How do you want your evil? [Archive] - Wizards Community

How do you want your evil? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Ioulaum
08-27-05, 12:50 AM There have been many(way too many) threads over in magic/diety forum complianting about how there too many powerful good guys and not enough powerful bad guys. And when someone mention some powerful bad guys, people start complianting that the bad sit around all day and do nothing. So I would ask what kind of evil do people want to see? The mega-ego manic who is bent of taking over the world, the ravening lunatic who kills everything on sight, or the quiet evil who corrupts good form within?
Darrian
08-27-05, 01:15 AM I want the Lawful Evil planner who has an agenda and who takes methodical steps to accomplish his goals. I want the Lawful Evil who can work/collaberate with others of similiar mindset. I see Zhentil Keep and the church of Bane this way.

The ways to accomplish Lawful Evil goals are subversion, corruption, diplomacy and force when all other means have been exhausted and the odds are stacked greatly in your favor.

Champions of Ruin describes the "Philosophies of Evil" pg 5-7. The two that I find most appealing and that I use currently in my game are "I am not Evil" and "seduction." I highly suggest that readers visit these pages in order to better define the evil that they like.

Darrian
(Evil is good)
GothicDan
08-27-05, 01:59 AM I always thought Bane was a little boring. He's organized, yes, but he's a tyrant. He may succeed in his goals of conquering where other non-LE deities fail, via the Zhentarim, but it's superbly difficult to keep ahold of land and citizens when you are tyrannizing them.

French Revolution, anyone?

That being said: I prefer Evil that just doesn't give a damn about anything other than achieving their personal goals, and using the most efficient and beneficial methods of doing so.

That's why I like Factol Skall. He's NE, but he's described as not actually "doing evil things." He's simply Evil due to his disrespect for life. And Larloch is evil because he will do anything to achieve his magical goals.
Darrian
08-27-05, 02:14 AM Dan, I see your example of tyranny failing in the french revolution. How about these two for tyranical rulers and longevity, Stalin and Mao. It would be very hard for anyone to argue that they were not tyrants and equally hard to argue that they were very enduring.

Darrian
(not a fan of Stalin or Mao)
Kuje31
08-27-05, 02:41 AM There have been many(way too many) threads over in magic/diety forum complianting about how there too many powerful good guys and not enough powerful bad guys. And when someone mention some powerful bad guys, people start complianting that the bad sit around all day and do nothing. So I would ask what kind of evil do people want to see? The mega-ego manic who is bent of taking over the world, the ravening lunatic who kills everything on sight, or the quiet evil who corrupts good form within?

I want the evil of FR, which is all of these and more since they all exist.
Yanagita Kunio
08-27-05, 02:46 AM I like my evil like I like my coffee...strong and dark...and with a spoon it....

My favorite evil is "The ends justifies the means." It gives PCs some thick gray matter [pun intended] to chew on. My current favorite candidate for a backwards drop into evil practices has to be the Moonstars...not that I want to drag the Blackstaff in the mud, but his new organization really teeters on that edge, and I can envision specific cells going over the brink. "Smite first, questions later" paladins fall into this category, too.

Thematically, I'm also a fan of hubris, not as a marker of personal evil but as an accidental cause of evil events. Dawn-Cataclysm-whoops Lathander falls into this category: it's not that Morning Lord didn't mean well or even try to do the right thing...it's just that his presumption of being right overwhelmed both common sense and the possibility of seeking advice before advancing. While old 2e stuff describes Karsus as barking mad, I think I prefer to characterize him as falling into this category as well.

Manipulative evil organizations are definitely in the forefront of my current campaign: Knights of the Shield, Shadow Thieves, and the Night Parade [so far it's a Sword-Coast-intensive game] for now...in future, hopefully the Yuan-ti.

The most powerful NPC I've built is a CE bard 20: exploiting his charm, status, and information-gathering skills, he collects gossip and dirty secrets, then deburses them out to all the people who really shouldn't know. Combining this with enchantment magics laced into his music like hypnotic suggestons, he can prompt riots, "arrange" suicides and murders, and otherwise turn communities on their ear...all of which occur after he leaves the area. My PCs need not fear, though, 'cause he's part of a long term plot....

