| Post/Author/DateTime | Post |
|---|---|
| Bullet0632002-23-08, 01:47 AM | Recently I have been running a Modern D20 game. I had my players make 17 year old school students as thier PC's. FYI Big Mistake one decided to kill his parents, one started robbing everything he could, one actually managed to rob a national guard armory(Good rolls on his part, bad rolls on mine). I may have made a few mistakes running it, well it happens, I then threw them a twist and one of thier NPC friends took them "sliding". I just recently finished watching all 3 seasons and got the idea from there. It was challanging to keep coming up with alternate earths, well, they took the sliding conrol from thier friend, how was the only one that knew how it works, and killed him too. I may have forgotten to mention that this happens to be a morally challenged group of players, I mean Characters, that did this. To punish them, after they just started pressing random buttons they slide into the Realms. of course they drove a 2007 Chevy Siverado with a bed full of military weopons into the portal and when they got to the otherside, the truck died and all the electronics died. After slaughtering a local farm family and stealing the horses and stuff, they now have a "War Wagon" being pulled by six draft horses. Needless to say, the realms may be changed forever after these guys get done just thought I would share this with everyone |
| johnkretzer02-23-08, 02:44 AM | Recently I have been running a Modern D20 game. I had my players make 17 year old school students as thier PC's. FYI Big Mistake one decided to kill his parents, one started robbing everything he could, one actually managed to rob a national guard armory(Good rolls on his part, bad rolls on mine). I may have made a few mistakes running it, well it happens, I then threw them a twist and one of thier NPC friends took them "sliding". I just recently finished watching all 3 seasons and got the idea from there. It was challanging to keep coming up with alternate earths, well, they took the sliding conrol from thier friend, how was the only one that knew how it works, and killed him too. I may have forgotten to mention that this happens to be a morally challenged group of players, I mean Characters, that did this. To punish them, after they just started pressing random buttons they slide into the Realms. of course they drove a 2007 Chevy Siverado with a bed full of military weopons into the portal and when they got to the otherside, the truck died and all the electronics died. After slaughtering a local farm family and stealing the horses and stuff, they now have a "War Wagon" being pulled by six draft horses. Needless to say, the realms may be changed forever after these guys get done just thought I would share this with everyone You do know all that military hardware doesn't work in the Realms? Gunpowder doesn't function in the Realms the same way electronics doesn't either. |
| Bullet0632002-23-08, 03:15 AM | we debated the gunpowder thing on Seals vs Drow thread for a while, and in my opinion the gunpowder weopons would work as long they have Ammo. I haven't seen anything in print to suggest that mechanical or chemical stuff from other worlds wouldn't work, just electronic stuff doesn't work It comes down to my world/my rules. I am the Almighty DM, I am God. Already planning on taking most of the guns away anyways. I doubt 3rd level characters can shoot down a big Dragon. I was working on it, A Dragon swooped down in the middle of the night and started eating the horse's. One of my players Critted on a called shot to the dragons eye. The dragon freaked and ran off to lick his wounds. it gives me the excuse for a reoccurring enemy, just haven't decided on the details of a one eye dragon yet They are currently in the dalelands and am thinking about putting the timeline shortly before the Godswar, and run them through that adventure |
| Old Sage02-23-08, 03:26 AM | If you're adhering to Realms canon, and you're talking about modern tech [or any type of derivative for that matter] that would run on electronic components or use electricity for power... it simply won't work in the Realms. We know this from the 1e and 2e FRCS box sets. To put it simply, the physics of Toril/Realmspace won't allow such aspects to function. Gun powder doesn't either, which is why the Realms has magical smoke powder. Smoke powder weapons were introduced to FR at the beginning of 2e in Forgotten Realms Adventures. During the Time of Troubles, Gond imparted the knowledge of smoke powder weapons to the Lantanese. |
| Bullet0632002-23-08, 03:42 AM | I don't always adhere to cannon, most of the time though, players always have a way of changing things though. Everyones version of the realms is different depending on what happens in thier campaigns. For now, I'm allowing the firearms, once the ammo runs out or I steal them, different story. they have to find or make new guns |
| johnkretzer02-23-08, 06:25 AM | we debated the gunpowder thing on Seals vs Drow thread for a while, and in my opinion the gunpowder weopons would work as long they have Ammo. I haven't seen anything in print to suggest that mechanical or chemical stuff from other worlds wouldn't work, just electronic stuff doesn't work It comes down to my world/my rules. I am the Almighty DM, I am God. Already planning on taking most of the guns away anyways. I doubt 3rd level characters can shoot down a big Dragon. I was working on it, A Dragon swooped down in the middle of the night and started eating the horse's. One of my players Critted on a called shot to the dragons eye. The dragon freaked and ran off to lick his wounds. it gives me the excuse for a reoccurring enemy, just haven't decided on the details of a one eye dragon yet They are currently in the dalelands and am thinking about putting the timeline shortly before the Godswar, and run them through that adventure You are right it is your game, personbaly I wouldn't like it much with those players. But as long as you guys are having fun I really don't care that much. Enjoy the game. Though a dragon breathing fire at them should really be a bad thing for them as things like ammo and are not very heat resistant. |
| Meldread02-23-08, 08:55 AM | When I read this, I laughed. Hard. It sounds like a hilarious game. |
| Lord Karsus02-23-08, 10:50 AM | Though a dragon breathing fire at them should really be a bad thing for them as things like ammo and are not very heat resistant. -Yeah... |
| MarkusTay6302-23-08, 02:23 PM | Sounds like my Brother-in-law's group... the guys I refuse to play with anymore. The game is about HEROES, not psychotics - if your friends enjoy this they need to seek immediate medical attention... for all our sakes. Or tell them to play GTA - it sounds about their speed. :rolleyes: Also, Gunpowder DOES NOT work in the Realms - if brought in from outside, it WILL NOT FUNCTION - it says so right in the Realmspace book. If you are not using the rules, then you are running something else, not FR/D&D. I am a fan of Sliders as well - if I were you, I'd run them into a group of Cromags... lots and LOTS of Cromags. :devil: |
| Lord Karsus02-23-08, 04:43 PM | Also, Gunpowder DOES NOT work in the Realms - if brought in from outside, it WILL NOT FUNCTION - it says so right in the Realmspace book. -Yes, he's been told three times now! Twice he's responded that he is not going to adhere to the rule! Geeze! If you are not using the rules, then you are running something else, not FR/D&D. -Come on, MT. Don't be like that. :: Disappointment :: |
| Mula02-23-08, 07:00 PM | Also, Gunpowder DOES NOT work in the Realms - if brought in from outside, it WILL NOT FUNCTION - it says so right in the Realmspace book. If you are not using the rules, then you are running something else, not FR/D&D.Whoah, that's harsh. Gunpowder, while non-existant, works just fine in my Realms. I still play D&D in FR, though. Your stance would mean that a large number of posters here on the FR boards aren't actually playing FR at all, since they're deviating from the canon. |
| Lord Karsus02-23-08, 07:09 PM | Your stance would mean that a large number of posters here on the FR boards aren't actually playing FR at all, since they're deviating from the canon. -He, himself, wouldn't be playing in the Forgotten Realms. |
| MarkusTay6302-24-08, 02:11 AM | I don't play in the cnaon Forgotten realms, I play in MY realms... and in my realms, Gunpowder doesn't work! I don't mind changing the lore, or the geography, but I don't like changing rules - especially ones that make such a devastating impact on the Realms. Do you have any idea how many high-levs are aware of other planes of existance? Don't you think some evil types would have imported high-tech weaponry ages ago if it functioned? The Imaskari probably would have had lasers and light-sabers, for chrisakes! Changing things to make the game more fun for your group is one thing, but changing them just a so a bunch of bloodthirsty savages can have their little blood-bath wet dream is ridiculous. Just pop in a copy of Faces of Death and let them get their hard-ons that way. :rolleyes: Seriously, none of you see anything wrong in giving a bunch of people the ability to masacre at will, without the other side being able to stop it? Even if they did find Gunpowder that DID funtion on Toril (and if you read the Chronicle of Amber, which Sliders is a cheap Sci-Fi rip-off of, it is entirely possible with an infinite number of alternate worlds), the 'forces that be' would show up soon enough. The Harpers, or El, or someone else would just turn them all into sheep... or pigs. I don't mind D20 Modern - I used to play in an Aftermath Campaign, and it was great fun. I just despise the idea of dumping THAT into a medieval fantasy world, UNCHECKED. I try to keep an open mind, but this is just pickin' at an old scab for me... :( |
| johnkretzer02-24-08, 06:51 AM | I don't play in the cnaon Forgotten realms, I play in MY realms... and in my realms, Gunpowder doesn't work! I don't mind changing the lore, or the geography, but I don't like changing rules - especially ones that make such a devastating impact on the Realms. Do you have any idea how many high-levs are aware of other planes of existance? Don't you think some evil types would have imported high-tech weaponry ages ago if it functioned? The Imaskari probably would have had lasers and light-sabers, for chrisakes! Changing things to make the game more fun for your group is one thing, but changing them just a so a bunch of bloodthirsty savages can have their little blood-bath wet dream is ridiculous. Just pop in a copy of Faces of Death and let them get their hard-ons that way. :rolleyes: Seriously, none of you see anything wrong in giving a bunch of people the ability to masacre at will, without the other side being able to stop it? Even if they did find Gunpowder that DID funtion on Toril (and if you read the Chronicle of Amber, which Sliders is a cheap Sci-Fi rip-off of, it is entirely possible with an infinite number of alternate worlds), the 'forces that be' would show up soon enough. The Harpers, or El, or someone else would just turn them all into sheep... or pigs. I don't mind D20 Modern - I used to play in an Aftermath Campaign, and it was great fun. I just despise the idea of dumping THAT into a medieval fantasy world, UNCHECKED. I try to keep an open mind, but this is just pickin' at an old scab for me... :( I agree with you in that it is a probably dumb campaign...disgusting...probably boring...and probably the people who play in it are people I'll aviod like the plague as I tend to find my normal civil, easygoing, and polite natute to be sorely tested around people who would enjoy this type of game in check. Also any 5th level wizard with fireball(and invis) would kill this party in a round( as I pointed out before with Dragonfire fire and ammo don't work well together) so you don't even have to bother El with these yahoos. But I also believe in freedom...if they find this game 'fun' sure they can do it...and as long as they don't try this stuff in the real world I could care less. What is the line....'I might completely disagree with what you say but I'll die to defend your right to say it.' I forgot who said this or if this is the exact quote or where it came from. |
