Expedition to Undermountain [Archive] - Wizards Community

Expedition to Undermountain [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Jhalad
07-02-07, 05:23 PM Okay, I've read the CoC, and I'm pretty sure I can do this. I've looked at the other FR posting areas, and can't seem to find one specific to products. So, that said... umm.. spoilers, for those who want to know..

SPOILERS (just reiterating)

Also, this is my personal opinion, and I am not trying to flame, troll, or whatever other descriptions for inappropriate posts there may be. I want to discuss this product and see how people feel, and also to allow the editors to respond. I want this to be constructive, not destructive.

:mad: WHAT THE HECK?!?!?!?!? :mad: ARGH!!!!!
I figured I'd get that out of the way....

Guys, guys, guys... come on...

This was, in the past, the BEST Forgotten Realms product EVER to be put out. I was jumping out of my chair a few months ago when I heard ya'll were gonna update it. I mean, the online articles were outstanding. They gave the feel of the original dungeon. And then you ganked them... and then you announced this, so I stop pestering about when the online articles would return.

So, a week ago I bought THE BOOK... and I gotta say, I was really disappointed... seriously truly saddened...:weep:

I don't want to go into any more details than I absolutely have to, but the event that starts this whole thing off struck me as off, but I dealt with it. Then, at the end, what did you do? And I quote - Pg. 193 - "What was the doom - We leave that mystery for the DMs to determine -" again... ARGH!!!!! :mad:

WHAT A COP-OUT! Not only did you destroy my most favorite of dungeons, but you don't even tell us WHY?!?!? Forgotten Realms is nothing if not detailed in it's happenings and history, and for one of the BIGGEST events to ever happen in the modern time to be brushed off like that... ARGH!!!! :mad:

Plus, you cram the story line (or at least imply that) down the PCs throats. Undermountain's biggest draw is that it was free roaming. The characters could go where they wanted, and do what they wanted. Nope, not any more... took that one away... And the advise you give DMs to keep characters on track, I think, was very poorly handled, and seems very heavy handed (found under The Lockout System, on page 10). By doing this, you are removing the mystery and mystique that IS Undermountain.

One more rant, and I'll get to the stuff I liked (and yeah, there was a good amount that I liked). On page 43, you show us a map of the The Yawning Portal Inn... where's the entry hole? If you say the basement, cool... but how do you get to the basement?... where's a map of the basement.... it's described as being 40 ft. across on page 42, but it's not on the map! Editing guys, editing....

What did I love... Chapter 1 was really good. The description of Waterdeep, the "Event", and ALL of the levels (maps included on most, which is a first), was GREAT. I really liked that. The factions info, and the entrances/exits was nicely done. Chapter 2's info about the Yawning portal and its occupants (excluding the above mentioned), was really good, as well as the random encounter info.

Level info (what little we saw) was nice, but it got a bit confusing after chapter 4. 3-D dungeons are not easy for DM's to run. But, inventive... definitely inventive. Also, I really wish WoTC would get away from the Tactical Encounter pages. I don't like them at all, and I feel they are simply there to take up space to fluff the products. But, that's my opinion. I'm sure that there are people that love them.

The artwork was great, as where the maps (again, what little we saw), but the feel of Undermountain was gone. Please, please, tell me you are gonna either continue the old web articles, or please put out a full product (with maps). I really felt betrayed by this product. I bought it on the faith that it was Undermountain, and could not fail. I really feel let down.