The one thing I'm loathe to do is thrown about evil orcs and goblins: truth is, I feel sorry for the poor buggers. Gruumsh and Mablungiyet are like the archetypal abusive father figures...it's like Ike Turner got a Divine Spark.
warlockco
08-27-05, 02:54 AM Over easy with a side of hash browns? ;) :P :rimshot:

The problem with Evil not really being Evil, is too many DMs make the bad guys pushovers.
All reoccuring villians in my games, will study and learn from fights that PCs participate in against their minions.
I tend to lean towards villians from James Bond, but without the extreme under estimating.
BrianCritchley
08-27-05, 03:31 AM yeah, I tend top learn from my PCs as a DM and act accordingly, I've noticed that my PCs tended to ignroe ranged combat. thus I had a dragon hit em and remain in the air.
warlockco
08-27-05, 06:04 AM yeah, I tend top learn from my PCs as a DM and act accordingly, I've noticed that my PCs tended to ignroe ranged combat. thus I had a dragon hit em and remain in the air.

Mine tend not to be melee heavy. One is always an archer (ranger), another is a rogue type, one is a cleric, two others vary. But none have focused on melee combat. So melee combat monsters tend to mess them up pretty bad, especially ones with lots of movement.

Which is what I tend to focus on personally when I play my characters, but I do ensure that I have a decent ranged attack. I do a Cleric/Ranger that is a Longsword user that can do fairly well in most situations. But then again I try to obtain gear that will allow me to defeat most damage reductions. Also tend to run heavy on knowledge skills.
Thraen
08-27-05, 07:41 AM Shouldn't it be obvious from my signature?

Sharrans preach subtlety, an unforgiving pursuit of vengeance, secrecy, lies, caution, fleeing from failure, and the corruption of all things innocent. On top of that, they aren't afraid to die. In fact, they aspire to nonexistence. Sharrans strike me as the type that would gladly spend their entire life in the pursuit of ruining the life of a single innocent.

Ideally they should be illusionists or enchanters. Illusionists would misdirect the PCs to think innocents were the cause of the evil while perpetually hiding his identity and location. Enchanters would use dominated innocents as bodyguards and minions. Even if the PCs chopped down a happy family to kill the BBEG, is it really a victory on their part?

My biggest problem with evil characters:
Too many use evil as a means to develop power.
Too few use power as a means to develop evil.
Zevox
08-27-05, 12:38 PM Well, I definitely don't like evil (*points to avatar* Paladin :angel: ), but since they're necessary to make a campaign setting worth playing in, I'm with Kuje: what we've got is fine - every kind Ioulaum listed, and others to boot, and plenty for me to choose from as a DM whilst making my tale.

Zevox
Angurwald
08-27-05, 12:59 PM Dynamic Evil, intelligent and dedicated is a must for every campaign.

For a more personnal evil I like my vilains the way the Darklords were described in the old edition of Ravenloft. They are evil, yes. They must be stopped, yes. But they have storys, goals and sometime redeeming qualities.

--A.
Jonathan Strange
08-28-05, 01:12 PM I agree. Evil with style, background, personality and depth. My PCs and I are running an epic level evil campaign. It's a good time!
Junon Ghostblade
08-28-05, 01:30 PM I like Evil NPC's the party has a hard time hating.

For example, on my own campaign world (not my Realms Campaign), I have this Lawful Evil Knight. Now the party has tried to want to hate him, but they just can't, he's come along and saved their lives on at least 2 occassions because it suited his goals to ensure they completed theirs. I even got one of the PC's to agree to marry him. The whole story is long and complicated, but the point is, I like villains the PC's love to hate and hate to love.
Sote
08-28-05, 03:04 PM I prefer the "the ends justify the means" and the "I'm not evil" reasonings, and I prefer villains born out of tragedy. I think I'm in love with the Eldreth Veluuthra at the moment. They have some valid points, and somehow they seem more real than most other evil organizations in the Realms. I'm not really fond of crazy organizations (like the Cult of the Dragon). Still, I can like aspects of all kinds of evil. I mean, I couldn't help but smile when I read about Red Caps in the third Monster Manual (psychotic, murderous fey? Gimme, gimme!)
Lucifer Leviathan
08-28-05, 03:16 PM my taste in evil can change with my mood... there are times when i want them to be cold and calculating.. r then theres the weasling little theif... or the big crusher thug type evil...i think it really depends on the reaction i want to get from my players..

