Flaws anyone? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Flaws anyone? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
VanceL
05-22-06, 02:49 AM Just quickly, has anyone out there developed some FR or FR-races specific flaws? Our DM allows some custom ones on top of the UA ones, as long as they are not "too broken", not to mention fitting into his campaign play "style", so if anyone has worked some up, I'm keen to hear. Many thanks, VL. :thinks:
BrianCritchley
05-22-06, 03:46 AM I'm not a fan of flaws myself
here's one for Sun Elves:

Sun Elf Bigot: you belive sun elves are better then all the lesser races, even the lesser elf races. and it shows in your interactions with them -2 to diplomacy and sense motive rolls vs non-sun elves.

P.S.
for the sun elf fans out there, I'm not saying sun elves are evil, or anything but many sun elves do tend to have a touch of the haughty noble to em.
BadCatMan
05-22-06, 03:57 AM I've seen some Eberron-specific ones, like Disfavoured in House, but I'm not sure FR is different enough from a standard campaign setting to really warrant unusual flaws. You could just take normal flaws and reflavour them.

Hmm. Some ideas, don't ask me about mechanics though.

Faithless / Disfavoured by Gods
You've denied the power of the Gods, refusing to bow down or submit, or you even doubt their existence. Or one diety in particular really has it in for you.
Effect: May not cast any divine spells, and will not receive any benefit from divine spells cast upon you. May not be raised or resurrected, may not receive any benefit from religious organisations.

Enemy of Faction
You've made some powerful enemies, who hunt you at every turn and do everything in their power to thwart you.
Effect: Pick an organisation, such as the Zhentarim, Cult of the Dragon, the Drow, or even the Harpers. Throughout your life you will be harrassed by it's agents.

Dishonoured
You've shamed yourself, your ancestors and your people, and suffer guilt and disgrace for your dishonour.
Prerequisite: Gold Dwarf
Effect: Some penalty, like Weak Willed's -3 will saves.
NightBreeze
05-22-06, 09:32 AM I'm not a fan of flaws myself
here's one for Sun Elves:

Sun Elf Bigot: you belive sun elves are better then all the lesser races, even the lesser elf races. and it shows in your interactions with them -2 to diplomacy and sense motive rolls vs non-sun elves.

P.S.
for the sun elf fans out there, I'm not saying sun elves are evil, or anything but many sun elves do tend to have a touch of the haughty noble to em.

I would say a -2 to int, too. Anyway, great one there. :D
GothicDan
05-22-06, 10:39 AM I would change it to Elven Bigot. Some Moon Elves (Craulnober..) and Wood Elves (Wealdath!) can be just as bigoted, if not moreso, than Sun Elves. The Eldreth Veluuthra only has under 100 members, and nowadays Wood Elves are more common than Sun Elves in their ranks, and the leaders only include 2 Sun Elves.
BrianCritchley
05-22-06, 04:23 PM I would change it to Elven Bigot. Some Moon Elves (Craulnober..) and Wood Elves (Wealdath!) can be just as bigoted, if not moreso, than Sun Elves. The Eldreth Veluuthra only has under 100 members, and nowadays Wood Elves are more common than Sun Elves in their ranks, and the leaders only include 2 Sun Elves.

maybe but in this case I was more thinking back to the fact that some gold elves look down even on elves who aren't gold elves.

also there's a differnace between this kinda bigotry and the Eldreth Veluuthra. this is more then "well I'm just better then you" kinda bigotry.

the examples of moon and wood elves you cited indeed are bigoted towards non-elves so yes I suppose you could change it if ya wanted too.
GothicDan
05-22-06, 04:44 PM True.

But also note that Sun Elves, when they want to, are masters of intrigue and espionage. They live and breathe court life - if anything, they'd be more adept at dealing with manipulating others. The Phelothin clan of Cormanthyr was a House of Sun Elves that specifically dealt in manipulation and commerce with non-Elven organizations and such.

The worst adversary is the one you don't know about. :)
BrianCritchley
05-22-06, 08:29 PM True.