But, as I said before, all of this is my personal opinion. I would like to hear others, bad, and good (especially good, so I can try and look at this from a different perspective). I hope that this post fell within the CoC, and if you do delete, please tell me why? I'd like to think that we are free to politely praise or condemn the products that WoTC makes.
Lord Karsus
07-03-07, 12:54 AM -There are already a couple of other threads open, dedicated to this particular book (with the same particular complaints, actually ;) ).
Gelcur
07-03-07, 09:01 AM Yeap, here (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=865685) is one of those threads. I think overall the books gotten mixed opinions. There are those who like it and those who hate, that thread pretty much covers all points of view.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Jhalad 07-02-07, 05:23 PM	Okay, I've read the CoC, and I'm pretty sure I can do this. I've looked at the other FR posting areas, and can't seem to find one specific to products. So, that said... umm.. spoilers, for those who want to know.. SPOILERS (just reiterating) Also, this is my personal opinion, and I am not trying to flame, troll, or whatever other descriptions for inappropriate posts there may be. I want to discuss this product and see how people feel, and also to allow the editors to respond. I want this to be constructive, not destructive. :mad: WHAT THE HECK?!?!?!?!? :mad: ARGH!!!!! I figured I'd get that out of the way.... Guys, guys, guys... come on... This was, in the past, the BEST Forgotten Realms product EVER to be put out. I was jumping out of my chair a few months ago when I heard ya'll were gonna update it. I mean, the online articles were outstanding. They gave the feel of the original dungeon. And then you ganked them... and then you announced this, so I stop pestering about when the online articles would return. So, a week ago I bought THE BOOK... and I gotta say, I was really disappointed... seriously truly saddened...:weep: I don't want to go into any more details than I absolutely have to, but the event that starts this whole thing off struck me as off, but I dealt with it. Then, at the end, what did you do? And I quote - Pg. 193 - "What was the doom - We leave that mystery for the DMs to determine -" again... ARGH!!!!! :mad: WHAT A COP-OUT! Not only did you destroy my most favorite of dungeons, but you don't even tell us WHY?!?!? Forgotten Realms is nothing if not detailed in it's happenings and history, and for one of the BIGGEST events to ever happen in the modern time to be brushed off like that... ARGH!!!! :mad: Plus, you cram the story line (or at least imply that) down the PCs throats. Undermountain's biggest draw is that it was free roaming. The characters could go where they wanted, and do what they wanted. Nope, not any more... took that one away... And the advise you give DMs to keep characters on track, I think, was very poorly handled, and seems very heavy handed (found under The Lockout System, on page 10). By doing this, you are removing the mystery and mystique that IS Undermountain. One more rant, and I'll get to the stuff I liked (and yeah, there was a good amount that I liked). On page 43, you show us a map of the The Yawning Portal Inn... where's the entry hole? If you say the basement, cool... but how do you get to the basement?... where's a map of the basement.... it's described as being 40 ft. across on page 42, but it's not on the map! Editing guys, editing.... What did I love... Chapter 1 was really good. The description of Waterdeep, the "Event", and ALL of the levels (maps included on most, which is a first), was GREAT. I really liked that. The factions info, and the entrances/exits was nicely done. Chapter 2's info about the Yawning portal and its occupants (excluding the above mentioned), was really good, as well as the random encounter info. Level info (what little we saw) was nice, but it got a bit confusing after chapter 4. 3-D dungeons are not easy for DM's to run. But, inventive... definitely inventive. Also, I really wish WoTC would get away from the Tactical Encounter pages. I don't like them at all, and I feel they are simply there to take up space to fluff the products. But, that's my opinion. I'm sure that there are people that love them. The artwork was great, as where the maps (again, what little we saw), but the feel of Undermountain was gone. Please, please, tell me you are gonna either continue the old web articles, or please put out a full product (with maps). I really felt betrayed by this product. I bought it on the faith that it was Undermountain, and could not fail. I really feel let down. But, as I said before, all of this is my personal opinion. I would like to hear others, bad, and good (especially good, so I can try and look at this from a different perspective). I hope that this post fell within the CoC, and if you do delete, please tell me why? I'd like to think that we are free to politely praise or condemn the products that WoTC makes.
Lord Karsus 07-03-07, 12:54 AM	-There are already a couple of other threads open, dedicated to this particular book (with the same particular complaints, actually ;) ).
Gelcur 07-03-07, 09:01 AM	Yeap, here (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=865685) is one of those threads. I think overall the books gotten mixed opinions. There are those who like it and those who hate, that thread pretty much covers all points of view.