i disagree with the staements made about the fact that the bad guys always sit around and wait.. they dont.. in fact its usually the good guys trying to run around like chickens and stop them from the new plaot the begun to hatch... all of my villians are proactive.. not reactive...

i did enjoy reading that section of champions of ruin.... and tho i know its not a forgotten realms book directly.. i would suggest the book of vile darkness.. it has some wonderful villian types in there...
Cli' San Aquanova
08-29-05, 12:29 PM I like the intelligent, stylish, evil antagonists. The ones who always have an ace up their sleeves. I also have an intense like for the few BBEGs for whom the means justify the ends. Goes back to style. NE or LE I suppose I like best.

But to be honest, I'll accept any kind of evil characters. Just anything but Chaotic Mind-Numbingly Boring (what CE should be called). Drow, Cyric(ists), Talos, Umberlee, Orcs- I'm looking at you. :bored:

-C'SA
:u:Bring Back Merfolk!!!:u:
Aylomeizen
08-29-05, 02:18 PM I've always enjoyed the manic, unpredictable brand of evil. It's very difficult to get into a high-level campaign as that type of character, since everyone at some point will identify you as an enemy.
Another Gnome
08-29-05, 02:54 PM I like evil who's not too high-and-mighty to accept they make mistakes, and when they do, don't follow it up with yet another mistake of getting caught on exacting vengeance. If a bunch of wannabe heroes destroys your super-secret lair and ruins your decade-old plans for world domination, as a smart villain you don't start plotting revenge, but a change of career.
Yom Beekus
08-29-05, 07:32 PM I like manipulative evil. Those who use others to get what they want. For my PC's, this can be the most fun.

But I also like evil vs. evil. This really puts the PC's in a tight spot. Essentially, they have to choose between the lesser of two evils (for no fool would take on both evils...or would they?)

I just wrapped up an adventure this past weekend that had elements of the Knights of the Shield and the Eldreth Veluuthra in the lands of Tethyr.

It was much fun, especially when it came down to which side they truly wanted to support. The PC's are mostly human, and ironically enough, they chose the Elves who were supported by the Eldreth Veluuthra.
Vasyek
08-29-05, 07:39 PM I favor entrenched, adaptive, and sadistic evil. The sort that turns a constant, discerning eye to the frailties and doubts of those around them while maintaining a benign facade... the sort that doesn't require rationalizations or personal affront as a premise for their atrocities. The sort that remains glib, inscrutable, and above all determined in the face of adversity.

In essence, the perversely personable; calculating and level-headed, yet celebratory and capricious, Neutral or Chaotic Evil.
Shemeska the Marauder
08-29-05, 11:07 PM Depends on what sort of mood I'm in. Last campaign it was primarily evil that realized it was evil and had a fanatical, sociopathic obsession with causing it that bordered on religious devotion. All yugoloths, all the time. :D

“The Waste gnaws at the souls of its petitioners minute by minute more so than even Nidhogg upon the roots of Yggdrasil. You are slowly devoured by misery and regret, apathy and acceptance is the only route of potential escape from it all. And that hope is a false one, an avenue to greater tortures. Eventually, bereft of what it was that made you hurt, bereft of any reason to your pain, bereft of meaning to it all and your own existence, you have only your pain to dwell upon. You clutch it tight, making it worse because that pain, your pain, gives your hollow existence a meaning and a purpose that you otherwise cannot claim. It makes you special, it makes you unique and it makes you hurt all the more so. You embrace your agonies against all reasons, for none exist but those you perceive in the absence of the self, in the absence of what it was that once made you your own being.”

“Your hope that makes you clutch to your own misery will devour you wholly. Most will simply cease to be, or continue on nearly catatonic to the outside world, aware of nothing but their own unceasing pain. Some will be sold by the hags and given a false release. Others will be killed by creatures afflicted just as much as themselves. Still others will be used by we Yugoloths to fuel the infernal sorceries and engines of the Wasting Tower, to turn the cogs of evil, to fuel the Loadstones more and more. We are perfection born of horror. Out of purposeless agony is born purpose, out of meaninglessness is born meaning. Out of your pain we arise to turn you upon the spit once more. The cycle repeats over and over and you fuel our hunger against all reason. Out of your miseries we emerge. Out of your agony I exist.”

