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| lavekkia06-12-07, 03:30 PM | Since Eladrinstar did not show up in months i presume that he won't reappear in short time. So i have started a new thread about Maztica; everyone feel free to contribute with everything he has in mind. Obviously everything written in the prevoius thread remain valid. Here is an initial ToC: 1. Maztica 1.1. General description 1.2. Regions 1.2.1. Nexal 1.2.1.1. Geography 1.2.1.2. Climate 1.2.1.3. Flora and fauna 1.2.1.4. Population 1.2.2. Payit 1.2.2.1. Geography 1.2.2.2. Climate 1.2.2.3. Flora and Fauna 1.2.2.4. Population 1.2.3. Far Payit 1.2.3.1. Geography 1.2.3.2. Climate 1.2.3.3. Flora and Fauna 1.2.3.4. Population 1.2.4. Pezelac 1.2.4.1. Geography 1.2.4.2. Climate 1.2.4.3. Flora and Fauna 1.2.4.4. Population 1.2.5. Kultaka 1.2.5.1. Geography 1.2.5.2. Climate 1.2.5.3. Flora and Fauna 1.2.5.4. Population 1.2.6. Huacli 1.2.6.1. Geography 1.2.6.2. Climate 1.2.6.3. Flora and Fauna 1.2.6.4. Population 1.2.7. Kolan 1.2.7.1. Geography 1.2.7.2. Climate 1.2.7.3. Flora and Fauna 1.2.7.4. Population 1.2.8. Tukan 1.2.8.1. Geography 1.2.8.2. Climate 1.2.8.3. Flora and Fauna 1.2.8.4. Population 1.2.9. Pasocada Basin 1.2.9.1. Geography 1.2.9.2. Climate 1.2.9.3. Flora and Fauna 1.2.9.4. Population 2. Races Of Maztica 2.1. Humans 2.1.1. Payit 2.1.2. Mazticans 2.1.3. Dog People 2.1.4. Green Folk 2.1.5. Azuposi 2.1.5.1. Sidebar: Azuposi and Kara – Tur 2.1.6. Minor groups 2.1.6.1. Metahel 2.1.6.2. Nahopaca 2.2. Halflings 2.3. Dwarves 2.4. Other races 2.4.1. Poscadar elves 3. Classes Of Maztica 3.1. Core classes 3.1.1. Substitution levels 3.2. Additional Classes 3.2.1. Substitution levels 3.3. PrCs 3.3.1. Pluma Weaver 3.3.2. Hishna Shaper 3.3.3. Eagle Knight 3.3.4. Jaguar Knight 3.3.5. Dog Shaman 4. Magic Of Maztica 4.1. Pluma Magic 4.2. Hishna Magic 4.3. New spells 4.3.1. sidebar: the ancient artifact spells 5. Monsters Of Maztica 6. Faiths Of Maztica 6.1. Maztica pantheon 6.1.1. sidebar: The afterlife 6.2. Maztican domains 7. Living Maztica 7.1. Lives of the common folk 7.1.1. Clothing and food 7.1.2. Work 7.1.3. Entertainment 7.1.3.1. Dancing 7.1.3.2. The Ball game 7.2. Economy and equipment 8. History Of Maztica 8.1. History 8.1.1. sidebar: The Maztican Calendar 8.1.2. After the coming of the Golden Legion 8.1.3. The foundation of New Waterdeep 8.2. Current events 9. Appendix: Expanded play 9.1. Psionic in Maztica 9.2. Epic games in Maztica 9.3. integrating other systems 10. Index |
| MarkusTay6306-12-07, 04:28 PM | Good Deal Lavekkia. :D Here is a Link to the Former thread, for reference. (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=821840) It will probably disappear off the boards soon. I see only one problem with your ToC so far - your Azuposi/Kara-Tur sidebar. I remember some discussion about this, but I couldn't find it in the Maztica thread, so it's probably buried in the Kara-Tur thread. I believe their were two sets of canon connections, the Issacortae and the Wu-Haltai. One was from Volo, and the other I can't recall, but both involved Monkey bringing settlers over from K-T. The Azuposi are related to the Northmen of the Moonshaes (strange, I know, but at least it is original), and that should become canon as soon as the GHotR hits shelves. Therefore the Azu-posi are a lighter-skinned Amerind people who are decended from the Northmen but were seperated from their people when the Sundering occurred. Its interesting to note that more Northmen probably survived in Anchorome then the ones we know of on the islands. I figure they were originally known as the Pozzi, and after the 'great flood' they were split into the Illu-posi (Island Pozzi) and the Azu-Posi (after mixing with local tribes of Azupaho ;) ). The people slowly migrated south, and their culture had been completely changed by the time they reached the border of Maztica. Somewhere WAY up north there could be a surviving colony of the original Pozzi (Norse). The fact that Northmen Longhouses are VERY similar in construction to NE Amerind's Lodges gives some credence to this connection, and the further north one travels the more 'racially pure' the Pozzi people appear. Its really the only way I can tie the two races together, but after 17,000 years the two would be nothing alike anymore. Perhaps the Wu-Haltai was but one tribe of some earlier people (the Haltai?), and another group was brought over by Monkey to save them from something (perhaps a sinking Island). We could even call this 'lost tribe' the Azu-Haltai, to make it all fit. |
| Sullivan06-12-07, 05:31 PM | So I have started a new thread about Maztica... I worked on material for a New World setting that used a lot of the mechanics in Monte Cook’s Arcana Unearthed books. After all, the setting is neither Occidental or Oriental – it is its own world, why not use a slightly different system? I’ll have to fish around my computer file, find them and post some of them here. |
| MarkusTay6306-12-07, 05:53 PM | Slightly different for magic, or classes, is fine, as long as everything remains D20 compatible (which Monte Cook's stuff is). Welcome aboard, Sullivan. :mage: *We really need some sort of 'welcome' smiley, or perhaps a salute... like this - http://e.deviantart.com/emoticons/w/wave.gif |
| Iakhovas06-12-07, 08:26 PM | The Azuposi/Illuskan connection from the PDF didn't survive the jump to the print Grand History, so feel free to include it or ignore it as you see fit. The Azuposi are related to the Northmen of the Moonshaes (strange, I know, but at least it is original), and that should become canon as soon as the GHotR hits shelves. |
| Sullivan06-12-07, 09:21 PM | Not everything I developed would be applicable to the settings – I was more or less envisioning the setting I was developing as a total mulligan. However, some of it can work. One thing I did was I put a variation of lizard people in a Mojave style desert. Most lizard folk are described as living in swamps, but deserts are home to a great many lizards. The lizard men I developed were Gela monsters in coloration and possibly carried a disease-ridden bite. Another thought was inspired by Gavin Menzies book, 1421*, about which more can be learned here (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1421_hypothesis). In the draft I developed, the Chinese analog had arrived decades before the European analog and maintained a connection with the indigenous people. Thus the European analog people were at an increased disadvantage in the setting. That would not be applicable here. However, a Kara-Tur expedition could arrive and begin to support indigenous people. This would create a kind of proverbial Cold War situation, with the Kara-Turan and Faerunian forces engaged in complicated maneuvering in the region, attempting to use the indigenous people as pawns – but the indigenous people are capable of their own plotting, politics and manipulating the Kara-Turan and Faerunian forces. *I don’t actually believe it, but it is interesting story fodder. |
| MarkusTay6306-12-07, 11:04 PM | Since I'm working in the presence of the Celestial Beauracracy in Anchorome (not much of a leap there, the cosmology is very similar), and there are at least two canon references to migrations from Kara-Tur, what you say is not only plausible but maybe even inevitable. There already exists a desert lizard race , the Asabis, in FR canon, but a 'True World' variant is a nice add. Firenewts would also be applicable, in volcanic regions. The Azuposi/Illuskan connection from the PDF didn't survive the jump to the print Grand History, so feel free to include it or ignore it as you see fit.Sorry to hear that, since I've been working it in. Was it dropped for space constraints, or because it didn't fit WotC's 'world view'? That is crucial, because I will still work with it if it was only do to space limitations in the book. I hated it at first, but it sort of grew on me. I'm always complaining about how derivitive the other parts of Toril are, so it would be duplicitous of me to dislike a concept just because it does not match the RW. So let me know, and I will keep working that angle. |
