DM's Regret [Archive] - Wizards Community

DM's Regret [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Garnet Hardeon
07-11-03, 07:12 PM Just asking to see if this is common:

Do you ever regret becoming a DM? Most of us start RPGs by being players to more experienced players who finally had a try at DMming. In that transition (from player to DM), has anyone ever regretted that change of status?

I have 2 play groups, and I'm a DM for one, and a player for the other. I have a lot of fun being a player...until my DM brings something up that I just KNOW the facts to. For example, he sicks a behir on us. We're supposedly 10th level characters who've never encountered that monster before. The other players haven't (literally) encountered the monster. They haven't even cracked open the Monster's Manual. So, they charge in anyway, roleplaying naturally.

I, on the other hand, know what a behir does. I know that if I get within range of its lightning, I'm fried. What matters to me is that my character shouldn't know. Now, I'm faced with a quandary: do I charge in, knowing that I will get fried for it, my fellow PCs will get fried for it, etc...or do I apply that knowledge and say, cast protection from lightning before I wade into battle? Regardless, either way is unnatural role-playing.

It gets worse in Faerun (our favorite campaign setting), as I have the same resources as my DM by virtue of being a DM for another gaming group. E.G., In the Underdark: What's that strange glow?Faezress. Whoops, my character knows. Hey, that drow can levitate! (Mind betrays me: "well, the must mean that drow is Highborn") or such. It's not like I can turn off what I know from having read and studied the DM books, right?

My DM knows that I DM for another group, and he does his best to be creative and creates wholly new creatures, situations, spells etc so that gaming isn't compromised. But it's awfully unfair to him that he has to do that at all! The compromise we've reached so far is that I wait a little longer than he does when the supplements come in. That way, he knows stuff I wouldn't know, and then things get less stilted. My other gaming group (the one I DM for) has been awfully gracious and understand that the lag between my organizing campaigns is longer than before since I have to wait a little for supplements every once and a while.

I'm glad that my situation is more or less amicable. But sometimes, it can get irritating. I don't think when one becomes a DM from a player, it means that the aspect of a player becomes ruined. But in my case, I have to admit it's altered a bit.

Oh well. That's what I think DM's Regret is. Does anyone know to fix that? Can it be fixed?
someone not you
07-11-03, 07:22 PM Well, the only thing I have to say about this is you need to seperate player from character knowledge.

You might know that you can build a kite and make it fly, but that doesn't mean it will. Use your common sense, would your player run up to a large nasty monster that is known to have something to do with lighting, or would he back off a bit and stay away?

The best example of this from my own playing/DM'ing is from World of Darkness, I was playing a character who would have no idea about this guy we captured who tried to attack us, he told us some stuff I know out of game that was wholly unbelievable to my character and I immediatley yelled "BULLS**T!!! That's absurd! This guy must be mental or something!!" I was awarded extra experience for it as my DM thought it was so funny.

Play your character not yourself!!!!!

I am NOT complaining at you or saying I am better by the way...just giving you some helpful hints possibly.

:angel:
Cthulhu
07-11-03, 07:30 PM I started out as a DM and it was several years before I actually got to play. I found I loved to play, but it was never quite the same thrill as DMing.

Anyway...I frequently ran into the same problem as Garnet, with the irritation of KNOWING what I really didn't want to know when I was a player. This offended my sense of DM fairness (something I maybe should dump if I'm actually playing :D ) to the point where I run my PCs almost like NPCs. Or I play characters that are a bit to agressive for there own good and find myself rushing into situations I know are bad for the character, so as not to give myself a chance to think about it. Or I find myself bored as I wait for the other players to finish what they are working through.

This is a good question, and I don't think there is an easy answer. Not if you want to continue playing the same FR campaign as your other group.

Your best bet might be to find someone playing with alternate settings and modules, or a different game system. Its not exactly fair to you if you love the FR campaign, but when has this ever been fair to DMs?
Garnet Hardeon
07-11-03, 08:16 PM What's awful is when my fellow players accuse me.

