Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Alurvelve 11-24-04, 01:34 AM	I am about to have my characters go back in time and try to save Myth Drannor by fighting in its downfall. I still have not worked out eveything but some tidbits or suggestions would be helpful. Currently the characters consist of Alurvelve male moon elf, Swb 3/Brd 4/Bld 10, AC 45, Hp 150, Saves 13/20/17, Str 20, Dex 20, Con 16, Int 29, Wis 16, Cha 18, Atk 31/31/26/21 (1d8+15, 15-20x2). Lia female sun elf, Pal 4/Rgr 4/Knight of Chalice 10, AC 27, Hp 212, Saves 28/19/20, Str 25, Sex 16, Con 20, Int 18, Wis 16, Cha 16, Atk 26/21/16/11 (2d6+22, 17-20x2), Has a potent weapon against outsiders. Parwyn male sun elf, Favored Soul 7/Blade of Corellon 10, AC 38, Hp 140, Saves 19/19/18, Str 26, Dex 18, Con 16, Int 16, Wis 15, Cha 19, Atk 24/19/14 (1d8+14, 12-20x3) & 24 (2d6+7 19-20x3) Drar male wood elf, Rgr 11/Underdark Stalker 6, AC 31, Hp 145, Saves 18/21/11, Str 20, Dex 24, Con 16, Int 16, Wis 16, Cha 16, Atk 20/15/10/5 (1d8+6+1d6shock, 15-20x2+1d10shock) & 20/15/10 (1d6+3 wounding) or range 340' 26/21/16/11 (1d8+7, 18-20x5) he also has a Celestial tiger companion named Avier. So what do you think.
Kuje31 11-24-04, 01:56 AM	I'd download 2e's The Fall of Myth Drannor if you don't have it already. It basically does most of what you want to do for you. http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dnd/downloads
GothicDan 11-24-04, 09:43 AM	Not to sound like I'm trying to bash you or anything, but it is going to take a heck of a lot more than a 17th level wizard to stop the Army of Darkness. Entire armies couldn't, and neither could Epic level High Mages. So unless your DM is going to severely tweak things in the Fall of Myth Drannor, trying to do this would probably be a suicide mission...
Lashan 11-24-04, 09:56 AM	Yeah, but it could be a really fun game to try.......even if you ultimately fail.
Alurvelve 11-24-04, 11:27 PM	I've just found out that there will be a couple other characters with us. Zircon male sun elf, AC 30, Hp 145, Saves 12/20/10, Str 20, Dex 20, Con 16, Int 18, Wis 16, Cha 16, Atk 20/15/10 (1d8+5, 12-20x2) & 20 (1d6+3, 15-20x2) There will also be some kind of mage but currently that is all I know of him. Question what would a Bard with a Knowledge Cormanthor 19, and Knwoledge History 21 know about the area? I'll keep you posted on what happens. And we should be leveling up twice before we go back in time.
GothicDan 11-24-04, 11:30 PM	32nd level Sun Elf? Is that pure wizard? If so, that was higher level than the Srinshee. Argh, my canon tradionalist sirens are screaming. :)
Chosen of the Dark Sun 11-25-04, 12:49 AM	Wait a moment, how does a level 17 have AC 45? That's better than some gods!
Ramar Aulinvox 11-25-04, 02:06 AM	Sounds good to me. I don't think that they could stop the fall, but "it would be fun to try." I have been working on conversions for the dark 3. If you would like I could post the finished one for you. Also, I like to do the time travel campaigns every now and then, and my philosophy is that the charecters going back in time never changes anything. they go back, because they have always gone back. they're just a part of the actual history and everyone has forgotten them or the facts have become scued. well good luck.