| Sullivan06-12-07, 11:23 PM | One thing that disappointed me about the apparent loss of the South America analog is that this may mean a decent analog of the Incan Empire. They were every bit as interesting as the Aztec and were almost curiously Roman in their desire to recreate their system of life and government wherever they went. The Aztec simply extorted gold and live sacrifices from everyone they conquered while the Inca wanted to make everyone they conquered into more Inca. Maybe there is room for this type of kingdom-empire on the northern continent. |
| Iakhovas06-13-07, 01:23 AM | No it wasn't cut. I just never submitted it. The Azuposi/Illuskan link was tenuous at best, and I never bothered to flesh it out. Frankly I had forgotten it until I saw this thread. Sorry to hear that, since I've been working it in. Was it dropped for space constraints, or because it didn't fit WotC's 'world view'? |
| Iakhovas06-13-07, 01:27 AM | The Olmec civilization living in the Lopango region south of Maztica may be a comparable substitute for an Inca type civilization in the Realms. One thing that disappointed me about the apparent loss of the South America analog is that this may mean a decent analog of the Incan Empire. |
| MarkusTay6306-13-07, 04:54 AM | Ah, Okay. I will think on it then. The three main civiliaztions are all present under different names, including the Mayans. The Olmec is actually a RW culture (they didn't even bother to change the name) that was a pre-cursor to the other groups, and it would work for the Incas. The Payit are the equivalent of the Mayans, and the Mazticans who came from the north are the Aztec, with Nexal being the equivalent of Tenochtitlan. The Azuposi are the pueblo-dwelling Anasazi culture, and more or less the Hopi tribe, whereas the dog-people, being the less sophisticated, represent less developed and probably cannibalistic Anasazi. |
| Sullivan06-13-07, 11:54 AM | Mostly I think there is an interesting tension between the stark contracts of the societies of the pseudo-Aztec and the pseudo -Inca. The pseudo-Aztec possess a weak central government, their cities are perpetually engaged in rivalry and are almost like Classical Greek communities in that sense. However, the pseudo-Inca cities are strongly connected by a potent central government bureaucracy and there is a kind of uniform culture and language everywhere. The people of the pseudo-Aztec cities are more free, but their cultures possesses a marked bloodlust evidenced in the human sacrifice. The people of the pseudo-Inca are not as free, but then the government does not practice human sacrifice with such abandon. Where would you want to live? The Inca also possessed an order of messengers and couriers. Without horses, all the travel was done on foot and these messengers took a primitive form of cocaine to help them endure long travels quickly. This could be handled with a prestige class, minus the coke use. |
| MarkusTay6306-13-07, 01:52 PM | We could simply create a 'holy plant', and call it whatever we want. Then by ingesting the leaves of said plant, it would fill the user with 'devine energy' and give him greater stamina. We just change it from drugs to religion and we're good to go. We could call the plant "Zaltec's Heart", after the war god. It would have a blue stalk, purplish-red leaves, and DARK red berries. The berries could be the 'devine' mechanism, rather then the leaves, to further seperate this plant from it's RW counterpart. |
| The Ubbergeek06-13-07, 02:41 PM | Not unlike the Vedic Soma... |
| MarkusTay6306-13-07, 02:58 PM | Not unlike the Vedic Soma...Precisely. :D I was going to bring Soma into the K-T region, and since we are making connections between the two, I can't see why this plant couldn't have traveled in either direction centiuries ago. |
| Occam06-15-07, 07:17 PM | I remember some discussion about this, but I couldn't find it in the Maztica thread, so it's probably buried in the Kara-Tur thread. I believe their were two sets of canon connections, the Issacortae and the Wu-Haltai. One was from Volo, and the other I can't recall, but both involved Monkey bringing settlers over from K-T. The other source (unless there's yet another I don't know about) is City of Gold, which implies a connection between the Azuposi and the Wu-haltai based on language similarities. The Monkey reference is only from the Volo novel, AFAIK, and I believe makes a connection to the Issacortae, although City of Gold does say "Wu-haltai and other races of Kara-Tur's Northern Wastes" (p. 8). |
| MarkusTay6306-15-07, 08:41 PM | The Wu-Haltai would make the most sense, since they migrated north and east over the centuries, so they probably came over through Anchorome via the 'long arm' of Kara-Tur that reaches across the top of the world map. I figure there was a 'little Ice Age' after the sundering, and the Bear... ummm the straight between the two landmasses froze over. Since thats stolen from RW, it makes sense, since both regions are excessively copied from RW history. I do remember there being two seperate mentions of Monkey bringing folks over, unless someone else got it wrong. I'll have to check back through the K-T thread, because now we may have three seperate connections. How does everyone feel about tying the Maztican Pantheon to the Draconic? Perhaps some sort of ancient racial memory from when Dragon empires ruled the world? After thousands of years they would remember these awesome beings as gods, especially given the low-magic in the region. Also ties in real well to their 'gods' needing sacrifices (they kept the early humans like cattle). So the myths would be nothing more then that, just myths. I thought it might be interesting to treat this area a little more heavy-handed then we are doing with K-T, because this region seems to have been the least popular setting. |
| Eladrinstar06-24-07, 07:17 PM | No, the internet didn't eat me (as speculated on original thread.) Depression ate me. I would like to apologize for dropping off the project. I just started getting depressed from crap at school, my family, everything. So I slowly let my internet life die. I knew you guys would figure something out. You guys are way more organized and willfull then I was. So I wish you all the best of luck. Sorry. I just wanted to spur Maztica redux into action, but I guess I just wasn't into it. So, I guess I should help now that I have more free time. I'm not organizer anymore, thankfully. Races By Alac Luin This isn't complete, but a place to start. Orcs and Half-Orcs Relatively new inhabitants in the true world. A Few Half orcs have traveled to Maztica from Faerun. About the year 1361 DR, some 20 thousand worshipers of Zaltec were transformed to Orcs, ogers, and trolls in an event called the Night of Wailing. As a result, in the current year (1374 DR), the first generation of orcs and half orcs born in Maztica are soon to be of an Adventuring age. Orcs and Half orcs native to Maztica come from the Nexal area and tend to be worshipers of Zaltec. Elves A tall bronzed skin tribe of elves, known as the Poscadar Elves, live in an shrubland type desert north of the Pasocada River and the Long Canyon. The origins of Poscadar is a mystery, but legend says the were created in a land of perpetual ice and snow, and were lead south to their current location by a wise shaman. They survive by hunting bison and have civil trading relations with the Azuposi humans. Other tribes of wild elves live in the jungles north of Payit lands. These wild elves are extremely xenophobic and aggressive. As of yet, no travelers from Faerun have been able to establish communications with these wild elves. These elves are distinguished by the ritual face painting they employ when expecting battle, and their distinctive hair style, typically the sides of the head shaved leaving only thin strip of hair in the center of the head running front to rear. Halflings Calling themselves the Short Ones the halfling neighbors of the Azuposi are removed from the culture of the jungle halflings to the south. Short ones are hunters and traders and keep small vegetable gardens. Short ones are avid collectors of turquoise Humans Azuposi A loose nation of human farmers that live north of the True Land of Maztica. They have their own deities, language, and customs. The Azuposi are divided into six tribes relating to the extreme points of the sun rise and sun set of the summer and winter solstices, and the abstract ideas of up and down. These tribes are, Mountain Lion (Northwest), Bear (Southwest), Badger (Northeast), Wolf (Southeast), Eagle (Up), Shrew (Down). Metahel A small human sect living on the western shores of the northern reaches of Maztica. They make their living as fishermen and are known to be decent whalers. Nahopaca A offshoot of the dog people living in the northern areas of Maztica, the Nahopaca are nomadic hunter gatherers and occasionally raid the homes of their neighbors, the Azuposi and short ones. |