But also note that Sun Elves, when they want to, are masters of intrigue and espionage. They live and breathe court life - if anything, they'd be more adept at dealing with manipulating others. The Phelothin clan of Cormanthyr was a House of Sun Elves that specifically dealt in manipulation and commerce with non-Elven organizations and such.

The worst adversary is the one you don't know about. :)

true eneugh. however I've always found these flaws in UA to be silly myself anyway. I perfer roleplay of flaws rather then rollplay. ;)
GothicDan
05-22-06, 11:18 PM I guess I just prefer roleplay flaws to not be represented in stats - one of the same reasons I don't like things being Cha-based. I'd rather separate rolling from roling completely. :)
MasterGrazzt
05-22-06, 11:26 PM White Wolf explained that their merits and flaws are intended to help game masters who find that their players are not too into the actual roleplaying, to give them a little reward for it. So basically, I think the idea of this sort of system is to serve as a pair of roleplaying training wheels.
BrianCritchley
05-23-06, 01:18 AM I guess I just prefer roleplay flaws to not be represented in stats - one of the same reasons I don't like things being Cha-based. I'd rather separate rolling from roling completely. :)

yeah me too, that and I find that just using the current stats if your smart works fine, your theif is less capable at lockpicking? don't max out his ranks in the skill. there ya go.
VanceL
05-23-06, 03:00 AM Hi Folks,
just to clarify, I was actually after any flaws that people had generated, not a discussion on the pros & cons of using them in the first place. Sorry if that sounds a bit peevish, but seeing as my current DM allows their use, I see no reason to not take advantage of them. So, any more Flaws for the game, specific to the Realms or Realms species/races been put together out there?

Anyone know if Ed himself has done anything in this line? :bow:
Ta.
bitter thorn
05-23-06, 04:15 AM We had a Nar Ranger take "no time for book learning", but we haven't developed or customized Realms specific ones yet. However, I find the idea fascinating. I'd like to see a variation of flaws that gave specific logical benifits instead of simply a feat.
bitter thorn
06-14-06, 04:19 AM Hi Folks,
just to clarify, I was actually after any flaws that people had generated, not a discussion on the pros & cons of using them in the first place. Sorry if that sounds a bit peevish, but seeing as my current DM allows their use, I see no reason to not take advantage of them. So, any more Flaws for the game, specific to the Realms or Realms species/races been put together out there?

Anyone know if Ed himself has done anything in this line? :bow:
Ta.

How many folks in the Realms are even using flaws? :confused:
JaiaDrottsingr
06-14-06, 11:32 AM Under-fear.

Most people fear all of the Underdark's races. What about the Svirf? Huh?! HUH?!!!!!!
Pystian
06-17-06, 10:48 AM For a Jotunbrud character I was working on a "double flaw". Instead of having two lesser flaws, you have one that just sucks a lot. "Bulky". You take all the penalties of being large. -1 to attack, -1 to AC, armor costs double.

In a similar vein, I think a "Blind" feat could be cool, though it's not really FR specific. Over the years I've seen a lot of people want to play a blind character, but it's usually just not practical.
bitter thorn
06-18-06, 09:23 PM For a Jotunbrud character I was working on a "double flaw". Instead of having two lesser flaws, you have one that just sucks a lot. "Bulky". You take all the penalties of being large. -1 to attack, -1 to AC, armor costs double.

In a similar vein, I think a "Blind" feat could be cool, though it's not really FR specific. Over the years I've seen a lot of people want to play a blind character, but it's usually just not practical.

I think the flaws suck more than that already. WotC designed them to be worse than the feats you get to minimize munchkinism I suppose. I'm still kicking around the notion of lesser flaws with lesser benifits directly tied to it. Is there such a system extant anywhere in d20?
BadCatMan
06-18-06, 10:58 PM Why, that's Traits. Usually +1 to one thing and -1 to one or two others. Just before Flaws in UA.
bitter thorn
06-18-06, 11:21 PM Why, that's Traits. Usually +1 to one thing and -1 to one or two others. Just before Flaws in UA.