Darrian 11-25-04, 09:28 AM	I would love to see your conversions for the dark 3. Darrian
Ramar Aulinvox 11-25-04, 02:23 PM	Here is Gaulgath Gaulgath Advanced Nycaloth Barbarian 1/ Frenzied Berserker 10 Large Outsider (Evil, Extraplanar, Yugoloth) HD: 20d8+11d12+186(427hp) Init: +3 Speed: 40', fly 80'(good)/(50', fly 100'(good)) A/C: 40(-1 size, +3 Dex, +13 Nat., +10 Armor, +5 Deflect.), touch 17, Flat- foot 37 BA/GR: +31/ +46 Attack: Claw +43 (d6+13) or Battle Axe +46 (2d6+15/19-20/x3+2d6, DC:38) Full Attack: Battle Axe +46/41/36/31 (2d6+15/19-20/x3+2d6, DC: 38) plus 3 claws +38 (d6+6) or by ranged weapon +33 Space/Reach: 10'/10' Special Attack: Spell-like abilities, Imroved Grab, Rake +43 (d6+6), Bleeding Wounds, Summon Yuguloth, Rage 1/day, Frenzy (+10 Str, -4A/C, "Speed" attacks, & take 2 non-leathal damage/round) 5/day, Supreme Cleave, Deathless Frenzy, Inspire Frenzy 3/day, Supreme Power Attack (+2/-1), Liftoff Special Qualities: DR:10/good, SR 39, Immunity to poison and acid, resistance to cold 10, fire 10, and electricity 10, telepathy 100' Saves: Fort +32, Reflex +23, Will +20 Abilities: Str 36(30), Dex 17, Con 22, Int 14, Wis 10, Chr 14 Skills: Bluff +25, Concentration +29, Diplomacy +15, Hide +19, Intimidate +29, Know(Arcana) +18, Know(Planes) +18, Listen +19, Move Silent +23, Search +29, Sense Motive +27, Spellcraft +31, Spot +19, Tumble +25, Jump +18, Climb +15, Swim +12 Feats: Power Attack, Cleave, Destructive Rage, Intimidating Rage, Weapon Focus(Battle Axe), Great Cleave, Improved Critical (Battle Axe), Extending Rage, Mobility(B) Epic Feats: Overwhelming Critical (Battle Axe), Devistating Critical (Battle Axe), Terrifying Frenzy(Rage) Challenge Rating: 28 Equipment: Heart Cleaver(+2 Large Vorpal Battle Axe w/ special wounding abilities), +5 Breastplate, Belt of Giant Str.(+6), Cloak of Resistance +5, Ring of Protection +5, 5 potions of Heal, Amulet of N.A. +1 Spell-Like Abilities: At will-Deeper Darkness, Desecrate, Fear, Invisibility, Mirror Image, See Invisibility, & Greater Teleport(Self plus 50 lbs. of objects) CL: 20, DC: 12+spell level Frenzied: A/C: 30; Grapple: +51; Att: Battle Axe +51(2d6+20/19-20/x3+2d6, DC:43); Full Att: Battle Axe +51/51/46/41/36 (as above) plus 3 claws +43(d6+9); SA: Rake +48(d6+9); lasts 14 rounds Raged: A/C: 32; HP(489); Grapple: +48; Att: Battle Axe +48(2d6+17/19-20/x3+2d6, DC:40); Full Att: Battle Axe +48/43/38/33(as above) plus 3 claws +40(d6+8); SA: Rake +45(d6+8);Fort +34, Will +22;Lasts 16 rounds Raged & Frenzied: A/C: 28; HP(489); Grapple: +53; Att: Battle Axe +53(2d6+22/19-20/x3, DC: 45); Full Att: Battle Axe +53/53/48/43/38(as above) plus 3claws +45(d6+10); SA: Rake +50(d6+10); Fort +34, Will +22; Lasts 16 rounds Note: Unlike the Nycaloth entrie in MM3, I do not automatically assume that Gaulgath is useing power attack. If you would like to incorporate these figures remember that with his Supreme Power Attack that every minus equals a plus 2 bonus to damage. Sources: Players Handbook(3.5), DMG(3.5), Monster Manual(3.5), MM3, The Fall of Myth Drannor(2nd), Players Guide to Fearun, Complete Warrior, Draconomican, Magic of Fearun, Epic Level Handbook
Lady Rolindin 11-25-04, 04:16 PM	This is a good ideal, but I hate to put a damper on your adventure. IN Netheril Empire of magic, it has the time Conduit spell on page 14, on page 13 it talks avbout time travel and you cannot change history. This from Mystra. You can go back and try yo help but the elf empire will still fall sorry! I wish the spell was rewritten myself to go back and change some parts of history my self, even though it's 2e no rule have been made to change Mystra stand on the spell. Quate: Mystrly created the time conduit spell to allow travel through time on her terms. Wizards who sought to create new spells that evaded the rules of time travel inevitablely failed, their research leading them back to the comclusion that mystryl time conduit spell was the only way to travel time. Its draw backs, however make it nearly impossible for time travelers to alter history(which, for many spellcasters, was the only reason to time travel). page 13 So you can go back and have fun killing the dark army. but the elf empire will still fall, and every battle they lost they will still lose, every battle they won they still will win ( with the pc helping, and if they are in a losing battle your side will lose). I would like to go back to the start of Netheril history and kill the first Nethrill the elder but, the empire will still come in to extance, and my pc's will become the hunted of the empire.