| lavekkia06-25-07, 07:13 PM | Good to know that you re back then. :D Aside from the strong need of 30 hours days ( :P ) i think that i could hanlde this thread and not let it die. I m documenting further about Maztica... material from the NWN mod website is interesting. I would like to use some screenshot as artworks but i don t own Neverwinter Night so i humbly ask collaboration. As an alternative if someone has 3D Studio MAX files or scenes that could fit in the theme feel free to PM and i ll try to get some rendering artworks. Obviously this applies also to Kara Tur stuff that you have. I would also like to thank the poster that PMed me some VERY interesting stuff about Maztica races and PrCs. I ll convert it to 3.5ed and post it. Aside from that i would like to restart the discussion about Maztican magic; especially the part about Totems, fetishes, pluma and hishna. Do everyone find any issue with this ? |
| Eladrinstar06-25-07, 07:41 PM | The magic system seems adequate, we'd have to convert it, maybe make it "stronger" so players can have the fun they can have with Faerunian casters. Remember, we aren't doing this for ourselves, we are doing it for the average FR fun, who, although they like lore, ultimately play the game to have fun. I have an idea for an aquatic race. The Sharalin, I think that's what they were called. They were in Queen of Depths and were said to come from a sea on the other side of the world. The waters directly west of Maztica? I think they were called Sharalin. My cousin has that book right now. She often has my books when I need them. And FR wiki is useless. As usual and expected. I was thinking of us starting an overhaul of the early maztican history, I could start now, as I have the GHotFR PDF, but I should wait until the canon version comes out. |
| Alac Luin06-25-07, 11:19 PM | Aside from that i would like to restart the discussion about Maztican magic; especially the part about Totems, fetishes, pluma and hishna. I'm for that, I'm only hanging out in the background as I think I got a little passionate last time, which I may have come across a bit "over zealous":embarrass You aren't getting rid of me that easily;) If wanted, I can work on, post an "idea" on a new class. meaning I'll write up a class, with substitution levels for pluma and hishna, which can be changed with input from others. |
| Alac Luin06-25-07, 11:46 PM | I have an idea for an aquatic race. The Sharalin, I think that's what they were called. They were in Queen of Depths and were said to come from a sea on the other side of the world. The waters directly west of Maztica? They are are called Shalarin, they have a write up in Monsters of Faerun. In Maztica, they are said to be from an area called "Sea of Corynactics" I cannot place this area on a map as of yet. Just that it is on the western side of Maztica. There is another aquatic race, Itzcatli, just north of Patit/ Helmsport. Shipping from New Waterdeep and Fort Flame would go right through their area. From what I can tell, these creatures look more like sahuagin. |
| Eladrinstar06-26-07, 01:39 AM | Hey, Alac Luin, do you mind if I post the rest of the stuff you PMed too me months ago? Also, there should be wheels in this setting. It's crazy enough everyone had too haul around those huge stones in real life without carts, do we really need to be even crazier with the same thing happening on another world? And metalworking should be slightly more common. Not very good metals, mind, because they still need to be weak against the armies of Amn, but still a capability of it. Also, human sacrifice. This is considered evil, alignment wise, but not necessarily societaly, in Maztica, right? I checked wikipedia and Mesoamerica had a pitifly small beastiary when compared the plethora of legendary creatures in Europe. I have a friend who came from a small village in Mexico, maybe his family knows anything from folklore. I am going to go over the Monster Manuals and the Fiend Folio (That one has an interesting creature called the Ahuizotal) and see what monsters we can adapt to the setting. The time of troubles had happened by the time the Conquistadors, I mean Amnians, arrived. Didn't it go relatively uneventfully. Should we retroactively insert a minor deity to get killed so we can at least mention the event? |
| Occam06-26-07, 11:30 AM | Also, there should be wheels in this setting. It's crazy enough everyone had too haul around those huge stones in real life without carts, do we really need to be even crazier with the same thing happening on another world? Despite the apparent "craziness" of it, real-world Mesoamericans did pretty well without wheeled vehicles. Why remove an interesting point of distinction from other Torilian cultures? And metalworking should be slightly more common. Not very good metals, mind, because they still need to be weak against the armies of Amn, but still a capability of it. Again, lack of metalworking is part of what makes Maztica different and interesting, and in a much more significant way than the use of wheels. Why try to make Maztica more like Faerun? What makes the setting engaging are its differences. Also, human sacrifice. This is considered evil, alignment wise, but not necessarily societaly, in Maztica, right? That's a very tricky area. Human sacrifice, in an of itself, is definitely an evil activity within the scope of D&D alignment. It's possible that a culture practicing regular human sacrifice could have enough redeeming qualities that it wouldn't be evil overall; I'd say that a lot of DM interpretation would be involved in making that call. However, part of the effect of the Night of Wailing and the return of Qotal was to delegitimize the culture of human sacrifice, and so it's much less common, and less problematic, now than it used to be (except, presumably, within Nexal). |
| MarkusTay6306-26-07, 01:32 PM | Couple of points - I like that you seperated the northern halflings from the jungle ones to the south. I picture a culture in the north similar to the halflings of Eberron (dino riders!). :D I would prefer if half-orcs and/or Orcs came from the south (Katashaka). I'm working on a conversion (map really) that would make the Nyambe rules 100% FR, and Orcs were driven from that region in ages past. That setting meshes VERY well with FR, so I would like to keep the compatibility level as high as possible. I'm hoping that somewhere down the road WotC picks up the rights to the setting and releases it as OUR Katashaka. It really is THAT good. There is another sea race available, the Hai Nu, who live in the Celestial Sea (which connects to/becomes the Western Ocean). This would mean that the eastern version of merfolk live in these waters as well - the Ningyo. Wasn't there some mention of either crabmen or lobstermen mentioned somewhere in source as well? On yet another project I'm doing for another site I will be visiting part of this region with a map, and I've named the large body of water between Maztica and Katashaka the "Lopango Sea". I agree with everything Occam has said, once again. The wheel, obviously, will have gone into common useage over the last 15 years of cultural inter-action, but the remote tribes still will not be using it. I would keep metal-working only with the Payit, and still extremely rare. They would have picked it up from the foreigners, but it would still be in its infancy and probably of poor quality. In Helmsport, anything should be possible at this point. I say go forward with the magic we discussed in the other thread. I only had time for a quick blurb, and can't commit any more time to any projects ATM. All of those items are listed somewhere in source, in various parts of the world, and its about time we put together a cohesive system for primitive magic users. |
