on her in Evermeet. :(
Lord Karsus
09-06-07, 07:08 PM And would completely destroy Elaine's take on her in Evermeet. :(

-I'm sure Elaine would be the first to mention how the Realms are a shared world, and that things change. The changes that Eilistraee has been going through are current, and do not retroactivley go back and change everything that Elaine wrote about her in the past. Thus, everything Elaine wrote about her past still stands.
Eli_the_Tanner
09-06-07, 07:33 PM It seems this consolidating of deities is part of a general move from Forgotten Relams being a setting for D&D but rather bring it into D&D as a cosmology itself.

Perhaps to a planescape-esque D&D rather than lots of different versions of D&D.
Sroblin
09-06-07, 09:51 PM But what exactly are these 'changes' with Eilistraie? All I've heard about are some clerics of hers being corrupted, not the goddess herself.
Lord Karsus
09-07-07, 10:00 AM But what exactly are these 'changes' with Eilistraie? All I've heard about are some clerics of hers being corrupted, not the goddess herself.

-Read The Lady Penitent trilogy. If you don't have access to it, here is a very abbreviated summary:

-Vhaeraun's worshippers open a gate from his domain into her domain. Vhaeraun enters her domain, intent on killing her and absorbing her divine power. Eilistraee, however, bests her brother and defeats him, absorbing his divine essence in the process. This, however, seems to have inherently changed Eilistraee. She is now called the Masked Lady, has allowed the Nightshadows into her church, and seems to be as much shadow as she is moonlight.
MarkusTay63
09-07-07, 01:50 PM Arrrgh... more 'Shadowcrap'. :rolleyes:
Alleran
09-08-07, 09:01 AM Arrrgh... more 'Shadowcrap'. :rolleyes:
That's what I thought as well. Honestly, I'd be surprised these days if we can get just one good event that doesn't involve the Shadow Weave, shadows in general, Shar, 'omgevilissokewlndevlmagescastevlmagic', or any combination thereof.
Meldread
09-08-07, 04:40 PM After reading the prelude to the Orc King, it seems at least some of my wild speculation might be true. Toril is in for a bumpy ride...

It seems we're heading squarely toward a dark world with a few very small points of light. So much gets wiped out from the Spellplague. The Time of Troubles looks to be a minor event in comparison.
MarkusTay63
09-08-07, 05:35 PM "Toto... I don't think we're in Kansas anymore..."
Lord Karsus
09-09-07, 08:23 AM -I'll probably pick up the 4e FRCS, but if things have changed too much, and I don't like it, I think that might be the end of the Realms for me. I'll stick in the past (present), thank you very much...
Vulpes
09-09-07, 06:41 PM -I'll probably pick up the 4e FRCS, but if things have changed too much, and I don't like it, I think that might be the end of the Realms for me. I'll stick in the past (present), thank you very much...

Frankly, I think that's the most prudent course. I mean, really, at this point we have only smatterings of possibilities of spoilers. Until we get much closer, any sort of informed opinion is rather premature. Which isn't to say one can't ***** or squeee or whatever (because if we couldn't, what the hell would the board talk about?), but either doomsaying or rapturizing is not productive. You'll just give yourself agita!

Now, having said all that, my two gps... :P Frankly, the changes that seem to be most likely (empires rising and falling, "points of light," etc.) don't seem particularly radical changes. I mean, really, even this "good always wins!" FR we supposedly have now isn't all roses and sunshine. What nations are really stable and just? Cormyr? Impiltur? Even there, your chances of being killed by a monster or barbarian hordes is higher than I know I'd like if I lived there. Look at most of the Western Heartlands or the Sword Coast: it really is a collection of cities and villages surrounded by very, very dangerous territory. So I don't think the shift in tone, if it actually is what we think it is, will be as drastic as some think.
MarkusTay63
09-10-07, 04:41 PM I think the shift in tone is to an earlier time, like it was in 1e. Anyone who has the maps from the old boxed set will see that points of civilization were few-and-far between. And take a look at the NPCs - level sixes were referred to as 'powerful'.