Ramar Aulinvox 11-25-04, 09:49 PM	Here's Malimshaer Malimshaer Advanced Nycaloth 10L. Rogue/12L. Assassin Large Outsider(Evil, Extraplanar, Yugoloth) HD: 22d8+22d6+440(616hp) Init: +8 Spd: 40', fly 90'(good) A/C: 42 (-1 sz, +8 Dex, +8 Armor, +5 Defl., +12 Nat), touch 22, flat-foot 42 BA/Gr: +37/+49 Attack: Great Axe +49 (3d6+17) or Dagger +46(d6+10) Full Att: Great Axe +47/42/37/32(3d6+17) & Short Sw. +44/39/34/29(d8+6/17-20) & Dagger +44/39/34/29(d6+6) Space/Reach: 10'/10' Special Att: Spell-Like Abilities, Improv. Grab, Rake +44 (d6+4), Bleading Wounds, Summon Yugoloth, Liftoff, Sneak Att. +11d6, Death Attack(DC:27), Poison Use, Spells Special Qualities: DR:10/good, SR:30, Yugoloth Traits, +6vs. Poison, Improved Uncanny Dodge, Improved Evasion, Trap Sense +3, Hide in Plain Sight, Trap Finding Saves: Fort +35, Reflex +41, Will +26 Abilities: Str 26, Dex 26, Con 30, Int 18, Wis 13, Chr 18 Skills: Balance +24, Bluff +29, Concentration +30, Diplomacy +32, Disable Device +39, Disguise +18, Excape Artist +33, Hide +51, Intimidate +28, Jump +34, Know(Arcana) +29, Know(Planes) +14, Listen +26, Move Silent +55, Search +39, Sense Motive +26, Spellcraft +18(+22 w/ scrolls), Spot +36, Tumble +57, Use Magic Device +29(31 w/ scrolls), Use Rope +12 Feats: Multiweapon Fight, Improv. Multiweapon Fight, Greater Multiweapon Fight, Quicken Spell-like ability(Greater Teleport), Mobility(B), Power Attack, Improved Bull Rush, Awesome Blow, Cleave, Great Cleave, Combat Reflexes Epic Feats: Perfect Multiweapon Fighting, Multiweapon Rend(usually d6+14), Spellcasting Harrier, Trap Sense, Improved Death Attack CR: 29 Equipment: Large +5 Unholy Great Axe, Dagger of Malimshaer, Large +2 Keen, Unholy Elf Bane Short Sw., +5 Ring of Protection, Staff of Life(25), Bracers of Armor +8, Cloak of Resis. +5, Wand of Stoneskin (13) Spell-like Abilities: At Will--deeper darkness, desecrate, fear, invisibility, mirror image, see invisibility, greater teleport(self plus 50 lbs. of gear). CL:22, DC: 14+spell level Spell/day:4/4/4/4 CL:12 DC:14+spell level Spells: Low-light vision, Silent Portal, Feather Fall, True Strike/Alter Self, Pass without Trace, Fox's Cunning, Spider Climb/Non-detection, Magic circle vs. Good, Misdirection, Spider Poison/Freedom of Movement, Modify Memory, Clairidence/Clairvoyance, Greater Invisibility Dagger of Malimshaer: Large +2 unholy adamatine Dagger. Adds +3 to DC for Assassin Death Attacks. Base Price: 125,002gp Note: Their is no power attack bonuses included in the attacks. Sources: PHB(3.5), DMG(3.5), MM(3.5), MM3, Players Guide to Fearun, Underdark, The Fall of Myth Drannor(2ed.), Epic level Handbook
Darrian 11-26-04, 08:46 AM	Thanks Ramar. Great write ups. Can't wait for the big daddy. Darrian
Kessalin Talira 11-26-04, 06:29 PM	Lady Rolindin makes a good point about the Time Conduit spell. However, there is also a Teleport Through Time spell on the wizards main site that works well for getting them there as well. When the PC's in my campaign went back in time, they were only going to go back for the Highfire Crown, which was created during the Weeping War, when the new Mythal was raised over Elven Court. They used the Teleport Through Time spell, which they had to first go find the notes for, so that the spell could actually be created. To do this, they had to travel to Anauroch and locate the crash site of Spiel Enclave, home of the Arcanist known only as Chronomancer. After exploring the enclave, they left with the notes they needed, and the spell was created. When they actually used it, however, there were... problems. They arrived over two years before the Highfire Crown was created, less than three months before the Army of Darkness first entered Cormanthor. Because of their limited access to the spell, they were forced to spend over a year fighting in the Weeping War and seeing first-hand what it was like. One of the characters was driven nearly insane by "battle fatigue", the others watched friends and heroes die. If you follow the numbers in the Fall of Myth Drannor book, expect your PC's to level up a lot. Mine went from 11th to 17th in just over a year of the Weeping War. Also, during that time, I would suggest allowing the characters to become Shadow Soldiers and take part in some of that group's more important missions. My PC's performed the Crystal Coup, and almost failed. They got the piece of the Gatekeeper's Crystal from literally the doorway of Gaulguth's tent, with him coming out of it as they ran. One of the players wanted to change characters from his ranger so that character, being a Shadow Soldier, became Rhymallos of the "Rhymallos Gambit" entry in Fall of Myth Drannor. They were on the verge of getting involved with the Spiders' Truce, because one member of the party was a Drow at the time. He's been changed into a moon elf, but keeps his appearance due to personal preference (that's a long story, too). All things considered, I think the time travel, regardless of how it's accomplished, shouldn't be to let the PC's save the city. I think it should show them what things were really like in the city when it fell... that things weren't all song and laughter in the last days of the City of Song. At least a couple of the time travellers IMC came away with the impression that it was for the best that the city fell. For the Khov'Anilessa, if you've got it, the new Nycaloth Commander from Monster Manual III makes a good place to start. My characters never fought any of them, so I never had to write up their stats, though you've hit very close to what I was going to do with them. IMC, Aulmpiter is going to be about CR 31, with all his levels. He'll either be something like Fighter 14, or some combination of prestige classes. Otherwise I'll just give him the Paragon template. He's the only one I have to actually write out, due to the fact that he's around in the modern-day Realms, and has launched his campaign again, this time to take over the ruins and establish his rule over the area, among other things. I'd say more, but I know at least one of my players reads these boards occasionally. I'll just say he's about to realize why he was summoned by the netherese in the first place, and start a dedicated effort to complete his original mission. Good luck with your version of the campaign, and I'm looking forward to seeing what you do with Aulmpiter as well.