| Occam06-26-07, 02:50 PM | I would prefer if half-orcs and/or Orcs came from the south (Katashaka). I'm working on a conversion (map really) that would make the Nyambe rules 100% FR, and Orcs were driven from that region in ages past. That setting meshes VERY well with FR, so I would like to keep the compatibility level as high as possible. I'm hoping that somewhere down the road WotC picks up the rights to the setting and releases it as OUR Katashaka. It really is THAT good. Agreed, I LOVE Nyambe. In the plans for my campaign, Kosan orc refugees fled Nyambe after the fall of their empire, bringing along many of their human slaves. After a perilous ocean crossing, many of them settled in the southern regions of the Maztican continent. Over thousands of years, Kosan interbreeding with the slave races basically bred the orc out of them, leaving a broad-nosed, brown-skinned race of humans. They formed the Olman Empire (tying into some Greyhawk background, which bleeds into FR via the Savage Tide Adventure Path and its FR conversion notes), which spread across much of the continent. After the empire's fall, its people went on to form many of the present-day civilizations of the True World, including the Mazticans/Nexalans. The payoff is the Night of Wailing, when the horrible transformation suffered by many Nexalans was not the introduction of something new, but a reassertion of the most savage parts of their ancient blood. (You have to throw trolls and ogres into the mix there, too, but that's not so hard to finagle.) Anyway, just some ideas. |
| Eladrinstar06-26-07, 02:55 PM | Over thousands of years, Kosan interbreeding with the slave races basically bred the orc out of them, leaving a broad-nosed, brown-skinned race of humans. I'm pretty sure it has the Maztican people coming out of Katashka in GHotFR, which will soon be canon. Maybe we should wait for this one. |
| MarkusTay6306-26-07, 03:27 PM | Agreed. We are just tossing around ideas right now, until that source becomes available. Besides, what you say does not in any way conflict with what Occam proposes, and it actually helps to give this region a slightly different flavor then the RW. If we run with the Olman idea, we could easily have a long-lost city in Lopango that connects to a mirror-image of itself in the Amedio Jungle, the way some FR cities exist in multiple places. This would explain how a single culture spread on two (or more) different worlds. |
| Eladrinstar06-26-07, 03:47 PM | If we run with the Olman idea, we could easily have a long-lost city in Lopango that connecys to a mirror-image of itself in the Amedio Jungle, the way some FR cities exist in multiple places. This would explain how a single culture spread on two (or more) different worlds. Similar to Kara-Tur and Asia in Kara-Tur: the Re-dux? |
| MarkusTay6306-26-07, 04:13 PM | I'm not quite sure what you mean. What I proposed in the KT thread was that all Oriental cultures originated on a single world (Jadespace?), but after a cataclysm/WSE the people of that world 'seeded' many others, including our own. What we are talking about here is that the Olman originated in katashaka (Nyambe), and spread into the Lopango region. Then, using powerful magics they opened up a portal to a similar region on another world and spread there as well. One culture, two worlds. This is far more like what happened in Imaskar, but I would make the Olman magic divine, to differntiate further between the two. Like how the Egyptian culture spilled over into FR, the Olman culture spilled over into GH. There are MANY connections between GH and FR, so that wouldn't be too far fetched. I think that our own RW 'Central American' cultures may be related to the Azcans and Oltecs from the Mystara: Hollow World setting. Those cultures are far more ancient, and could have spread to ancient earth, whereas the cultures of both FR and GH are 'newer'. Probably two seperate instances of parallel evolution that each spread to at least one other world. Blame it on the gods - if all of the gods/immortals where the same, then it stands to reason that similar cultures would develop around them. |
| Alac Luin06-26-07, 04:26 PM | Hey, Alac Luin, do you mind if I post the rest of the stuff you PMed too me months ago? Sure, go ahead. I don't even remember everything I sent you, but it has all been posted on these boards at one point or another. Also, there should be wheels in this setting. It's crazy enough everyone had too haul around those huge stones in real life without carts, do we really need to be even crazier with the same thing happening on another world? Despite the apparent "craziness" of it, real-world Mesoamericans did pretty well without wheeled vehicles. Why remove an interesting point of distinction from other Torilian cultures? Slightly over looked is the existence of the items known as plumaliters. These things were used to do much of hauling around, merchants used them to carry goods, transport people etcetera. The main reason there were no wheels was the lack of pack animals. It was pointless to have carts when there was no way to move the carts/wagons. The jungle/desert/mountain environments of Maztica were not conductive to growing larger animals. To represent this, look at the real world chihuahuas. And metalworking should be slightly more common. Not very good metals, mind, because they still need to be weak against the armies of Amn, but still a capability of it. Again, lack of metalworking is part of what makes Maztica different and interesting, and in a much more significant way than the use of wheels. Why try to make Maztica more like Faerun? What makes the setting engaging are its differences. Th Mazticans did have the ability to work metal before the golden legion arrived. They worked gold, silver, and even bronze. EDIT: We can also add copper as a metal that they worked. The main reason for the lack of metalworking was the availability of resources, as in iron is not plentiful. Also, human sacrifice. This is considered evil, alignment wise, but not necessarily societaly, in Maztica, right? That's a very tricky area. Human sacrifice, in an of itself, is definitely an evil activity within the scope of D&D alignment. <snip> However, part of the effect of the Night of Wailing and the return of Qotal was to delegitimize the culture of human sacrifice, and so it's much less common, and less problematic, now than it used to be (except, presumably, within Nexal). One thing to keep in mind, the human sacrifices were performed by the clergy of Evil deities. The clergy of Zaltec ruled most areas by force, (both military and political) and fear. Many generations of this, society had to accept this as a fact of life. It really doesn't effect the view of D&D alignment that much. I checked wikipedia and Mesoamerica had a pitifly small beastiary <snip> I am going to go over the Monster Manuals and the Fiend Folio (That one has an interesting creature called the Ahuizotal) and see what monsters we can adapt to the setting. There are several that can be used, even in Monsters of Faerun. Tlincallis and Aarakocra are both natives of Maztica. The time of troubles had happened by the time the Conquistadors, I mean Amnians, arrived. Didn't it go relatively uneventfully. Should we retroactively insert a minor deity to get killed so we can at least mention the event? Nope, and no need really. Time of Troubles happened in 1358 DR Cordel arrived in Maztica 1361 DR, 3 years after the ToT. |
| MarkusTay6306-26-07, 06:37 PM | TOT = A volcano erupted... The End. ;) Here is a list of all the official creatures unique to the setting. Maztican Bestiary AaraKocra – Bird people. Ahuizotl – This guy is cool, a feathered ‘alligator-man’ Bakar – Large intelligent enchanted ants. Chac – Jaguar-like ‘nature-spirits’, I would give them the ‘Fey’ or ‘Spirit’ subtype. H’Calos – Giant black centipede Jagre – Jaguar-Ogres Kamatlan – looking similar to a displacer beast, a jaguar with four snakes growing out of its shoulders. Pasocada Ghost – From CoG, basically an arrow-shooting ghost Plumazotl – a strange living ‘feather construct’ Tabaxi – Jaguar-people; these guys present a unique problem. There is/was a tribe of HUMAN Tabaxi living in Katashaka/Chult/large island east of Katashaka. When doing some stuff for the Malatra region of Kara-Tur, I figured that the original Jaguar people were created from a tribe of Tabaxi by the Rakshasa, hence the confusion. That first group continued to refer to themselves as ‘Tabaxi’. Tlalocoatl - The Maztican Dragon (Rain Dragon), with a head at both ends! Thats it, thats all the official ones from the setting and the three modules. There is also a list of monsters from other parts of Toril that are available. I could of sworn there were some goblin-types, but I guess not. Using the Jungle Goblins (Batiri), as well as the Jungle Dwarves, from Chult would probably work out well, though. Yuan-ti are too obvious, and I'm already using them in K-T AND Zakhara, so they don't need to be here too. Races of more intelligent Lizardmen would work well, though, probably in Lopango. Also, the ratmen (Goblin Rat) of K-T would make a nice add there as well. We can bring back the Alaghi from 2e FR as well (sasquatch-like creatures). lots of possibilities here. |
