Post/Author/DateTime	Post
newbDM 04-06-04, 01:27 PM	I originally posted in the "Whats a DM to do" But they suggested to come to the "experts" ----------------------------------- Up until now our campaigns have been very little roleplaying and lots of fights. This time round everyone wants to do a bit more roleplaying but that means my job is all the much more hard to do. We're running a neutral campaign the party is: HexBlade for a Tank - General guy who does everything nobody else wants to do. Rogue/Assassin Wizard - Party Leader Cleric - Religious leader The setting is FR in Thay, or at least it starts there. Books I have: Unapproachable East Lords of Darkness Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting Core books. PLayers guide to the Realm What I'm looking for is help in working policital angles in a campaign, I'm guessing I'm going ot need to know each persons agenda... and that of the NPC parties. In thay I'm going to need an agenda for each Zulkir right? As well as for each organization... maybe people could help me out with those. Which Groups both good and Bad would work in Thay? My guess are: Harpers spies Rasheman spies Zhent Spies Moondagger Spies Kossuth Church Shar Church Bane Church Evoc Zulkir Necro Zulkir Illus Zulkir Conj Zulkir Ench Zulkir Tran Zulkir Abju Zulkir As well as countries: Mulhulorand (Spelling?) Rasheman(Spelling?) Thesk(Spelling?) Algorland (Spelling?) I'm looking for things that the groups would focus on, I figure if I had 1 - 2 goals for each group/person/country it might make how the PC's interact with the NPC's easier. I don't have my book with me but I think I missed 1 zulkir Am I missing any? Anyone want to help out with possible overal goals for each group/individual? Also any books you think may help out a new DM running a Neutral to Evil adventure that is more political than hack 'n slash?
newbDM 04-07-04, 08:01 AM	Wow... almost 40 views and not one reply.....
Archangel 04-07-04, 08:18 AM	Missed Divination Zulkir! Neutral to Evil PC won't work if roleplayed properly. If you want a real adventure then they all need to be EVIL(old Thay) or all Neutral(new Thay)! You know that the new Thay is not militaristic anymore (at least not openly), they turned merchant (have enclaves in every major city on Faerun)! You could even make adventure about them trying to raise the Thay reputation around those many Enclaves so they are better accepted in those cities(and have more trade). As for old Thay you could also add Shade Enclave and Cult of the Dragon into the mix. Also since Szass Tam botched an attack on some Archdemon that Demon could be looking for ways to get back on him and whole of Thay! Some ideas from me!:)
newbDM 04-07-04, 08:35 AM	The PC's minus the Assasin are going to be Lawful evil. With one Neutral PC. (The priest of Kussoth) New Thay for sure is how we will be going, just this is the first time I need to figure out what each group is doing, in relation to Thay. Thats where I'm stumbling.
Archangel 04-07-04, 09:04 AM	Actually, it depends on the level of the players. If they are starting new (lvl 1 - 10) then you don't need many groups because they can't do much about them, but if they are high level 11+ then prepare intrigues for 3-4 groups (usually Harpers, Zhents, maybe some trading groups->Sembian?, also some outerplanar group like Githyanki)!
newbDM 04-07-04, 10:36 AM	Well they're starting at level 2. And your right they can't do anything about themd irectly but they can definitely get introduced to them. And just because the Zhents have a plan to do "X" doesn't mean that its always big guys doing it right/ I mean they could have orcs doing "X" at the moment or any assortment of lower level people.
Helmo 04-07-04, 11:00 AM	WOWĄĄ If you want an agenda of all this groups it will be a mind-boggling taskĄĄ. Anyway, a few things. Aglarond, Rashemen, Mulhuroland and Thesk will oppose Thayans in every aspect. I know they have leave their militaristic attitude for a mercantile one, but this goal can be even more dangerous for these countries. This new attitude is showing thayans pretty face to the world ("they are not so bad guys after all, did you see the wand of light I bought them to look for lost cattle in windy nights?"), and that can make this countries become more isolated and lost potential allies if war finally comes. So, they will always oppose Thay. The Zhents and the Church of Bane: These guys have mercantile interests all over the Moonshea area and beyond so the new Thayan aims must be a thorn in the head for them. They will surely work with the Evication zulkir and those guys who donīt want a mercantile Thay. A mercantile Thay is a threat for them, but a military Thay isnīt. The Harper agents will also oppose Thay in many aspects, but, due to their nature (at least I consider them more contemplative) and the fact that their are not as directly threatened by Thay as the Zhents threaten them their agents will be more info gathering than anything else. Those were just a few quick thoughts, I hope they were helpful.
newbDM 04-07-04, 11:08 AM	Thats exactly what I'm looknig for, just little tid bits here and there. And yes it is a mind boggling task which is why I hoped to get some help from you guys (Thanks BTW!) So I generally see the Zulkir Going into three Categories then: 1. For Military Thay 2. For Trading Thay 3. Don't care and sides with whatever side is winning. That sums them up as the books I have are pretty clear stating which Zulkir is allied with who and which ones wants the other dead. Thanks for the Other Organizations.. Now the big ones left are: Shar Kossuth Bane They all have a decent size following in Thay, but Kossuth is the big one I believe... I mean there has to be some sort of agenda for the church.. spread the gospel of course but other than that they need to have a goal I'm sure.
