Mini-Adventures in The Shining South [Archive] - Wizards Community

Mini-Adventures in The Shining South [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Brenigin
04-19-04, 06:04 PM I note that the WotC catalogue text says there will be 3 mini adventures in Thomas Reid's The Shining South sourcebook.

What do others think of these? I thought they were a great addition to The Silver Marches, as was the Web Enhancement adventure for The Unapproachable East. While (imo) FR tends to attract more experienced DMs, these adventures are a great resource both for those new to D&D and those with less time on their hands. Even the basic keyed locations we got in Underdark are better than nothing.

More adventures!!
Cunning Linguist
04-19-04, 06:36 PM No, less adventures.
The books should be a lexia of information, not a adventure box. They take up space that could have been used for more information.
Metis
04-19-04, 10:00 PM Originally posted by Cunning Linguist
No, less adventures.
The books should be a lexia of information, not a adventure box. They take up space that could have been used for more information. Perhaps if they get good reviews it will hail a continuation of printed adventures?
protonik
04-20-04, 12:08 PM I think adventures are absolutely essential to a product like the Shining South or Silver Marches because they do two things:

1. Help a DM jump start a campaign

and

2. Provide inspiration and flavour ideas on how to run a campaign in that region. Lets face it, running an adventure in Thay is not all like running an adventure in Cormyr and adventures help to illustrate to DMs what an adventure in that area would be like given the high character of each of the regions in the Forgotten Realms.

Many of the old products included adventuring material and plenty of data on the locales in which they took place. Here I am thinking of the Haunted Halls of Eveningstar, an excellent resource for the area and an adventure resource, though more of a toolkit to jumpstart a campaign than a storyline, but still, it illustrates my point.

Adventures can be just as informative and flavourful as general resource products because they outline cities, dungeons, inhabitants etc. of the region they occur in, often to greater detail than general regional sourcebooks.

I like to think of the Forgotten Realms region book as being more like the 2E boxed sets like Menzoberanzan or Ruins of Zhentil Keep, which contained adventures for a DM to run in those settings as well as a plethora of region specific information. On top of that, many of these products are some of the finest that were produced for the Realms in 2E.

So the inclusion of adventures, mini ones or not, is a bonus to US in that sense. I would love to see some smaller supplements like Haunted Halls being released in 3E, detailing smaller communities and providing adventure hooks for all.

Jason
newbDM
04-20-04, 02:23 PM The adventures while good are 1 time items... I don't want to pay X dollars for something I use once.

Adventures are GREAT web enhancements but I'd prefer them left out of the actual book.
protonik
04-20-04, 04:08 PM One time? One time? Do yuo know how many times I have run Sunless Citadel? 4 with 4 different groups, sometimes even the same players were in the groups. If the information in the adventure contains useful NPC stats etc, it can even provide for more detailed settings setting up recurring threats and potential allies. Take the 1st level adventure in the FRCS, the players developed a healthy relationship with the Enclave that helped them to overcome many threats and the players cared about the NPCs at the Enclave that weren't the initial threat (details escape me). When I killed one of them in a side trek the players were MAD at me for it. I think that implies an adventure giving more than just a one time shot in the arm.

Adventures are essential. Nuff said.

Jason
Cunning Linguist
04-20-04, 06:03 PM One time? One time? Do yuo know how many times I have run Sunless Citadel? 4

Why can't you use a web enhancement 4 times?
Kuje31
04-20-04, 06:59 PM Originally posted by Cunning Linguist
Why can't you use a web enhancement 4 times?