| Eladrinstar06-27-07, 12:50 AM | Alac Luin PMed this monetary system to me ages ago. It's pretty creative Money Cocoa Bean: A cocoa bean is a small, brown nugget that can be ground into a flavoring. It is the most commonly used currency across the True world, and is abbreviated “cb”. It can be considered the rough equivalent of the copper piece. Copper Blade: A pressed sheet of copper, hammered flat and long shape somewhat similar to a knife blade, though it has no use as a weapon. Each has a small hole near the end, and they can be strung on a twine to create a conveniently carried necklace. Coral Bud: Coral buds are common along coastlines, and only achieve their value in inland parts of the True world. Each is about the size of a child’s fist. Jade and Turquoise: These stones are much valued by Maztican carvers and artisans. The size of the stones varies from pebble to fist-sized. Their value, after craftsmanship, can go up considerably in a city environment. The rate given increases at an equal rate. Quill of Gold Dust: A hollowed bird feather nearly a foot long. It is filled with powdered gold and sealed with a wax plug at the end. It is another widely used commercial agent, though with a much higher value than the cocoa bean; a quill of gold dust is abbreviated “GC”. -------- I'm going to guess inland coral buds are worth as much as copper blades. |
| Alac Luin06-27-07, 01:05 AM | I took that monetary system out of the book, Here is the accompanying chart (forgive my formating) TABLE IV: Items Of Value Commodity Maztican Realms Name Value(cocoa beans) Value (gold pieces) Cocoa Bean 1 1/100 Ear of Mayz 1 1/100 Copper Blade 10 1/10 Coral Bud 50 1/2 Jade (uncutstone) 100-1000 1-10 Quill of Gold Dust 500 5 gp Turquoise (uncut) 1000-10,000 10-100 |
| Eladrinstar06-27-07, 09:16 PM | Is it okay if I start to work on the deities? Is Darien, Cordell's albino wizard and mistress, still alive? I have an idea about her that could be interesting. |
| Alac Luin06-27-07, 09:23 PM | Is Darien, Cordell's albino wizard and mistress, still alive? I have an idea about her that could be interesting. Nope, she is dead. her and the other drow living in mt zaltec were all turned into Driders by Lolth. It is assumed all the driders died, a few may have escaped but she was explicitly killed off. There were only about 20 drow there in the first place. |
| Eladrinstar06-27-07, 09:34 PM | Nope, she is dead. her and the other drow living in mt zaltec were all turned into Driders by Lolth. It is assumed all the driders died, a few may have escaped but she was explicitly killed off. There were only about 20 drow there in the first place. Where does it say she was a drow? I think you may be confusing her with someone else. Darien is the woman who basically won a major victory for Cordell legion by teleporting to the enemy commander and fireballing him. My idea was that some Mazticans would adopt a foreigner as a quasi-deity. Cordell is way too obvious, so I thought Darien would be better since her evocation magic had never been seen among the Mazticans. |
| Alac Luin06-27-07, 09:42 PM | She's a drow, it was a long on going plot to bring dominance of Mazteca to the Drow. The clergy of Zaltec were already pawns of the Drow. The idea was to bring an armed force, with superior weapons to help conquer all of Maztica. Just about every move Cordell took for the ten years before the the Night of Wailing has been guided by this albino drow. (all this is detailed in the Maztica trilogy) |
| MarkusTay6306-28-07, 01:32 AM | Here is a list of the known maztican gods, and the Draconic Gods I feel they would correspond to. We discussed this in the other thread, and I think someone liked it, but we never went any further with it. Maztican Gods Kukal = Asgorath, or Io Maztica = A local aspect of Chauntea I chose these two as aspects of the earth Mother and the World serpent, who represent the primordial Devine Feminine and Masculine seen in most primitive mythos. Also, it specifically says “His undying despair shattered the Elder God…”, which sounds like a damn good reason to me why the world serpent was fragmented on Toril. Azul = Tlaloc, Aztec God of Rain, previously unknown on Toril, and father of the Tlalocoutl Eha = Hlal; besides the name, there isn’t such a good connection. She is female, however, and is the least ‘substantial’ of the pantheon. Kiltzi = Tamara; besides being good, she is the consort of Lendys, which fits the myths pretty good Nula = Astilabor; even though Null sounds better, the alignment fits and she's female. Plutoq = Null, in his Lawful-neutral aspect, although this connection isn’t perfect, he’s association with the earth could tie in with guardianship of the dead. Qotal = Jazirian, otherwise known as Quetzalcoatl, although I think he was killed by Merrshaulk, so I would say Lendys took over this aspect of him way back. Tezca = Garyx, lord of the fire-using dragons and Flame. Watil = Kereska - Worst fit of the bunch, even her alignment is off. The only explanation I can think of that she is the goddess of creativity and magic, two things which the Mazticans tie into their world-view of nature. Zaltec = Kalzareinad, the god of evil draconic magic that died during the ToT We could of course build upon this, and I purposely left out Bahamut (Xymor) and Tiamet, because they are already represented in the Realms. The Dragon gods that we could add are Zorquan (N) and Task (CE); Task makes a good fit and we could call him Coyote here, and have been brought over by the northern tribes from Anchorome. Another One I really like is Nathair Sglathach, god of Fairy dragons. I peg him as the K-T god Monkey, called Raven in this part of the world - A light hearted trickster and shapechanger. The way I look at it, way back when dragons ruled Toril, they kept primitive humans as herd animals. In time, the humans learned to worship the dragons as gods, and fed them 'sacrifices'. After the Sundering, the world changed and humans were able to survive, whereas the larger dragons had a harder time of it and their empires fell. The names the Maztican people give their gods are actually the names of the ancient Drgons who ruled this part of the world. Those dragons are long dead, but the 'mana' their worshippers were providing attracted the attention of the draconic Gods themselves, and they have taken on these names here in order to continue receiving this worship. The Drow wanting to take over this region fits nicely, because I bet Lolth would LOVE to get her hands on all of this worshippers offering sacrifices. The fact that Tiamet created the Scorpionmen (Tlincalis) in RW mythology is just icing on the cake. :D |