| MarkusTay6302-24-08, 10:58 AM | I had a bad experience with a group that just did whatever they wanted, and the DM didn't try to reign them in AT ALL. You couldn't even start them out in a town, like normal, because they would immediately attack and kill everyone else in the tavern, and then go on to slaughter the rest of the town. They basically treated everything they met as monster encounter, and they had NO concept of roleplay. This just brought all those BAD memories back. :( "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it" is widely attributed to Voltaire, but cannot be found in his writings. With good reason. The phrase was invented by a later author as an epitome of his attitude. It appeared in The Friends of Voltaire (1906), written by Evelyn Beatrice Hall under the pseudonym Stephen G. Tallentyre. --- From another site... Thank You for reminding me of that... I'll just be quiet now. :embarrass |
| Lord Karsus02-24-08, 11:56 AM | I agree with you in that it is a probably dumb campaign...disgusting...probably boring...But I also believe in freedom...if they find this game 'fun' sure they can do it...and as long as they don't try this stuff in the real world I could care less. -Agreed. |
| Mula02-24-08, 01:43 PM | Seriously, none of you see anything wrong in giving a bunch of people the ability to masacre at will, without the other side being able to stop it? But you see, smokepowder really is nothing but gunpowder, wrapped in a magical package. The Realms already has gunpowder, it's just magical in nature. The reason it's not very widespread is because most people don't want exploding powders and guns and bullets in their semi-medieval fantasy. |
| GothicDan02-24-08, 01:50 PM | Annnd magic isn't available on an every day level in such large quantities as gunpowder. Faerun would be a very different place if gunpowder functioned. Honestly, people not noticing such significant ramifications of historical alteration REALLY disturbs me, and makes me perturbed about the world in general. Like, I was up last night thinking about it for quite awhile. It sort of scares me, and I'm hoping that non-RPG folk might understand how things work - but I seriously doubt it. |
| johnkretzer02-24-08, 01:58 PM | I had a bad experience with a group that just did whatever they wanted, and the DM didn't try to reign them in AT ALL. You couldn't even start them out in a town, like normal, because they would immediately attack and kill everyone else in the tavern, and then go on to slaughter the rest of the town. They basically treated everything they met as monster encounter, and they had NO concept of roleplay. This just brought all those BAD memories back. :( "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it" is widely attributed to Voltaire, but cannot be found in his writings. With good reason. The phrase was invented by a later author as an epitome of his attitude. It appeared in The Friends of Voltaire (1906), written by Evelyn Beatrice Hall under the pseudonym Stephen G. Tallentyre. --- From another site... Thank You for reminding me of that... I'll just be quiet now. :embarrass Oh you don't have to be quiet about it....the above statement says nothing about critizing it, especialy in light of the fact that he did post in a public forum. It is just that saying you are playing it wrong...is well wrong... I mean it has alot to critize about it. 1) How did they get away their 1st crimes? I mean in most case of murdering the parents kids are often the first ones they suspect. Also it seemed like the second one who stole everything in sight seemed pretty reckless and also would have been caught...as for the one who stole from the national guard armory...um how does a 17 year old have the skills to disguise a truck to hail off all that hardware...etc...etc...etc... 2) How did a 3rd level character crit. a dragon? Why was the dragon such a dumbass? Why didn't it go in and start eating them? Or use it's fear aura? Or it's breath weapon? Or about a thousand other options it has at it's disposal. 3) I don't get how the OP can even think that these three guys can do anything right unless he allows it or wants it to happen as I said give a 5th level wizard with invis. and fireball and these guys are done. They also should be hunted right now for the farmers they took out and being what they are using as a mode of transportation I really doubt they can really hide their tracks...and it is odd enough that people would be concerned what happened to those farmers...and a mid-level ranger can easily kill these guys. In my opinion they are not even worthy of attracting the attention of powerful NBPCs like El, or groups like the Harpers...except maybe because of this strange new weaponery...but if that happens they would last 2 seconds because they will be torn apart by probably 4 different groups looking to take what they have. I mean did the OP really thought he would impress us with his campaign? They is no logic to it at all it is just a ego trip for the players. Also something that strikes me that you Bullet06320 should really look at your DMing style. You spoke of punishing your players for a action they took....a DM should never punish his players....he should have consequences for their actions but it shouldn't be punishment. It might take the form of punishment for the characters like if they ever get caught for killing the farm family. Overall as I said I am not impressed by your campaign. Though it seems to me that this is probably your fist attempt at running a game so please take the above as advice and not a insult. I think you are the one who says you have never played D&D before but have read the books in a couple of posts. Anyway my other advice to you is find new players. Now if you are all having fun then keep going the way you are, but don't expect alot of players on these forums will consider this campaign cool, awesome or (insert the other 4th edition adjective used to market it). Most of them just won't waste their time responding to it. @MarkusTay63: Thank you for placing the quote I like so much. |
| johnkretzer02-24-08, 02:02 PM | Annnd magic isn't available on an every day level in such large quantities as gunpowder. Faerun would be a very different place if gunpowder functioned. Honestly, people not noticing such significant ramifications of historical alteration REALLY disturbs me, and makes me perturbed about the world in general. Like, I was up last night thinking about it for quite awhile. It sort of scares me, and I'm hoping that non-RPG folk might understand how things work - but I seriously doubt it. Don't worry Dan...rest easy I understand it too. Alot more people do to. We just don't feel the need to shout about it like those who are ignorant feel the need to shout about. Get some sleep...we can fix the world later. |
| GothicDan02-24-08, 02:12 PM | Alright, John. We'll do it later. I'll keep translating the Aeneid, now. :) |
| Lord Karsus02-24-08, 02:16 PM | ....a DM should never punish his players....he should have consequences for their actions but it shouldn't be punishment. -This, I disagree with. Consequences are often punishment for actions. My own campaign, for instance. The PCs ran into a Halfling 'don', who has a monopoly on the black market in the current city they were in. They were able to gain an audience with him, because they are looking to buy ensorceled cannon balls, which are an illegal item for personal use throughout the world. I don't know what the characters were expecting, but they encountered a very evil individual. He killed a wench for bringing him a drink that wasn't up to his standards. For whatever reason, one PC had a problem with this (his alignment is CN, mind you), stormed out, negating the deal the other players were making. He then mentioned at the close of our last game that he was going to go back at night and light the tavern on fire. If he goes through with this, I am going to have his character fail, captured, tortured by the mafioso Halfling, and killed. He had serious problems with the idea that he isn't the 'king ****' in the world. |
| GothicDan02-24-08, 02:22 PM | That sounds like a punishing consequence. :) |
| Old Sage02-24-08, 08:13 PM | But you see, smokepowder really is nothing but gunpowder, wrapped in a magical package. The Realms already has gunpowder, it's just magical in nature.Smoke powder *is* a magical powder similar to gun powder. The reason it's not very widespread is because most people don't want exploding powders and guns and bullets in their semi-medieval fantasy.The Church of Gond is the reason why smoke powder firearms are not widespread in the Realms. See the 'Firearms in the Realms' section of Forgotten Realms Adventures and Gond's entry in Faiths & Pantheons for details about how and where the use of smoke powder weapons have featured in the Realms. |
| Meldread02-24-08, 11:13 PM | Markus I know how you feel concerning mingling the real world with a fictional medieval setting when it comes to gunpowder and stuff. Although, I am equally sickened every time I read how Elminster visits Ed - it makes me want to puke every time I read how he crosses over to the real world, gives Ed little nuggets and he passes it back to us. It's a blatant breach of the fourth wall. I just ignore it and try to force it out of my mind, despite the fact that it's cannon. Even so, I still find this guys game amusing. It reminded me of Elminster and Ed, and the concept was believable if taken in that context. Especially considering that they were "sliding". If Elminster visited the real world then these guys could slide into Toril. When I read the post I burst out laughing at the mental imagery of a bunch of hell raising kids appearing on Faerun in a Chevy Silverado. Talk about not being in Kansas anymore... As for the players actions. I see nothing wrong. The game is meant to have fun. That's why it's a game. People who play Grand Theft Auto don't go around killing cops, selling drugs, picking up prostitutes (then killing them after having sex with them), slaughtering innocent people walking down the street, among the many other things you can do in GTA... As far as I am concerned the same logic applies in D&D. The way I see it, as long as everyone at the table is having fun, then there is no harm done. If these guys want to drive into Suzail with guns literally blazing, rocket launchers, and hand grenades... then hey... it's not my game. No harm, no foul. At least it isn't cannon, like Elminster's visits to the real world. |
