Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Green Elven Vampire 11-10-03, 05:18 PM	Obviously since Quilue is both a chosen of Eiliestraee and Mystra she has the Templates for both. Of all 7 sisters (Simbul included) she has to be the most deadliest, or effective in battle. Does anyone care to support this theory or topple it? I'd love some feedback.
Saasiel 11-10-03, 07:08 PM	Originally posted by Green Elven Vampire Obviously since Quilue is both a chosen of Eiliestraee and Mystra she has the Templates for both. Of all 7 sisters (Simbul included) she has to be the most deadliest, or effective in battle. Does anyone care to support this theory or topple it? I'd love some feedback. She definitely is the most devious... being drow and all. I don't think she had overcome her innate evil as yet...
Green Elven Vampire 11-10-03, 08:33 PM	I tend to agree with you to a degree my friend. While not holding a bit of old evil still in herself, she DOES have a more dour and darker outlook to life than her 6 other bright and giddy pale sisters. Ever read Silverfall:Stories of the seven sisters? Great book. And most the spells used by all 7 sisters in this novel appear in the FR Campaign accessory; Magic of Faerún. Great stuff.
Cherrn 11-10-03, 09:18 PM	And she is dead sexy, even more than her sisters are :p
Straploknight 11-10-03, 10:53 PM	Originally posted by Saasiel She definitely is the most devious... being drow and all. I don't think she had overcome her innate evil as yet... Why do drow have to be innately evil?
Wooly Rupert 11-10-03, 11:07 PM	Originally posted by Saasiel She definitely is the most devious... being drow and all. I don't think she had overcome her innate evil as yet... What innate evil? Qilué is chaotic good. Her birth mother, Iliryztara Veladorn was a follower of Eilistraee. Nowhere is there any mention of Qilué being evil.
Herr Doktor 11-10-03, 11:08 PM	Originally posted by Straploknight Why do drow have to be innately evil? Drow don't have to be innately evil (in the from birth sense), but they definetly are innately evil in the "Possessed as an essential characteristic; inherent," fashion. It's how they are raised, as for how Quilue was most likely raised... She is CG in the descriptions I have read.
Wooly Rupert 11-10-03, 11:11 PM	Originally posted by Herr Doktor Drow don't have to be innately evil (in the from birth sense), but they definetly are innately evil in the "Possessed as an essential characteristic; inherent," fashion. It's how they are raised, as for how Quilue was most likely raised... She is CG in the descriptions I have read. Nope. Her mom, who was heading to the surface while Qilué was still in the womb, was a follower of Eilistraee.
Herr Doktor 11-10-03, 11:31 PM	Originally posted by Wooly Rupert Nope. Her mom, who was heading to the surface while Qilué was still in the womb, was a follower of Eilistraee. Oh, I know... I must've been unclear in that last portion. I said, (should've broken it into two sentences), that: As for how Qilué was most likely raised... She is CG in the descriptions I have read. Meaning that she was most likely raised differently.
Wooly Rupert 11-11-03, 12:26 AM	Whoops, my bad! :embarrass
Srinshee 11-11-03, 12:37 AM	There is no template for "Chosen of Eilistraee." She's "just" a "regular," "simple," "run of the mill" CG Drow female Clr 19 with the Chosen Of Mystra template, aho is ALSO the chosen of Eilistraee but has never been given any additional powers in any writeups she's recieved. (For the best game source on Qilue, see the 2e Seven Sisters book.)
Wooly Rupert 11-11-03, 12:48 AM	Yeah, it's said in a couple of sources that Chosen of Eilistraee is a title. I believe that all the priestesses of the Promenade (the temple just outside Skullport) are called that.
Kossie 11-11-03, 04:02 AM	Hs anyone got a 3e (or even 3.5) version of her as I'd love to see it?!?
kgiggles 11-11-03, 10:34 AM	Yeah me too!!
kgiggles 11-11-03, 10:35 AM	Yeah me too!!
Nightlore 11-11-03, 01:01 PM	Ok, I've read the information on her in the FRCS. I am just curious about her back story. If I read that book on the seven sisters, does it describe the circumstances of her birth? I mean, how is she drow? I'm assuming the father is the same as the other sisters? Any hints here would be excellent.