| Eladrinstar06-28-07, 02:02 AM | Here is a list of the known maztican gods, and the Draconic Gods I feel they would correspond to. We discussed this in the other thread, and I think someone liked it, but we never went any further with it. Maztican Gods Kukal = Asgorath, or Io Maztica = A local aspect of Chauntea I chose these two as aspects of the earth Mother and the World serpent, who represent the primordial Devine Feminine and Masculine seen in most primitive mythos. Also, it specifically says “His undying despair shattered the Elder God…”, which sounds like a damn good reason to me why the world serpent was fragmented on Toril. Azul = Tlaloc, Aztec God of Rain, previously unknown on Toril, and father of the Tlalocoutl Eha = Hlal; besides the name, there isn’t such a good connection. She is female, however, and is the least ‘substantial’ of the pantheon. Kiltzi = Tamara; besides being good, she is the consort of Lendys, which fits the myths pretty good Nula = Astilabor; even though Null sounds better, the alignment fits and she's female. Plutoq = Null, in his Lawful-neutral aspect, although this connection isn’t perfect, he’s association with the earth could tie in with guardianship of the dead. Qotal = Jazirian, otherwise known as Quetzalcoatl, although I think he was killed by Merrshaulk, so I would say Lendys took over this aspect of him way back. Tezca = Garyx, lord of the fire-using dragons and Flame. Watil = Worst fit of the bunch, even her alignment is off. The only explanation I can think of that she is the goddess of creativity and magic, two things which the Mazticans tie into their world-view of nature. Zaltec = Kalzareinad, the god of evil draconic magic that died during the ToT We could of course build upon this, and I purposely left out Bahamut (Xymor) and Tiamet, because they are already represented in the Realms. The Dragon gods that we could add are Zorquan (N) and Task (CE); Task makes a good fit and we could call him Coyote here, and have been brought over by the northern tribes from Anchorome. Another One I really like is Nathair Sglathach, god of Fairy dragons. I peg him as the K-T god Monkey, called Raven in this part of the world - A light hearted trickster and shapechanger. The way I look at it, way back when dragons ruled Toril, they kept primitive humans as herd animals. In time, the humans learned to worship the dragons as gods, and fed them 'sacrifices'. After the Sundering, the world changed and humans were able to survive, whereas the larger dragons had a harder time of it and their empires fell. The names the Maztican people give their gods are actually the names of the ancient Drgons who ruled this part of the world. Those dragons are long dead, but the 'mana' their worshippers were providing attracted the attention of the draconic Gods themselves, and they have taken on these names here in order to continue receiving this worship. The Drow wanting to take over this region fits nicely, because I bet Lolth would LOVE to get her hands on all of this worshippers offering sacrifices. The fact that Tiamet created the Scorpionmen (Tlincalis) in RW mythology is just icing on the cake. :D Nice concept, but I think we should just hint at it, such as Faerunians finding ancient temples with clearly recognizable dragons, but the natives have no idea what they are. The draconic presence in the setting is small, and the Maztican Gods should only be aspects. I get started on the gods tomorrow. I don't like to write this late because I these are my ranting hours, and I'd probably end up comparing Zaltec to Bush or Lindsay Lohan. |
| Alac Luin06-28-07, 06:00 PM | The Drow wanting to take over this region fits nicely, because I bet Lolth would LOVE to get her hands on all of this worshippers offering sacrifices. The fact that Tiamet created the Scorpionmen (Tlincalis) in RW mythology is just icing on the cake. :D "Officially" (as according to the novels) the few Drow mentioned actually turned their back on Lolth and turned to Zaltec. It was at the drow insistence that the Zaltec Worshipers increased the sacrifices. It was because they turned to Zaltec, Lolth turned them into Driders. It appears Lolth "forgot" about these drow and her attention returned to them after Darien returned to Maztica. |
| MarkusTay6306-28-07, 06:03 PM | Thats what I am saying, the dragons (except for the Tlalocoutles) are long gone, but these ancient aspects are 'leftovers' from the time when dragons ruled. Its just a tie-in to other parts of the world, and better establishes the draconic pantheon on Toril. There is a book mentioned in 2e Draconomican called the Book of the World, which is clearly a draconic religious text, but written by ancient humans! :eek: It was found in Asram, and has proven an enigma, but perhaps that could have been the ancient 'holy book' of the Mazticans, which was later brought to Asram by Netherese who found it. Its just one way we can tie this region into the rest of the realms a little better. ;) It was because they turned to Zaltec, Lolth turned them into Driders. It appears Lolth "forgot" about these drow and her attention returned to them after Darien returned to Maztica.I think 'Tlin' is a DROW WORD, because in the Underdark we have a city known as T'lindhet! The fact that many of the Drow from THAT city have turned from Lolth and worship Loviatar leads one to believe that the word 'T'lin' is some ancient word for 'unfaithful', or rather, Dark Elves who are easily swayed by other gods. Thats not canon, but I try to find connections like that whenever I can. Perhaps the Tlincallis (Drow for "unfaithful vermin"?) were originally worshippers of Tiamet, but turned from her to worship Lolth or even Zaltec, and were turned into there current form by her. That would fit with RW mythology, because it says Tiamet created the scorpionmen. So basically, we have Lolth getting pi$$ed at the Drow Zaltec worshippers and turning them into Driders, and then Tiamet getting pi$$ed for pretty much the same reason, and copying Lolth and turning her former worshippers into something similar. In fact, I could even see Lolth bringing these 'faithless' drow to Tiamet's attention. |
| Eladrinstar06-28-07, 07:29 PM | I've started working on them. I am going to have Eha originally Akadi's aspect, but during the time of troubles, Hlal seized Eha. Akadi sensed a dragon god is controlling her old aspect, and is pestering the draconic pantheon to see who has done it. She isn't in too much danger, she is a Greater Goddess. |
| MarkusTay6306-28-07, 08:24 PM | Cool. As far as the humans of Maztica are concerned, nothing is changed. This just changes the 'truth' behind their beliefs, and gives this once-dull region some new flare. Helm now intruding on this area is a very interesting development, especially given that he has many paladins (read: Dragon-slaying knights) amongst his order. The fact that he is no longer popular within his own pantheon, and is now making enemies here, should be an interesting dynamic. He may even have to ally with some of the 'good' draconic deities. ;) |
| Eladrinstar06-28-07, 08:30 PM | Eha is done :). Next up, Lesser Gods: Plutoq, Nula and Watil. EHA Wind Sprite Demigoddess Symbol: A cloud with a silver lining emerging from a flute. Home Plane: Mayel Alignment: CG Portfolio: Breath, air, wind, play, luck, Worshippers: Travelers, explorers, message runners, Aarakocra, Cleric Alignments: CG, CN, CE Domains: Travel, Air, Chaos, Luck Favored Weapon: Shortbow “Piercing Vapor” Of all the dozens of aspects and demigods worshipped in the True World, Eha is perhaps the most prominent. She is a relatively young goddess, arriving on Maztica only a few thousand years ago. She is fickle and changing, and she has had a relation with Azul, resulting in a frost godling Zaltec recently consumed. She has been known to sing at dawn and dance along the grass, leaving morning dew. She often takes the form of a slender woman when appearing to mortals. She is often transparent, and is surrounded by a white vapor which is both clothes and hair. When traveling, she takes the form of a spherical cloud. Her worshippers are those who trek bravely into the wild places of the True World. Her name is also invoked by messagers, and legends tell of winds picking up runners carrying messages of vital importance and placing them at their destination. Her clerics pray for spells at dawn. She has no scheduled holy days. Her sacrifices are usually ground cocoa and mayz, often after a birth. She finds sacrifice of sentient beings abhorrent, and prefers her worshippers do not sacrifice animals to her. While clerics of Watil guide over the mother during childbirth, Eha’s clerics are there for the baby, for it is said Eha helps the child breathe its first breath. History/Relationships: Among the Mazticans, is said she was brought into being by the first human breath. The truth however, is far different. Thousands of years ago, when Akadi floated on the jetstream, she spied a verdant land. Curious, she took a portion of her divinity and sent it to investigate. After the time of troubles, she realized she was no longer in control of Eha. She sensed a draconic presence, and she is pestering the dragon pantheon for information. She used to have a relationship with Azul, but she realized his evilness soon after the fact, and left him. She hates Zaltec for