My new campaign has a more mortal version of evil, more goal oriented that knows it's evil but honestly doesn't care because the ends are justified in their view. Probably a combination of LE, LN, and NE working together.
Link182
08-29-05, 11:40 PM Those recent drow novels were great in their depictions of evil characters.
but I think I prefer the "I'm not evil" type.
I have one NPC who was once a great elven hero thousands of years ago. After being resurrected and finding everything he once knew gone and all his adoring fans long dead, he snapped. He's a self destructive alchoholic that worships Beshaba as he believes he's personally cursed and the world is out to get him. Worshipping her is the only way to stave off his rotten misfortune. He wants desparetly to regain his fame and so he can be validated through the adoration of others.
The Red Wizards are another interesting example of evil. I have on NPC in my campaign that I've been trying to create a set of wierd morals that make sense to him but seem abhorrant to others. He may be appalled at witnessing the abuse or violation of someone, but if at the same time, if someone told him that person was of a slave class, it would then make sense and seem ok. He also attacked and nearly killed his wife to steal some secret wizardly knowledge. Though they spell battled with intent to kill and she is hunting him down for revenge, he still loves her dearly. Magical might in Thay, being more important than human life, feelings or family.
I've often wondered why a PC or NPC would openly or secretly worship a known "evil" god. Not seeing or not believing you are a blantant evil villan is probably a good reason.
jim9311
08-30-05, 02:01 PM i think most of the evil background and such will probably be left up to a DM. I think WotC (and TSR before) shy away from giving "details" on evil. There is still a large group of people in the world who can't separate the game we love from us as people. They see a group of people who want to play a game of devils, demons and sacrificing minions. And I think the publishers fear that they will be tainted with that same coloring.
Aylomeizen
08-31-05, 08:34 AM I dislike cheesy evil - the evil that promotes unrealistic images, such as Cyric, Bane, or Talos. The purpose of evil is to show little deviation from good - hence, it seems more attractive. I honestly have no idea as to why the common Joe would stop following a good diety to follow Talos or Cyric, knowing that he'd ultimately be screwed over in the long run.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Ioulaum 08-27-05, 12:50 AM	There have been many(way too many) threads over in magic/diety forum complianting about how there too many powerful good guys and not enough powerful bad guys. And when someone mention some powerful bad guys, people start complianting that the bad sit around all day and do nothing. So I would ask what kind of evil do people want to see? The mega-ego manic who is bent of taking over the world, the ravening lunatic who kills everything on sight, or the quiet evil who corrupts good form within?
Darrian 08-27-05, 01:15 AM	I want the Lawful Evil planner who has an agenda and who takes methodical steps to accomplish his goals. I want the Lawful Evil who can work/collaberate with others of similiar mindset. I see Zhentil Keep and the church of Bane this way. The ways to accomplish Lawful Evil goals are subversion, corruption, diplomacy and force when all other means have been exhausted and the odds are stacked greatly in your favor. Champions of Ruin describes the "Philosophies of Evil" pg 5-7. The two that I find most appealing and that I use currently in my game are "I am not Evil" and "seduction." I highly suggest that readers visit these pages in order to better define the evil that they like. Darrian (Evil is good)
GothicDan 08-27-05, 01:59 AM	I always thought Bane was a little boring. He's organized, yes, but he's a tyrant. He may succeed in his goals of conquering where other non-LE deities fail, via the Zhentarim, but it's superbly difficult to keep ahold of land and citizens when you are tyrannizing them. French Revolution, anyone? That being said: I prefer Evil that just doesn't give a damn about anything other than achieving their personal goals, and using the most efficient and beneficial methods of doing so. That's why I like Factol Skall. He's NE, but he's described as not actually "doing evil things." He's simply Evil due to his disrespect for life. And Larloch is evil because he will do anything to achieve his magical goals.
Darrian 08-27-05, 02:14 AM	Dan, I see your example of tyranny failing in the french revolution. How about these two for tyranical rulers and longevity, Stalin and Mao. It would be very hard for anyone to argue that they were not tyrants and equally hard to argue that they were very enduring. Darrian (not a fan of Stalin or Mao)