Thanks! I thought it rang a bell.
bitter thorn
06-21-06, 04:51 AM Why, that's Traits. Usually +1 to one thing and -1 to one or two others. Just before Flaws in UA.

Is anyone using trait to round out characters in the Realms?
BadCatMan
06-21-06, 04:56 AM Yo.

I've got a Svirfneblin, who is Skinny and Suspicious.
bitter thorn
06-21-06, 05:31 AM LOL! Cool.
Mordayn
06-24-06, 08:31 AM Some new traits and flaws i use in my campaign:

Traits:

Curious: Grants +1 to your gather information and search checks, but a -2 penalty to spot and diplomacy checks.

Skittish: Grants a +1 bonus to initiative, but a -2 penalty to saves against fear.

Flaws:

Shunned:
For some reason, animals hate you.
Prerequisites: Wild empathy or animal companion class ability.
Effect: You loose your wild empathy and animal companion class benefits, you can never gain these abilities unless you get rid of this flaw. In addition all animals have an initial attitude of hostile against you, and you receive a -4 penalty to handle animal and ride checks.

Armor-allergy:
You are exceptionally inadept at using armor and shields.
Prerequisites: Must have an armor or shield proficiency.
Effect: You can never gain proficiency in any kind of armor or shield unless you get rid of this flaw. When wearing armor or using a shield you receive double the normal armor check and non-proficiency penalty for doing so.

Spell-fumbler:
You haven't quite got the hang of spellcasting.
Prerequisites: Ability to cast spells
Effect: You gain a 10% spell-failure, this spell failure stacks with any spell failure from armor or shields. This spell failure counts for any spells you cast, even those without somatic components. In addition, any time you roll a natural 1 on a caster level check, the spell you cast backfires and affects you instead of the intended target. This includes caster level checks to overcome a creatures spell resistance.
bitter thorn
06-25-06, 09:52 PM Excellent. Thanks.
bitter thorn
07-16-06, 02:24 AM For anyone who's curious.