Alurvelve 11-27-04, 01:12 AM	Chosen of the Dark Sun here is his AC listing AC: 45 (10+10armor+5dex+10int+5ring+5amulet) +5 elven chainmail, +5 ring of prot., +5 amulet of natural armor, 20(+5) dexterity, 30(+10) intelligence, and then the normal base 10 to start
Alurvelve 12-01-04, 02:52 AM	Ramar Aulinvox could you please, please, please post your version of Aulimpiter(sp?). Your other two were great and will be greatly appreciated in my campaign.
Alurvelve 12-04-04, 05:00 AM	If you think that 45 was a high AC, I just went through the character again and since he always fights defensively thats another +3 to AC(tumble), he also has dodge so thats a +1, and with our Bladesinger while singing he gets another +2 to AC. So that gives him an AC 51, or a AC 54 in total defense :OMG!
Crust 12-04-04, 05:28 PM	Ramar, I like your writeups. I was taken aback after seeing Malimshaer's levels, but I always thought he'd definitely have assassin levels. Gaulgath is also on point with how I'd imagine him. The Fall of Myth Drannor is one of the best war supplements out there. It's amazing how the battles are arranged day-by-day, with all the epic events documented. Some of the elves are extremely powerful, and even Elminster and Khelben are involved. When taking into account the power of Ramar's fiends, one can only imagine how truly powerful Fflar was beyond the sword he carried, or how powerful that dwarf was who drove that mithril spike through Gaulgath, only to be cloven in two by Heartcleaver!
Balthor 12-05-04, 02:24 AM	hey, all you need is a steam powerd car, a shotgun from S-Mart and some bad cliche's.... oops that was a different story... :doh:
primemover003 12-05-04, 04:23 PM	This is my BOOM-stick!
Ramar Aulinvox 12-06-04, 04:00 PM	Ramar Aulinvox could you please, please, please post your version of Aulimpiter(sp?). Your other two were great and will be greatly appreciated in my campaign. Thanks for the compliments. Sorry I haven't been able to post him yet but a huge attack of RL is going right now and I'm still working on the conversion, though it won't be long. probably be done sometime this week.