"Why didn't you tell us?" or "It was easier for you because bleh bleh bleh..."

Like I'm going to help ruin the hard work our DM put in for us! Sheesh! Thank goodness, that was nipped in the bud, but one or two resentful ones...they suck. That's just my opinion, but really...
Garnet Hardeon
07-11-03, 08:37 PM Well, the only thing I have to say about this is you need to seperate player from character knowledge.

Which I wish I could do, but sometimes, the info just pops up. I wish I could deal with it like an off-on switch. Once I blurted, "but that can't be! I KNOW that girl's SR, and it's not as high as you think it is!"

My DM laughed and acceded. I got nasty looks from the other players.

Oh well, it's a lonely cruise to and fro the DM's screen. :)
Gadodel
07-11-03, 09:20 PM My instinct is to create, design and storytell-to be the DM. A lot of the folks I have played with in the past like me as the DM. Yet, like everyone; I want a chance to play...to take a break from the "management" side of the game. Though, many folks dislike me as a player...mostly because I am just as intense.

That intensity serves me well as a DM, but not as a player.

From this I learned that taking breaks, sometime as long as a couple of weeks is the cure of many ills.
Lashan
07-12-03, 09:28 AM You get better at seperating player knowledge vs personel knowledge. At this point, my friends and I have been playing DnD for 22 years. We have all been DMs and players. It's still a great game and we have fun with it.

One thing that a DM can do is mix things up. That can happen in 3E better then in other editions. You can now have a half-dragon/celestial/infernal type creature. There are a ton of things you can add onto the critters that you don't know about. Just have your DM start doing that. Even then, you will be suprised.
Shadow_god
07-15-03, 12:21 AM I DM most of the time so I get stuck like you when I play a pc. The best thing I can think of is role general knowledge checks for yourself, you DM you should be able to set a fitting dc. If you fail simply act stupid, otherwise you get to show off your PC's mental might in a new way.
Xae'an
07-15-03, 07:44 PM In my group it was quite a logical choice that I would be the DM, since I'm the only one with rule books and sufficient knowledge about D&D rules and about the Forgotten Realms. I thought it would become quite a difficult task and I wasn't sure if I could do it in a proper way, but then everything turned out fine. I think DMing is far easier if your players have little knowledge about the campaign world (they know it primarily from the computer games, only two of them have read novels about it) and have to explore it. It's more interessting for them too, as what they discover is something new for themselves as well as for their characters. Also you can occasionally change or adjust the setting a bit and nobody will notice. I don't regret becoming a DM at all.
Triton
07-15-03, 07:56 PM Amen. Some of the worst players can be those that argue over every call you make, because they own a lot of the books, and know all the secrets. "You can't do that, there are no Zhents in Unther. My thief would have heard if there was."
To me the worst is the ones who don't understand why their 3rd level thief 3 level ninja is not allowed to try a triple backflip into a summersault run down the side of the tunnel like Neo, around the paladin fighting three orcs to be ready for a backstab on the next round. This isn't the freakn Matrix. 6th level characters don't naturally do that.
Azzadar
07-15-03, 08:29 PM I don't regret becoming a DM and playing in other games. I tend to get into character well and try hard to react as the charater would.

I would like to give a piece of advice I was taught about DMing.