Kuje31 08-27-05, 02:41 AM	There have been many(way too many) threads over in magic/diety forum complianting about how there too many powerful good guys and not enough powerful bad guys. And when someone mention some powerful bad guys, people start complianting that the bad sit around all day and do nothing. So I would ask what kind of evil do people want to see? The mega-ego manic who is bent of taking over the world, the ravening lunatic who kills everything on sight, or the quiet evil who corrupts good form within? I want the evil of FR, which is all of these and more since they all exist.
Yanagita Kunio 08-27-05, 02:46 AM	I like my evil like I like my coffee...strong and dark...and with a spoon it.... My favorite evil is "The ends justifies the means." It gives PCs some thick gray matter [pun intended] to chew on. My current favorite candidate for a backwards drop into evil practices has to be the Moonstars...not that I want to drag the Blackstaff in the mud, but his new organization really teeters on that edge, and I can envision specific cells going over the brink. "Smite first, questions later" paladins fall into this category, too. Thematically, I'm also a fan of hubris, not as a marker of personal evil but as an accidental cause of evil events. Dawn-Cataclysm-whoops Lathander falls into this category: it's not that Morning Lord didn't mean well or even try to do the right thing...it's just that his presumption of being right overwhelmed both common sense and the possibility of seeking advice before advancing. While old 2e stuff describes Karsus as barking mad, I think I prefer to characterize him as falling into this category as well. Manipulative evil organizations are definitely in the forefront of my current campaign: Knights of the Shield, Shadow Thieves, and the Night Parade [so far it's a Sword-Coast-intensive game] for now...in future, hopefully the Yuan-ti. The most powerful NPC I've built is a CE bard 20: exploiting his charm, status, and information-gathering skills, he collects gossip and dirty secrets, then deburses them out to all the people who really shouldn't know. Combining this with enchantment magics laced into his music like hypnotic suggestons, he can prompt riots, "arrange" suicides and murders, and otherwise turn communities on their ear...all of which occur after he leaves the area. My PCs need not fear, though, 'cause he's part of a long term plot.... The one thing I'm loathe to do is thrown about evil orcs and goblins: truth is, I feel sorry for the poor buggers. Gruumsh and Mablungiyet are like the archetypal abusive father figures...it's like Ike Turner got a Divine Spark.
warlockco 08-27-05, 02:54 AM	Over easy with a side of hash browns? ;) :P :rimshot: The problem with Evil not really being Evil, is too many DMs make the bad guys pushovers. All reoccuring villians in my games, will study and learn from fights that PCs participate in against their minions. I tend to lean towards villians from James Bond, but without the extreme under estimating.
BrianCritchley 08-27-05, 03:31 AM	yeah, I tend top learn from my PCs as a DM and act accordingly, I've noticed that my PCs tended to ignroe ranged combat. thus I had a dragon hit em and remain in the air.
warlockco 08-27-05, 06:04 AM	yeah, I tend top learn from my PCs as a DM and act accordingly, I've noticed that my PCs tended to ignroe ranged combat. thus I had a dragon hit em and remain in the air. Mine tend not to be melee heavy. One is always an archer (ranger), another is a rogue type, one is a cleric, two others vary. But none have focused on melee combat. So melee combat monsters tend to mess them up pretty bad, especially ones with lots of movement. Which is what I tend to focus on personally when I play my characters, but I do ensure that I have a decent ranged attack. I do a Cleric/Ranger that is a Longsword user that can do fairly well in most situations. But then again I try to obtain gear that will allow me to defeat most damage reductions. Also tend to run heavy on knowledge skills.
Thraen 08-27-05, 07:41 AM	Shouldn't it be obvious from my signature? Sharrans preach subtlety, an unforgiving pursuit of vengeance, secrecy, lies, caution, fleeing from failure, and the corruption of all things innocent. On top of that, they aren't afraid to die. In fact, they aspire to nonexistence. Sharrans strike me as the type that would gladly spend their entire life in the pursuit of ruining the life of a single innocent. Ideally they should be illusionists or enchanters. Illusionists would misdirect the PCs to think innocents were the cause of the evil while perpetually hiding his identity and location. Enchanters would use dominated innocents as bodyguards and minions. Even if the PCs chopped down a happy family to kill the BBEG, is it really a victory on their part? My biggest problem with evil characters: Too many use evil as a means to develop power. Too few use power as a means to develop evil.