Kuje31 11-11-03, 01:17 PM	Originally posted by Nightlore Ok, I've read the information on her in the FRCS. I am just curious about her back story. If I read that book on the seven sisters, does it describe the circumstances of her birth? I mean, how is she drow? I'm assuming the father is the same as the other sisters? Any hints here would be excellent. Yes her father is the same as the others. Here's the short of it. Mystra possed their mother, and by the time Qilue was to be born, her father went to a seer, and she told him his wife was possed. By this time Mystra's magic was turning his wife into a lich, and so he cut her head off. At the same time a priestess of Eilistraee was leaving the Underdark and her child was stillborn and was poisoning her. Mystra went to Eilistraee and they switched the babies. So Qilue was born from a drow mother, instead of the half elven mother the others were born from. More can be found in the Seven Sisters sourcebook from 2e.
loki87 11-11-03, 01:18 PM	Back to the orginal topic, I think the Simbul is the most powerful of the Seven, and maybe the most powerful being in Faerun. With a combination of her abilities and leadership, she has single-handedly held the Red Wizards of Thay at bay for years. That alone makes her the "deadliest" IMHO.
Srinshee 11-11-03, 01:41 PM	Yes, Alassra is probably the most deadly, (she can turn herself into a freakin' lightning bolt.) I'd place Laeral a close second, not as much as because she's closest in levels as because she's subtle and can easily work circumstances to her advantage without alerting others to her plans. (Except when she was wearing the crown of horns, and tearing broad swathes out of the high forest just for the heck of it.) She's also an accomplished mage and skilled in crafting deadly spells like Laeral's Crowning Touch.
The Simbul 11-12-03, 06:43 AM	The Simbul would wipe the floor with Qilue. Personally I never cared for the idea of a Drow becoming the 7th sister. I liked the idea that the 7th sister was a mysterious, unknown, unheardfrom, blacksheep of the family type of thing, and I thought it was rather silly that they had to come up with the most ridiculous background story just so they could have one of the Uber-c00L book-selling Drow as a Chosen.
Darkmistress 11-12-03, 07:10 AM	I guess the "black sheep" bit was taken rather... literally. Don't care much for Qilue, either. I read her background in The Seven Sisters accessory, and had to laugh. She and her friends were bloody invading a temple of Ghaunadar (spelling?), killing oozes and worshippers left and right -- when she was a little girl. Sure, she had divine aid from Eilistraee, but this is just ridiculous.
Kuje31 11-12-03, 01:21 PM	Just to make it clear before "I hate what Ed did to her," bashing starts. Ed didn't write her back ground, Steven Schend did. :)
The Spellcasting Sorcerer 11-12-03, 01:50 PM	Originally posted by The Simbul The Simbul would wipe the floor with Qilue. No, she wouldn't. While the Simbul would ultimately triumph over Qilue, I'm sure the drow priestess, with her spell resistance and divine spells, is fully capable of putting up quite a fight before going down for the count. And there's nothing to stop Qilue from casting antimagic field, rushing forward, and slashing the Simbul to death with a masterwork bastard sword. The Simbul would be a fool to underestimate Qilue Veladorn, the Chosen of Mystra and High Priestess of the Eilistraeean faith on Toril.
Amaranthine 11-12-03, 03:39 PM	I *think* Mr. Greenwood's contribution was the the 7th sister was a "dark disaster". No other information given. Another author (Steven Schend, mentioned above?) took that little tidbit and ran with it.
Kuje31 11-12-03, 03:42 PM	Originally posted by Amaranthine I *think* Mr. Greenwood's contribution was the the 7th sister was a "dark disaster". No other information given. Another author (Steven Schend, mentioned above?) took that little tidbit and ran with it. Right, which is what I meant. :) Steven Schend came up with her current background, etc.....
Srinshee 11-12-03, 03:59 PM	I didn'tmind Qilue's orgin story. Steven Schend was the master of fluff. They shoudl rehire that guy!
Morka 11-12-03, 05:27 PM	Originally posted by Kuje31 Yes her father is the same as the others. Here's the short of it. Mystra possed their mother, and by the time Qilue was to be born, her father went to a seer, and she told him his wife was possed. By this time Mystra's magic was turning his wife into a lich, and so he cut her head off. At the same time a priestess of Eilistraee was leaving the Underdark and her child was stillborn and was poisoning her. Mystra went to Eilistraee and they switched the babies. So Qilue was born from a drow mother, instead of the half elven mother the others were born from. More can be found in the Seven Sisters sourcebook from 2e. Weird. She shouldn't be a drow then, she should be human, like her sisters?
