Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Charles Phipps 10-14-07, 07:58 PM	I've read the article by Richard Baker and, frankly, it doesn't seem that much different from the Old Realms. The Realms wasn't exactly Eberron or Dragonlance but a place that was already waist deep in random encounters/monsters. So what will have changed in your opinion?
johnkretzer 10-15-07, 12:57 AM	I've read the article by Richard Baker and, frankly, it doesn't seem that much different from the Old Realms. The Realms wasn't exactly Eberron or Dragonlance but a place that was already waist deep in random encounters/monsters. So what will have changed in your opinion? For me I agree the Realms has always have a PoL feel...but my problem is that to me it had greater depth then a PoL campaign can generate. Now it is a little too point of lightish. I mean reading their desciption of the PoL campaign trade is all but impossible. In the Realms trade was a big part of the world, heck the Zhentarim goal has been to rule though trade as much as conquering. Also I like the Red Wozards Enclave which again isn't very PoLish. Also the PoL camapign make the heroes too great at a too early of a level in my opinion. I like the more human side of the stories where the character becomes heroes and aren't just born that way. Which is a issue with the overall feel of 4th edition in general. Also not to mention that ther Weave is gone and it has become very low magic...
Charles Phipps 10-15-07, 01:13 AM	Well, The Weave is gone but clearly wizards and sorcerers will still be available in whatever form the D&D 4E chooses to make them. I'm personally hoping that they'll ditch the Vancian form of them. I'm suspecting we'll be seeing new magic will be drawn from the Elements, Shadows, and other sources directly as part of the Flavor Text of the New Realms if I had to make a wild guess right now. Of course, I always felt the Red Wizards shouldn't have Enclaves and those should be Zhentish ones. You dont need TWO trading empires of evil wizards IMHO.
Reneshat 10-15-07, 01:24 AM	For me I agree the Realms has always have a PoL feel...but my problem is that to me it had greater depth then a PoL campaign can generate. Now it is a little too point of lightish. I mean reading their desciption of the PoL campaign trade is all but impossible. In the Realms trade was a big part of the world, heck the Zhentarim goal has been to rule though trade as much as conquering. Also I like the Red Wozards Enclave which again isn't very PoLish. Also the PoL camapign make the heroes too great at a too early of a level in my opinion. I like the more human side of the stories where the character becomes heroes and aren't just born that way. Which is a issue with the overall feel of 4th edition in general. Also not to mention that ther Weave is gone and it has become very low magic... John, I think this is a case of you assuming too much. There are many things we know about the new setting, but there are many things we don't know, including many of the things you have mentioned here. We don't know how the death of Mystra winds up affecting how high magic the campaign world is. We don't know just how Points of Light the campaign world is really going to be. Sure, the prologue to the Orc King makes Realms 1485 seems like Dark Sun all over again, but all things aside, that was a prologue to one book set in an area that honestly wasn't all that civilized to begin with, possibly set many years after the new campaign will be. I understand why you are upset about the changes you have heard about, and why what you have heard would lead you to feel this is the direction of the world, but to be fair, we don't actually know that yet. We just plain don't have enough information to make any hard judgments on what the new Realms is going to be like. Will it be missing many things that you like about the Realms, and will there be new things and changes you don't like? I can assure you of that. Will everything be as bad as you think it will be? Maybe, maybe not. Rich simply hasn't given us enough information yet, and no one else has given us much information at all. So by all means, voice your complaints about the information we have gotten so far. Let us know how you would do things, or would work the specific changes we know about. Keep in mind however, that "it's not over until the fat lady sings," and we are just now reaching the end of the first act. We have two more excruciating acts of Reams development to go before we know exactly what it is we are dealing with. Rich Baker tailgates.
johnkretzer 10-15-07, 02:04 AM	John, I think this is a case of you assuming too much. There are many things we know about the new setting, but there are many things we don't know, including many of the things you have mentioned here. We don't know how the death of Mystra winds up affecting how high magic the campaign world is. We don't know just how Points of Light the campaign world is really going to be. Sure, the prologue to the Orc King makes Realms 1485 seems like Dark Sun all over again, but all things aside, that was a prologue to one book set in an area that honestly wasn't all that civilized to begin with, possibly set many years after the new campaign will be. I understand why you are upset about the changes you have heard about, and why what you have heard would lead you to feel this is the direction of the world, but to be fair, we don't actually know that yet. We just plain don't have enough information to make any hard judgments on what the new Realms is going to be like. Will it be missing many things that you like about the Realms, and will there be new things and changes you don't like? I can assure you of that. Will everything be as bad as you think it will be? Maybe, maybe not. Rich simply hasn't given us enough information yet, and no one else has given us much information at all. So by all means, voice your complaints about the information we have gotten so far. Let us know how you would do things, or would work the specific changes we know about. Keep in mind however, that "it's not over until the fat lady sings," and we are just now reaching the end of the first act. We have two more excruciating acts of Reams development to go before we know exactly what it is we are dealing with. Rich Baker tailgates. You are right. I migh be assuming a little much here. Though then again I perfer to pessimistic so when things turn out better I am pleasently surprised... By the way is there a end to the joke in your sig?
johnkretzer 10-15-07, 02:08 AM	Well, The Weave is gone but clearly wizards and sorcerers will still be available in whatever form the D&D 4E chooses to make them. I'm personally hoping that they'll ditch the Vancian form of them. I'm suspecting we'll be seeing new magic will be drawn from the Elements, Shadows, and other sources directly as part of the Flavor Text of the New Realms if I had to make a wild guess right now. Of course, I always felt the Red Wizards shouldn't have Enclaves and those should be Zhentish ones. You dont need TWO trading empires of evil wizards IMHO. I liked that evil forces competeing with each other...it just seems to be alot of fun. Getting help from your enemies..shrug. Also I like the Vancian magic system. Though that is besides the point as the Weave wasn't a Vancian magic system to start with. I mean all magic went though the Weave including the ones you mentioned( Those aren't exactly new magic types they have been around since second edition shadow masgic since 1st).