I will buy the 4e FRCS as well, and make my decisions based on that. Either way, I will continue to enjoy the 'current' Realms and eagerly await the GHotR - the last great gasp of 3e.
Lord Karsus
09-11-07, 09:49 AM Either way, I will continue to enjoy the 'current' Realms and eagerly await the GHotR - the last great gasp of 3e.

-Who'd ever thought that I'd miss 3e?
MarkusTay63
09-11-07, 04:16 PM Just think, we'll be able to get together over a beer when they announce 7e, and talk about the good old days of 5e. ;)
Lord Karsus
09-12-07, 11:30 AM -We all might be dead by that point.
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
09-12-07, 11:51 AM That's what I thought as well. Honestly, I'd be surprised these days if we can get just one good event that doesn't involve the Shadow Weave, shadows in general, Shar, 'omgevilissokewlndevlmagescastevlmagic', or any combination thereof.

And why are shadows so inherently evil, anyway?

I am also pretty tired of the current shadow overload...
MarkusTay63
09-12-07, 12:29 PM And why are shadows so inherently evil, anyway?It's all Peter Pan's fault...
Lord Karsus
09-12-07, 01:20 PM And why are shadows so inherently evil, anyway?

-The color black itself has many sociological/psychological 'bad' connotations, going back thousands of years, in various cultures.
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
09-12-07, 01:22 PM -The color black itself has many sociological/psychological 'bad' connotations, going back thousands of years, in various cultures.

I'm aware of that (rhetorical question!). That doesn't mean it makes great story design.

Besides, shade can offer a lot of relief on a hot, sunny day. Some plants and animals live and thrive in the darkness. "Darkness is bad/harmful to life" is way too simplistic for me.
Lord Karsus
09-12-07, 02:04 PM I'm aware of that (rhetorical question!).

-Oh. Sorry, sorry, sorry...
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
09-12-07, 07:28 PM It's OK.:)
GothicDan
09-12-07, 07:41 PM While humans are neurologically wired to feel 'negative' towards lack of light, that's an evolutionary thing. Who knows if the humans of Abeir-Toril evolved? We know a lot of the demihumans didn't. Maybe that's why Erevan, who's associated somewhat with shadow, isn't evil among the Tel'Quessir?

Truthfully, I do tend to play somewhat stereotyped characters, to the point of redundancy (Shade Human Shadow Adept/Shadowcraft Mage of Shar, Fire Genasi Fire Elementalist of Kossuth, etc.) But that's just because I tend to play zealously dedicated types.

And even though fantasy's rife with overused villainous stereotypes, there's usually a reason why those stereotypes came about - at this point, they instinctively, subconsciously evoke certain emotions in our brains. (Like the darkness/black = 'bad' example, even though it's philosophically not universal - darkness still makes our serotonin levels drop.)

I forgot where I was going.