Ramar Aulinvox 12-11-04, 10:40 PM	Here's the big daddy.... Aulmpiter Advanced Nycaloth Sorc. 20 Huge Outsider(Evil, Extraplanar, Yugoloth) HD: 33d8+20d4+530 (716hp) Init: +2 Spd: 40', fly 90' (good) A/C: 38 (-2sz, +15 nat., +2 dex, +8 armor, +5 deflection) Base Att/Grapple: +43/+61 Attack: Melee Rod of Malicious Vigilence +57 (3d6+15+1 vile/19-20/x2) or by ranged touch att. +43(by spell) Full Att.: Melee Rod +57/52/47/42(3d6+15+1 vile/19-20/x2) & 3 claws +46(d8+5 plus bleeding) Space/Reach: 15'/15' Special Att: Spell-like abilities, Improved Grab., Rake +46(d8+5), Bleeding Wounds, Summon Yugoloth, Lift off, spells Special Qualities: DR: 10/good, SR 31, Yugoloth traits, Fast Healing 3 Saves: Fort +37, Reflex +29, Will +36 Abilities: Str 30, Dex 14, Con 31, Int 18, Wis 16, Chr 36(30) Skills: Bluff +69, Concen. +66, Diplomacy +59, Hide +14, Intimidate +55, Jump +46, Know(Arcana) +60, Know(Planes) +40, Listen +39, Move Silent +22, Search +40, Sense Motive +39, Spellcraft +66, Spot +39 Feats: Power Attack, Mobility(B), Flyby Attack, Improved Bull Rush, Awesome Blow, Leadership, Combat Casting, Darkspeech, Weapon Focus(Heavy Mace), Vile Martial Strike(Heavy Mace), Combat Reflexes, Improved Critical(Heavy Mace), Craft Rod, Craft Magic Arms & Armor Epic Feats: Improved Combat Casting, Spellcasting Harrier, Epic Leadership, Legendary Commander, Fast Healing CR: 30 Equipment(suggested): Rod of Malicious Vigilence(+5 unholy huge heavy mace that acts as a rod of alertness), Ring of Protection +5, Ring of Vile Spells, Wand of Dimensional Anchor (20), Bracers of Armor +8, Cloak of Resis +3, Choker of Chr +6 SLA: At Will--deeper darkness, desecrate, fear, invisibility, mirror image, see invisibility, greater teleport(self plus 50 lbs. of gear). CL: 33 DC: 23+spell level Spells/day: (6/10/9/9/9/9/8/8/8/8) CL: 20 DC: 23+spell level 0L-Detect Magic, Read Magic, Preserve Organ, Light, Arcane Mark, Dancing Lights, Ghost Sound, Resistance, Flare 1L-Shield, True Strike, Identify, Charm Person, Comp. Lang. 2L-Darkbolt, Whispering Wind, Glitterdust, Bull's Str., Detect Thoughts 3L-Dispel Magic, Haste, Displacement, Slow 4L-Enervation, Stoneskin, Lesser Globe of Invul., Charm Monster 5L-Resonating Resistance, Soul Shackes, Telekinesis, Prying Eyes 6L-True Seeing, Fiendish Quickening, Disintegrate 7L-Finger of Death, Spell Turning, Mass Invisibility 8L-Screen, Mindblank, Power Word, Stun 9L-Mindrape, Foresight, Wish Sources: DMG, PHB, MM, MMIII, Book of Vile Darkness, The Fall of Myth Drannor, Forsaken House, Epic Level Handbook Note: the attacks for Aulmpiter do not include power attack. I guess I should give defence for Aulmpiter being a sorcerer. Aulmpiter not only possesses magical abilities, but is a dominating leader, fighter, and tachtician. I haven't converted the Mantle Stone of Vhyridaan and the Orb of Pyxaanthal yet, so they are not included in the above stats. Sorry for the long wait.
Darrian 12-12-04, 08:25 AM	Great work Ramar!!!! As a DM, I thank you, although my players may not thank you when they run into these three baddies. Darrian
Kessalin Talira 12-12-04, 09:41 AM	There's a 3.5 conversion of the Mantle Stone on page 123 of the Player's Guide to Faerun. Not as good as the original, but it might be a place to start on a conversion.
Lord Zeb 08-16-05, 07:24 AM	Bravo, this is awesome. Little bump & save to my threads here. I actually have a party of heroes whose adventures were set during the Crown Wars who have catapulted forward through time to just before the Fall of Myth Drannor (they were lost on the planes, and received a divine mission to use the Shadow Plane to return to Faerun, but ended up in a new time period). These guys look mean. :cool:
Shemeska the Marauder 08-16-05, 11:19 AM	How to stop the Army of Darkness? *grin* Offer to pay the Yugoloth trio more than they were being paid already by Malkazid. Given their nature, and that betraying their master at the time doesn't betray their own longterm racial/alignment goals, they'd be up for bribes and up for smiling betrayal to the highest bidder.
GothicDan 08-16-05, 11:41 AM	Hehehe.
Darrian 08-16-05, 12:43 PM	Just be sure to take every precaution to protect yourself from them after you bribe them. There is nothing in their nature to stop them from killing you after you pay them. Darrian
Genasi_tac 08-17-05, 04:40 AM	I've always been intrigued by elven history and lore, so a Myth Drannor campaign idea sounds pretty interesting, I may bug my DM for a chance to do something like this. Also to travel through time, the spell doesn't say anything about not altering history. In 2e it states that Mystra doesn't allow it, but does that count now? seeing as there is no further information on it I would assume so, going on the possiblity that while you can affect history you can't actually change it in any significant way. Still be fun though.
Crowyn 08-17-05, 07:09 AM	Another way to think of it is :"Whatever happens through the actions of time travelers has happened in history". So if your PC do something in the past (which must not neccessarily alter history on a large scale), they have done it already. In this case, they could have held a flank against the army of darkness so that a group of Myth Drannans could flee the city. This would make their contribution significant, yet would not change the overall history.