http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=187647

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
VanceL 05-22-06, 02:49 AM	Just quickly, has anyone out there developed some FR or FR-races specific flaws? Our DM allows some custom ones on top of the UA ones, as long as they are not "too broken", not to mention fitting into his campaign play "style", so if anyone has worked some up, I'm keen to hear. Many thanks, VL. :thinks:
BrianCritchley 05-22-06, 03:46 AM	I'm not a fan of flaws myself here's one for Sun Elves: Sun Elf Bigot: you belive sun elves are better then all the lesser races, even the lesser elf races. and it shows in your interactions with them -2 to diplomacy and sense motive rolls vs non-sun elves. P.S. for the sun elf fans out there, I'm not saying sun elves are evil, or anything but many sun elves do tend to have a touch of the haughty noble to em.
BadCatMan 05-22-06, 03:57 AM	I've seen some Eberron-specific ones, like Disfavoured in House, but I'm not sure FR is different enough from a standard campaign setting to really warrant unusual flaws. You could just take normal flaws and reflavour them. Hmm. Some ideas, don't ask me about mechanics though. Faithless / Disfavoured by Gods You've denied the power of the Gods, refusing to bow down or submit, or you even doubt their existence. Or one diety in particular really has it in for you. Effect: May not cast any divine spells, and will not receive any benefit from divine spells cast upon you. May not be raised or resurrected, may not receive any benefit from religious organisations. Enemy of Faction You've made some powerful enemies, who hunt you at every turn and do everything in their power to thwart you. Effect: Pick an organisation, such as the Zhentarim, Cult of the Dragon, the Drow, or even the Harpers. Throughout your life you will be harrassed by it's agents. Dishonoured You've shamed yourself, your ancestors and your people, and suffer guilt and disgrace for your dishonour. Prerequisite: Gold Dwarf Effect: Some penalty, like Weak Willed's -3 will saves.
NightBreeze 05-22-06, 09:32 AM	I'm not a fan of flaws myself here's one for Sun Elves: Sun Elf Bigot: you belive sun elves are better then all the lesser races, even the lesser elf races. and it shows in your interactions with them -2 to diplomacy and sense motive rolls vs non-sun elves. P.S. for the sun elf fans out there, I'm not saying sun elves are evil, or anything but many sun elves do tend to have a touch of the haughty noble to em. I would say a -2 to int, too. Anyway, great one there. :D
GothicDan 05-22-06, 10:39 AM	I would change it to Elven Bigot. Some Moon Elves (Craulnober..) and Wood Elves (Wealdath!) can be just as bigoted, if not moreso, than Sun Elves. The Eldreth Veluuthra only has under 100 members, and nowadays Wood Elves are more common than Sun Elves in their ranks, and the leaders only include 2 Sun Elves.
BrianCritchley 05-22-06, 04:23 PM	I would change it to Elven Bigot. Some Moon Elves (Craulnober..) and Wood Elves (Wealdath!) can be just as bigoted, if not moreso, than Sun Elves. The Eldreth Veluuthra only has under 100 members, and nowadays Wood Elves are more common than Sun Elves in their ranks, and the leaders only include 2 Sun Elves. maybe but in this case I was more thinking back to the fact that some gold elves look down even on elves who aren't gold elves. also there's a differnace between this kinda bigotry and the Eldreth Veluuthra. this is more then "well I'm just better then you" kinda bigotry. the examples of moon and wood elves you cited indeed are bigoted towards non-elves so yes I suppose you could change it if ya wanted too.
GothicDan 05-22-06, 04:44 PM	True. But also note that Sun Elves, when they want to, are masters of intrigue and espionage. They live and breathe court life - if anything, they'd be more adept at dealing with manipulating others. The Phelothin clan of Cormanthyr was a House of Sun Elves that specifically dealt in manipulation and commerce with non-Elven organizations and such. The worst adversary is the one you don't know about. :)
BrianCritchley 05-22-06, 08:29 PM	True. But also note that Sun Elves, when they want to, are masters of intrigue and espionage. They live and breathe court life - if anything, they'd be more adept at dealing with manipulating others. The Phelothin clan of Cormanthyr was a House of Sun Elves that specifically dealt in manipulation and commerce with non-Elven organizations and such. The worst adversary is the one you don't know about. :) true eneugh. however I've always found these flaws in UA to be silly myself anyway. I perfer roleplay of flaws rather then rollplay. ;)
GothicDan 05-22-06, 11:18 PM	I guess I just prefer roleplay flaws to not be represented in stats - one of the same reasons I don't like things being Cha-based. I'd rather separate rolling from roling completely. :)
MasterGrazzt 05-22-06, 11:26 PM	White Wolf explained that their merits and flaws are intended to help game masters who find that their players are not too into the actual roleplaying, to give them a little reward for it. So basically, I think the idea of this sort of system is to serve as a pair of roleplaying training wheels.