Bye. :)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Meldread 09-05-07, 11:39 PM	I was reading a few posts in another thread and a wild speculative thought hit me. Hold the flames, I know 95% of the people here on these forums will want to set me on fire after reading this... To understand how my speculation came about, we really need to look at the big picture and Wizard's actions with the Realm's thus far. When 3E first came out they introduced the Great Tree in an effort to make the setting more independent. Over the course of many years the Realm's has undergone a lot of changes. WotC has shown that they have some level of dislike for areas outside of Faerun and their real world-ish cultures. Speculation due to events in the world has led many to believe that the Mulhorandi and Faerunian Pantheons will eventually merge, and at least some of us think this will happen during the transition between 3.5E to 4E. Looking at recent events with the Drow Deities, it seems that there will eventually only be a single deity left standing. The pantheon is rapidly being weeded out. Eilistraee seems to be taking a strong swerve toward neutral, and it could even be possible that she swings toward evil. Keep in mind that Eilistraee is a Realms-Centric Deity and has no connection with other settings. The Elves are returning to Faerun in large numbers... if we believe the Mulhorandi Pantheon will merge with the Faerunian Pantheon because of their worshipers colliding in the Old Empires region, then should we not think the same about the Elven deities? From what I understand Gnomes are being written out of 4E entirely, although this may or may not apply to the Realm's there is little reason to believe it doesn't. If that is the case it would wipe out the entire Gnomish Pantheon. Over the years, we've seen a consistent slide and bias placed on the Faerunian Pantheon. In a sense, it is no longer just a "human" pantheon, but seems to be spreading to many different races and cultures. Could it be that in 4E that we will only have a single pantheon for the entire planet? (Or at least all known regions of the planet.) If the speculative rumors about FR taking a 100 leap forward into the future are true that would give things plenty of time to take place. It is all wild speculation, but if we look at the general WotC attitude and their actions it seems plausible. I'm going to go hide now. ;) :hides:
Dark Wizard 09-05-07, 11:50 PM	That's crazy. Crazy like a fox. A villainous fox. So crazy it might just be what WotC is thinking.
Meldread 09-06-07, 12:21 AM	Look at how things have been sliding toward a Faerunian-Centric world. If I remember correctly the Dwarven deities did some sort of ritual to help Dwarven women become more fertile and produce more dwarves. Last I heard there was some success, but what if things went horribly wrong? There goes the Dwarven Deities. The Maztica Deities are already dead or near death, but since Maztica won't be touched by WotC that holds little relevance. If Gnomes are written out so are their deities. You then have the Orcish Deities, and who can say what will happen there? The Halfling Deities are easy enough to write out of existence due to lack of importance, similar to how easy it is to write out Gnomes. Halflings also already seem to have a knack for worshiping human deities anyway. Give the following races a single deity to jump behind and everyone else can be split between the rest: Drow, Dwarves, Elves and Orcs. Outside of that everyone else can more or less be maneuvered into worshiping deities from the Faerunian Pantheon. Ask the Sahuagin who now seem to be worshipers of Umberlee. ;) So that basically leaves us with... Elves: Corellon Larethian Dwarves: Moradin Orcs: Gruumsh Drow: Eilistraee/Lolth hybrid Hell, if you want to really cut down the list, you can kill all of the non-human deities and just leave the Drow and Dwarves their single deity. The Elves can worship Tymora, Chauntea and Mielikki (ooh! ooh! Good Elves now have something in common with Drizzt. You know it's in now! :P). Orcs can worship Garagos/Cyric/Some other Chaotic Evil Deity. There has also been mention (if I remember correctly) that FR will be stepping away from it's 30 subraces for every race syndrome. So apparently, the moment the Sun Elves had to begin worshiping a Human Deity they all committed ritualistic suicide. :P
Eli_the_Tanner 09-06-07, 12:23 AM	Tired of the same old Gnomes! Confused over your out-standing pantheons!! Worried your gods aren't insured for future RSE's!!! Well despair no more, as we here at WotC can solve your troubles. By consolidating your deities into one easy pantheon, we can save you time and money with a more managable Forgotten Realms system. All for just a nominal fee. So sign up today at: www.gleemax.hasbro.wizards.paizo/4E.co.org (www.wizards.com) and we can clear away any and all unnecassary parts of your collective imagination! -WARNING!! This process may involve the crushing of your childhood memories and/or hopes for future gaming experiences.
