Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Bleegh 04-11-04, 10:30 AM	I'm about to start a campaign with exalted characters in the realms, but I have a little problem. My players want good kuo-toan monks who are voluntarily poor(as per the feat in the BoED). To gain the two exalted feats they need for this (sacred vow, vow of poverty) BoED states that they need to contact a celestial and take the vow in their presence. I think that the characters should not be able to start with these feats, and I would like some more opinions. A kuo-toa starts at level 3 automatically with 2 feats, 1 gained during monster levels, one at level three, their first class level. Definately they should not be allowed to take an exalted feat in their monstrous levels (they are in evil underdark kuo-toa society), and I don't think that they should be allowed to take them while training at a monestary as it does not seem logical to have celestials running around monestaries just to give out exalted feats. If what faction of monk they are matters (other than evil ones of course) please tell me, or if I got some other detail wrong tell me that too. Otherwise I would just like to know if people think this is a reasonable ruling.
Cunning Linguist 04-11-04, 10:50 AM	I don't see any problem with your reasoning. Is this Kuo-Toan a good character btw? An unwritten prerequisite for every vile feat is an evil alignment, and likevise a good alignment is required for every exalted feats. So where in the underdark does this Kuo-Toan go past all his evil and become Lawful Good?
Bleegh 04-11-04, 01:04 PM	The backstories of these characters are that they were annoyed with the kuo-toa government and went to the surface, where they were found by a monk from this monestary and turned to good (basically the redeemed villain character type thing if you have BoED handy).
Cunning Linguist 04-11-04, 04:16 PM	Well, the monk (who found them) could be a high level celestial, and he could have been the one they gave the plegde to.. but your the DM.. all up to you.
Orion the Raven 04-12-04, 05:26 AM	Finding a celestial who will take the time to listen and not automatically assume trechery or just get right to smiting those guys is going to be a problem. Their race is universally renown for hatred and evil, so celetials are just not going to be lining up around the block to put faith in these guys. That could be the whole basis of an adventure in and of itself.
Dargoth 04-12-04, 06:08 AM	Originally posted by Bleegh I'm about to start a campaign with exalted characters in the realms, but I have a little problem. My players want good kuo-toan monks who are voluntarily poor(as per the feat in the BoED). To gain the two exalted feats they need for this (sacred vow, vow of poverty) BoED states that they need to contact a celestial and take the vow in their presence. I think that the characters should not be able to start with these feats, and I would like some more opinions. A kuo-toa starts at level 3 automatically with 2 feats, 1 gained during monster levels, one at level three, their first class level. Definately they should not be allowed to take an exalted feat in their monstrous levels (they are in evil underdark kuo-toa society), and I don't think that they should be allowed to take them while training at a monestary as it does not seem logical to have celestials running around monestaries just to give out exalted feats. If what faction of monk they are matters (other than evil ones of course) please tell me, or if I got some other detail wrong tell me that too. Otherwise I would just like to know if people think this is a reasonable ruling. Make them play it out Let them play Kuo Toa as a Monster class ie they start as a First level Kua Toa. Start them off as what ever the Default alignment for Kuo Toa is (I believe there CE) make them roleplay there conversion to good (at which point you'll let them take the exalted feat)
Bleegh 04-12-04, 05:09 PM	Well, the monk (who found them) could be a high level celestial, and he could have been the one they gave the plegde to.. but your the DM.. all up to you. This is a good idea and I was actually thinking of doing something like this... if not with the monk that found them but maybe the leader of the monastery. Though I was thinking of having him be a saint(as per BoED) or something similar, someone who has gained celestial status through their deeds and was fairly normal at birth, rather than some high level celestial in disguise, as that seems very unrealsitic and sort of contrived (is that the word im looking for?). Finding a celestial who will take the time to listen and not automatically assume trechery or just get right to smiting those guys is going to be a problem. Their race is universally renown for hatred and evil, so celetials are just not going to be lining up around the block to put faith in these guys. That could be the whole basis of an adventure in and of itself. Though I had thought of sending the PCs on an adventure like this, if I go with the above idea, there is no reason for them to take it. Your idea about making them prove their loyalty and not just finding the guy is interesting though and I will try to make use of it (sorry for no formatting but I just accidentally activated sticky keys and I am unable to type periods commas etc) As for the last idea it is very good and will show them how their characters progressed and make their backstories more meaningful (These players are basically minmaxers powergamers whatever term has a negative connotation to you) and I am trying to show them that sainthood divinity etc even in D&D means more than just stat bonuses and should challenging to obtain Thanks to all who replied and again sorry for the lack of formatting