| GothicDan02-24-08, 11:16 PM | I thought that Markus was more picking up on the historical ramifications of what would happen if the physics of Abeir-Toril was the same as Earth, not necessarily the planar connection and intermingling between the two Spheres. But, I could be wrong. :) |
| Lord Karsus02-24-08, 11:33 PM | Although, I am equally sickened every time I read how Elminster visits Ed - it makes me want to puke every time I read how he crosses over to the real world, gives Ed little nuggets and he passes it back to us. -As do I. As I brought up in another thread: -While we're talking about wacky continuity, does anyone else realize that, by affirming that Elminster visited Ed Greenwood, and told him about the setting, in AGHotR, they've unraveled reality? Not only could the final page, that takes place in the future not be possible, since Elminster would have had to have given that information to Ed Greenwood, but Ed Greenwood could have given a copy of AGHotR to Elminster, thus causing him to know the definite future, thus being able to avoid the calamity that happens in 1385 DR... |
| Meldread02-25-08, 12:01 AM | I actually think I might have been to harsh to say "it makes me want to puke"... but yeah, it's definitely an eye roller. What bothers me the most, I think, is how it shatters the suspension of disbelief by knocking down the fourth wall. I actually find the fact that these guys - who are "sliding" and end up in the Realm's slightly more believable... (if only by a bit...) But oh well. The way I see it, as long as folks are enjoying their game there shouldn't be any problems. After all, Wizard's blew the Realm's up - literally and figuratively. What they are doing is minor in comparison. |
| Lord Karsus02-25-08, 12:05 AM | What bothers me the most, I think, is how it shatters the suspension of disbelief by knocking down the fourth wall. -Elminster traveling to Earth, I have no real problem with. Earth is a world in the multiverse, so it is possible that a Planewalker/Spelljammer could visit it, and vice-versa. The part I don't like is the idea that everything published is dependent upon Elminster having chats with Ed Greenwood. It makes things- everything- seem a little hollow, in my book. |
| Meldread02-25-08, 12:28 AM | Yes, I agree. However, there is a small logical fallacy as well - there is no magic on Earth. If Elminster comes to Earth he can't travel back to Toril. It would be a one-way magical portal. It's been argued that groups such as the Mulhorandi come from a 'fictional' Earth. I could buy and accept that. However, Ed is a real person existing on the real planet Earth - the same Earth I live on. Last time I checked, while many claim to be wizards that have magical powers, they weren't opening portals or gateways to other worlds. While some folks claim to see unidentified flying objects in the sky, last time I checked, they weren't Spelljammers. :P It just feels totally unnecessary, and really doesn't have a point at all. However, I am in total agreement with you. It makes everything feel hollow. |
| Straploknight02-25-08, 12:30 AM | El is prevented from using the information in AGHotR by the Vice Presidential Action Rangers. If he were to influence events using said tome, El would likely end up a victim of the Vice Presidential Action Rangers. Its what they do man, and they are good at it! |
| johnkretzer02-25-08, 12:33 AM | -This, I disagree with. Consequences are often punishment for actions. My own campaign, for instance. The PCs ran into a Halfling 'don', who has a monopoly on the black market in the current city they were in. They were able to gain an audience with him, because they are looking to buy ensorceled cannon balls, which are an illegal item for personal use throughout the world. I don't know what the characters were expecting, but they encountered a very evil individual. He killed a wench for bringing him a drink that wasn't up to his standards. For whatever reason, one PC had a problem with this (his alignment is CN, mind you), stormed out, negating the deal the other players were making. He then mentioned at the close of our last game that he was going to go back at night and light the tavern on fire. If he goes through with this, I am going to have his character fail, captured, tortured by the mafioso Halfling, and killed. He had serious problems with the idea that he isn't the 'king ****' in the world. What I mean by this is that a DM should take a more neutral approach to his players action and view possible consequences logicaly. It seemed to me to be more of a tone of these PCs just killed my NPC I am going to get them for this attidude od the OP. I was warning against that. Now take your situration if the player covers himself perfectly with his arson attempt I just don't see how the halfling dom will know it is him to punish...but if he does so anyway then I would say that crosses the line from punishing the character to punishing the player. Of course if he leaves a signed note or something else just as obvious then he gets what coming to him. I mean I have done some boneheaded things as a player before and most of the time if I can recognize it I agree with whatever consequences happen as a result...but I have also been in siturations where I pick pocket 5 gold from a merchant and he turns around and spends thousands of gold to track me down and punish me for it(usualy by trying to kill my character spending more money)...this goes beyond all sense of logic or sensible action on part of merchants action just because that particular DM has problems with players gaining money from not killing things. Now in your player case I would say that unless he protects himself with non-detection spells eventualy that halfling crime boss will catch up to him. I hope that is clearer in what I meant by that orginal statement. |
| johnkretzer02-25-08, 12:40 AM | Yes, I agree. However, there is a small logical fallacy as well - there is no magic on Earth. If Elminster comes to Earth he can't travel back to Toril. It would be a one-way magical portal. Who says that the Earth has no magic? Can you prove it doesn't? Actualy if you go with old D&D canon it is completely possible to travel from Earth to any D&D world...so in the D&D universe the Earth does have magic by canon. I actualy liked the (I forget what the lit. term for it is) where Ed Greenwood recieves the infomation from Elminster. I find it entertaining to read. Heck without we wouldn't have the hilarious footnotes by Elminster in the Volo's Guides. I even have run really great adventure where the PC travel to Earth from the FR...or a really good campaign once where the PC played themselves transported the the FRs. But I guess to each his own. |
| Straploknight02-25-08, 12:46 AM | Man, that would be a blast, traveling from FR to Earth. I could act out my favorite "What-If" (the one where Conan gets transported to the future - he almost chops Cap's arm off), Just like Conan I could rob a guy, take his money, throw away those worthless paper wrappings and pocket the 1.25 in coin thinking I made a good score. Yeah... that'd be fun :D That was one of the big let downs of the whole D20 Modern thing. I was hoping for a completely compatible rules set so such time-space traveling would be possible with out to much work. |
| Lord Karsus02-25-08, 12:51 AM | El is prevented from using the information in AGHotR by the Vice Presidential Action Rangers. If he were to influence events using said tome, El would likely end up a victim of the Vice Presidential Action Rangers. Its what they do man, and they are good at it! -It's a good thing that Al Gore, Stephen Hawking, Gary Gygax and Nichelle Nichols are working to protect us. Now take your situration if the player covers himself perfectly with his arson attempt I just don't see how the halfling dom will know it is him to punish...but if he does so anyway then I would say that crosses the line from punishing the character to punishing the player. Of course if he leaves a signed note or something else just as obvious then he gets what coming to him. -When he marches up to the tavern, torch alight, and magic conjured, the Ogre bouncers will obvious see him. He does have the capacity to turn himself invisible for a limited period, however. In such a case, there is no way that the tavern that the Halfling 'don'- Runt- operates out of isn't warded against fire. With the resources he has, it'd be stupid to assume his livelihood wasn't aptly protected. When fleeing after conjuring a lightning strike, or whatever method he'd use, he would no longer be invisible. Thus, if the Ogre bouncers, who they PCs prviously encountered were not able to identify the character, any of the various bums, drunks and street watchers who are in the area, as well as a simple divination spell, could reveal his identity. -As previously mention, this player has a problem accepting the concept that he is not Mr. Badass King ****. The player in question is constantly picking fights with those NPCs who are (statistically) more powerful than him (with one of his two PCs, anyway). He's indiscriminantly killed at least two individuals- a rival mercenary group that challenged the PCs, and the tavern owner who threatened to call the town guard when the PC refused to remove the dead corpses of the aforementioned NPCs off of the steps of his business. -I do want to punish the player, but at the same time, the situation, if he actually goes through with it, calls for punishment of the character. Especially in a civilized, lawful city. And, this would be that characters second arson... |
| johnkretzer02-25-08, 12:58 AM | -I do want to punish the player, but at the same time, the situation, if he actually goes through with it, calls for punishment of the character. Especially in a civilized, lawful city. And, this would be that characters second arson... I understand this situration...and the player will get what should happen in light of this situration. I am not saying you are unfair...even though from the sounds of things that player will accuse of it. All I was just saying is that I have seen DMs get pissy about the death of their favorite NPCs, or the players completely outsmart them, etc react to punish those players for not following his nicely laid train tracks. And all DMs should be careful not to do this. Just ake as a word of advice from someone who as been playing and running games for about 20 years now. |
| Lord Karsus02-25-08, 01:09 AM | All I was just saying is that I have seen DMs get pissy about the death of their favorite NPCs, or the players completely outsmart them, etc react to punish those players for not following his nicely laid train tracks. And all DMs should be careful not to do this. -That, I am not doing. As I mentioned before, he has burned another building to the ground- he set fire to a paper mill on the edge of a town the PCs were in, because a worker there had been doing a little illegal logging on the side. While that was not at all what I think a CG character should do, nor was it the type of action I had expected and prepared for, the character did do this in the middle of the night, on the edge of the town, to a mundane building. There wasn't anybody around, so he got away with doing what he did. Same thing concerning the mercenaries and bartender. But, in this case, there are justifiable factors to explain his actions catching up with him- and rather quickly. |