Krash 09-06-07, 12:33 AM	I think what 4E is saying about gnomes is that they won't be playable as PCs. Gnomes will not be eliminated Faerūn-wide. That would be a ridiculous state of affairs. -- George Krashos
Meldread 09-06-07, 12:45 AM	That sounds more plausible. Of course, it wouldn't be any worse than the whole Great Tree fiasco. Getting rid of Gnomes would do what, at worst? Make Lantan (a region of Toril for which almost no lore exists, and is so insular that almost no one visits) a big empty island? Don't get me wrong. I love Gnomes, it is just that overall they don't impact the setting overly much for them to be missed. After all, most people miss them anyway because they don't look down. :P Maybe if RAS polymorphed Drizzt into a Gnome for a few novels they'd get more respect!
Wellin_Adipocere 09-06-07, 01:29 AM	There will come a time Meldread, when they fate of all will rest with but one small gnome.
Meldread 09-06-07, 01:39 AM	Of course... on the issue of Gnomes, it wouldn't be hard to retcon their pantheon out of existence. I could be wrong, but the only major settlement they have in the Realm's is Lantan. Most if not all the Gnome's there worship Gond, who is a Human deity. Gond himself could be retconned into being more Gnomish than Human and then... ta da... :P
MarkHall 09-06-07, 02:07 AM	Actually, the gnomes have settlements in the Great Dale as well as Thesk, and throughout the Western Heartlands. And am I the only one who thought the dwarves of the first Moonshaes Trilogy would've worked really well as gnomes?
MarkusTay63 09-06-07, 03:20 PM	Notice, in the September and Beyond (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/4pr/20070905a) part of the WotC site, it specifically mentions the newly formed kingdom of Yaļmmunahar, but NO mention of the Gnomish kingdom Songfarla from the same Dragon article? Then again, Songfarla would have been founded before the fall of Netheril... And yeah, people are confusing 4e rules with 4e FR - Gnomes will more then likely be a playable race in PHB II. I agree that the pantheons seem to be merging, though - many gods already operate outside of their areas. BTW, from all the mention of Maztica in that "sneak peak", I would go so far as to assume that we will see some adventuring in Maztica with 4e, just like the Stormreach thing in Eberron.
Sroblin 09-06-07, 03:31 PM	Eilistraie turning neutral/evil? Doesn't that sort of undermine what she's all about? Unless there's been another book released, the only things I've heard is that a few of her servants in the battle against Lolth are straying from the path of good, not that the goddess was as well. But then, I'm behind with the times. It seemed strange that they killed of Vhaerun after building up his importance for so many years in 3.0. I would be sad to see Eilistraie go evil- I mean, that was what made her unique, after all.
MarkusTay63 09-06-07, 06:32 PM	And would completely destroy Elaine's take on her in Evermeet. :(
Lord Karsus 09-06-07, 07:08 PM	And would completely destroy Elaine's take on her in Evermeet. :( -I'm sure Elaine would be the first to mention how the Realms are a shared world, and that things change. The changes that Eilistraee has been going through are current, and do not retroactivley go back and change everything that Elaine wrote about her in the past. Thus, everything Elaine wrote about her past still stands.
Eli_the_Tanner 09-06-07, 07:33 PM	It seems this consolidating of deities is part of a general move from Forgotten Relams being a setting for D&D but rather bring it into D&D as a cosmology itself. Perhaps to a planescape-esque D&D rather than lots of different versions of D&D.
Sroblin 09-06-07, 09:51 PM	But what exactly are these 'changes' with Eilistraie? All I've heard about are some clerics of hers being corrupted, not the goddess herself.
Lord Karsus 09-07-07, 10:00 AM	But what exactly are these 'changes' with Eilistraie? All I've heard about are some clerics of hers being corrupted, not the goddess herself. -Read The Lady Penitent trilogy. If you don't have access to it, here is a very abbreviated summary: -Vhaeraun's worshippers open a gate from his domain into her domain. Vhaeraun enters her domain, intent on killing her and absorbing her divine power. Eilistraee, however, bests her brother and defeats him, absorbing his divine essence in the process. This, however, seems to have inherently changed Eilistraee. She is now called the Masked Lady, has allowed the Nightshadows into her church, and seems to be as much shadow as she is moonlight.
MarkusTay63 09-07-07, 01:50 PM	Arrrgh... more 'Shadowcrap'. :rolleyes:
Alleran 09-08-07, 09:01 AM	Arrrgh... more 'Shadowcrap'. :rolleyes: That's what I thought as well. Honestly, I'd be surprised these days if we can get just one good event that doesn't involve the Shadow Weave, shadows in general, Shar, 'omgevilissokewlndevlmagescastevlmagic', or any combination thereof.
Meldread 09-08-07, 04:40 PM	After reading the prelude to the Orc King, it seems at least some of my wild speculation might be true. Toril is in for a bumpy ride... It seems we're heading squarely toward a dark world with a few very small points of light. So much gets wiped out from the Spellplague. The Time of Troubles looks to be a minor event in comparison.