Wooly Rupert 11-12-03, 05:50 PM	Originally posted by Morka Weird. She shouldn't be a drow then, she should be human, like her sisters? You know, that's one thing that always kinda bugged me... The only thing I can figure is that the lifeforce of the unborn Chosen was transferred into the drow fetus...
Srinshee 11-12-03, 05:55 PM	Some things are just beyond the comprehension of us mere mortals, i guess.
Wooly Rupert 11-12-03, 06:24 PM	Originally posted by Srinshee Some things are just beyond the comprehension of us mere mortals, i guess. Indeed. But enough about my boss... ;)
Kuje31 11-12-03, 10:34 PM	Originally posted by Morka Weird. She shouldn't be a drow then, she should be human, like her sisters? Dont ask me. :). As the others said, there are things about that, that we don't understand. I mean really two deities decided to swap her life force, so she is drow. :)
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin 11-12-03, 10:36 PM	Originally posted by Wooly Rupert What innate evil? Qilué is chaotic good. Her birth mother, Iliryztara Veladorn was a follower of Eilistraee. Nowhere is there any mention of Qilué being evil. Agreed. Drow are not actually *born* evil (though there is influence from Lolth, I suppose), and Qilue has enough goodness in her background not to have innate evil, IMO (though of course, anyone can be tempted, that's a part of life). Besides, upon reading her story in Silverfall, I didn't not see a shred of evil about her (mischief yes, but not evil). She really was the wise and kind priestess she is made out to be. Ed Greenwood did a good job writing her even if he didn't technically create the character. PS: And yes, as powerful as the Simbul is, she would not have an easy time if she picked a fight with Qilue (though she wouldn't, most likely...). It is not a good idea to underestimate Qilue just because she is the youngest, casts no arcane magic, and has the least levels.
Sirius_Black 11-12-03, 11:55 PM	Originally posted by Srinshee I didn'tmind Qilue's orgin story. Steven Schend was the master of fluff. They shoudl rehire that guy! Amen...at least in this case even if you didn't like his idea, Schend took a tidbit and made it into something. He didn't just cut and paste material from a 2E book into a 3E book or make pretty columns for thousands of prestige classes.
Sirius_Black 11-13-03, 12:00 AM	Originally posted by The Spellcasting Sorcerer No, she wouldn't. While the Simbul would ultimately triumph over Qilue, I'm sure the drow priestess, with her spell resistance and divine spells, is fully capable of putting up quite a fight before going down for the count. Who cares about who would win between these two?!!!! :behold: I mean come on you two....everyone knows that regardless of who would win, Drizzt would immediately arrive upon the scene and slaughter the survivor. :teach: He then would sit down with his journal and brood for the next two or three chapters about what he had done. I mean come on guys...think....when it comes to fighting in the FR there is only one victor possible in any combat...and he is the Uber Drow....Drizzt. :bow:
Srinshee 11-13-03, 12:03 AM	Elminster could kick drizzt's butt any day of the week, even with munchkin drow SR. So could the simbul, so could pretty much any of the seven sisters. Come to think of it, the way Yvonnel Baenre died doesn't make any sense at all in game terms, but hey, it was a novel, and not a articularly good one, so what the heck.
Wooly Rupert 11-13-03, 12:43 AM	Oh gods, this thread is degenerating into another "who's the baddest?" thread... Please, no more!
The Simbul 11-13-03, 03:10 AM	Originally posted by Amaranthine I *think* Mr. Greenwood's contribution was the the 7th sister was a "dark disaster". No other information given. Another author (Steven Schend, mentioned above?) took that little tidbit and ran with it. I know, hence the reason I despise the character concept even more.