| Old Sage02-25-08, 01:18 AM | -Elminster traveling to Earth, I have no real problem with. Earth is a world in the multiverse, so it is possible that a Planewalker/Spelljammer could visit it, and vice-versa. The part I don't like is the idea that everything published is dependent upon Elminster having chats with Ed Greenwood. It makes things- everything- seem a little hollow, in my book.I seem to recall Ed [or maybe it was THO] suggesting that although there are Realms portals to Earth, it is the D&D interpretation of our world. I'll have to look into the archives. |
| Old Sage02-25-08, 01:20 AM | -It's a good thing that Al Gore, Stephen Hawking, Gary Gygax and Nichelle Nichols are working to protect us.I wonder how the Vice President class will fare in 4e D&D? :D |
| Lord Karsus02-25-08, 01:24 AM | I wonder how the Vice President class will fare in 4e D&D. :D -I hear it's going to be in the second volume of 'Class' books. -Vice Presidents are going to be 'Controllers', and like Balors, can control their underlings, to the extent of making them explode. |
| Mula02-25-08, 02:59 AM | The Church of Gond is the reason why smoke powder firearms are not widespread in the Realms. See the 'Firearms in the Realms' section of Forgotten Realms Adventures and Gond's entry in Faiths & Pantheons for details about how and where the use of smoke powder weapons have featured in the Realms.That's the in game reason. The Real Reason is because guns and bombs and cannons and all that isn't what most fans of semi-medieval fantasy want in their fantasy settings. |
| Bullet0632002-25-08, 05:04 AM | This happens to be a fun game i'm running and I'm sorry some people don't appreciate it. Some things happened I didn't expect and am having to come up with solutions. I may have made some mistakes running this but have been playing D&D for almost 20 years, and this is the most fun game I've ever had. Someone said that Gunpowder doesn't work in the realms according to the Realmspace book, I've been looking through it and can't find the reference. if you now the page number let me now |
| GothicDan02-25-08, 09:39 AM | Bullet, I'm glad you're enjoying your game! My above pet peeve was more sort of a general explosion. I respect people who know there would be a difference, and the specific ramifications, but who decide to ignore them anyway. That's enlightened ignorance, to me. ;) As oppose to Mula there, who just seems to be arguing there would be little difference at all. That's just being foolish, to me. I've done quite a few dodgy things in the name of fun, too. |
| Old Sage02-25-08, 10:08 AM | Someone said that Gunpowder doesn't work in the realms according to the Realmspace book, I've been looking through it and can't find the reference. if you now the page number let me now'Twas MarkusTay. I don't have Realmspace near me at the moment... but I do recall that Old Grey Box also states much the same [as I said earlier]:- "The physics of the Realms are slightly out of sync with the rest of the planes, so that gunpowder and many technological devices which operate on electronics do not function. Equivalent devices may be developed by player-characters. DM’s judgment is advised as to what may be allowed into the world." [DM's Sourcebook of the Realms pg. 9] |
| GothicDan02-25-08, 10:15 AM | Go Old Sage. Quote-TASTIC! |
| Meldread02-25-08, 10:54 AM | Bullet- I'm glad you're having fun. Keep in mind that it doesn't matter what cannon says, and that the Realm's you've manage to "slide" into could have been a slightly altered version of the Realm's, with no connection to the canonical Realm's at all. So if you want gunpowder to work - it can. My suggestion is just to adlib things, and pretend that you're in an altered version of the Realm's - where whatever you want to happen is possible. Give yourself total freedom. |
| HVulpes02-25-08, 10:54 AM | It would be interesting to play out a Slider Realms adventure, where one went to alterntive realms like Reverse Gender world (with the sexy female Elminster who sleeps with multiple men and the Seven Brothers), Reverse Alignment world (with the return of the Gentle Tyrant Bane), no-spellplague realms and of course Gothic Dan's favourite realms, Elven Empires Realms. A realms with empires ruled over by Wise, kind, beautiful Gold Elf Kings and Queens with the goodly races aligned against evil subterrain empires of Drow and their slaves. Correct, GD? :D HV |
| Lord Karsus02-25-08, 12:07 PM | That's the in game reason. The Real Reason is because guns and bombs and cannons and all that isn't what most fans of semi-medieval fantasy want in their fantasy settings. -But magic is fine. |
| MarkusTay6302-25-08, 12:19 PM | I didn't want to post in this thread again, because my 'Grognard Mantle' was slipping... :rolleyes: However, I may be able to help after all - I thought that Markus was more picking up on the historical ramifications of what would happen if the physics of Abeir-Toril was the same as Earth, not necessarily the planar connection and intermingling between the two Spheres. But, I could be wrong. :)No, you would be quite correct - you can't change something as significant as that and expect the rest of the lore to still 'work'. The Spelljammer Campaign got into the use of Gunpowder, and Smokepowder, Weapons in the Realms. If they simply worked, right out of the box, then the Realms would have been invaded and taken over long ago by outsiders. In order to use your Gunpowder Weapons (which was possible), you needed to find someone (a Gondman?) savy enough to make some minor modifications to the weapons to allow the use of Smokepowder. Personally, I think only the ammunition would be different, but it appears certain other things need to be 'tweaked' as well. Think of it as buying a gas oven - it comes set-up for natural gas, but if you want to use it with propane, you need to change the jets (I've done quite a few of these conversions) - it takes an hour or so, after the first time. Anyhow, as I mentioned earlier, the excellent Chronicles of Amber is the PERFECT example of exactly what the DM OP is attempting. Amber is a world where gunpowder DOES NOT function. However, one of it's 'Lords' found an alternate Prime material World (the whole series is about planes-hopping; Planescape fans would love it) that produced a 'gunpowder' that would work in Amber - with an infinite number of parallel worlds, at least one should have what his group would need. The way I look at it, his group DID NOT come from our Earth, or the D&D version of Earth (which are considered two seperate worlds in canon, BTW), but rather another one altogether, and the gunpowder from that Earth was just like Smokepowder. See... I 'fixed' it. ;) Now it makes sense - and when the Zhents, Red Wizards, Luskan, the Twisted Rune, etc, etc... all find out about this functional, non-magical version of Gunpowder, they will STOP AT NOTHING to capture these techno-barbarians and find out what world they originated from. :devil: When I read the post I burst out laughing at the mental imagery of a bunch of hell raising kids appearing on Faerun in a Chevy Silverado. Talk about not being in Kansas anymore...Nothing New - one of the party members from my first Greyhawk Campaign came over on a Harley! He drove it until he ran out of gas, and then walked the rest of the way to a town (where he met the rest of us). The guy wanted to be himself in the game, and thats how the DM accomplished it. Unfortunetly, it made him a level 0 commoner with some funky leather armor. :D Also, in GH, tech works, as evidenced by the Crashed Spaceship in Expedition to the Barrier Peaks - and that particular player was the only one allowed to use 'meta-game' knowledge during that adventure. Sometimes mixing tech in a magical world can be fun... as long as there are limits! As far as dealing with the PCs in this case - a simple Hedgewizard or Druid with a low-lev Heat Metal spell should be able to take the wind out of their sails. :P |
| Mula02-25-08, 12:30 PM | -But magic is fine.Yes, but smokepowder is only superficially magical in nature because it so much represents gunpowder. Many people aren't comfortable with having guns and bombs, even if magical, in the Realms. It's a bit like the lightning rail in Eberron - it's magical, so it's not really a train, but it's still obviously inspired by the real world thing and basically functions as one, and thus many people are put off by the thing. |
| Mula02-25-08, 12:36 PM | As oppose to Mula there, who just seems to be arguing there would be little difference at all. That's just being foolish, to me.Now now, I'm not arguing that if real gunpowder with materials to make it were to be introduced in the Realms it wouldn't overtake smokepowder. It's mundane, so producing it would obviously be much simpler. However, what I'm saying is that smokepowder is the magical equivalent of gunpowder, but because it's just a superficial change from the real stuff, it's not going to be very widespread in a semi-medieval fantasy world (clashes with what many people want). In my Realms, gunpowder would work just fine if it actually existed. No one's discovered how to make it, or at least, for some reason, it's something only a handful of people know. Regardless, it doesn't exist in practice. |
| Bullet0632002-25-08, 01:00 PM | 'Twas MarkusTay. I don't have Realmspace near me at the moment... but I do recall that Old Grey Box also states much the same [as I said earlier]:- "The physics of the Realms are slightly out of sync with the rest of the planes, so that gunpowder and many technological devices which operate on electronics do not function. Equivalent devices may be developed by player-characters. DM’s judgment is advised as to what may be allowed into the world." [DM's Sourcebook of the Realms pg. 9] Thanks for the Reference, I missed it, and now that I've seen it print, oops I made a mistake. But with the way the PCs got to the Realms, and Gunpowder happens to work where thay are, It is merely an Alternate Dimension Realms. Not quite the same but that should satisfy everyone out there. |