Don't tell your players everything. I don't name monsters, unless there character knows what it is. The first time they fought a hydra, I described the way it looked and moved. I don't say, "A five headed fire hydra attacks you." They didn't know what it was. Doing this creates some fear and mystery in encounters. They freaked out after I described a pair of zombies in a dark room. I do the same thing for traps and items they find.
Keldor D'Antrell
07-17-03, 10:28 PM Doesn't it explain this in the 3e DMG? It does in the 2nd ed. Always _only_ describe what the players sense.
How would _any_ PC know a monster's correct name? In my campaigns, I have the players name the monsters themselves until they learn the 'correct' name from someone who does know it. I also remind the players of things they don't know, wouldn't/couldn't know. My point: if a DM becomes a player and attempts to use player knowledge, the DM should notice this (because the DM should know the background of the PCs and how experienced they are, what they would know about encountered monsters, etc.).
I once ran into a basilisk with my beloved PCs and I gritted my teeth and rushed it to kill it like I had no idea what it could do. Luckily only one of them had to face a petrification saving throw and he made it so thereafter my PCs could say they knew about the dangers of basilisks i.e. knew that they did something with their eyes so it's best not to meet their gaze. [A clever player would then do some research when his PC got back to civilisation].
Ivarrius
07-17-03, 10:59 PM I have always been a PC, up until recently when I tried DM'ing for the first time. My DM has switched to become a character now, and I can see that he faces some of the same problems you mentioned Garnet.

He has just learned that His dwarven fighter, has a limited knowledge of Magical spells and Monsters, but has a good knowledge of how to combat Goblinoids and Giants. When he comes up against something.. he may know what it is OOC, but he usually plays it off well.

In your case however... no one says you have to play a dim witted adventurer who runs head long into every encounter.. play the safe PC who always warns the group. You don't haev to say, 'that guy has a crazy lightning attack' but you could say.. 'whoa friends.. we have yet to fight one of these... we know not what it is capable of. perhaps we should be a bit more careful.'

That way you aren't DM-izing.. you are just roleplaying.
Arsonist
07-18-03, 12:06 AM For example, he sicks a behir on us. We're supposedly 10th level characters who've never encountered that monster before. The other players haven't (literally) encountered the monster. They haven't even cracked open the Monster's Manual. So, they charge in anyway, roleplaying naturally.

They all roleplay idiots? I haven't been playing for long but I can't see a group going very far if they rush into attack monsters they have yet to face before...
.
.
.
Unless they were Dwarves. In which case...good for them!

Anyhow, the DM/player transition does seem tough. My DMs (husband and wife) have apparently always switched out the role of DM in order to keep a solid feel for both approaches to the game. It seems to work very well. He has been playing a Half-Orc warrior, quite successfully (read: Stupid, stupid Orc), for the past 2 years, yet he knows an unbelievable amount of info on the FR setting.
thalious
07-18-03, 03:54 AM My only regret in being the DM is that it is almost impossible for me to ever get to be a player, since I have almost all the books, the session are at my house, and sad to say, I do the best job as DM, though one of my players is good, just needs more time behind the screen and some books of his own. Mine are all stuffed with pieces of paper in varies pages with crucial info that I can't just lend out and dont want to dislodge and thus lose their spots.
Garnet Hardeon
07-18-03, 06:43 AM They all roleplay idiots? I haven't been playing for long but I can't see a group going very far if they rush into attack monsters they have yet to face before...

I wouldn't say idiots :); as our DM was describing the behir, one of the players thought he knew what he was dealing with and convinced everyone to rush in. (What did he think it was? A serpentine automaton we had dealt with previously. Oh well, he learned the hard way. :D
Keldor D'Antrell
07-18-03, 11:02 AM Ooh that reminds me of the time my party was investigating some caves on a mountainside. We had already been in several and despatched the resident cavemen (weren't we the typical bunch of hack and slash mercenaries!) and had got to assuming that this was just a little common or garden cave man community we were dealing with. We dutifully traipsed into the next cave and found ourselves confronting an angry green dragon which promptly breathed on us! Everyone dropped dead except for the toughest dwarven fighter who had sufficient HP to fail his save and still live (and he _did_ fail his save!) and the halfling warrior who could only survive if he saved (he always _was_ lucky!). The two of them killed it in the end and the PCs in question still live(!) but they learned something that day, I can tell you!:D
kidjay76
07-18-03, 11:09 AM "Well, the only thing I have to say about this is you need to seperate player from character knowledge."