Zanan 11-13-03, 03:41 AM	Originally posted by Srinshee Come to think of it, the way Yvonnel Baenre died doesn't make any sense at all in game terms, but hey, it was a novel, and not a articularly good one, so what the heck. That was due to some "dead magic field - thingy" and without magic, most spellcasters - divine and arcane - do look a bit week when the dwarf-driven axe near their breastbones ... (and, the whole thing was of course AD&D AND a novel )
Sirius_Black 11-13-03, 11:31 AM	Originally posted by Wooly Rupert Oh gods, this thread is degenerating into another "who's the baddest?" thread... Please, no more! Wait a minute!!! There have been other threads posted about who would win a fight between two novel characters? What?!!! Are you serious?!!! No, that's not right. I'm Sirius. <Sigh> It's a mad, mad world. Next thing you'll tell me is the new Player's Guide to the FR might have a few Pretige Classes in it. ;)
Sirius_Black 11-13-03, 11:34 AM	One thing I'd like to note and if I've mentioned this before....well, humor me. If you think Qilue was dangerous now.....bad.....capable of taking out her sister, or anyone that powerful......what do you think she's like now after the events within the novel Windwalker ? I don't want to spoil it for those who haven't read the book. But, suffice to say, a great deal that happens impacts or will impact Qilue. I'm very curious to how she deals with the events and if her personality will show any changes. Thus, I'm really curious about what the future lies for this lady. In fact, I'd love to see a book written by Elaine Cunningham centered on Qilue. Not as much as I'd like to see a book centered on Elaith, but.....still, a strong desire.
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin 11-15-03, 12:28 AM	Originally posted by Srinshee Come to think of it, the way Yvonnel Baenre died doesn't make any sense at all in game terms, but hey, it was a novel, and not a articularly good one, so what the heck. When you think about it, Bruenor was only able to kill her through sheer luck, and astoundingly quick thinking (or was it mostly just a fluke?). It *did* makes sense to me the way it was done, though.
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin 11-15-03, 12:32 AM	Originally posted by Zanan Originally posted by Srinshee Come to think of it, the way Yvonnel Baenre died doesn't make any sense at all in game terms, but hey, it was a novel, and not a articularly good one, so what the heck. That was due to some "dead magic field - thingy" A summoned demon (set up by Errtu) had a box in his possession with a dead magic stone within. When he was summoned into the room, he opened the box, and while this immediately set him back to where he came from, it dispelled all of the magical protective spells Matron Baenre was using, as well as any other magic in the room. This gave Bruenor a few seconds to drive his axe into the Matron--he and his companions would have been killed otherwise.
Faraer 11-15-03, 12:43 AM	'Chosen of Eilistraee': remember, Ed doesn't believe in Chosen (in the 'of Mystra' sense) of gods other than Mystra (as I don't). All the worshippers at Eilistraee's Promemade are the Chosen of Eilistraee. Qilué is the Chosen of the Chosen and any powers gained from that status should be left to the DM, not yet another thing players can look up in books. Legend is full of amazing deeds performed by children. If the modern sensibility finds that 'ridiculous', it's a sad deterioration. It's not that Steven Schend came up with Qilué, published her, and said to Ed 'There!' She wouldn't have appeared as she did without Ed's approval and cooperation. Gah. Please will someone ban 'X vs Y' discussions totally. Here's a link to the ESD of The Seven Sisters. (http://www.rpgnow.com/product_info.php?products_id=873&) Great book, and not just about the Sisters.
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin 11-15-03, 12:53 AM	Originally posted by Faraer 'Chosen of Eilistraee': remember, Ed doesn't believe in Chosen (in the 'of Mystra' sense) of gods other than Mystra (as I don't). *nods* The Chosen of Mystra are there mainly as a check on Mystra's power, not as a way of "elevating" certain wizards. Having the Chosen templates for other deites more or less takes away the point.
Darkmistress 11-15-03, 05:08 AM	Legend is full of amazing deeds performed by children. If the modern sensibility finds that 'ridiculous', it's a sad deterioration. The Seven Sisters are, by and large, perfect, uber, immortal characters. They can do practically anything. Nothing fazes them. They laugh in the face of an impending doom, because they know that they'll overcome it anyway. The fact that Qilue has been doing it since she was a little girl makes her even more irritating. My problem does not lie with my "modern sensibility" -- whatever you think that implies, because I certainly have no idea what you're talking about -- but lies in bad characterization. Perfect, uber characters are boring. I won't prolong this little kerfluffle by commenting on Qilue's choice of attire in Silverfall.
loki87 11-15-03, 08:50 AM	I think it would have made for a far more interesting story if the seventh sister, the "dark disaster," was actually evil. Of course, that's just my worthless opinion. :)
Darkmistress 11-15-03, 09:10 AM	Originally posted by loki87 I think it would have made for a far more interesting story if the seventh sister, the "dark disaster," was actually evil. Of course, that's just my worthless opinion. :) Hey, I think that'd have been a lot more refreshing. :)
Faraer 11-15-03, 10:08 AM	They laugh in the face of an impending doom, because they know that they'll overcome it anyway.No, because laughter is one of the ways that adventurers and other folk who face adversity in the Realms deal with it and make peril livable. The Sisters, who're insane, more so. The modern sensibility is just the way 21st-century people tend to think compared to, say, 11th-century people. It favours the historical over the universal, the profane over the sacred, faults over strengths. The Sisters aren't suitable novel protagonists, Ed agrees, but I find their characterization wonderful.