absorbing her daughter, and gives her support to foreign explorers who oppose his faiths practices. She is on friendly terms with Nula, and they often pull damaging pranks on their brother’s plans. Dogma: Fresh air is as important as clean water, so make sure yourself and others get as much as possible. Listen to the song of the morning birds, their tone can often warn you of what the coming day holds. Never harm a bird, unless it is to survive, for they are Eha’s servants. Don’t be afraid to destroy evil where it exists, but be merciful when appropriate. Help the foreigners when they foil evil, but make sure the respect the land and the people. Clergy and Temples: Clergy members are told to travel the land and help good where they can. They must always respect other travels when appropriate, and often are guides for Easterners. Clergy members usually wear very light clothing, often clothes tribal barbarians would wear, little more than a loincloth for males, even in civilized areas. They do favor extensive white and blue body paint, and this is sometimes mistaken for clothes. They spend hours painting intricate patterns that could take a week to come off. Shrines to Eha are rare, but not unknown. They usually tend to be small amphitheaters built almost as if opposite of the ziggurats. Her clergy practices rites while dancing and leaping among the stone steps. Often it features a cistern to catch rain water, and give it to those Azul has denied such a necessary thing. |
| MarkusTay6306-28-07, 08:46 PM | I'm a little confused, you wrote that she gave birth to Zaltec, but then hates Zaltec for consuming her daughter?! Zaltec and Eha are supposed to be brother and sister, as are they all. Thats another reason why I found the Draconic Pantheon so appealing, they're another big family of siblings. Also, I made a blunder, that was just pointed out to me by one of our prestigous members. Asgorath is Io, but not the world serpent. Ouroboros is the world serpent, so it would work better if you used him. Both Kukal and Ouroboros are considered fragmented/shattered, so it fits, and since neither are really worshipped anymore it doesn't really matter religious-wise. EDIT: After re-reading that sentence, I understand it now. Zaltec wasn't the child, he was the 'consumer' - sorry. |
| Eladrinstar06-28-07, 09:56 PM | Zaltec and Eha are supposed to be brother and sister, as are they all. Not necessarily. She is not mentioned as being born to Kukal and Maztica, but everyone else was. She may just be an interloper. |
| MarkusTay6306-29-07, 02:45 AM | Really? I had only read the myths at the beginning of the one book, not the specifics on the gods in the back of the other book. No wonder I don't remember her place in the myths - good call then. Sorry for all the confusion. In fact, I like it much better that she's an interloper - it fits better with the changes you/we are making. ;) |
| Eladrinstar06-29-07, 03:02 AM | Really? I had only read the myths at the beginning of the one book, not the specifics on the gods in the back of the other book. No wonder I don't remember her place in the myths - good call then. You're not missing much. |
| MarkusTay6306-29-07, 11:24 PM | After a little bit of research, I realize that Lendys must have been Qotal for quite some time, because Jazirian was killed BEFORE the couatls began to worship Qotal. Jazirian and Qotal are clearly two seperate beings, as per SK pg. 55-56. So if you still want the original Qotal replaced at some point more recent by Lendys, then I would say he was Quetzalcoatl (an interloper) at first, and was probably killed by Lendys after Ubtao stole his followers (the cuoatl). Or, alternately, you could say that Ubtao was Qotal all along, but was forced to chose between his followers in Maztica and the ones in Chult. Once he abandoned his western followers some years back, Lendys picked up the slack. The second version probably makes more sense, and we don't have to 'borrow' the Aztec God. In fact, Ubtao is a primordial Sauroid God, and the Sarrukh are sauroids AND were turned into couatls, so it makes sense in a weird sort of way for Ubtao to have been Qotal all along. At some point in their development, the Sarrukh probably gave up worshipping their primitive 'Sauroid Gods', and switched over to the more intellectual world serpent. Tyranthraxus was probably a member of that lost pantheon as well. BTW, I found some intersting stuff in SK concerning some of the 'Scaley gods', and it seems they LOVE sacrifices, so they fit the Maztican Pantheon to a 'T' (I know there are some differences between the Serpent gods and the Draconic, but I lumped them all together as 'scaley'). |
| Eladrinstar06-30-07, 01:48 AM | I've got Plutoq done. Next are the nature twins (Nula and Watil). PLUTOQ Master of Earth and Stone Lesser God Symbol: A mountain with a jade peak. Homeplane: Itzli Alignment: LN Portfolio: Earth, mountains, earthquakes, soil Worshippers: Farmers, mountain dwellers Cleric Alignments: LN, LG, LE Domains: Earth, Law, Destruction Favored Weapons: Maca “Fist of Plutoq” Plutoq is the youngest son in the pantheon, and would be just as strong as Tezca and Azul, if he had more worshippers. He is content with simple offerings from farmers for fertile soil. Occasionally, he has been stirred into anger, causing earthquakes that aren’t as devastating as they are in lands where such disasters are uncommon. He appears as a burly 40 foot tall man with stony muscle and clay girth. He has jade eyes, and long tusk-like obsidian teeth. His worshippers are the rare tribes who live on mountains or badlands. He is also worshipped by farmers who ask for fertile soil (Kiltzi often contest him for the attention of these farmers). Plutoq’s clerics pray for spells at noon. Acceptable sacrifices are vessels of pottery and jewelry. He does not ask for human sacrifice, though that does not stop certain clerics of immorality. He is seen as a god who could care less what mortals do, as long as they give him sacrifice where it is due. History/Relationship: Plutoq was the last child of Kukal and Maztica, born after the twins Nula and Watil. He is the most often ignored of the pantheon, to his annoyance. The first attempt, and failure, at making humanity, the clay people, was his idea. He sided with Zaltec when the schism between the eldest brothers began. Most of the pantheon tends to disregard his activities. Kiltzi is his rival in many cases, and some of their aspects have even killed each other. He is protective of Watil, and encourages his worshippers to ally with her. Dogma: Remember to always think Plutoq when the earth gives you luck, such as fertile soil and jewels. Never disrespect a mountain, for when you climb one, you are at it’s mercy. Respect plant life, for they are guests in the earth, and enrich the soil in time. Death is time for one to return to the earth, where one will be transformed into something more. Clergy and Temples: There are too factions of the faith of Plutoq. One is the “Clay”. They concern themselves with the low fertile soils, while the “Stones” watch over the mountaintops. The Clay help farmers, but the Stones tend to just spend their time contemplating rocks and snow in the heights. The Clay tend to wear light clothing and often coat themselves in mud, which they claim is cleansing of diseases and skin conditions. The stones wrap themselves in thick brown robes to hold of the cold. Clay temples tend to be small ziggurats, often with purposely less then sturdy foundations. However, they are constructed in a way that the temple slowly sinks into the earth instead of simply collapsing. This serves as a reminder that the earth reclaims all. The Stones temples are usually natural mountain caves, with rock formations serving as the sole decoration. |
| lavekkia07-08-07, 07:00 PM | I'm for that, I'm only hanging out in the background as I think I got a little passionate last time, which I may have come across a bit "over zealous":embarrass You aren't getting rid of me that easily;) If wanted, I can work on, post an "idea" on a new class. meaning I'll write up a class, with substitution levels for pluma and hishna, which can be changed with input from others. Shameless Bump :) I would like to see it if you are still interested in the thread.... I also would like to let everyone know that i did not drop the thread; i simply am a little (ready VERY VERY) busy so my updates are not very frequently. I am still working on the material i have; it s interesting but i ll wait Alac material before posting it. |