Agreed. I DM for one group and play Lord of the Rings RPG for another. The LOTR GM (or narrator, as they're called) plays in my D&D campaign. There's never been a problem about either of us knowing too much. Play in character and the rest will follow. What would your character do in a situation? Use that as a base point and go from there. If you've created an adventure correctly, your players should stand a fighting chance of winning through any battle they fight anyway.

This is actually a problem that happens even to players who don't DM. What's line between what you know and what your character knows? If you're playing a barbarian with intelligence 8, your character probably isn't inclined to stop for 10 minutes and logically analyze a puzzle, the way you yourself might. I find in our group that everyone's pretty good at staying in character.

Finally, don't overthink it. Metagame thinking is going to happen occasionally. Everyone makes mistakes, DMs and players alike. If you're enjoying your character and no one else is complaining, don't sweat how you roleplay tactics in combat.
Patrakis
07-18-03, 12:35 PM For me, Playing has so much to do with story and so little with rules that i can't relate with your problems being a PC vs a DM.

Story is pretty much everything in our game and ROLE is also very important. The fact that i know the rules isnt important since i play a ROLE and i get my challenges after 20 years of playing in how well i play these roles.

If i play a low intelligence PCs i have fun playing that role and do my best to play dumb. The same goes for a really wise cleric, i like that role too.

The same thing applies to rules knowledge, if my character never saw a displacer beast in his life, you bet i'll do my best to play as if i never did. Thats the fun, the challenge of playing after 20 years.

And that is my 2 coppers worth.
Garnet Hardeon
07-18-03, 01:29 PM Lots of posts about separating character knowledge and DM knowledge. Yes, this is being done. I agree, (and this does happen in my case) that entering a role so fully does displace this knowledge.

But sometimes, just sometimes (not all the time, but enough that when it does happen, it's a blooming nuisance), the info one picks up just enters. Again, it's not like people have an "on-off" switch with regards to what they know.