Helmo 04-07-04, 11:46 AM	The Bane Church will support the Zhents efforts of doing Thay a Military power once again (the zhents leader is also the Chosen of Bane, remember?, so if itīs bad for the Zhents, itīs bad for Bane and vice versa). I am not sure about Kossuth. Will they approve the Thayan new way?. I have always thought about this god as a destructive one (he is evil and Fire is one of its prime interest), so perhaps its clergy will be siding with the anti-mercantile faction, but I am not sure. Itīs important to point that the Divination Zulkir (I think), who sides with Tam, has some important information about the Evocation Zulkir that has prevented him from taking direct action against the mercantile faction efforts of showing Thay pretty face and becoming a mercantile power. That limits the Evocation Zulkir and will lead him to be subtle in his aims (having the Zhents do the dirty work for him will be good, thatīs why I think they can join forces). Shar: who knows?, the Lady of Night is as secretive as one might think. Surely their agents will be info gathering, trying to know everything about everybody and providing the other factions with wrong pieces of information, leading everybody in the wrong direction... but what can you hope about the secrets goddess?.
newbDM 04-07-04, 12:11 PM	So the Zhents have cleared out all of the Cyricists from the Organization?
Ramius_Mordale 04-07-04, 12:28 PM	I believe Kossuth is True Neutral, which means he doesn't care which side wins. True he is destructive, but his order I believe works to just keep the nation from destroying itself and keeping its aim focused on the overall outcome. World domination. To tell you the truth I think Shar is laughable as well as Selune. Why? Cause all they care about is screwing the other over and don't really care about anything else. Its basically a huge sibling rivalry thing thats on a diety level. Sure she is the goddess of secrets but I think she would just try a way to strengthen her power thats it. I really never think gods really care which nation really comes on top as long as they still have followers and become stronger. But thats just my point of view! :) Now I would say Kossuth, since you said I believe (correct me if I'm wrong) that your cleric is a cleric of Kossuth, that they would be most interested and more involved in this intrigue campaign of yours. Mainly as allies I would guess, they might not openly give your pcs actual supplies or support, but hey when there in a jam with some zulkir, they might just have a 'Get out of jail free!' card that they didn't know they had. As long as it is within the Church's power of course and how severe they messed with the zulkir. Remember intrigue needs to be subtle, a zulkir isn't just going to kill someone for no good reason just cause he hates the guy. He needs to have an excuse to do it before he acts or make it appear as it wasn't them if they can't get one. I believe there is a prestige class that pretains to Priest of Kossuth that can become assassin-like in some book I read out of the mountain that I have of them. (I'll try and find it and post it up to let you know what book it is in later if I get the time) Now with Bane? Hmm... that's tricky. I would say Bane would want back the old Thay but Merchantile businesses are also another tool to be used by Tyranny. Can anyone say Monopoly? If they Zhents (that are Banites) could say break a deal with the Thayans (cause right now a rift is present in the Zhents ranks between Cyric and Banites) in order to secure the Zhents as a whole in the grasp again I think they would take it. Besides, Bane is always on his toes and right now wants to strengthen his power back to where he stood before the time of troubles. He might encourage say his clerics trying to convert more members of Thay into the clergy. Again always a good way to take over is by subvertly and quietly taking control from within something Bane is definiately good at. And I'm sure Banite clerics wouldn't have a problem hiring out their group to 'take care' of a certain task or two that they don't want to be connected with. Say killing a Torm Priest or Paladin? Well thats just a few thoughts I had that might help. Hope these two silver help ya for your travels.
newbDM 04-07-04, 02:10 PM	See this stuff is great thanks alot everyone. Its nice to see the books with all the information but its hard to find out goals because well tis up to the DM to make the goals but some nice somewhat general (Not for instance take over the world etc) helps alot.
Ramius_Mordale 04-10-04, 01:48 AM	Just to clearify, I didn't say have them conquer the world I said Kossuth Priest try to keep the nation united behind that mentality. The Unapproachable East Source book has tons of information about Thay and its neighbors. By the way, that prestige class I was talking about is in that very book on Page 21, and its name is the Black Flame Zealot. If it fits one of your PCs or not I guess thats up to you but just thought I would recommend it. Anyways, I wish you the best of luck with this campaign. Your PCs are going to need it if they are messing with the zulkirs.
trentlanthier 04-10-04, 07:37 AM	Well... one of them wants to be a Zulkir.... I guess thats messing with :P
Ramius_Mordale 04-10-04, 09:53 AM	*Chuckles* :) Well I guess your right. Good luck man. If I where you find a rod of absorbtion or negation. ;) Just a thought.