Lord Zeb 08-17-05, 07:25 AM	That's how I'm going to play it as well. The players have grand ideas about saving Myth Drannor, but in reality 200,000+ demons, devils, yugoloths and gnolls (and whatever else I add in) will be too much even for them. I burned some of my ink cartridge last night printing 2/3 of the Fall of Myth Drannor PDF, so I can start thinking about where the PCs will fit in the war. They arrived a few decades before, to get themselves established in the new time period, and earn some street cred by defending this elven land. I'm leaning towards right after the Srinshee departs (I have left it vague at this point). Does Coronal Eltargrim pass from natural causes (old age)? Reading about the N'Vaehlar (sp), that seems perfect to interject the PCs into the war for the duration. Anybody have a 3e conversion of the Vaehlarn Tiira? "free" Mind Blank thanks to them sound sweet for the PCs...
Crowyn 08-17-05, 07:32 AM	Lost Empires states that Eltagrim left for Arvandor.
Darrian 08-17-05, 07:33 AM	Here is an idea, have the party go back in time and help the Army of Darkness destroy Myth Drannor. That way you will have no problems potentially changing the results AND you can be a winner! Darrian (Go with the winner)
Lord Zeb 08-17-05, 07:50 AM	Lost Empires states that Eltagrim left for Arvandor. Thanks...but isn't that a 'fancy' (or "nice") way of saying he died?
Genasi_tac 08-17-05, 07:53 AM	Assuming that your PCs are using the Teleport through Time spell, how do you intend to send them back? Maybe I'm missing something in the spell description, but as far as I can read it says nothing about travelling to the future, and there is no duration for how long they stay. The description goes on about going to the past and altering history, but I'm just wondering what ideas you have for sending them back to their own time. That is if you wish for them to return to their own time and not have them become permanent figures of that particular timeline. I get so confused about time, the 2e spell lists a duration of one year before they return to the almost exact time they left, or something like that. But without that sort of descriptor, how are they going to return?
Lord Zeb 08-17-05, 08:19 AM	Assuming that your PCs are using the Teleport through Time spell, how do you intend to send them back? Maybe I'm missing something in the spell description, but as far as I can read it says nothing about travelling to the future, and there is no duration for how long they stay. The description goes on about going to the past and altering history, but I'm just wondering what ideas you have for sending them back to their own time. That is if you wish for them to return to their own time and not have them become permanent figures of that particular timeline. I get so confused about time, the 2e spell lists a duration of one year before they return to the almost exact time they left, or something like that. But without that sort of descriptor, how are they going to return? For my PCs.... They are not going to return. They did not use any time spell, rather they went to deep within the Plane of Shadow (could've used Deep Ethereal, was a toss up for me) on a quest, and stepped through a portal emblazoned with the three elfblades, placing them in Cormanthyr in the late 660s. More GM fiat than hard core rules. They were "lost" on the planes for a long time (Planescape type campaign for levels 9-19), but always searching for a way home to Miyeritar. The Seldarine path led them through darkness, to arrive in a dark time for the elves, with hopes that they can alleviate elven suffering. They are 20th level now, and I'm thinking about what (if anything...) they need to do next to reach epic levels. :plotting:
Crowyn 08-17-05, 10:00 AM	Thanks...but isn't that a 'fancy' (or "nice") way of saying he died? Not really. He decided to leave, moving bodily to another plane (or maybe stopping his heart). But the book does clearly state that he thought his job was done after Myth Drannor was stable enough.
Genasi_tac 08-17-05, 10:19 AM	Lord Zeb: Cool For their progression into epic levels, I'd say just have them sit through a few battles, maybe send them up against some greater demons in the army, maybe not the not the Trio, because weren't they killed by various famous elves? I only remember Fflar and I think one of the others was a bladesinger. Wasn't one of the Starym elves the spellmajor at this time?(Completely unrelated really but just thought I'd have it for reference.) Or are you perhaps intending for some of your characters to replace various important figures in this campaign, mayhaps actually giving rise to the legends surrounding them? I think if I remember correctly that Fflar wasn't really remembered all that well, I may be wrong cause I'm not all that familiar with 2e, I remember reading that most of the history on him was lost, but if you refer to the Last Mythal series they have him as a very well known character. Also on a slightly unrelated matter, wasn't Zaor Moonflower around as well at the time of the fall of Myth Drannor? I read Evermeet and he says something about being one of the last surviving refugees from the City of Song. All this is just curiousity on my part.
Lord Zeb 08-17-05, 11:09 AM	Thanks :D The plan is for them to take on some of the other major demons in general -- I'd like for them to take the place of the legendary heroes (depending on how they do...) for at least some of the fights w/ the Trio. Since the version of the Trio has them up in the 28-30 CR range, I expect that will be quite a ways off. That's one of the reasons I have them arrive 40+ years before the war, maybe gain a few levels doing quests for the elves. Not sure about Zaor and Starym (sounds right though) - I have more reading to do for sure. I was curious about Eltargrim 'cause in 3e terms he'd be level 30ish, and a huge boost to the elves. I guess that's a good reason to keep him out of the war...