Zevox 08-27-05, 12:38 PM	Well, I definitely don't like evil (points to avatar Paladin :angel: ), but since they're necessary to make a campaign setting worth playing in, I'm with Kuje: what we've got is fine - every kind Ioulaum listed, and others to boot, and plenty for me to choose from as a DM whilst making my tale. Zevox
Angurwald 08-27-05, 12:59 PM	Dynamic Evil, intelligent and dedicated is a must for every campaign. For a more personnal evil I like my vilains the way the Darklords were described in the old edition of Ravenloft. They are evil, yes. They must be stopped, yes. But they have storys, goals and sometime redeeming qualities. --A.
Jonathan Strange 08-28-05, 01:12 PM	I agree. Evil with style, background, personality and depth. My PCs and I are running an epic level evil campaign. It's a good time!
Junon Ghostblade 08-28-05, 01:30 PM	I like Evil NPC's the party has a hard time hating. For example, on my own campaign world (not my Realms Campaign), I have this Lawful Evil Knight. Now the party has tried to want to hate him, but they just can't, he's come along and saved their lives on at least 2 occassions because it suited his goals to ensure they completed theirs. I even got one of the PC's to agree to marry him. The whole story is long and complicated, but the point is, I like villains the PC's love to hate and hate to love.
Sote 08-28-05, 03:04 PM	I prefer the "the ends justify the means" and the "I'm not evil" reasonings, and I prefer villains born out of tragedy. I think I'm in love with the Eldreth Veluuthra at the moment. They have some valid points, and somehow they seem more real than most other evil organizations in the Realms. I'm not really fond of crazy organizations (like the Cult of the Dragon). Still, I can like aspects of all kinds of evil. I mean, I couldn't help but smile when I read about Red Caps in the third Monster Manual (psychotic, murderous fey? Gimme, gimme!)
Lucifer Leviathan 08-28-05, 03:16 PM	my taste in evil can change with my mood... there are times when i want them to be cold and calculating.. r then theres the weasling little theif... or the big crusher thug type evil...i think it really depends on the reaction i want to get from my players.. i disagree with the staements made about the fact that the bad guys always sit around and wait.. they dont.. in fact its usually the good guys trying to run around like chickens and stop them from the new plaot the begun to hatch... all of my villians are proactive.. not reactive... i did enjoy reading that section of champions of ruin.... and tho i know its not a forgotten realms book directly.. i would suggest the book of vile darkness.. it has some wonderful villian types in there...
Cli' San Aquanova 08-29-05, 12:29 PM	I like the intelligent, stylish, evil antagonists. The ones who always have an ace up their sleeves. I also have an intense like for the few BBEGs for whom the means justify the ends. Goes back to style. NE or LE I suppose I like best. But to be honest, I'll accept any kind of evil characters. Just anything but Chaotic Mind-Numbingly Boring (what CE should be called). Drow, Cyric(ists), Talos, Umberlee, Orcs- I'm looking at you. :bored: -C'SA :u:Bring Back Merfolk!!!:u:
Aylomeizen 08-29-05, 02:18 PM	I've always enjoyed the manic, unpredictable brand of evil. It's very difficult to get into a high-level campaign as that type of character, since everyone at some point will identify you as an enemy.
Another Gnome 08-29-05, 02:54 PM	I like evil who's not too high-and-mighty to accept they make mistakes, and when they do, don't follow it up with yet another mistake of getting caught on exacting vengeance. If a bunch of wannabe heroes destroys your super-secret lair and ruins your decade-old plans for world domination, as a smart villain you don't start plotting revenge, but a change of career.
Yom Beekus 08-29-05, 07:32 PM	I like manipulative evil. Those who use others to get what they want. For my PC's, this can be the most fun. But I also like evil vs. evil. This really puts the PC's in a tight spot. Essentially, they have to choose between the lesser of two evils (for no fool would take on both evils...or would they?) I just wrapped up an adventure this past weekend that had elements of the Knights of the Shield and the Eldreth Veluuthra in the lands of Tethyr. It was much fun, especially when it came down to which side they truly wanted to support. The PC's are mostly human, and ironically enough, they chose the Elves who were supported by the Eldreth Veluuthra.