| MarkusTay6302-25-08, 01:06 PM | Someone said that Gunpowder doesn't work in the realms according to the Realmspace book, I've been looking through it and can't find the reference. if you now the page number let me nowI just went through it, and it doesn't... which is odd. I KNOW it says it in the Spelljammer rules, so I just assumed it was in Realmspace. I'll check the other books later, its probably in the boxed set somewhere. I would like to thank the OP for getting me to re-read that tome - there are some VERY interesting bits about the Sphere in there (like the fact the entire sphere appears to be Mystra's spellbook!), or the Torm-cursed 'evil ones' that are forcerd to march around the sphere for all eternity. I wonder what happens to all of that come 4e? :confused: 'Twas MarkusTay. I don't have Realmspace near me at the moment... but I do recall that Old Grey Box also states much the same [as I said earlier]:- "The physics of the Realms are slightly out of sync with the rest of the planes, so that gunpowder and many technological devices which operate on electronics do not function. Equivalent devices may be developed by player-characters. DM’s judgment is advised as to what may be allowed into the world." [DM's Sourcebook of the Realms pg. 9]It says the same exact thing on pg. 192 of the Kara-Tur boxed set, which is not only part of the FR setting, but bears the official FR logo, unlike Zakhara material. ;) BTW, I'm not anti-guns - I allow them, and even ran a 'Wild West' FR campaign set in the Anchorome of the 1500's. What I am against is allowing players too run rampant over a world - ANY world - without consequences. Games have rules, as do worlds, and it is a DMs job to enforce them - without them people can just stay home and 'pretend' anything they want. |
| Bullet0632002-25-08, 01:13 PM | I hadn't opened it up n quite a while either, the giant floating skull is all I can say |
| Lord Karsus02-25-08, 01:29 PM | ...or the Torm-cursed 'evil ones' that are forcerd to march around the sphere for all eternity. -I remember those guys. |
| MarkusTay6302-25-08, 01:41 PM | I hadn't opened it up n quite a while either, the giant floating skull is all I can sayI understand completely - I bought a lot of the Spelljammer stuff for the lore, but I was never very happy with the concept as a whole (I'd never play in it). I hope that 4e fixes the major problems with it, and we get more of a Michael Moorcock take on "traveling the Astral Seas", then flying through space in Spanish Galleons. :rolleyes: It was a very weak attempt to compete with Space: 1889, the game that won RPG Game of the Year the year before Spelljammer was published. They basically just 'rushed it out the door' in order to steal some of that game's thunder. Too bad they didn't just wait a bit longer - it was an incredibly 'niche' setting, and quickly died off. Given more then a single year, and a little hindsight, I think something MUCH BETTER could be produced now, that would tie Planescape and Spelljammer together. The way it was before, Spelljamming really didn't make much sense in a universe with Planer travel, so the two settings were in conflict which each other, IMHO. I have high hopes of traveling to other worlds via ship in the Astral, the way it was meant to be. :cloud9: BTW, anyone here who is 'Planar Savy' mind telling me how Planescape handled 'Guns'? Did they even work in the outer planes? :confused: |
| GothicDan02-25-08, 02:04 PM | A realms with empires ruled over by Wise, kind, beautiful Gold Elf Kings and Queens with the goodly races aligned against evil subterrain empires of Drow and their slaves. Correct, GD? Oh, yes please. |
| Meldread02-25-08, 04:01 PM | Markus- Now it makes sense - and when the Zhents, Red Wizards, Luskan, the Twisted Rune, etc, etc... all find out about this functional, non-magical version of Gunpowder, they will STOP AT NOTHING to capture these techno-barbarians and find out what world they originated from. Just thinking about it makes me giggle like a little school girl and rub my hands together. The evil little devil on my shoulder is dancing and singing, "Please attack the Red Wizard... PLEASE OH PLEASE ATTACK HIM!" :evillaugh :plotting: Seriously, I love players like this. They are very predictable and it is very easy to make up plots for them - they do most of the work themselves! They end up making so many enemies you need a database just to keep up with them. "Remember that time, six years ago, when you shot that villager in Cormyr?" "Ummm... yeah... I think so. That was awhile ago, though." "Yeah, well his son never forgot. He's been plotting revenge against you ever sense. He's embraced Necromancy and now has an undead army heading your way. Have fun." :evillaugh |
| Keryth02-25-08, 04:57 PM | I had a bad experience with a group that just did whatever they wanted, and the DM didn't try to reign them in AT ALL. You couldn't even start them out in a town, like normal, because they would immediately attack and kill everyone else in the tavern, and then go on to slaughter the rest of the town. They basically treated everything they met as monster encounter, and they had NO concept of roleplay. This just brought all those BAD memories back. :( "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it" is widely attributed to Voltaire, but cannot be found in his writings. With good reason. The phrase was invented by a later author as an epitome of his attitude. It appeared in The Friends of Voltaire (1906), written by Evelyn Beatrice Hall under the pseudonym Stephen G. Tallentyre. --- From another site... Thank You for reminding me of that... I'll just be quiet now. :embarrass Sounds like you were in a Knights of the Dinner Table strip :) I feel for you, I really do. Been there, done that. Burned the T-shirt to forget the experience. However, I too have had a chance to let gunpowder weapons work in the Realms. But, it was magic which allowed it to do so. I had a villian Archmage who discovered Earth during the Civil War and was looting the battlefields of corpses and their weapons. He would them use necromancy and summoning magic to animate the corpses, merge them with demons, and the weapons would then work, but only in the hands of the Soldavi, as he called them. Really ****** the players off when they go their hands on Springfield rifles and colt pistols that didn;t work, but had to face em en masse from spell resistant opponents. |
| Keryth02-25-08, 05:06 PM | 'Twas MarkusTay. I don't have Realmspace near me at the moment... but I do recall that Old Grey Box also states much the same [as I said earlier]:- "The physics of the Realms are slightly out of sync with the rest of the planes, so that gunpowder and many technological devices which operate on electronics do not function. Equivalent devices may be developed by player-characters. DM’s judgment is advised as to what may be allowed into the world." [DM's Sourcebook of the Realms pg. 9] In other words, its more a guideline than a rule |
| Old Sage02-25-08, 06:41 PM | No. It is the rule for the officially published Realms setting. It is a guideline for the individual DM's home Realms campaign. |
| RealmsRunner02-25-08, 09:38 PM | It's been argued that groups such as the Mulhorandi come from a 'fictional' Earth. I did not know that. Can you elaborate? I'm extremely curious. |
| Meldread02-25-08, 10:36 PM | Basically there is an argument that there are two Earth's. The real Earth (the one that we live on) and the fictional D&D Earth. If you jump back to the previous page you'll see some people referencing the fictional Earth in relation to my comments about Elminster visiting Ed. In a nutshell it's just a silly argument that is used when the real world (read: the breaking of the fourth Wall) happens in the FR. The fictional D&D Earth is said to basically be a carbon copy of our world, except all of the traditional D&D trappings are there (perhaps hidden from public knowledge). Therefore, magic and possibly even monsters would exist - it's just that we (or our fictional D&D selves) wouldn't know about it. However, that logic falls apart when Elminster passes information to a fictional D&D Ed Greenwood, who then somehow manages to pass the information to the real Earth Ed Greenwood, who then passes that information to us. Canonically speaking, the Forgotten Realm's has had many interactions with Earth. Elminster has visited Ed for example. Although it is never stated openly it is heavily implied that the Imaskari came to our world and kidnapped the Mulhorandi and other groups within the Middle East. Additionally, I believe Kara-Tur has some connections to Earth, and the people of Maztica have some relation to South America in a similar way that the Mulhorandi are connected to Earth. It is likely that there are many more references that I am leaving out. |
| GothicDan02-25-08, 10:49 PM | I don't understand your stance, Meldread. Given that there's a plethora of ACTUAL Earth deities that exist, and can grant spells, I'm not sure how the multiverse could exist WITHOUT fictional Earth being the 'true' Earth in D&D. And you're very wrong on a few things concerning Maztica and Kara-Tur. Namely, they are analogs of direct Earth regions with no explanation and no suggestions of contact with Earth. That's largely why I hate them so much. Heck, if there was more of a Mulhorandi story behind it, then it'd make sense in a multiplanar setting. But they act as if Maztica and Kara-Tur Have NO connections with Earth. While I wouldn't do the Mary Sue thing of "I drop into D&D world," the idea of a multiverse implies that our Earth has connections to fantasy realms. Heck, it goes back to Michael Moorcock's Omniverse, on which the Multiverse was based. |
| Lord Karsus02-25-08, 11:07 PM | And you're very wrong on a few things concerning Maztica and Kara-Tur. Namely, they are analogs of direct Earth regions with no explanation and no suggestions of contact with Earth. That's largely why I hate them so much. Heck, if there was more of a Mulhorandi story behind it, then it'd make sense in a multiplanar setting. But they act as if Maztica and Kara-Tur Have NO connections with Earth. -In his obsessive research on Kara-Tur, and to a lesser degree, Maztica, I believe MT discovered some bits here and there that imply that the natives of Kara-Tur and Maztica are related to those living in South America and Southeast Asia. |
| MarkusTay6302-25-08, 11:50 PM | Pg. 2. Powers & Pantheons - "Much later, Goblinkin (Orcs, Hobgoblins, and their lesser kin such as kobolds and Goblins) entered Faerűn, as did human peoples from other Spheres, moving to settle in what we know as Kara-Tur, Maztica, and Zakhara." accent, mine - The Shou interloped from another sphere, most likely Jadespace, and NOT neccessarily from Earth. Mazticans, IIRC, interloped form Hepmonland (GH), or at least one tribe did. That was reasoned out in the Maztica thread from a few months back (I wish I had bookmarked it). Also, at least two other groups migrated to there form Kara-Tur, NOT another sphere. Don't exactly recall which two groups (Wu-Haltai and Issacortae?), but I know it was the being known as 'Monkey' that lead them there, once through the Underdark, and another time through the 'Realm of the dead' (don't ask). Zakhara... I don't know, I'm not really seeing them as interlopers. If anything, that region was probably the 'birthplace' of humanity at the Dawn of Time. I have it that the Hin came from there (although they were also originally interlopers, as per P&P), and later the Dgen emigrated from there to Calimshan. The only thing I can think of is that a group came over from a desert world, similar to Arrakis, Tatooine, or Athas, not Earth. The gods there are NOT RW Gods, as are some others (like the Celestial Bureaucracy or the Vedic Lords of Creation, and there is no connection to Earth what-so-ever, aside form the Arabian Flavor of the setting. Going back over that page in P&P is interesting - the Dwarves also interloped, before any Elves did... lending credence to my suspicians about the Black Diamond affair having taken place on Toril (after all, if the FEY originated there, then that story should definately have taken place there). I also find it amusing that the Kobolds were still part of the Goblinoids in that passage I quoted... poor little bastards... keep switching species from edition to edition... no one wants to claim the little buggers I guess. :P Of course, the Ogres have been switching races since the very beginning as well, so the Kobolds are in good company. ;) -In his obsessive research on Kara-Tur...Obsessive? :uh-huh: I prefer "rigorous, thorough, motivated, or dedicated".... :rolleyes: |