Genasi_tac 08-17-05, 11:53 AM	Eltargrim is gone before the the war starts I think. It's one of the main reasons they're so vulnerable during the war, they've all been backstabbing and plotting against each other at this time. Also I think the Srinshee(spelling?) is gone as well ,the warblade has already been lost, about the time your PC group arrives actually if I remember right(the crownblade left with the Srinshee as well). So basically all you've got is ArtBlade at this point in time. I think someone put the Srinshee at something like 30+lvl and as she was considered more powerful than Eltargrim I'd believe he's around 27-30, Eltargrim was a warrior mainly and the CrownBlade gave him the abilities of a High Mage hence he is possibly a high CR than his level. 40 years before the war hmmm? I think you've got some interesting things to go through there, you could send them off on a failed attempt to find the WarBlade for Myth Drannor, it was lost in the Twisted Tower, Josidiah Starym sought it and came back with the ArtBlade so it's still out there, might be a good chance to give them some levels.
Lord Zeb 08-17-05, 12:42 PM	40 years before the war hmmm? I think you've got some interesting things to go through there, you could send them off on a failed attempt to find the WarBlade for Myth Drannor, it was lost in the Twisted Tower, Josidiah Starym sought it and came back with the ArtBlade so it's still out there, might be a good chance to give them some levels. That's a great idea. After reading about the elfblades, I thought they were very cool indeed. Now, just a matter of if I want a PC to have one (hehe). The quest for it should be good for a level or two, which will help when the actual war breaks out. Right now the breakdown for possible challenges are: 1) ancient blue dragon trying to move into the north-western portions of Cormanthyr (good quest for gaining the elven trust and also for upping the parties GP to match their level ... they were a little behind the DMG chart). 2) THE STORM LORD’S KEEP from Dungeon 93 (test out their epic level, or near-epic level) 3) few demon/devil/yugoloth scouts pre-war (much closer to start of war) ... 4) Quest for the Warblade (thanks :)) I have a few other ideas written down in my campaign notebook @ home. One of the PCs is a Fochlucan Lyrist (campaign started in 2e, conversion to 3.0 only had a couple of adventures, so for 3.5 our group decided to re-redo the characters), which in my FR lore has the Fochlucans as the ancient elven precursor to the Harpers. By Cormanthyr's time, there aren't any Fochlucans left*, but their ideological descendents are in the Harpers. And from what I understand, the Harpers get hit hard, and have to rebuild after the war. Great fodder for that PC to get involved deeper into the current time period. * well maybe, after reading book II of the Last Mythal series I was thinking maybe the Star Elves still have some Fochlucans kickin'.
Genasi_tac 08-17-05, 01:04 PM	Personally I'm not to familiar with 2e, I've only gotten into DnD in the last year and a half, but I have a serious love of FR so I gather everything I can on it. But your ideas seem sound enough, seeing as Myth Drannor is one of the most magically advanced cities at the time I'm sure there will be quite a few nifty things for them to pick up. How many non-elves are in the group? Because there are still quite a number of elven households that are opposed to non-elves in their city, Starym included(I think Josidiah is the only good one). You could implement possible assassination attempts on the party and political intrigues as well if you'd like, maybe have them do a few short errands for the good elves of the city, protection for those elves who aren't opposed to non-elven entry, seeing as quite a few of these elves were targeted by the not so nice ones. If you really feel like going for Artifacts you could have an elven High Mage ask your group to investigate the Starym activities and rumors attributed to their Moonblade(Which is perverted by evil) the thing is in 2e stats though, I don't know if it's been updated, I doubt it. Or any of many wonderous activities, have them track demon scouts(as you mentioned) back to Hellgate keep(this would be just before the war I'd say) and attempt to come back and warn the city. If you haven't already I recommend you download the Fall of Myth Drannor supplent and Comanthyr, they've got quite alot of useful information. I'm not a fan of Star Elves personally but they might have some although I think their numbers are still very few even at this point in time, and I think just before the war or maybe sometime in short period of peace, the entire Harpers of Twilight (Pervious Name) are slaughtered by drow I think, not too sure, except for Elminster and Khelben, I think you may want to adjust their stats as well if perhaps your group encounter them, I don't think they're even in epic at this stage or they're just hitting low epic. P.S. ElfBlades are cool huh? :D
Lord Zeb 08-17-05, 01:32 PM	Yah, Elfblades wicked cool. :cool: I have the Cormanthyr / Fall of MD free PDFs downloaded. The Fall will help a lot with running the war. I believe Khelben is the "Nameless Harper" at this time, so the PCs may never know who they are dealing with (not huuuuge FR buffs anyways, so may not be an issue). They have heard of Elminster, but as long as I keep that part quick, shouldn't be too much of a big deal. That's if I go with the Harper angle. :) MD at the point they arrive is fairly cosmopolitan, with some elf supremacists amongst them, so the party (1/2 orc, 1/2 giant, (reincarnated elf) Minotaur* and a Sun Elf) will have an interesting time with the non-elf haters. This whole thing should keep us going for quite a while :D * Minotaur came up on our homebrew reincarnation table, which I ruled as the LA 0 Dragonlance variety for party balance. Thanks for all the feedback :)
Genasi_tac 08-17-05, 01:42 PM	Well, it sounds like it's gonna be fun, I really think I'm gonna consider pitching this campaign like this idea to my DM, although I think I might go for Netheril or the Vyshanti(spelling?) empire, and now it's time for me to get some rest. You have one very unlucky or lucky elf, either way you look at it, to become a Minotaur. I am now out of anything of real importance to say, to tired I guess.