Well we could, but I'd rather have them in a book because 1) I don't like reading PDF's or web enhancements over the puter 2) I could print it out but that takes a lot more ink. 3) Then the sheets would be lost or the whole print out would as well, like the monster compendium sheets from 2e.
Cunning Linguist
04-20-04, 07:05 PM Well, I for my part would like to have The Affiliated Merchants of the Underdark and The Lowerdark enhancement in the Underdark book, rather then the adventure part from page 186 to 191.
protonik
04-21-04, 01:23 AM I don't have a printer, hate reading pdfs on a computer screen and don't use the web enhancements personally. I would rather have an adventure printed right there in the book where I can not lose it and it work. Sure I could use a web enhancement 4 or more times, but the arguement wasn't web enhancements, it was adventures in sourcebooks.

Also you need to keep in mind that each product is somebodies first exposure to a book and a lot of people still don't have access to a computer, so what better way to show them how to run an underdark/thayan/silver marches flavoured adventure than to provide one to them in a sourcebook... JUST LIKE THE OLD DAYS. Not shouting, providing emphasis. This way it is right there for them.

Sure it is right there on the website but several factors make that a chore:

A) Computer access
b) Printer access
C) Wizards website is for the birds and very poorly designed. Finding a link to a specific aspect of their website can be difficult at times, and frustrating at others, especially for newbies. Don't even get me started on the horrid search function that turns up very little useable resources.

Jason
The_Declaration
04-21-04, 09:23 AM I agree with Linguist, I want the books to be filled up with as much info as possible.
I don't care about scenarios, I take that part in charge. It can be provided in web enhancement
Faraer
04-21-04, 10:37 AM A good scenario can be invaluable in presenting a place, providing a slightly different point of view which creates a stereoscopic vision. My understanding of the Dales and Cormyr is much richer for FRE1-3 and FRQ1, because they show what the places are like at ground level and how adventuring companies can interact with them. Of course, mediocre scenarios won't achieve this: "Beneath the Twisted Tower" tells us nothing about the mode of the Realms, let alone of Shadowdale; most of the Realms Dungeon adventures have failed for my purposes in this regard.

As has been noted, many of the people who apparently dislike reading PDFs on computers will happily read as much text on websites...
protonik
04-21-04, 10:40 PM I think PDFs look blurry personally, maybe that is just me, but it almost like I am looking through smeared lenses when I see a pdf.