Charles Phipps 10-15-07, 02:12 AM	I'm aware of that but I'm fairly sure they'll accent the difference in future editions.
johnkretzer 10-15-07, 02:16 AM	I'm aware of that but I'm fairly sure they'll accent the difference in future editions. Anyway the Weave was the best tool to implemented the changes to the magic system you could possibly want. I don't get why they destroyed it. Personaly just from a pov of a writer the Weave is the best plot device since slice bread.
Charles Phipps 10-15-07, 03:03 AM	Drizzt nodded in resignation at the unavoidable truth of that statement. There were times when he felt as if the road he walked was not a straight line toward progress, but a circling track, a futile loop. He let that negative notion pass, and reminded himself of how far the region had come—and that in a world gone mad from the Spellplague. Few places in all of Faerūn could claim to be more civilized than they had been those hundred years before, but the region known as the Silver Marches, in no small part because of the courage of a succession of orc kings named Obould, had much to be proud of. His perspective and memories of that time a hundred years gone, before the rise of the Empire of Netheril, the coming of the aboleths, and the discordant and disastrous joining of two worlds, brought to Drizzt thoughts of another predicament so much like the one playing out before him. And here's some more. “I have ventured outside of the Silver Marches,” Drizzt said, “have you? I have witnessed the death of once-proud Luskan, and with it, the death of a dear, dear friend, whose dreams lay shattered and broken beside the bodies of five thousand victims. I have watched the greatest cathedral in the world burn and collapse. I witnessed the hope of the goodly drow, the rise of the followers of Eilistraee. But where are they now?” “You speak in ridd—” the elf started, but Drizzt slammed him again. “Gone!” Drizzt shouted. “Gone, and gone with them the hopes of a tamed and gentle world. I have watched once safe trails revert to wilderness, and have walked a dozen-dozen communities that you will never know. They are gone now, lost to the Spellplague or worse! Where are the benevolent gods? Where is the refuge from the tumult of a world gone mad? Where are the candles to chase away the darkness?” Plus this... “They are here, those lights of hope,” Drizzt said, to both elves. “In the Silver Marches. Or they are nowhere. Do we choose peace or do we choose war? If it is battle you seek, fool elf, then get you gone from this land. You will find death aplenty, I assure you. You will find ruins where once proud cities stood. You will find fields of wind-washed bones, or perhaps the remains of a single hearth, where once an entire village thrived. “And in that hundred years of chaos, amidst the coming of darkness, few have escaped the swirl of destruction, but we have flourished. Can you say the same for Thay? Mulhorand? Sembia? So, likely things that are now gone. * Cadderly and Spirit Soaring. * Elistrarae's followers will either be gone or decimated. * Thay will not be thriving. * Sembia will not be thriving. * Neither will Mulhorand. But we don't know if they'll be GONE.
Crazygx34 10-15-07, 03:56 AM	I think they will have more evil kingdom and less racism. Just look in your history. If they advanced 100 in futur. Toril look already a lot like planet earth for geographie and continent and some human kingdom style. Yes I'm sure the Zentharim will have grow stronger. The Arcane brotherhood and red wizard too. But maybe some less racism between race. I don't have read the orc king but maybe it going in the way of reapproach dwarf, human, elve and orc like in Sylverimoon. I think that will make like orian and occidant but in faerun. Maztica will be more explored and colonized, I don't know for Kar-tur. More liberty and respect of each other in the west and more slave and evil kingdow in the east. It what I think of it. The weave gone the arcane spellcaster will be granted spell by who. Maybe god will not grant the spell anymore. Spellcaster will be more like superheroes without to have to make prayer to be granted spell. But the best will be surely the class systems. that will not have to wait high level for making looking a dark elve looking like a dark elve, you know what I mean. It what I have read it just speculations. Dritzz going older and maybe a stronger dwarf kingdom in mythral hall. But maybe the chaos will be everywhere and everybody going like zombie in the street , wait , running , stealing and killing for food.
MerrikCale 10-15-07, 08:45 PM	So, likely things that are now gone. * Cadderly and Spirit Soaring. * Elistrarae's followers will either be gone or decimated. * Thay will not be thriving. * Sembia will not be thriving. * Neither will Mulhorand. But we don't know if they'll be GONE. And we also don't know if they will happen for certain in 4e or are just a glimpse at a potential future
meto30 10-17-07, 02:28 PM	I'm guessing the Wow player will ask for 'croissants and sparkling water' or just simply 'bread and water' In Korea, about a hundred people actually said that in restaurants after playing too much Wow... made the evening TV news, really.