Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Dankan 11-17-07, 06:28 AM	Hi, everyone!Do you think it might be possible for the evil forces on faerun to be united?And i mean really unites and try to conquer all the good lands by workinh together.Imagine:The Zhentarin, united with, the Red Wizards, the Drow, the Dladrageth House, the Sharrans, and finally City of Shade.All of them working together to bring the forces of good down, assaulting the Silver Marches, Cormanthor, Evereska, Evermmet, and Waterdeep.Try to imagine this eormous alliance commanding also legions of demons, devils, undead, plus the scores og Giants. trolls, goblins, Orcs and Dragons living in Toril.Who could unite them?What could be done to stop them?And what the good forces might accomplish?I'm looking forward to hear your ideas
Bullet06320 11-17-07, 06:49 AM	Not possible, each group has its own agenda and any alliance would end up falling apart when one group or another tries to take out one of thier own allies for thier own ends or more power or whatever. The Red Wizards do it to each other already, Same as the Zhents.
Dankan 11-17-07, 11:53 AM	Then what kind of alliance would hold between evil forces?Perhaps the Shdes and Red Wizards would work together given how both are evil and both want to progress further the lore of magic.Even the Cult of the Dragon might work with Thay, or even the Black Blood as described in CR.And it wouldn't be difficult that the church of Shar works with either group, or drow, given that in Cormyr, Shadowdale and Anauroch they are seen working with different groups of evil.I most desperataly need ideas on the subject
Craig C. 11-17-07, 12:05 PM	I wouldn't get too hung-up on these factions wanting to hook-up just because they share the word or concept of *Evil* as a defining descriptor. These alliances you seek are always possible for short-term missions and objectives of the sort ... but likely in a very corrupt, self-serving, and disengenuous structuring. From a long-term perspective, hell no ... none of these groups will prosper or stay true to any compact or alliance parameters. Try to use D&D alignment mechanics and compatibilities as a guideline. Start with finding common purpose and common ground on short-term objectives for 2 or more of these entities ... and then take it from there. During well-played RP of these short-term missions, you'll quickly find out that any long-term alliances of these groups will become nigh impossible.
Stigger 11-17-07, 12:23 PM	Most don't seem to be internally united, so its a bit hard to swallow them being able to externally unite with anyone else...
MarkusTay63 11-17-07, 01:38 PM	The Twisted Rune is an example of a group of powerful evil beings that have united for strength, even though they each have their own agenda. It's entirely possible, but your not going to see the Zhents allying with Thay anythime soon - the problem is both wants to "rule the world", and only one can. Also, many of their goals would be the same (control economies), so they would more likely wind up enemies then anything else. On a smaller scale, you might see a local Zhent agent work with a Thayan enclave to assassinate the ruler of a city, but on a grander scale the leadership would fight too much amongst themselves (just look at the Zhents right now, or even the Harper/Moonstars - even 'good' groups find it difficult to work together because each 'leader' will have his own itinerary). Right now I'm using just that dynamic in my campaign - the adventurers are gaurds for a disguised group of Thayans, but they are working against OTHER forces of evil in the Moonsea area. So the PCs are doing 'good', even though their bosses are doing 'bad' - right now they are all on the same page. Eventually things will have to come to a head, but thats the whole idea. ;)
Dankan 11-17-07, 03:26 PM	well i wouldn't want mu PC's to be evli, on the contrary, i want themn to working against evil.Now if someone from my party gets tainted and turned to evil then;) Anywhay i would like to put the Drow working with Sharrans to bring the world in darkmess(since Shar's clergy supports the shadows and the drow dont' like the sun, i would assume that they have a common goal).In addition i am going to make an alleiance with those factions with the cult of Dragon since it supports undead(and is not especially concerned with world domination) amd finaly, who else, the shades(at least these folks won't have a problem working with Shadow casters)
MarkusTay63 11-17-07, 03:38 PM	The idea is, IMG, I want it to come down to them making a choice at some point. They think they are working for a merchant consortium out of the Easting Reach. Once they arrive in Mulmaster, certain wheels will be put into motion and they will begin the series of adventures in the Mysteries of the Moonsea book. However, they will be doing so on the behalf of their merchant employers, who are looking for 'something' in the area. They will be the 'good' little heroes while employed, but eventually they will find out exactly who they are working for. Now, if they have been accomplishing 'good' with Thayan backing, who's to say that is wrong? Thay makes an excellent 'benefactor/Patron for the PCs because right now many of the persons in power are persuiing economic goals, rather then military ones. I like to set them up with a bit of a moral dilema right from the beginning. I'm even thinking of running them through the whole Randal Morn trilogy at some point - wouldn't it be a kick in the head if Thay saved Daggerdale? :D Indirectly, of course...
Butterface 11-17-07, 07:48 PM	The Church of Shar seems to be quite good at finding evil organizations to join its cause, as evidenced in the Cormyr/Shadowdale/Anauroch adventure, and the last several pages of Grand History. The Church of Cyric, the Church of Bane, the Zhentarim, the Drow in/around Shadowdale, and the Shadovar all seem to fall prey to the pretty words of the Nightsinger at one point or another in that adventure series. Shar has a very specific goal though: the destruction of Mystra. I don't know if that fits in with your overall idea too well.
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin 11-17-07, 10:43 PM	As for the topic question--it doesn't seem likely, no!
Dankan 11-18-07, 03:46 AM	Well from what you people said i think there's no way for all the evil forces to be working together(despite of imagine how cool it would be to do that one day, oh the side of good will fall trembling).But maybe, there could be an alliance with some of them, if you keep in mind that quite a few evil organizations have the same goals(for example both the drow, the Sharrs and the Black Blood, wish to bring the world into darkness).What do you thinh, though, about the organizations i 've put earlier in the discussion?Could it happen?And also, i would like to put a major vilain, such as, those refered to Champions of Ruin, or FCI, FCII.CAn anyone tell me who might work with the above groops, bearing in mind that,at least, he has almost the same agenda?
Stigger 11-18-07, 11:20 AM	I suspect ego would get in the way of any meaningful cooperation. Drow would be looking to take what they could and then leaving their 'allies' to hang, Sharrans might be willing depending on how it advanced their lady's goals, and well, the Black Blood types are just too chaotic to really coordinate anything that well from what I can tell... then again, apart from the drow, I don't really find any of them to be particularly compelling evils.
Alter_Boy 11-18-07, 06:10 PM	Unless Ed Greenwood was leading them, then probably not. Most of these groups can't work well with themselves, much less others.
Craig C. 11-18-07, 06:34 PM	As I mentioned earlier, short-term alliances are always possible. But the chances of long-term betrayal and pact-breaking is monumentally high considering the nature of these groups. In essence, tactical alliances work, strategic ones don't. And the more tactical alliances that eventually unravel, word gets out amongst the information networks and lore transferrals available to these groups. Then "bad reputation" kicks in, and that just hinders the alliances even further.
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin 11-18-07, 08:14 PM	Well from what you people said i think there's no way for all the evil forces to be working together(despite of imagine how cool it would be to do that one day, oh the side of good will fall trembling). I wouldn't consider that to be particularly "cool".
Bullet06320 11-18-07, 11:49 PM	it depends on your deffinition of cool
Dankan 11-19-07, 11:01 AM	To bring the discussion back to the topic i don't want them to work to work together for long terms, just to make a united plan that will take a toll of the forces of good.Perhaps i 'll make them betray ech other in the end that shall make thing a little ore interesting.Could u give some advise about how to complicate tings a little, about the grops i mentioned earlier?And none has still told me about my suggestion to put an additional villain either from CR, or FCI, FCII