ElGrecoETAC 08-17-05, 08:59 PM	Ramar, Ever considered stating Fflar? Your Trio Nefarious are very well made, and a Fflar that could defeat the greatest of the three would arguably be something more than the high-teens Fighter most people have been throwing around. That's not to say I'm opposed to a single-class write-up; I'm just curious to see what sort of Fflar would be good enough to take down Aulmpiter in your eyes. :)
Ramar Aulinvox 08-18-05, 02:30 AM	Ramar, Ever considered stating Fflar? Your Trio Nefarious are very well made, and a Fflar that could defeat the greatest of the three would arguably be something more than the high-teens Fighter most people have been throwing around. That's not to say I'm opposed to a single-class write-up; I'm just curious to see what sort of Fflar would be good enough to take down Aulmpiter in your eyes. :) Well, I never really thought about it because until Forsaken House and Lost Empires of Fearun came out, nobody knew for sure if Fflar was an elven bladesinger, human paladin, half-elf ranger, or what. Now we know he was a elven fighter. I think that the teen level straight fighter write ups are probably pretty accurate because Fflar would have easily died fighting Aulmpiter except that he broke the mantle stone of Vhyridaan with Foebane in an almost retributive strike that killed him. Also, there is the distinked possibility that Aulmpiter is not dead. Even beyond all of that, I like how Fflar is set out to be just an almost regular guy who did what "little" he could. In his eyes, Josidia Starym and the others were the real heroes. Fflar is just a guy who was trying to buy the people of Myth Drannor a little more time to get away and didn't really expect to win but was determined to try none the less. Now, it would be hard for a 15th level character to even stand toe-to-toe with a CR 30 foe, so I would not be adverse to making him a little higher level and just considering that he was extrodinarily modest; however, RL is being quite demanding right now, but if I get the time I might work on something for Fflar within the next week or two. p.s. thanks for the complement.
Alratan 08-19-05, 12:09 PM	I've actually run a very similar campaign, with a similar attitude to start off with. However, by the end, my PCs had got into it so much that I let them win - they had tried so hard and so inventively. Trying to draw the Mulhrondi God Kings into the war, making allies in the most unusual of places - resisting the temptation to use the wraith pyramid scheme at the worst moments of the war, that was a great campaign.
Lord Zeb 08-19-05, 12:24 PM	I've actually run a very similar campaign, with a similar attitude to start off with. However, by the end, my PCs had got into it so much that I let them win - they had tried so hard and so inventively. Trying to draw the Mulhrondi God Kings into the war, making allies in the most unusual of places - resisting the temptation to use the wraith pyramid scheme at the worst moments of the war, that was a great campaign. So, what happened afterwards :) ... or did you quit that campaign after that huge war?
Alratan 08-19-05, 02:25 PM	The characters were quite high level by the end of the Weeping War, so we moved on to a two PC/player structure, with the originals being semi-retired meddlers - they fell out with the Chosen of Mystra very significantly when they were discovered to be Time-Travellers - but were supported by the more reactionary remaining members of the city nobility (they sold getting allies with the reasoning that elf lives were precious - human's weren't), and there was also significant political tension with the Mulhrondi - who were woken from their slumber a bit early be the PCs intervention. There are also troubles with the aftermath of the PCs battle-tactics in the war (opening gates from Magma and the sea at the bottom of Celestia on top of the horde at various points isn't good for the countyside, and tenacious magic PaOing every elf that volunteered into a tulani eladrin wasn't exactly non-disruptive to elven society. The last was done after a trip to the Upper Planes after allies was rebuffed). The original characters play political games, whilst the new low level ones adventure within the changed Faerun of the period. It's still almost going - but we've not had a session for nearly 6 months - what with work - aprt from games held via VoIP. Edit: There were some great moments - like when they realised they could use knowledge skills/cohort's bardic knowlege to remember where adventurers had made very spectacular finds in the future, and then go and loot those comparitivly very easy encounters to equip Myth Drannor's soldiers.