Jason

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Brenigin 04-19-04, 06:04 PM	I note that the WotC catalogue text says there will be 3 mini adventures in Thomas Reid's The Shining South sourcebook. What do others think of these? I thought they were a great addition to The Silver Marches, as was the Web Enhancement adventure for The Unapproachable East. While (imo) FR tends to attract more experienced DMs, these adventures are a great resource both for those new to D&D and those with less time on their hands. Even the basic keyed locations we got in Underdark are better than nothing. More adventures!!
Cunning Linguist 04-19-04, 06:36 PM	No, less adventures. The books should be a lexia of information, not a adventure box. They take up space that could have been used for more information.
Metis 04-19-04, 10:00 PM	Originally posted by Cunning Linguist No, less adventures. The books should be a lexia of information, not a adventure box. They take up space that could have been used for more information. Perhaps if they get good reviews it will hail a continuation of printed adventures?
protonik 04-20-04, 12:08 PM	I think adventures are absolutely essential to a product like the Shining South or Silver Marches because they do two things: 1. Help a DM jump start a campaign and 2. Provide inspiration and flavour ideas on how to run a campaign in that region. Lets face it, running an adventure in Thay is not all like running an adventure in Cormyr and adventures help to illustrate to DMs what an adventure in that area would be like given the high character of each of the regions in the Forgotten Realms. Many of the old products included adventuring material and plenty of data on the locales in which they took place. Here I am thinking of the Haunted Halls of Eveningstar, an excellent resource for the area and an adventure resource, though more of a toolkit to jumpstart a campaign than a storyline, but still, it illustrates my point. Adventures can be just as informative and flavourful as general resource products because they outline cities, dungeons, inhabitants etc. of the region they occur in, often to greater detail than general regional sourcebooks. I like to think of the Forgotten Realms region book as being more like the 2E boxed sets like Menzoberanzan or Ruins of Zhentil Keep, which contained adventures for a DM to run in those settings as well as a plethora of region specific information. On top of that, many of these products are some of the finest that were produced for the Realms in 2E. So the inclusion of adventures, mini ones or not, is a bonus to US in that sense. I would love to see some smaller supplements like Haunted Halls being released in 3E, detailing smaller communities and providing adventure hooks for all. Jason
newbDM 04-20-04, 02:23 PM	The adventures while good are 1 time items... I don't want to pay X dollars for something I use once. Adventures are GREAT web enhancements but I'd prefer them left out of the actual book.
protonik 04-20-04, 04:08 PM	One time? One time? Do yuo know how many times I have run Sunless Citadel? 4 with 4 different groups, sometimes even the same players were in the groups. If the information in the adventure contains useful NPC stats etc, it can even provide for more detailed settings setting up recurring threats and potential allies. Take the 1st level adventure in the FRCS, the players developed a healthy relationship with the Enclave that helped them to overcome many threats and the players cared about the NPCs at the Enclave that weren't the initial threat (details escape me). When I killed one of them in a side trek the players were MAD at me for it. I think that implies an adventure giving more than just a one time shot in the arm. Adventures are essential. Nuff said. Jason
Cunning Linguist 04-20-04, 06:03 PM	One time? One time? Do yuo know how many times I have run Sunless Citadel? 4 Why can't you use a web enhancement 4 times?
Kuje31 04-20-04, 06:59 PM	Originally posted by Cunning Linguist Why can't you use a web enhancement 4 times? Well we could, but I'd rather have them in a book because 1) I don't like reading PDF's or web enhancements over the puter 2) I could print it out but that takes a lot more ink. 3) Then the sheets would be lost or the whole print out would as well, like the monster compendium sheets from 2e.
Cunning Linguist 04-20-04, 07:05 PM	Well, I for my part would like to have The Affiliated Merchants of the Underdark and The Lowerdark enhancement in the Underdark book, rather then the adventure part from page 186 to 191.
protonik 04-21-04, 01:23 AM	I don't have a printer, hate reading pdfs on a computer screen and don't use the web enhancements personally. I would rather have an adventure printed right there in the book where I can not lose it and it work. Sure I could use a web enhancement 4 or more times, but the arguement wasn't web enhancements, it was adventures in sourcebooks. Also you need to keep in mind that each product is somebodies first exposure to a book and a lot of people still don't have access to a computer, so what better way to show them how to run an underdark/thayan/silver marches flavoured adventure than to provide one to them in a sourcebook... JUST LIKE THE OLD DAYS. Not shouting, providing emphasis. This way it is right there for them. Sure it is right there on the website but several factors make that a chore: A) Computer access b) Printer access C) Wizards website is for the birds and very poorly designed. Finding a link to a specific aspect of their website can be difficult at times, and frustrating at others, especially for newbies. Don't even get me started on the horrid search function that turns up very little useable resources. Jason
The_Declaration 04-21-04, 09:23 AM	I agree with Linguist, I want the books to be filled up with as much info as possible. I don't care about scenarios, I take that part in charge. It can be provided in web enhancement
Faraer 04-21-04, 10:37 AM	A good scenario can be invaluable in presenting a place, providing a slightly different point of view which creates a stereoscopic vision. My understanding of the Dales and Cormyr is much richer for FRE1-3 and FRQ1, because they show what the places are like at ground level and how adventuring companies can interact with them. Of course, mediocre scenarios won't achieve this: "Beneath the Twisted Tower" tells us nothing about the mode of the Realms, let alone of Shadowdale; most of the Realms Dungeon adventures have failed for my purposes in this regard. As has been noted, many of the people who apparently dislike reading PDFs on computers will happily read as much text on websites...
protonik 04-21-04, 10:40 PM	I think PDFs look blurry personally, maybe that is just me, but it almost like I am looking through smeared lenses when I see a pdf. Jason