| MarkusTay6307-08-07, 07:35 PM | Both this thread and the K-T thread are somewhat on hold until we see what new lore we will be given in GHotR. Even the Elven Netbook has been pushed back until its release. I figure eventually we will have something for all of them, and then we can get on with the one I'm really loooking forward to. Halflings: The Other White Meat. :P |
| Raptorial07-09-07, 09:43 PM | Although I must admit that I do not remember much about Maztica, I would be willing to put my knowledge of legends of South/Central/North America to fill out the bestiary whenever you wish. |
| lavekkia07-10-07, 01:52 PM | Although I must admit that I do not remember much about Maztica, I would be willing to put my knowledge of legends of South/Central/North America to fill out the bestiary whenever you wish. You re welcome :) |
| Alac Luin07-11-07, 12:12 AM | Markus, I was looking at what I already had on the artisians, and went back to the old thread and wanted a little input on what was discused before. I may deviate a little, but.... All this needs to placed in the context that "Craft wonderous item" is a 3rd level feat. Talismen, as earlier discribed, look like weak wonderous items. My rough ideas fall around spmething like this. 1st level - Artisian path (choose pluma or hishna), Craft Talisman, Artistic Knowledge (similar to bardic knowledge) 4th level- craft wonderous item feat free for this class 9th level - craft Talismans (my idea talismans are linked to Totem areas, limited range) 13th level- craft Totem shard items (holds a portion of "tribe's totem spirit, useable any distance) 17th level- Totem Spirit- Creates/calls for protective spirits for tribal land, this may incroach on the Mythal seed in epic magic, but its an idea |
| MarkusTay6307-11-07, 02:15 AM | Looks good so far. :D |
| Raptorial07-11-07, 11:24 PM | Well, the first creutre is cryptozoology-oriented, but it could be nice for the bestiary. I'm sorry I couldn't get better art, but you surely know how it is...I guess. http://www.occultopedia.com/images_/topic/bigshoe.jpg Ucumar Zupai Medium Monstrous Humanoid Hit Dice: 4d8+23 (41 hp) Initiative: +2 (+2 Dex) Speed: 40 ft. (8 squares) Armor Class: 14 (+2 Dex, +2 natural), touch 12, flat-footed 1 Base Attack/Grapple: +4/+8 Attack: Claw +8 melee (1d6+4) Full Attack: Claw +8 melee (1d6+4) Space/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft. Special Attacks: Frightful presence, rake Special Qualities: Darkvision 60ft., powerful build, scent Saves: Fort +6, Ref +6, Will +5 Abilities: Str 19, Dex 15, Con 21, Int 4, Wis 13, Cha 12 Skills: Climb +5, Intimidate +5, Jump +6, Listen +1, Spot +1 Feats: Improved Bull Rush, Toughness Environment: Warm mountain forests Organization: Solitary, pair, or tribe (3-7) Challenge Rating: 3 Treasure: None Alignment: Always neutral Advancement: By level Level Adjustment: +2 (?) A brutish race of men-beasts that live in the higher lands, the Ucumar Zupai are an awe-inspiring sight. They reach a height of 6-8 feet, but are muscled like few other humanoids of that size. Ucumar Zupai's eyes gleam when hit by the moonlight. This, combined with their-dagger like clawed hands, make the beasts terrifying to behold. An Ucumar Zupai possesses a feral cunning, making life for any poor souls travelling in their lands a living nightmare. |
| MarkusTay6307-12-07, 12:55 AM | Thing looks a lot like Ed's Alaghi (MoF), and are probably an ancestor of them, like a low-land yeti. It looks good, and would work well as a Sasquatch in Anchorome as well. :D |
| Raptorial07-12-07, 01:26 AM | Yes, the Ucumar Zupai are pretty much South American Sasquatch in cryptozoology, though more feral and ferocious. Here's my next creation, a creature that is a terror of the deep and found in some of the Mayan legends Camazotz Medium Magical Beast (Aquatic) Hit Dice: 7d10+28 (66 hp) Initiative: -1 (-1 Dex) Speed: 10 ft. (2 squares), swim 40 ft. (8 squares) Armor Class: 14 (-1 Dex, +5 natural), touch 9, flat-footed 14 Base Attack/Grapple: +7/+10 Attack: Bite +10 melee (2d6+3) Full Attack: Bite +10 melee (2d6+3) and claw +5 melee (1d4 +1) Space/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft. Special Attacks: Disease (filth fever, bite), touch beyond death's veil, pounce Special Qualities: Blindsense, darkvision 60ft., low-light vision Saves: Fort +11, Ref +4, Will +2 Abilities: Str 16, Dex 9, Con 18, Int 2, Wis 11, Cha 9 Skills: Jump +5, Listen +6, Survival +2 Feats: Endurance, Great Fortitude, Track Environment: Any aquatic underground Organization: Solitary or gang (2-5) Challenge Rating: 7 Treasure: None Alignment: Always chaotic neutral Advancement: 8-14 HD (Medium); 15-21 HD (Large) Level Adjustment: - Touch Beyond Death's Veil (Su): A Camazotz is considered an incorporeal creature for the purposes of attacking incorporeal creatures. Called demons by some, souls of the dead by others, the Camazotz are in truth ferocious batlike beasts that dwell in the deep caverns connected to senotes (sp). The sacrifices that fall through to the bottom are hastily devoured by these monstrosities, as are any unfortunate enough to fall through themselves. The Camazotz are also servants of the god of the underworld (I'm not sure who we give this title in Maztica), albeit ones that have their own ends in the scheme of things. Despite its ungainly hobbling on land, a Camazotz can propel itself with force into a hopping pounce when prey nears. The beast's tiny white eyes are a result of underground life, and its nose is converted into an sensory "eye". A 7-foot Camazotz shuffling toward you is truly terrifying, whether you are dead or not. |
| MarkusTay6307-12-07, 01:32 AM | Nice, I like it. We gonna get a Chukakabra before this is through? I love that little goat-sucker. :D |
| Raptorial07-12-07, 01:39 AM | I'll try to get a Chup done as soon as I can, plus a conversion of d20 Modern's Mapinguari (A South American jungle cryptid...big sloth, pretty much). |
| MarkusTay6307-12-07, 01:44 AM | There are a few sites dedicated to Maztican campaigns, including several NWN sites. I don't play that game, but I have been 'slutting' around a few of the sites and the fan-base is as dedicated as ours. Some of the mod-pack artwork is inspiring, here's one example. (http://rom.rpgs.sytes.net/). Some really good stuff there on the cosmology (it's shaped like a pyramid, of course). I remember seeing a list of beasties for this region on one site a long while back, but now I can't seem to find it again. |
| Alac Luin07-12-07, 12:33 PM | It's a shame most of those Maztica revival sites die, in 2 years, there is only one update on the front page, and that update is about Mel Gibson. One note on the cosmology, that is taken directly from the Maztican boxed set. The image looks like a cut and paste from the .pdf EDIT: On the beasties, how about chihuahuas? Sure we may need to change the name. I can see them more of a swarm then stated individually :D |
| MarkusTay6307-12-07, 01:50 PM | I guess we can call them 'rat-dogs', which would be the native name. They could have been re-named by clever merchants importing them to Waterdeep - 'Fairy Dogs' are now all the rage in the North. :P So, we gonna put a Mogli-type here, or a Tarzan-type further south in Katashaka? We can always do a "Wild Child" PrC for it. Or perhaps even a Travis Morgan (The Warlord) type up in the arctic wastes of northern Anchorome. :D |
| Raptorial07-12-07, 09:39 PM | Here's the conversion of the Mapinguari. I'll have flavor and pics later. Mapinguari Large Animal Hit Dice: 8d8+48 (84 hp) Initiative: +0 Speed: 30 ft. (6 squares) Armor Class: 15 (-1 size, +6 natural), touch 9, flat-footed 15 Base Attack/Grapple: +6/+16 Attack: Slam +11 melee (1d6+6) Full Attack: 2 Slams +11 melee (1d6+6) Space/Reach: 10 ft./10 ft. Special Attacks: - Special Qualities: Low-light vision, scent, stench Saves: Fort +12, Ref +6, Will +3 Abilities: Str 23, Dex 11, Con 22, Int 2, Wis 12, Cha 8 Skills: Climb +10, Listen +5 Feats: Cleave, Endurance, Power Attack Environment: Warm rainforests Organization: Solitary Challenge Rating: 5 Treasure: None Alignment: Always neutral Advancement: 9-16 HD (Large); 17-24 HD (Huge) Level Adjustment: - |