BrianCritchley 05-23-06, 01:18 AM	I guess I just prefer roleplay flaws to not be represented in stats - one of the same reasons I don't like things being Cha-based. I'd rather separate rolling from roling completely. :) yeah me too, that and I find that just using the current stats if your smart works fine, your theif is less capable at lockpicking? don't max out his ranks in the skill. there ya go.
VanceL 05-23-06, 03:00 AM	Hi Folks, just to clarify, I was actually after any flaws that people had generated, not a discussion on the pros & cons of using them in the first place. Sorry if that sounds a bit peevish, but seeing as my current DM allows their use, I see no reason to not take advantage of them. So, any more Flaws for the game, specific to the Realms or Realms species/races been put together out there? Anyone know if Ed himself has done anything in this line? :bow: Ta.
bitter thorn 05-23-06, 04:15 AM	We had a Nar Ranger take "no time for book learning", but we haven't developed or customized Realms specific ones yet. However, I find the idea fascinating. I'd like to see a variation of flaws that gave specific logical benifits instead of simply a feat.
bitter thorn 06-14-06, 04:19 AM	Hi Folks, just to clarify, I was actually after any flaws that people had generated, not a discussion on the pros & cons of using them in the first place. Sorry if that sounds a bit peevish, but seeing as my current DM allows their use, I see no reason to not take advantage of them. So, any more Flaws for the game, specific to the Realms or Realms species/races been put together out there? Anyone know if Ed himself has done anything in this line? :bow: Ta. How many folks in the Realms are even using flaws? :confused:
JaiaDrottsingr 06-14-06, 11:32 AM	Under-fear. Most people fear all of the Underdark's races. What about the Svirf? Huh?! HUH?!!!!!!
Pystian 06-17-06, 10:48 AM	For a Jotunbrud character I was working on a "double flaw". Instead of having two lesser flaws, you have one that just sucks a lot. "Bulky". You take all the penalties of being large. -1 to attack, -1 to AC, armor costs double. In a similar vein, I think a "Blind" feat could be cool, though it's not really FR specific. Over the years I've seen a lot of people want to play a blind character, but it's usually just not practical.
bitter thorn 06-18-06, 09:23 PM	For a Jotunbrud character I was working on a "double flaw". Instead of having two lesser flaws, you have one that just sucks a lot. "Bulky". You take all the penalties of being large. -1 to attack, -1 to AC, armor costs double. In a similar vein, I think a "Blind" feat could be cool, though it's not really FR specific. Over the years I've seen a lot of people want to play a blind character, but it's usually just not practical. I think the flaws suck more than that already. WotC designed them to be worse than the feats you get to minimize munchkinism I suppose. I'm still kicking around the notion of lesser flaws with lesser benifits directly tied to it. Is there such a system extant anywhere in d20?
BadCatMan 06-18-06, 10:58 PM	Why, that's Traits. Usually +1 to one thing and -1 to one or two others. Just before Flaws in UA.
bitter thorn 06-18-06, 11:21 PM	Why, that's Traits. Usually +1 to one thing and -1 to one or two others. Just before Flaws in UA. Thanks! I thought it rang a bell.
bitter thorn 06-21-06, 04:51 AM	Why, that's Traits. Usually +1 to one thing and -1 to one or two others. Just before Flaws in UA. Is anyone using trait to round out characters in the Realms?
BadCatMan 06-21-06, 04:56 AM	Yo. I've got a Svirfneblin, who is Skinny and Suspicious.
bitter thorn 06-21-06, 05:31 AM	LOL! Cool.
Mordayn 06-24-06, 08:31 AM	Some new traits and flaws i use in my campaign: Traits: Curious: Grants +1 to your gather information and search checks, but a -2 penalty to spot and diplomacy checks. Skittish: Grants a +1 bonus to initiative, but a -2 penalty to saves against fear. Flaws: Shunned: For some reason, animals hate you. Prerequisites: Wild empathy or animal companion class ability. Effect: You loose your wild empathy and animal companion class benefits, you can never gain these abilities unless you get rid of this flaw. In addition all animals have an initial attitude of hostile against you, and you receive a -4 penalty to handle animal and ride checks. Armor-allergy: You are exceptionally inadept at using armor and shields. Prerequisites: Must have an armor or shield proficiency. Effect: You can never gain proficiency in any kind of armor or shield unless you get rid of this flaw. When wearing armor or using a shield you receive double the normal armor check and non-proficiency penalty for doing so. Spell-fumbler: You haven't quite got the hang of spellcasting. Prerequisites: Ability to cast spells Effect: You gain a 10% spell-failure, this spell failure stacks with any spell failure from armor or shields. This spell failure counts for any spells you cast, even those without somatic components. In addition, any time you roll a natural 1 on a caster level check, the spell you cast backfires and affects you instead of the intended target. This includes caster level checks to overcome a creatures spell resistance.
bitter thorn 06-25-06, 09:52 PM	Excellent. Thanks.
bitter thorn 07-16-06, 02:24 AM	For anyone who's curious. http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=187647