Oh well. At the end of the day, I've resolved that this just has to be done on a case to case basis. :)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Garnet Hardeon 07-11-03, 07:12 PM	Just asking to see if this is common: Do you ever regret becoming a DM? Most of us start RPGs by being players to more experienced players who finally had a try at DMming. In that transition (from player to DM), has anyone ever regretted that change of status? I have 2 play groups, and I'm a DM for one, and a player for the other. I have a lot of fun being a player...until my DM brings something up that I just KNOW the facts to. For example, he sicks a behir on us. We're supposedly 10th level characters who've never encountered that monster before. The other players haven't (literally) encountered the monster. They haven't even cracked open the Monster's Manual. So, they charge in anyway, roleplaying naturally. I, on the other hand, know what a behir does. I know that if I get within range of its lightning, I'm fried. What matters to me is that my character shouldn't know. Now, I'm faced with a quandary: do I charge in, knowing that I will get fried for it, my fellow PCs will get fried for it, etc...or do I apply that knowledge and say, cast protection from lightning before I wade into battle? Regardless, either way is unnatural role-playing. It gets worse in Faerun (our favorite campaign setting), as I have the same resources as my DM by virtue of being a DM for another gaming group. E.G., In the Underdark: What's that strange glow?Faezress. Whoops, my character knows. Hey, that drow can levitate! (Mind betrays me: "well, the must mean that drow is Highborn") or such. It's not like I can turn off what I know from having read and studied the DM books, right? My DM knows that I DM for another group, and he does his best to be creative and creates wholly new creatures, situations, spells etc so that gaming isn't compromised. But it's awfully unfair to him that he has to do that at all! The compromise we've reached so far is that I wait a little longer than he does when the supplements come in. That way, he knows stuff I wouldn't know, and then things get less stilted. My other gaming group (the one I DM for) has been awfully gracious and understand that the lag between my organizing campaigns is longer than before since I have to wait a little for supplements every once and a while. I'm glad that my situation is more or less amicable. But sometimes, it can get irritating. I don't think when one becomes a DM from a player, it means that the aspect of a player becomes ruined. But in my case, I have to admit it's altered a bit. Oh well. That's what I think DM's Regret is. Does anyone know to fix that? Can it be fixed?
someone not you 07-11-03, 07:22 PM	Well, the only thing I have to say about this is you need to seperate player from character knowledge. You might know that you can build a kite and make it fly, but that doesn't mean it will. Use your common sense, would your player run up to a large nasty monster that is known to have something to do with lighting, or would he back off a bit and stay away? The best example of this from my own playing/DM'ing is from World of Darkness, I was playing a character who would have no idea about this guy we captured who tried to attack us, he told us some stuff I know out of game that was wholly unbelievable to my character and I immediatley yelled "BULLS**T!!! That's absurd! This guy must be mental or something!!" I was awarded extra experience for it as my DM thought it was so funny. Play your character not yourself!!!!! I am NOT complaining at you or saying I am better by the way...just giving you some helpful hints possibly. :angel:
Cthulhu 07-11-03, 07:30 PM	I started out as a DM and it was several years before I actually got to play. I found I loved to play, but it was never quite the same thrill as DMing. Anyway...I frequently ran into the same problem as Garnet, with the irritation of KNOWING what I really didn't want to know when I was a player. This offended my sense of DM fairness (something I maybe should dump if I'm actually playing :D ) to the point where I run my PCs almost like NPCs. Or I play characters that are a bit to agressive for there own good and find myself rushing into situations I know are bad for the character, so as not to give myself a chance to think about it. Or I find myself bored as I wait for the other players to finish what they are working through. This is a good question, and I don't think there is an easy answer. Not if you want to continue playing the same FR campaign as your other group. Your best bet might be to find someone playing with alternate settings and modules, or a different game system. Its not exactly fair to you if you love the FR campaign, but when has this ever been fair to DMs?
Garnet Hardeon 07-11-03, 08:16 PM	What's awful is when my fellow players accuse me. "Why didn't you tell us?" or "It was easier for you because bleh bleh bleh..." Like I'm going to help ruin the hard work our DM put in for us! Sheesh! Thank goodness, that was nipped in the bud, but one or two resentful ones...they suck. That's just my opinion, but really...
Garnet Hardeon 07-11-03, 08:37 PM	Well, the only thing I have to say about this is you need to seperate player from character knowledge. Which I wish I could do, but sometimes, the info just pops up. I wish I could deal with it like an off-on switch. Once I blurted, "but that can't be! I KNOW that girl's SR, and it's not as high as you think it is!" My DM laughed and acceded. I got nasty looks from the other players. Oh well, it's a lonely cruise to and fro the DM's screen. :)