| Lord Karsus02-25-08, 11:52 PM | -See, there you go. Straight from the horses' mouth. |
| Meldread02-26-08, 12:39 AM | Dan - It comes down to personal taste. I hate Maztica and Kara-Tur for the reason you mentioned, precisely because they are blatant carbon copies of the real world. I also reject the lightning rail (or whatever it is called) in Eberron, for the same reason I reject smokepowder in my Realm's. In fact the lightning rail is one of the primary reasons I have refused to pick up the Eberron setting. I just can't get past it. I also hate Spelljamming. Although, like Markus I really look forward to 'sailing' on the Astral Sea. A sort of Planescape meets Spelljammer type thing. I just hate the concept of outer space and spaceships in my Realm's. If I wanted that, I'd be playing Star Wars. Oddly enough though, I have some love for Mulhorand. Not much, mind you, but I like a handful of the deities. Yet, despite that fact I hate the more obvious porting over of some deities - Greek, Roman and Norse deities in particular. I do not mind deities that have similarities, or even deities that are direct carbon copies - I just hate the fact that they share the same name. It is in that same twisted logic that I hate Elminster visiting the real world and talking to Ed. Since that is cannon, it is also equally possible for Rich Baker to visit the Forgotten Realm's and... hey... wait a minute! That explains EVERYTHING! :P |
| Old Sage02-26-08, 12:42 AM | In a nutshell it's just a silly argument that is used when the real world (read: the breaking of the fourth Wall) happens in the FR. The fictional D&D Earth is said to basically be a carbon copy of our world, except all of the traditional D&D trappings are there (perhaps hidden from public knowledge). Therefore, magic and possibly even monsters would exist - it's just that we (or our fictional D&D selves) wouldn't know about it.From Ed:- "This, by the way, is where the “Forgotten” part of “Forgotten Realms” came from: we people of real-world Earth have ‘forgotten’ the once-widely-used gates to Toril, which gave us our legends of vampires, dragons, et al." |
| Old Sage02-26-08, 12:46 AM | Eric gave the strong impression the Mulan slaves were kidnapped from Earth in Powers & Pantheons, but did not state so explicitly. Eric also hinted about this in Volo's Guide to All Things Magical in the write up of the artifact relating to Ptah. |
| MarkusTay6302-26-08, 01:58 AM | I like to think of the 'Pharaonic' culture originating with the Imaskari, and they, in turn, spread it to other worlds, like our Earth. In my mind, the Imaskari are just like the Goa'uld of Stargate. In fact, IMG, the Imaskari ARE the Goa'uld (minus the Sci-Fi stuff). :D See? No problem now! FR didn't copy the RW - the RW copied FR! :P Same thing with my version of the K-T: The original sphere of the Oriental Peoples suffered a cataclysm, and that sphere's Overgod - the Celestial Emperor - split his being into 12 pieces, sending each off into a different sphere with a group of survivors, hoping at least one of them would 'make it'. Unbeknowst to the others, his original aspect was also left, but greatly diminished (just a regular god, now), and he kept a small group on the home world, just in case. Little did he know that all of them would survive, and thrive, and thats where Greyhawk got its Emerald Empire, Theah (7th sea) got it's Cathay, Jadespace, etc... and even RW China. Yup... IMG Earth, the Chinese were interlopers. :dancin: So, don't look at them as RW cultures 'planted' on FR, look at them as Fantasy cultures 'planted' on the RW. ;) |
| Bullet0632002-26-08, 06:06 AM | BTW, anyone here who is 'Planar Savy' mind telling me how Planescape handled 'Guns'? Did they even work in the outer planes? :confused: Don't own much Planescape stuff, but each plane would probly have its own rules or Guidlines. |
| Rauric02-26-08, 10:12 AM | I think he is following the rule of "I have a wonky idea for a campaign that sounds like my players will love". That is all that matters. I love the FR boards. Gamers post their ideas and some people automatically come on and throw canonbombs and "That can't happen because..." at ya. There are many ways he can explain guns working in the Realms, the main one is alternate reality and the other one is that he is the DM. ;) |
| Rauric02-26-08, 10:18 AM | "-I do want to punish the player, but at the same time, the situation, if he actually goes through with it, calls for punishment of the character. Especially in a civilized, lawful city. And, this would be that characters second arson..." I am a bit confused. If the city is so lawful and civilized than how could the halfling kill a wench "just" for serving a drink wrong. If stuff like that is going on in the middle of a tavern than an arsonist might not have a problem with a second torching. I figure after the second one he would get caught. If he has a decent plan and makes the rolls you should (IMO) let it happen. |
| GothicDan02-26-08, 10:29 AM | I love the FR boards. Gamers post their ideas and some people automatically come on and throw canonbombs and "That can't happen because..." at ya. This is what I was referring to as ignorant versus enlightened negligence. You better darn well know the rules of something - ANYTHING - before ignoring them, so you can understand the ramifications. I feel this way -for everything.- |
| Rauric02-26-08, 10:34 AM | If it works for his game and his group then who cares? If guns work in HIS game then maybe people can give him some ideas on what type of mayhem that could cause. Sliders was all about alternate worlds working differently than how we think they should. |
| Lord Karsus02-26-08, 11:36 AM | You better darn well know the rules of something - ANYTHING - before ignoring them, so you can understand the ramifications. -Excellent point. |
| MarkusTay6302-26-08, 12:26 PM | I DID try to fix things by later contributing in a more helpful manner, Rauric. The 'alternate world' thing works, but I would just say they slid from an alternate Earth, not to an alternate FR. As I've said, almost that same exact scenario happened in a set of fantasy novels where the main characters were basically 'Sliders', and all one had to do was find a single alternate world where the Gunpowder from there would function in Amber (the main world of the series, where gunpowder did NOT work). There are at least two versions of Earth in canon, so why not three? Who's to say that the world he originally ran his D20 Modern Campaign on was even Earth at all? Just say that they are using Gunpowder from Earth #357 and everything else still works! And I still think he needs to send the Cromags after them, or perhaps the FR equivalent - the Malaugrym. :devil: |
| Lord Karsus02-26-08, 12:29 PM | There are at least two versions of Earth in canon, so why not three? -There's more than that. There's Marvel Earth, there's DC Earth, there's Harry Potter Earth, there's G.I. Joe Earth, etc. |
| MarkusTay6302-26-08, 12:34 PM | In D&D canon. :rolleyes: But your still right - I just remebered one of my favorite 2e supplements - the Gothic Earth Gazetteer! Unless, of course, the 'D&D version' of Earth that designers are always referencing is the same as the one in that sourcebook, which would be kinda cool. :) There's also the Earth of Gamma World, but that again may just be the future version of the same game Earth. |
| Lord Karsus02-26-08, 12:38 PM | In D&D canon. :rolleyes: -There's also...Red Mask of Doom, or something to that effect, which I believe took place in France, and all of the d20 books, which I consider D&D, since the same rules and everything apply. |
| Rauric02-26-08, 12:57 PM | My suggestion is ignore canon because it just causes more problems then solves. Just have the stuff in the books be guidelines or suggestions IMO. |
| GothicDan02-26-08, 01:09 PM | If you post on a forum, you care about peoples' opinions. Period. Rauric, you're basically telling US how to handle our understanding of FR, by telling us to not comment on others', you know. I absolutely abhor that. Just let people freaking talk. Let them brawl. That's where advancement comes from, and that's how ideas are shared. |
| Rauric02-26-08, 01:25 PM | ;) No I am offering my opinion which is to ignore canon. It works for me so I am just throwing the idea out there. I am not a Realms snob so I don't tell anyone how something should be. I abhor people coming to the FR boards giving their ideas and getting them shot down because they do not adhere to canon or "that cannot possibly happen." I dislike closeminded people especially when it is about a simple, silly game. |
| Lord Karsus02-26-08, 02:01 PM | I abhor people coming to the FR boards giving their ideas and getting them shot down because they do not adhere to canon or "that cannot possibly happen." I dislike closeminded people especially when it is about a simple, silly game. -If someone is specifically asking for opinions, the answer 'Do whatever you want', isn't helpful. -And, furthermore, the OP wasn't asking for ideas, opinions, or anything else. He was simply sharing his/her story with us. He didn't say at any point that he was going to change anything in his/her campaign based on the responses he/she got. |
| Rauric02-26-08, 02:23 PM | Even better. A gamer comes on these boards with a story he may think is cool since the game he ran was a lot of fun. He just wants to let people in on it. Then he gets "That one part couldn't happen because..." Stuff like that can bother people and scare people off from these boards. Things like that is a reason why these boards have a certain stigma. Too many people care too much about Lore and canon that when someone realtes game ideas that don't fit with those things they get "corrected". It is a game. On the other hand there are some disturbing parts to Blues game , like the murdering of the parents. That is pretty creepy. D20 Modern running around FR killing Liches? I would not want to be in the game but as long as they have fun and don't kill their folks in real life go for it! |