Vasyek 08-29-05, 07:39 PM	I favor entrenched, adaptive, and sadistic evil. The sort that turns a constant, discerning eye to the frailties and doubts of those around them while maintaining a benign facade... the sort that doesn't require rationalizations or personal affront as a premise for their atrocities. The sort that remains glib, inscrutable, and above all determined in the face of adversity. In essence, the perversely personable; calculating and level-headed, yet celebratory and capricious, Neutral or Chaotic Evil.
Shemeska the Marauder 08-29-05, 11:07 PM	Depends on what sort of mood I'm in. Last campaign it was primarily evil that realized it was evil and had a fanatical, sociopathic obsession with causing it that bordered on religious devotion. All yugoloths, all the time. :D “The Waste gnaws at the souls of its petitioners minute by minute more so than even Nidhogg upon the roots of Yggdrasil. You are slowly devoured by misery and regret, apathy and acceptance is the only route of potential escape from it all. And that hope is a false one, an avenue to greater tortures. Eventually, bereft of what it was that made you hurt, bereft of any reason to your pain, bereft of meaning to it all and your own existence, you have only your pain to dwell upon. You clutch it tight, making it worse because that pain, your pain, gives your hollow existence a meaning and a purpose that you otherwise cannot claim. It makes you special, it makes you unique and it makes you hurt all the more so. You embrace your agonies against all reasons, for none exist but those you perceive in the absence of the self, in the absence of what it was that once made you your own being.” “Your hope that makes you clutch to your own misery will devour you wholly. Most will simply cease to be, or continue on nearly catatonic to the outside world, aware of nothing but their own unceasing pain. Some will be sold by the hags and given a false release. Others will be killed by creatures afflicted just as much as themselves. Still others will be used by we Yugoloths to fuel the infernal sorceries and engines of the Wasting Tower, to turn the cogs of evil, to fuel the Loadstones more and more. We are perfection born of horror. Out of purposeless agony is born purpose, out of meaninglessness is born meaning. Out of your pain we arise to turn you upon the spit once more. The cycle repeats over and over and you fuel our hunger against all reason. Out of your miseries we emerge. Out of your agony I exist.” My new campaign has a more mortal version of evil, more goal oriented that knows it's evil but honestly doesn't care because the ends are justified in their view. Probably a combination of LE, LN, and NE working together.
Link182 08-29-05, 11:40 PM	Those recent drow novels were great in their depictions of evil characters. but I think I prefer the "I'm not evil" type. I have one NPC who was once a great elven hero thousands of years ago. After being resurrected and finding everything he once knew gone and all his adoring fans long dead, he snapped. He's a self destructive alchoholic that worships Beshaba as he believes he's personally cursed and the world is out to get him. Worshipping her is the only way to stave off his rotten misfortune. He wants desparetly to regain his fame and so he can be validated through the adoration of others. The Red Wizards are another interesting example of evil. I have on NPC in my campaign that I've been trying to create a set of wierd morals that make sense to him but seem abhorrant to others. He may be appalled at witnessing the abuse or violation of someone, but if at the same time, if someone told him that person was of a slave class, it would then make sense and seem ok. He also attacked and nearly killed his wife to steal some secret wizardly knowledge. Though they spell battled with intent to kill and she is hunting him down for revenge, he still loves her dearly. Magical might in Thay, being more important than human life, feelings or family. I've often wondered why a PC or NPC would openly or secretly worship a known "evil" god. Not seeing or not believing you are a blantant evil villan is probably a good reason.
jim9311 08-30-05, 02:01 PM	i think most of the evil background and such will probably be left up to a DM. I think WotC (and TSR before) shy away from giving "details" on evil. There is still a large group of people in the world who can't separate the game we love from us as people. They see a group of people who want to play a game of devils, demons and sacrificing minions. And I think the publishers fear that they will be tainted with that same coloring.
Aylomeizen 08-31-05, 08:34 AM	I dislike cheesy evil - the evil that promotes unrealistic images, such as Cyric, Bane, or Talos. The purpose of evil is to show little deviation from good - hence, it seems more attractive. I honestly have no idea as to why the common Joe would stop following a good diety to follow Talos or Cyric, knowing that he'd ultimately be screwed over in the long run.