Gadodel 07-11-03, 09:20 PM	My instinct is to create, design and storytell-to be the DM. A lot of the folks I have played with in the past like me as the DM. Yet, like everyone; I want a chance to play...to take a break from the "management" side of the game. Though, many folks dislike me as a player...mostly because I am just as intense. That intensity serves me well as a DM, but not as a player. From this I learned that taking breaks, sometime as long as a couple of weeks is the cure of many ills.
Lashan 07-12-03, 09:28 AM	You get better at seperating player knowledge vs personel knowledge. At this point, my friends and I have been playing DnD for 22 years. We have all been DMs and players. It's still a great game and we have fun with it. One thing that a DM can do is mix things up. That can happen in 3E better then in other editions. You can now have a half-dragon/celestial/infernal type creature. There are a ton of things you can add onto the critters that you don't know about. Just have your DM start doing that. Even then, you will be suprised.
Shadow_god 07-15-03, 12:21 AM	I DM most of the time so I get stuck like you when I play a pc. The best thing I can think of is role general knowledge checks for yourself, you DM you should be able to set a fitting dc. If you fail simply act stupid, otherwise you get to show off your PC's mental might in a new way.
Xae'an 07-15-03, 07:44 PM	In my group it was quite a logical choice that I would be the DM, since I'm the only one with rule books and sufficient knowledge about D&D rules and about the Forgotten Realms. I thought it would become quite a difficult task and I wasn't sure if I could do it in a proper way, but then everything turned out fine. I think DMing is far easier if your players have little knowledge about the campaign world (they know it primarily from the computer games, only two of them have read novels about it) and have to explore it. It's more interessting for them too, as what they discover is something new for themselves as well as for their characters. Also you can occasionally change or adjust the setting a bit and nobody will notice. I don't regret becoming a DM at all.
Triton 07-15-03, 07:56 PM	Amen. Some of the worst players can be those that argue over every call you make, because they own a lot of the books, and know all the secrets. "You can't do that, there are no Zhents in Unther. My thief would have heard if there was." To me the worst is the ones who don't understand why their 3rd level thief 3 level ninja is not allowed to try a triple backflip into a summersault run down the side of the tunnel like Neo, around the paladin fighting three orcs to be ready for a backstab on the next round. This isn't the freakn Matrix. 6th level characters don't naturally do that.
Azzadar 07-15-03, 08:29 PM	I don't regret becoming a DM and playing in other games. I tend to get into character well and try hard to react as the charater would. I would like to give a piece of advice I was taught about DMing. Don't tell your players everything. I don't name monsters, unless there character knows what it is. The first time they fought a hydra, I described the way it looked and moved. I don't say, "A five headed fire hydra attacks you." They didn't know what it was. Doing this creates some fear and mystery in encounters. They freaked out after I described a pair of zombies in a dark room. I do the same thing for traps and items they find.
Keldor D'Antrell 07-17-03, 10:28 PM	Doesn't it explain this in the 3e DMG? It does in the 2nd ed. Always _only_ describe what the players sense. How would _any_ PC know a monster's correct name? In my campaigns, I have the players name the monsters themselves until they learn the 'correct' name from someone who does know it. I also remind the players of things they don't know, wouldn't/couldn't know. My point: if a DM becomes a player and attempts to use player knowledge, the DM should notice this (because the DM should know the background of the PCs and how experienced they are, what they would know about encountered monsters, etc.). I once ran into a basilisk with my beloved PCs and I gritted my teeth and rushed it to kill it like I had no idea what it could do. Luckily only one of them had to face a petrification saving throw and he made it so thereafter my PCs could say they knew about the dangers of basilisks i.e. knew that they did something with their eyes so it's best not to meet their gaze. [A clever player would then do some research when his PC got back to civilisation].
Ivarrius 07-17-03, 10:59 PM	I have always been a PC, up until recently when I tried DM'ing for the first time. My DM has switched to become a character now, and I can see that he faces some of the same problems you mentioned Garnet. He has just learned that His dwarven fighter, has a limited knowledge of Magical spells and Monsters, but has a good knowledge of how to combat Goblinoids and Giants. When he comes up against something.. he may know what it is OOC, but he usually plays it off well. In your case however... no one says you have to play a dim witted adventurer who runs head long into every encounter.. play the safe PC who always warns the group. You don't haev to say, 'that guy has a crazy lightning attack' but you could say.. 'whoa friends.. we have yet to fight one of these... we know not what it is capable of. perhaps we should be a bit more careful.' That way you aren't DM-izing.. you are just roleplaying.