| Lord Karsus02-26-08, 02:41 PM | Even better. A gamer comes on these boards with a story he may think is cool since the game he ran was a lot of fun. He just wants to let people in on it. Then he gets "That one part couldn't happen because..." Stuff like that can bother people and scare people off from these boards. Things like that is a reason why these boards have a certain stigma. Too many people care too much about Lore and canon that when someone realtes game ideas that don't fit with those things they get "corrected". It is a game. -If he/she wasn't looking to hear what other people thought of his campaign, he/she wouldn't have posted his/her story to begin with. I run a D&D campaign every week. Every so often, I'll post snippets as the 'What's a DM to do?' section, when I'm looking for imput/help/whatever. Overall, however, I don't talk about my campaign because: A) Truthfully, I don't care what other people think about it and, B) I don't think other people care about it, either. -If the OP didn't want people to discuss his campaign, in whatever form that takes, he/she wouldn't have posted. Like a conversation, if you don't want people talking about something, you don't mention it. -He/she wasn't asking for opinions/suggestions/critique, but at the same time, if he/she didn't want people to comment, period, he/she wouldn't have posted. |
| Rauric02-26-08, 03:00 PM | Can see correcting someone for misuse of a rule perhaps, but ragging on somebodies campaign or ideas never seemed right to me. I will tell someone it is not my cup of tea if I don't like their idea, but I wll never criticize their idea or tell them it is wrong. A buddy of mine wanted us to do a Sliders campaign which would include the FR and other D&D places and settings and I told him I probably would not play. When I was in my teens or early twenties that may have sounded like fun but I just couldn't play in that game. I was pretty nice about it though. |
| Lord Karsus02-26-08, 03:04 PM | Can see correcting someone for misuse of a rule perhaps, but ragging on somebodies campaign or ideas never seemed right to me. I will tell someone it is not my cup of tea if I don't like their idea, but I wll never criticize their idea or tell them it is wrong. -That's how conversations go. Like I said before, if you didn't want imput from whoever you are talking to about a particular subject, you wouldn't mention it. If you didn't want sex advice from your mom (:yuck:), you wouldn't mention anything related to said topic around her. Bullet posted his/her story, so people are going to comment. He reserves the right to listen or not listen (I'd recommend that he doesn't, and simply do whatever it is he wants), but, at the same time, everyone else reserves the right to say what's on their minds, so long as it falls within the bounds of the CoC, which everyone thus far is doing. -And, as Sage said: No. It is the rule for the officially published Realms setting. It is a guideline for the individual DM's home Realms campaign. -There is a major difference between the officially published Forgotten Realms, and one's own home campaign. |
| GothicDan02-26-08, 03:13 PM | Rauric, your logic really baffles me. Can see correcting someone for misuse of a rule perhaps You really think the ever-changing rules of the game are more important than the history of the world? Well, then the problem is you're arguing from a totally different standpoint than most of us. I don't run into every rules-discussion thread and go, "No this is wrong, stop correcting him on the rules!" so the fact that you personally do the same to those of us who try to point out lore inconsistencies is really, really hypocritical. |
| Rauric02-26-08, 03:39 PM | People may use different aspects of a setting. They may not use all of it as written. If the Red Wizards were destroyed in someones campaign and another person says "That could never happen" and then tells them that their game/capaign is wrong well that irks me a bit. If someone posts that they need to assault Elminster for some reason and all the poster gets as a response is "Forget about it, you will lose" that irks me. I have been reading these boards for years and doing alot of lurking. I have seen many people blast people for their noncanical Realms or crazy ideas like killing the Seven Sisters. At one point I was even one of those people who told them it probably could not be done. I realize now I should have helped them out and given them suggestions instead of just poohpoohing their ideas and telling them to forget about it. There is a difference between correcting someone on their rule use and their creative ideas. To me at least. Plus the people that blast peoples campaigns or ideas never really offer any aid or help to make it work it seems. |
| GothicDan02-26-08, 03:41 PM | If it irks you, why don't you actually add to ways in which things COULD happen, rather than trying to silence people with negative comments? Be CONSTRUCTIVE. :) And yes, I think deconstruction is a necessary element of stable construction. |
| Straploknight02-26-08, 05:22 PM | Given more then a single year, and a little hindsight, I think something MUCH BETTER could be produced now, that would tie Planescape and Spelljammer together. The way it was before, Spelljamming really didn't make much sense in a universe with Planer travel, so the two settings were in conflict which each other, IMHO. I have high hopes of traveling to other worlds via ship in the Astral, the way it was meant to be. :cloud9: Yeah, I would have prefered a setting where the various worlds were seperated by vast distances on the prime and the phlogiston to be the astral (although I did like the explosive element of the phlogiston) with the crystal spheres being different planes rather than different primes. |
| Mula02-28-08, 12:46 PM | And yes, I think deconstruction is a necessary element of stable construction. This is wrong, GD. Consider this deconstruction. |
| GothicDan02-28-08, 12:48 PM | You're telling me what I think is wrong? That's an opinion-based argument, not a factual one. That being said, when I said deconstruction, I meant actually breaking things up into bits and analyzing how they affect each other. NOT destroying things. There's a difference. This whole mess did anything BUT analyze how every little ripple would affect everything else. But then again, the designers aren't scientists or mathematicians or historians or even psychologists. I wouldn't expect them to care too much about this sort of thing, so I can't say I'm very disappointed. |
| Mula02-28-08, 12:57 PM | That being said, when I said deconstruction, I meant actually breaking things up into bits and analyzing how they affect each other. NOT destroying things. There's a difference. This whole mess did anything BUT analyze how every little ripple would affect everything else.Oh, wait, I'm supposed to declare the OP's game not FR/D&D in a very long post? Was that how it went? |
| MarkusTay6302-28-08, 01:14 PM | At this point, I wish his group would have arived in FR post Spellplague, and just finished the job WotC started. :rolleyes: |
| GothicDan02-28-08, 03:10 PM | Oh, wait, I'm supposed to declare the OP's game not FR/D&D in a very long post? Was that how it went? You weren't 'supposed' to do anything. I'm not sure what's going on here, but I have no clue what you're trying to get at. I know there's irony in there, but you're not even trying to follow the discussion - you're just being randomly snide. |
| Bullet0632002-28-08, 03:58 PM | At this point, I wish his group would have arived in FR post Spellplague, and just finished the job WotC started. :rolleyes: Give me some Time, My players can ruin anything. wont be playing again untill next week so I still have some time to figure out exactly when they are |
| Lord Karsus02-28-08, 04:01 PM | ...you're just being randomly snide. -Ding, ding, ding. -Certain posters- primarily Mr. Misc, and to a lesser degree, some other people- for whatever reason, primarily complain about a specific aspect of the boards, rather than actually contribute to the discussion in a constructive manner beneficial to the request of the OP. |
| Mula02-29-08, 12:11 AM | I'm not sure what's going on here, but I have no clue what you're trying to get at. I know there's irony in there, but you're not even trying to follow the discussion - you're just being randomly snide.I just find it funny that you basically justify threadcrapping by calling it "deconstruction". |
| GothicDan02-29-08, 12:26 AM | I just find it funny that you basically justify threadcrapping by calling it "deconstruction". Why do you feel pointing out the negative points in a topic is 'threadcrapping'? |
| Mula02-29-08, 01:40 AM | There's a difference between occasionally pointing out negatives and an ever present negativity towards ideas that the FR board regulars don't think are "appropriate" in the Realms. It's just silly how close minded the FR forum sometimes is. Even if an idea/suggestion/whatever isn't outright shot down, it's usually accompanied by this passive-aggressive and condescending attitude towards anything unorthodox. Also, it's funny that until I gave a smart sounding concept (simulationism vs. narrativism) to explain my viewpoint, your attitude came off as very dismissive and arrogant. There's no one right way to play D&D or the Realms. While probably not completely obvious in my previous posts regarding the issue, I think simulationism (or whatever you want to call it) is just as valid as my style of gaming, and I don't think your or someone else's campaign is somehow lesser or wrong because of it. I think the OP's campaign sounds kinda fun (minus the rampant murdering). Probably not a game I'd run on a regular basis, but I'd love to occasionally play in a crazy-wacky type of game. |
| Bullet0632002-29-08, 06:12 AM | There's no one right way to play D&D or the Realms. While probably not completely obvious in my previous posts regarding the issue, I think simulationism (or whatever you want to call it) is just as valid as my style of gaming, and I don't think your or someone else's campaign is somehow lesser or wrong because of it. I think the OP's campaign sounds kinda fun (minus the rampant murdering). Probably not a game I'd run on a regular basis, but I'd love to occasionally play in a crazy-wacky type of game. Everyone has different styles of playing D&D that suit them. One way isnt wrong compared to another, its just that we all have different tastes. The game is fun, I pretty much gave my players free reign to be themselves in a game and some of them did things I didn't expect. But it is just a game. I thank everyone for thier opinions and the Critisism. I thought it was something freaky and Strange that happened with my current game and decided I would share it with everyone |
| GothicDan02-29-08, 09:25 AM | It's just silly how close minded the FR forum sometimes is. "Be open-minded. But not so open-minded that your brain falls out." Dr. Krauss, Theoretical Particle Cosmologist, Nobel Laureate, to my Physics Class I see a lot of brains falling out. ;) Also, it's funny that until I gave a smart sounding concept (simulationism vs. narrativism) to explain my viewpoint, your attitude came off as very dismissive and arrogant. In Discrete Math, we're learning to speak to your audience. Speak to me in a way that will best evoke my emotional reaction of thinking you to be a smart and credible source. Anyway... Bullet: Sorry for clogging up your thread. Mula and I don't play well together. As I said at first, I'm glad you're having fun. I wouldn't have fun in the campaign, but I've already iterated that it's your game, and I'm VERY glad that you at least wanted to know of the original references for tech. :) |
