Post/Author/DateTime	Post
arrisnyte 03-06-04, 03:21 PM	Umm, I just got a look at the sneak peeks for Players Guide to Faerun, and for Psionics options it says Magic and PSionics affect each other. Now, granted, I rarely if ever use or allow psionics in my campaigns, but um this completely spits in the face ov everything I've ever read of Psionics in Faerun. Does anyone else remember the Drizzt Series book, where the Time fo Troubles completely cut off Magic to the world, sending Menzobarrenzen (Sp?)'s house structure into disarray, except for the one predominantly psionic Drow house. That would suggest that indeed, The Psionics are different option should be used... Is wizards just not checking all the background material, or has the setting changed, and if so, will there be reprints and rewrties of old books?
Cunning Linguist 03-06-04, 03:30 PM	There is a problem with the Psion look in PGtF but it's the other way around. It says Psion’s are not bound to the weave, and nothing can stop them from accessing there own personal weave. That’s a big no-no from what we have heard before. Psion powers was a part of the weave, just like clerics and wizards, but they used it another way. The clear cut of psion powers from magic will start more complaints then the FR cosmology, or at least that is my prediction.
Wooly Rupert 03-06-04, 05:47 PM	Originally posted by arrisnyte Does anyone else remember the Drizzt Series book, where the Time fo Troubles completely cut off Magic to the world, sending Menzobarrenzen (Sp?)'s house structure into disarray, except for the one predominantly psionic Drow house. That would suggest that indeed, The Psionics are different option should be used... Magic wasn't completely cut off, it was still very much in evidence. It was simply very unreliable. I think that part of the problem with psionics in D&D is that other than the Dark Sun setting, psionics has never been integrated into the game. It's always been a bolt-on -- and that's why it's never fit all that well.
arrisnyte 03-06-04, 06:11 PM	Magic wasn't completely cut off, it was still very much in evidence. It was simply very unreliable. Well, whether you call it cut off or Unreliable, none of the houses had Working Magical Defenses, but the Psionic House was in 100% total control of their wards, and powers. That to me Screams "Psionics are Different"!
TheGreenGriffon 03-06-04, 06:48 PM	Yup. Any way you slice it Psionics and Magic are different things despite what the new 3ed book says. The old Psionics handbook was my opinion the most balanced version to play and it was 2ed. Also FR novels have stated in many spots Psionics are not effected by magic and vice versa and a Psion doesnt tap the weave, they are the result of Mind over matter. I dont like what they did with Psionics in 3ed, they basically made a new type of sorcerer and made it difficult to get the schools you wanted withoiut having high stats across the board as each devotion had its own requisite to determine what level powers you could manifest. They also took away the sense of mystery behind Psionics and didnt run it on a prerequsite system for what powers you could tap, now like spells its based on levels.
arrisnyte 03-06-04, 07:15 PM	Originally posted by TheGreenGriffon Yup. Any way you slice it Psionics and Magic are different things despite what the new 3ed book says. The old Psionics handbook was my opinion the most balanced version to play and it was 2ed. Also FR novels have stated in many spots Psionics are not effected by magic and vice versa and a Psion doesnt tap the weave, they are the result of Mind over matter. I dont like what they did with Psionics in 3ed, they basically made a new type of sorcerer and made it difficult to get the schools you wanted withoiut having high stats across the board as each devotion had its own requisite to determine what level powers you could manifest. They also took away the sense of mystery behind Psionics and didnt run it on a prerequsite system for what powers you could tap, now like spells its based on levels. YEah. Regardless of the outcome of this particular discrepancy, I'm trying to "Fix" Psionics (Note, anyone who sees this and decides to try and flame me, keep in mind I ignore flames) by making them a more easier to integrate system. Psionics themselves, as an idea, have nothing wrong with them; quite the opposite, I'm intrigued by the mind over matter psychic theme. But honestly The point based system kind of makes it hard to integrate, so I'm trying to work it over to a slot-based system. As it progresses, I'll put it up somewhere and post a link somewhere on the boards.
Wooly Rupert 03-06-04, 07:19 PM	Keep in mind that there's a new 3.5 Psionics book coming out, which is supposed to fix a lot of the problems with the 3.0 one... Having said that, I'll voice my biggest complaint about psionics in 3.x: manifestations (you know, now powers have something about them that other people can pick up on). I have no idea why they decided to add that monkeywrench into the mix, but it ruined psionics for me.
arrisnyte 03-06-04, 07:23 PM	Originally posted by Wooly Rupert Keep in mind that there's a new 3.5 Psionics book coming out, which is supposed to fix a lot of the problems with the 3.0 one... Having said that, I'll voice my biggest complaint about psionics in 3.x: manifestations (you know, now powers have something about them that other people can pick up on). I have no idea why they decided to add that monkeywrench into the mix, but it ruined psionics for me. And 3.5 was full of great fixes all over... In my mind, it's still point based, it's still junk. And MAnifestations are really no different that, say, Verbal or somatic components, at least to me. If I see 4 people standing around, and one waggling his fingers, I know where the big explosion came from. But if I see 4 people standing around, and I'm suddenly shot off fo my feet into a nearby wall, I think its a little unfair to say that "Well there's a psion, but TS trying to find him."
Amoun 03-06-04, 08:20 PM	I actually enjoy the new point based system of the new psionics. Its a lot more manageable... Psionics in 2nd edition was a wee bit difficult to deal with, it was needlessly complicated (this is my opinion :p). Psionics also always had PP, power points was it called PSPs I cant remember now. Also you have to realize psionics is meant to be more flexible than magic, so making a level based system would kind of be counter-productive but thats ur option. As for the Magic affects Psionics and vica versa well thats (for lack of a better word) utter crap. But you guys have to remember just because in an official book it says that magic and psionics works this or that way in the realms u can do what you want with it. I for allow psionics and use the "psionics is different" option, except I consider SR (spell resistance) also PR (Power Resistance). My argument for that is that a creature is innately resistant to things affecting it *shrugs*. Also (especially in the FR) I did this for game balance issues. Even though you might not like something that Wizards publishes (or will publish in the case of the Players Guide) you do have to understand that a lot of thinking has gone into most products. There must be some valid reasons why they believe magic and psionics should affect each other *shrugs* I fail to see the need for that but then again I am not using what they are saying in this particular instance. So the first thing you should not do if you dont like something that they published is scream and holler and not think about why they did a certain change... after you thought about the reasons why and figured out their "arguments" THEN you can start screaming and moaning :p Amoun
Straploknight 03-06-04, 09:16 PM	I would say that magic and psionics affect each other in FR so you dont have to add another layer of complexity to the campaign. If magic and psionics were invisible to each other why didn't psionically endowed creatures dominate Fr? Why aren't there specific spells or items designed as a defense against psionics (hey magic can do just about anything)?
arrisnyte 03-07-04, 12:13 AM	Originally posted by Straploknight I would say that magic and psionics affect each other in FR so you dont have to add another layer of complexity to the campaign. If magic and psionics were invisible to each other why didn't psionically endowed creatures dominate Fr? Why aren't there specific spells or items designed as a defense against psionics (hey magic can do just about anything)? The reason they wouldn't dominate is becasue in a Psionics are Different setting, Magic is just as foreign and cryptic to psions as psionic energy is to mages. And in Faerun, you may have noticed a LOT of Magic users, some of them very powerful. A 20th level Psion up against Elminster or Khelben might very well get his powers in past their Spell Resistance...But every one of their spells would get past the Psion's power resistance. So it comes down to sheer numbers.