Arsonist 07-18-03, 12:06 AM	For example, he sicks a behir on us. We're supposedly 10th level characters who've never encountered that monster before. The other players haven't (literally) encountered the monster. They haven't even cracked open the Monster's Manual. So, they charge in anyway, roleplaying naturally. They all roleplay idiots? I haven't been playing for long but I can't see a group going very far if they rush into attack monsters they have yet to face before... . . . Unless they were Dwarves. In which case...good for them! Anyhow, the DM/player transition does seem tough. My DMs (husband and wife) have apparently always switched out the role of DM in order to keep a solid feel for both approaches to the game. It seems to work very well. He has been playing a Half-Orc warrior, quite successfully (read: Stupid, stupid Orc), for the past 2 years, yet he knows an unbelievable amount of info on the FR setting.
thalious 07-18-03, 03:54 AM	My only regret in being the DM is that it is almost impossible for me to ever get to be a player, since I have almost all the books, the session are at my house, and sad to say, I do the best job as DM, though one of my players is good, just needs more time behind the screen and some books of his own. Mine are all stuffed with pieces of paper in varies pages with crucial info that I can't just lend out and dont want to dislodge and thus lose their spots.
Garnet Hardeon 07-18-03, 06:43 AM	They all roleplay idiots? I haven't been playing for long but I can't see a group going very far if they rush into attack monsters they have yet to face before... I wouldn't say idiots :); as our DM was describing the behir, one of the players thought he knew what he was dealing with and convinced everyone to rush in. (What did he think it was? A serpentine automaton we had dealt with previously. Oh well, he learned the hard way. :D
Keldor D'Antrell 07-18-03, 11:02 AM	Ooh that reminds me of the time my party was investigating some caves on a mountainside. We had already been in several and despatched the resident cavemen (weren't we the typical bunch of hack and slash mercenaries!) and had got to assuming that this was just a little common or garden cave man community we were dealing with. We dutifully traipsed into the next cave and found ourselves confronting an angry green dragon which promptly breathed on us! Everyone dropped dead except for the toughest dwarven fighter who had sufficient HP to fail his save and still live (and he _did_ fail his save!) and the halfling warrior who could only survive if he saved (he always _was_ lucky!). The two of them killed it in the end and the PCs in question still live(!) but they learned something that day, I can tell you!:D
kidjay76 07-18-03, 11:09 AM	"Well, the only thing I have to say about this is you need to seperate player from character knowledge." Agreed. I DM for one group and play Lord of the Rings RPG for another. The LOTR GM (or narrator, as they're called) plays in my D&D campaign. There's never been a problem about either of us knowing too much. Play in character and the rest will follow. What would your character do in a situation? Use that as a base point and go from there. If you've created an adventure correctly, your players should stand a fighting chance of winning through any battle they fight anyway. This is actually a problem that happens even to players who don't DM. What's line between what you know and what your character knows? If you're playing a barbarian with intelligence 8, your character probably isn't inclined to stop for 10 minutes and logically analyze a puzzle, the way you yourself might. I find in our group that everyone's pretty good at staying in character. Finally, don't overthink it. Metagame thinking is going to happen occasionally. Everyone makes mistakes, DMs and players alike. If you're enjoying your character and no one else is complaining, don't sweat how you roleplay tactics in combat.
Patrakis 07-18-03, 12:35 PM	For me, Playing has so much to do with story and so little with rules that i can't relate with your problems being a PC vs a DM. Story is pretty much everything in our game and ROLE is also very important. The fact that i know the rules isnt important since i play a ROLE and i get my challenges after 20 years of playing in how well i play these roles. If i play a low intelligence PCs i have fun playing that role and do my best to play dumb. The same goes for a really wise cleric, i like that role too. The same thing applies to rules knowledge, if my character never saw a displacer beast in his life, you bet i'll do my best to play as if i never did. Thats the fun, the challenge of playing after 20 years. And that is my 2 coppers worth.
Garnet Hardeon 07-18-03, 01:29 PM	Lots of posts about separating character knowledge and DM knowledge. Yes, this is being done. I agree, (and this does happen in my case) that entering a role so fully does displace this knowledge. But sometimes, just sometimes (not all the time, but enough that when it does happen, it's a blooming nuisance), the info one picks up just enters. Again, it's not like people have an "on-off" switch with regards to what they know. Oh well. At the end of the day, I've resolved that this just has to be done on a case to case basis. :)