| Rinonalyrna Fathomlin02-29-08, 02:22 PM | There's a difference between occasionally pointing out negatives and an ever present negativity towards ideas that the FR board regulars don't think are "appropriate" in the Realms. You are a board regular. As are certain others who like to use the term "board regular" as if it doesn't apply to them. |
| MarkusTay6302-29-08, 02:26 PM | Maybe he's a 'Bored' regular? :P In Discrete Math, we're learning to speak to your audience. Speak to me in a way that will best evoke my emotional reaction of thinking you to be a smart and credible source.Now your singing MY song, Danny me lad. ;) As a smart Irishmen once said, "If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bulls__t." :D |
| Rinonalyrna Fathomlin02-29-08, 02:29 PM | Maybe he's a 'Bored' regular? :P Maybe... |
| Mula02-29-08, 04:13 PM | I'm not a board regular who's negative and opposed to new ideas. :) |
| GothicDan02-29-08, 04:38 PM | You're not. I consider the 'not negative' part not complimentary, though. New ideas are awesome. However, 'new' doesn't necessarily imply 'good.' P(x): It is good. Q(x): It is new. Q(x)=>~P(x) |
| Mula02-29-08, 06:22 PM | Personally, I think new ideas are refreshing. No, they're not necessarily good, but luckily D&D and FR are games and we don't have to take them too seriously. :) And trust me, I already know you disagree. :P |
| Bullet0632003-01-08, 01:38 AM | [QUOTE=GothicDan;15220846 Bullet: Sorry for clogging up your thread. Mula and I don't play well together. As I said at first, I'm glad you're having fun. I wouldn't have fun in the campaign, but I've already iterated that it's your game, and I'm VERY glad that you at least wanted to know of the original references for tech. :)[/QUOTE] I wouldn't have posted it if I didn't want feedback, not everyone plays well together, thats life I merely missed the original reference and it had been discussed elswhere but untill this thread nobody ever posted where to find it, but since its only a guideline, its my call. Thanks ps dont worry, Zhents are already hunting them |
| MarkusTay6303-01-08, 02:10 AM | As long as you and your players are having fun, its all good. ;) I'm not a board regular who's negative and opposed to new ideas. :)So its NOT negative to be negative toward people who act negatively? :confused: |
| Mula03-01-08, 02:25 AM | So its NOT negative to be negative toward people who act negatively? :confused: Nope. |
| MarkusTay6303-01-08, 02:28 AM | So thats a negative, then? ;) :D |
| GothicDan03-01-08, 08:37 AM | Bullet, you're good people. And MT... You see why I tend not to like Mula's arguments. |
| MarkusTay6303-01-08, 11:30 AM | Because they are not as fun-spirited as mine? :D :P And yeah... Bullet made me feel bad... sorry... :allalone: I was a jerk at first, and he was still respectful - Kudos to him for being the better man. |
| Mula03-01-08, 03:37 PM | Well, if you consider tolerant people who don't like intolerance as intolerant, then yeah, you could consider my dislike for negativity as negativity. But again, that's just silly. |
| Lord Karsus03-02-08, 12:01 AM | -It is. See the first and second posts of this page. |
| Rauric03-02-08, 07:54 AM | I just get bothered by people telling other people their game ideas are wrong or how they are wrong with how they play in a setting. I guess that is what I mean overall. People have the right to say whatever they want about people and their games though as long as the COC is not messed with at all. I just was posting to say that it irked me a bit. No biggie. |
| GothicDan03-02-08, 10:24 AM | Well, if you consider tolerant people who don't like intolerance as intolerant, then yeah, you could consider my dislike for negativity as negativity. But again, that's just silly. Call me silly, because I honestly think those people are detrimental to society. |
| Old Sage03-02-08, 10:34 AM | *sigh* Folks, I deliberately posted this reply (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=15187476&postcount=61) earlier in an attempt to avoid these types on nonsense debates. I think it would be best for all if we just moved on. |
| Mula03-02-08, 02:46 PM | I thought the point of the FR boards was nonsense debates? :confused: |
| Bullet0632003-02-08, 10:51 PM | I thought the point of the FR boards was nonsense debates? :confused: Some Boards are nonsensical and some boards are more serious this thread is a bit of both And I'm a Cab Driver, I can put up with alot of things before telling you to get out of my cab. |
| Lord Karsus03-03-08, 02:25 AM | And I'm a Cab Driver, I can put up with alot of things before telling you to get out of my cab. -Are you one of those cab drivers that gets their customers talking about their sexuality and exploits, like on that TV show? Or, how about that cab that gives away money, like on that other TV show? |
| Bullet0632003-06-08, 05:04 AM | -Are you one of those cab drivers that gets their customers talking about their sexuality and exploits, like on that TV show? Or, how about that cab that gives away money, like on that other TV show? I don't give money away, but I could tell you stories about the things that have been said and have happened in the back of my cab. I think they would get heavily edited on this thread |
| Lord Karsus03-06-08, 06:04 AM | -Crazy, crazy, Connecticut... |
| Straploknight03-08-08, 09:00 PM | I thought the point of the FR boards was nonsense debates? :confused: Heh, nonsensical debates on the FR board is like the internet. Serious business! |
| Zsych03-08-08, 09:12 PM | I think there's no great harm in gun powder running and it won't change the history of FR any, since there's never a guarantee that technology will be developed. These characters should eventually run out of ammo, and if they make serious enemies in the meantime... ouch!! .. or they could create a power-base of sorts with what little other-worldly resources they have left... I'd expect the sliding tech is busted though, till they get out, which won't be soon at all. ... I find all the casual killing somewhat disturbing btw, but if they're playing evil characters then there is no reason to object. Still, the attitude of killing and destroying everything that comes your way should seriously bite them in the back, when they don't have the option of running away from that world. They no doubt make enemies everywhere they go, and if their disruptive power is high enough, powerful mages and other factions will likely divine their expected effect and take some type of action. |
| Bullet0632003-12-08, 07:05 AM | -Crazy, crazy, Connecticut... Pretty Much, took someone to Manhatten last night on another note, I got a player coming in that wasn't able to make the last 2 games, I made him draw a charchter using the same rules as everyone else. two problems, first, he wants to use a skateboard as his primary weapon I'm looking for Stats for a Skateboard as a Weapon. I was thinking a club or spiked club maybe, conisdering the wheels Martial Weapon Profieciency or Exoctioc Weapon Profieciency? Considering its size and shape, a +1 or +2 Shield Bounus if using it only for defence of taking the Total Defense Action Plus would it add to the movement rate of the Character? +10'-15' if on concrete, All other skill checks would fall under Balance and Ride(Skateboard) What do you think, A little Help please? ofcourse, the 2nd problem is getting him from the real world to FR, was thinking he showed up a few days earlier, the kid who created the tech to get to the realms pushed him in as an experimant. Its simple and it works for me. We continue this mess i created tonite, so I got to get some sleep and think about it, Thanks for any help with the Skateboard isssue |
| Lord Karsus03-12-08, 09:40 AM | Pretty Much, took someone to Manhatten last night -That's crazy. I'm looking for Stats for a Skateboard as a Weapon. -Isn't there a book that has stats for a whole bunch of make-shift weapons? |
| MarkusTay6303-12-08, 11:58 AM | ofcourse, the 2nd problem is getting him from the real world to FR, was thinking he showed up a few days earlier, the kid who created the tech to get to the realms pushed him in as an experimant. Its simple and it works for me. We continue this mess i created tonite, so I got to get some sleep and think about it, Thanks for any help with the Skateboard isssueUgh... my stomach hurts just thinking about the Skateboard... but I'll try to be helpful. I have run time-travel campaigns (very limited, just a few hours), and it worked out great! Similar situation, too - I had to add someone, so I dropped him ahead of the other group. Then I had the original group find a 'trail' and follow it, until they came across the second group (the second group was actually a few people from the first group who went through a portal, ran into the other guy, and then started 'tracking' something ahead of them - THEMSELVES!) As the story progressed, I would describe certain things the trackers would find (evidence of last week's session), and none of them caught on. It was great fun - they realized who they were following only when they saw their backs walk into the portal. :D Not everyone went through, so the couple guys left behind turned around and saw the guys who just went through it behind them. It was a very weird but memorable moment. |
| Bullet0632003-12-08, 05:59 PM | Cute Campaign, I got some help on the skateboard issue on the D20modern boards http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?p=15325085#post15325085 |
| Lord Karsus03-12-08, 06:38 PM | -d20 Apocalypse. That was the book, yeah. My regular DM, a few months ago, stopped running a D&D campaign, when one of our players got pregnant, with the not feeling good, and all of that stuff. Once her and her husband gave us a definite about if they wanted to keep on playing or not, luckily, we stopped playing that afeful campaign. I like D&D as much as the next guy (or girl) here, but there is just something about d20 Modern that just isn't fun, I don't think. |
| MarkusTay6303-12-08, 08:04 PM | Its like living in 'the now', and we can kinda do that already, without the rulebooks... An "After the Holocaust" campaign I can get into, something along the lines of Mad Max, or Escape from New York, or even Planet of the Apes or Resident Evil type scenarios, but the 'here and now' just isn't all that interesting. http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y178/MarkusTay/Thundarr_Moon_sm.jpg I know, I've shown it before, but I love that pic! :dancin: |
| Lord Karsus03-12-08, 11:03 PM | Its like living in 'the now', and we can kinda do that already, without the rulebooks... -Yeah, that's how I felt. Some people like that, and good for them, but for me, it just loses something. D&D is fun, with the armor, and the swords, and the magic, and the Dragons, and that. The d20 X games don't really have that- even though they do. In the campaign I was in, it was up to us to stop this cult leader (who was an Illithid) from turning the Human cult members into Goblins. There was just something intangilible missing. I know, I've shown it before, but I love that pic! :dancin: -What was that from? |
| MarkusTay6303-13-08, 02:11 AM | Thundarr! The Barbarian! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LhAobPugvsk) Bestest cartoon EVA. :D |
| Lord Karsus03-13-08, 10:15 AM | Thundarr! The Barbarian! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LhAobPugvsk) -Oh, I remember that one. |