MarkusTay63 09-08-07, 05:35 PM	"Toto... I don't think we're in Kansas anymore..."
Lord Karsus 09-09-07, 08:23 AM	-I'll probably pick up the 4e FRCS, but if things have changed too much, and I don't like it, I think that might be the end of the Realms for me. I'll stick in the past (present), thank you very much...
Vulpes 09-09-07, 06:41 PM	-I'll probably pick up the 4e FRCS, but if things have changed too much, and I don't like it, I think that might be the end of the Realms for me. I'll stick in the past (present), thank you very much... Frankly, I think that's the most prudent course. I mean, really, at this point we have only smatterings of possibilities of spoilers. Until we get much closer, any sort of informed opinion is rather premature. Which isn't to say one can't ***** or squeee or whatever (because if we couldn't, what the hell would the board talk about?), but either doomsaying or rapturizing is not productive. You'll just give yourself agita! Now, having said all that, my two gps... :P Frankly, the changes that seem to be most likely (empires rising and falling, "points of light," etc.) don't seem particularly radical changes. I mean, really, even this "good always wins!" FR we supposedly have now isn't all roses and sunshine. What nations are really stable and just? Cormyr? Impiltur? Even there, your chances of being killed by a monster or barbarian hordes is higher than I know I'd like if I lived there. Look at most of the Western Heartlands or the Sword Coast: it really is a collection of cities and villages surrounded by very, very dangerous territory. So I don't think the shift in tone, if it actually is what we think it is, will be as drastic as some think.
MarkusTay63 09-10-07, 04:41 PM	I think the shift in tone is to an earlier time, like it was in 1e. Anyone who has the maps from the old boxed set will see that points of civilization were few-and-far between. And take a look at the NPCs - level sixes were referred to as 'powerful'. I will buy the 4e FRCS as well, and make my decisions based on that. Either way, I will continue to enjoy the 'current' Realms and eagerly await the GHotR - the last great gasp of 3e.
Lord Karsus 09-11-07, 09:49 AM	Either way, I will continue to enjoy the 'current' Realms and eagerly await the GHotR - the last great gasp of 3e. -Who'd ever thought that I'd miss 3e?
MarkusTay63 09-11-07, 04:16 PM	Just think, we'll be able to get together over a beer when they announce 7e, and talk about the good old days of 5e. ;)
Lord Karsus 09-12-07, 11:30 AM	-We all might be dead by that point.
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin 09-12-07, 11:51 AM	That's what I thought as well. Honestly, I'd be surprised these days if we can get just one good event that doesn't involve the Shadow Weave, shadows in general, Shar, 'omgevilissokewlndevlmagescastevlmagic', or any combination thereof. And why are shadows so inherently evil, anyway? I am also pretty tired of the current shadow overload...
MarkusTay63 09-12-07, 12:29 PM	And why are shadows so inherently evil, anyway?It's all Peter Pan's fault...
Lord Karsus 09-12-07, 01:20 PM	And why are shadows so inherently evil, anyway? -The color black itself has many sociological/psychological 'bad' connotations, going back thousands of years, in various cultures.
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin 09-12-07, 01:22 PM	-The color black itself has many sociological/psychological 'bad' connotations, going back thousands of years, in various cultures. I'm aware of that (rhetorical question!). That doesn't mean it makes great story design. Besides, shade can offer a lot of relief on a hot, sunny day. Some plants and animals live and thrive in the darkness. "Darkness is bad/harmful to life" is way too simplistic for me.
Lord Karsus 09-12-07, 02:04 PM	I'm aware of that (rhetorical question!). -Oh. Sorry, sorry, sorry...
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin 09-12-07, 07:28 PM	It's OK.:)
GothicDan 09-12-07, 07:41 PM	While humans are neurologically wired to feel 'negative' towards lack of light, that's an evolutionary thing. Who knows if the humans of Abeir-Toril evolved? We know a lot of the demihumans didn't. Maybe that's why Erevan, who's associated somewhat with shadow, isn't evil among the Tel'Quessir? Truthfully, I do tend to play somewhat stereotyped characters, to the point of redundancy (Shade Human Shadow Adept/Shadowcraft Mage of Shar, Fire Genasi Fire Elementalist of Kossuth, etc.) But that's just because I tend to play zealously dedicated types. And even though fantasy's rife with overused villainous stereotypes, there's usually a reason why those stereotypes came about - at this point, they instinctively, subconsciously evoke certain emotions in our brains. (Like the darkness/black = 'bad' example, even though it's philosophically not universal - darkness still makes our serotonin levels drop.) I forgot where I was going. Bye. :)