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin 11-15-03, 04:37 PM	Originally posted by loki87 I think it would have made for a far more interesting story if the seventh sister, the "dark disaster," was actually evil. Of course, that's just my worthless opinion. :) Or insane, or very eccentric, (not that the other 6 aren't odd in some way), or perhaps just a person caught in a downward spiral because of some bad choices she made. Or a combination of these (and I include "evil").
Kuje31 11-15-03, 04:41 PM	Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin Or insane, or very eccentric, (not that the other 6 aren't odd in some way), or perhaps just a person caught in a downward spiral because of some bad choices she made. Or a combination of these (and I include "evil"). Well all of the Chosen are insane.... And actually Laeral is probably one of the most insane, considering what happened to her with the Crown of Horns..... She was LE for many years, until Khelben shattered the Crown.
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin 11-15-03, 04:43 PM	Originally posted by Kuje31 Well all of the Chosen are insane.... And actually Laeral is probably one of the most insane, considering what happened to her with the Crown of Horns..... She was LE for many years, until Khelben shattered the Crown. Yeah, I thought about that, but there are varying degrees...after all, the Chosen aren't so insane they need to be locked up. :) By insane I meant someone completely out of touch with reality ("psychotic" in the modern sense).
Xae'an 11-17-03, 07:14 PM	I agree with the theory of the Simbul being the most powerful of the Seven Sisters, mostly because of her shapechange and protection from spells supernatural abilities and because of epic spellcasting, which no other of the seven is capable of. Still I think Qilue would be a close second, her spellresistance making her dangerous opponent for spellcasters. Personally I like Qilue, although I think the circumstances of her birth are at least a bit farfetched.
Kuje31 11-17-03, 07:37 PM	Originally posted by Xae'an I agree with the theory of the Simbul being the most powerful of the Seven Sisters, mostly because of her shapechange and protection from spells supernatural abilities and because of epic spellcasting, which no other of the seven is capable of. Still I think Qilue would be a close second, her spellresistance making her dangerous opponent for spellcasters. Personally I like Qilue, although I think the circumstances of her birth are at least a bit farfetched. Far fetched, well come on. Its fantasy..... I mean there are a lot of things that are far fetched in fantasy or even in FR. :) I don't see how switching the "soul" of a babe that was dead, and one that was going to die, as that far fetched.....
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin 11-18-03, 12:26 PM	Originally posted by Xae'an I agree with the theory of the Simbul being the most powerful of the Seven Sisters, mostly because of her shapechange and protection from spells supernatural abilities and because of epic spellcasting, which no other of the seven is capable of. Well, I don't know if she is the only one *capable* of epic spellcasting--remember that so far, only 3 of the seven sisters have been fully stated out. How do we know that, for example, Laeral doesn't have this feat (though I would agree that she most likely doesn't). Correct me if I'm wrong.
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin 11-18-03, 12:27 PM	Originally posted by Xae'an I agree with the theory of the Simbul being the most powerful of the Seven Sisters, mostly because of her shapechange and protection from spells supernatural abilities and because of epic spellcasting, which no other of the seven is capable of. Well, I don't know if she is the only one *capable* of epic spellcasting--remember that so far, only 3 of the seven sisters have been fully stated out. How do we know that, for example, Laeral doesn't have this feat (though I would agree that she most likely doesn't). Correct me if I'm wrong.
Srinshee 11-18-03, 12:30 PM	It would make a lot of sense to me if Laeral DID have the feat. She's a tough cookie.
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin 11-18-03, 12:34 PM	Originally posted by Srinshee It would make a lot of sense to me if Laeral DID have the feat. She's a tough cookie. *nods* Same goes for the oft-overlooked Sylune. My point is that we don't have the full stats for those characters, so it is better not to make assumptions about them.